Teachers not providing feedback IS a serious problem

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I normally skip over all the FCPS/teacher bashing posts here, but the one post about teachers not providing feedback really got me thinking.

If the new norm is that teachers just put a score in the grade book and it’s on the student to come talk to the teachers to understand why they got that score, we have a serious problem. I can’t imagine not getting an essay back that I wrote without any feedback on how to improve my writing. Let alone a math test…

This is a core function to learning in my opinion and not something that can just be done away with or on a request only basis.

Teachers say this is because they are overworked and have too many students. The lack of teachers at the moment probably isn’t making this any easier. And with all the mud being thrown in their face on a daily basis, I can’t imagine anyone would want to go into teaching. So now we have a retention and recruiting problem…

At some point someone needs to throw up the red flag on a national level and turn this ship around. And by that I mean addressing the real issues and not these BS “CRT” and “GET THE PORN OUT OF SCHOOLS” distractions. The real issues i see are:

1. Retention- (fix this by better pay, benefits)
2. Recruiting- this is a nationwide issue. Perhaps full ride scholarships for teachers like the military does with ROTC. No one wants to go into student debt to get treated like a subhuman
3. Morale- give the teachers their dignity back. They are professionals and should be treated as such. No, Karen, just because you have children in school does not mean the teachers work for you or you should be able to dictate how they run their classroom. They are public servants - like police or judges. Treat them with respect.
4. State Testing- just get rid of it already. It takes away from the students learning and puts pressure on teachers to only teach towards the test (this is what happens when you tie teacher raises and school funding to test scores). Let’s be honest- rich people care about it because the high test scores affect their property value. We don’t need to be making decisions about public education to benefit some rich people and their property values

I’m sure there are a lot of other problems, but this really jumped out to me. Just my thoughts. And this isn’t just high school- my middle schooler also hasn’t received feedback on assignments all year

I agree with you on most points but as a former high school English teacher who left the profession because I was working 60-80 hours a week and still never done:

I absolutely support teachers not writing in margins of papers. Seriously. For the vast majority of students it is a complete waste of time. I’d spend hours and hours writing detailed feedback…let’s say, 10 mins per student x 120 students = 20 hours of work. 20 hours! And I got 5 hours is planning time per week to plan all of my lessons, not even counting grading. So it was never done, and I was always feeling inadequate and a failure and stressed.

Of those 120 students, fewer than 10 would actually read the comments, and maybe 5 per assignment might ask for the chance to re-write something. The rest just looked for a grade and threw out the paper…or at best maybe skimmed comments looking for praise and ignored everything else.

I might have at most 5-10% of students who acted upon suggestions even when I gave time to do revisions and rewriting in class.

So, of those 20 hours…only 1 hour actually had any impact on student achievement. I literally gave up that many hours every week that I could have spent with my friends, family, fitness, and my own goals and joys…all
Of which I neglected because I was constantly grading papers.

Now, if I were to go back (and if I could turn back time and get back those literally YEARS of my life I lost trying to earn gold stars for being a great English teacher) I would give just a grade and would conference with students in class who asked. Each student could get 5-10 mins and 3 actionable tips for improvement. All in the school day. They’d be able to revise. Win/win.

Teaching DOWN to those who don't care is not the answer. That's not fulfilling your job to the kids who do care.

Your complaints are valid and understandable, and the posts of other teachers on here are also appalling to read in terms of how the kids treat them, but you're lumping all the kids together. That's disrespectful also. And handing them some verbose, unhelpful "rubric" with a number on it is not teaching them. It's not. I was a writing instructor for awhile -and I did the margin comments and red ink write ups for my classes b/c it is the most useful feedback- and these things are useless.

So, your solution is not a solution. But I'd be interested in hearing from teachers what the solution is. Because at this point, why even give assignments. Most kids (in other than the fact-based subjects like math) are not getting meaningful feedback and learning the material to their abilities, and then college professors, employers, etc. complain that "kids can't write" or "kids aren't capable of analyzing" problems. Well. . . . that's b/c you don't learn that from a rubric.

Well, you are not resign very closely. This actually IS a solution. No margin comments….there is no need to do for 149 students what is useful only to 5 of them. The fact that you were a “writing instructor” and wrote margin notes that you felt were effective doesn’t mean they actually ARE effective.It actually does mean that. I've seen it first hand through teaching, grading/commenting and meeting with students.

My HS students were honest, for the most part. And the vast majority would admit they didn’t care or pay attention to the comments. Just the grade. "Vast majority." Ok. Whatever you need to tell yourself.

Rubrics don’t teach writing. But writers become better writers the more they write and have a real audience who gives feedback on their writing. NOT assessment feedback from a teacher. Real feedback from a real audience. Lazy and false.

A good writing teacher would assign FAR more than she could ever read, much less comment on. A great English teacher would spend time creating real writing opportunities for students, planning effective lessons, and guiding students toward developing lots of first drafts into a few final drafts.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Also my understanding is that 5th, 8th, and 3nd of course no longer require actual essays like they used to
https://www.doe.virginia.gov/teaching-learnin...ol-writing-resources

8th grade test still requires an essay. However, they are piloting a reading/writing test for 8th grade for next year. Not sure how much writing will be on it.

My point. There is no writing these teachers need to teach. So there is less writing to teach. And honestly chat gtp can probably give feedback in the margins if teachers don’t want to do it.

Most teachers do not have summers off as they work multiple jobs. They do not make enough money to take a two month vacation.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
NP. Then it sounds like it is time for you to move on. Your complaints sound valid. But, moving on, you'd be happier, or at least less bitter. And maybe the kids would get the meaningful feedback that they need from someone who still wants to be there.

I’m not the person you replied to but lol how clueless. Teachers moving on is what’s causing the problem. The mythical person you want to teach your kids isn’t coming and the more that leave the faster those remain burn out and leave too, and all that will be left are the teachers that can’t leave and those are generally not the ones you want. People with all the right training as well as infinite passion in the face of awful conditions does not exist at the scale FCPS needs.

Not clueless. It's spot on. Plenty of teachers at my kid's school are stellar. and have found a way to make it work and work well Then there are the ones that are not and have not (luckily for us that has been the exception not the rule). And we'd all be happier, them and us, if they just moved on. Conditions are not changing in the way that teachers want them to and so the "survival of the fittest" is going to have to act to cull out those who don't like the current situation. And let's face it, even paying more isn't going to fix those things.

Whatever.

I only have a few more years in FCPS. So in the end, this is not going to affect us. So, if you all want to go around hurling insults at parents for what are LEGITIMATE concerns, have at it. Literally, I don't care.

Those stellar teachers who make it work? They are sacrificing their nights and weekends. They just aren’t telling you that. Teachers who will “make it work and work well” give up their work / life balance.

Survival of the fittest? I don’t want my job to be a “survival” situation. Your word choice alone shows what you really think of teachers. We are expected to martyr ourselves: just shut up and take the conditions, or be “weak” and leave.

But by your own admission: you don’t care. I am not one of the posters hurling insults at parents, but I am a teacher who endures tons FROM parents on DCUM. I have to remind myself that most parents aren’t as disrespectful as what I see here.

- stellar teacher here

Well, good for you. I stand by my comments and some of the others on here. And, with only a few years left, no I really don't care. And as for "work/life" you have all summer off and are not the only profession that struggles with that. So, I really don't want to hear it.

I’m the PP.

I do not have summers off. I need to work a 2nd job because my pay isn’t sufficient. I also put in many unpaid hours prepping for the next year. I easily work 80 unpaid hours each summer.

You “don’t want to hear it.” Fine. Then don’t visit this thread. We take enough abuse as teachers, so there’s really no need for you to come here and pile it on.

It’s a good life lesson: If you have nothing nice to say…

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
NP. Then it sounds like it is time for you to move on. Your complaints sound valid. But, moving on, you'd be happier, or at least less bitter. And maybe the kids would get the meaningful feedback that they need from someone who still wants to be there.

I’m not the person you replied to but lol how clueless. Teachers moving on is what’s causing the problem. The mythical person you want to teach your kids isn’t coming and the more that leave the faster those remain burn out and leave too, and all that will be left are the teachers that can’t leave and those are generally not the ones you want. People with all the right training as well as infinite passion in the face of awful conditions does not exist at the scale FCPS needs.

Not clueless. It's spot on. Plenty of teachers at my kid's school are stellar. and have found a way to make it work and work well Then there are the ones that are not and have not (luckily for us that has been the exception not the rule). And we'd all be happier, them and us, if they just moved on. Conditions are not changing in the way that teachers want them to and so the "survival of the fittest" is going to have to act to cull out those who don't like the current situation. And let's face it, even paying more isn't going to fix those things.

Whatever.

I only have a few more years in FCPS. So in the end, this is not going to affect us. So, if you all want to go around hurling insults at parents for what are LEGITIMATE concerns, have at it. Literally, I don't care.

Those stellar teachers who make it work? They are sacrificing their nights and weekends. They just aren’t telling you that. Teachers who will “make it work and work well” give up their work / life balance.

Survival of the fittest? I don’t want my job to be a “survival” situation. Your word choice alone shows what you really think of teachers. We are expected to martyr ourselves: just shut up and take the conditions, or be “weak” and leave.

But by your own admission: you don’t care. I am not one of the posters hurling insults at parents, but I am a teacher who endures tons FROM parents on DCUM. I have to remind myself that most parents aren’t as disrespectful as what I see here.

- stellar teacher here

Well, good for you. I stand by my comments and some of the others on here. And, with only a few years left, no I really don't care. And as for "work/life" you have all summer off and are not the only profession that struggles with that. So, I really don't want to hear it.

I’m the PP.

I do not have summers off. I need to work a 2nd job because my pay isn’t sufficient. I also put in many unpaid hours prepping for the next year. I easily work 80 unpaid hours each summer.

You “don’t want to hear it.” Fine. Then don’t visit this thread. We take enough abuse as teachers, so there’s really no need for you to come here and pile it on.

It’s a good life lesson: If you have nothing nice to say…

Take your own advice. And anyone can visit what they choose.

Your issue is you don't like to be told you are not doing the full extent of your job. I get it. I wouldn't like it either. But that doesn't mean that the posters on here have not raised valid points. You just want to complain, throw a tantrum, etc. and have people say "it's ok that you do the minimum." It's not.

I know many teachers. None have second jobs other than maybe a fun one at Jiffy Lube so they can watch free concerts. Not one. They are traveling. HItting the pools. Beaches, etc. And good for them. They should be. So I'm always curious about these posts on here where they are all supposedly having second and third jobs . . . . And in any event, I have known LOTS of of people with multiple jobs. I used to be one of them.

[Anonymous]

NP. It's shocking how many judgemental, second-guessing comments there are on this thread from people who clearly have never spent a day in the classroom. No wonder people are leaving teaching in droves.
Some of you wouldn't last a day in today's classrooms.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:NP. It's shocking how many judgemental, second-guessing comments there are on this thread from people who clearly have never spent a day in the classroom. No wonder people are leaving teaching in droves.
Some of you wouldn't last a day in today's classrooms.

Agree. I think not providing feedback is a serious problem but the cause is not bad or lazy teachers, it's the way schools are currently set up. And partly the cause is bad students, which is caused by bad parents, at least some of whom should know better.

Parents complain and teachers complain but neither complain to the right people. Complaining to each other helps no one.

[Anonymous]

There is no requirement to provide margin writing in Fairfax. You do have to give a grade and have something to show why you gave that grade. That's it. There is only one writing SOL in all of K-12 grade. This is a fake issue. It's completely optional and no teacher has to do it.

[Anonymous]

Even the catholic schools have a rubric and grade per the rubric without margin writing. Their rubrics are often more precise so that it's easy to see what area was weak in the writing. Kids can make appointments to go over writing during their free period. This is a non issue for teachers and students.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
NP. Then it sounds like it is time for you to move on. Your complaints sound valid. But, moving on, you'd be happier, or at least less bitter. And maybe the kids would get the meaningful feedback that they need from someone who still wants to be there.

I’m not the person you replied to but lol how clueless. Teachers moving on is what’s causing the problem. The mythical person you want to teach your kids isn’t coming and the more that leave the faster those remain burn out and leave too, and all that will be left are the teachers that can’t leave and those are generally not the ones you want. People with all the right training as well as infinite passion in the face of awful conditions does not exist at the scale FCPS needs.

Not clueless. It's spot on. Plenty of teachers at my kid's school are stellar. and have found a way to make it work and work well Then there are the ones that are not and have not (luckily for us that has been the exception not the rule). And we'd all be happier, them and us, if they just moved on. Conditions are not changing in the way that teachers want them to and so the "survival of the fittest" is going to have to act to cull out those who don't like the current situation. And let's face it, even paying more isn't going to fix those things.

Whatever.

I only have a few more years in FCPS. So in the end, this is not going to affect us. So, if you all want to go around hurling insults at parents for what are LEGITIMATE concerns, have at it. Literally, I don't care.

Those stellar teachers who make it work? They are sacrificing their nights and weekends. They just aren’t telling you that. Teachers who will “make it work and work well” give up their work / life balance.

Survival of the fittest? I don’t want my job to be a “survival” situation. Your word choice alone shows what you really think of teachers. We are expected to martyr ourselves: just shut up and take the conditions, or be “weak” and leave.

But by your own admission: you don’t care. I am not one of the posters hurling insults at parents, but I am a teacher who endures tons FROM parents on DCUM. I have to remind myself that most parents aren’t as disrespectful as what I see here.

- stellar teacher here

Well, good for you. I stand by my comments and some of the others on here. And, with only a few years left, no I really don't care. And as for "work/life" you have all summer off and are not the only profession that struggles with that. So, I really don't want to hear it.

I’m the PP.

I do not have summers off. I need to work a 2nd job because my pay isn’t sufficient. I also put in many unpaid hours prepping for the next year. I easily work 80 unpaid hours each summer.

You “don’t want to hear it.” Fine. Then don’t visit this thread. We take enough abuse as teachers, so there’s really no need for you to come here and pile it on.

It’s a good life lesson: If you have nothing nice to say…

Take your own advice. And anyone can visit what they choose.

Your issue is you don't like to be told you are not doing the full extent of your job. I get it. I wouldn't like it either. But that doesn't mean that the posters on here have not raised valid points. You just want to complain, throw a tantrum, etc. and have people say "it's ok that you do the minimum." It's not.

I know many teachers. None have second jobs other than maybe a fun one at Jiffy Lube so they can watch free concerts. Not one. They are traveling. HItting the pools. Beaches, etc. And good for them. They should be. So I'm always curious about these posts on here where they are all supposedly having second and third jobs . . . . And in any event, I have known LOTS of of people with multiple jobs. I used to be one of them.

I'm the PP and I am going to clarify your major misconception. First: I said nothing mean. You're welcome to check. Second: My issue is that doing my job takes 60 hours a week. I leave meticulous comments and many of them. I have my students reflect and revise, and then I comment AGAIN. So your assumption that I am lazy is wrong, unnecessary, and (I suspect) stems from a place of extreme ignorance.

This is why I'm planning on quitting. I do everything right, work my tail off, and then I get criticized for commenting on the fact it's hard work. Heck, I didn't even complain. I simply commented.

And your comment about teachers having these lazy summers? You realize we have different situations, correct? Some of us are single mothers and have to provide for a whole family on our salary. Some of us need second and third jobs. You claim you used to be in a similar situation. Perhaps it's time for you to find some kindness then? Remember what it was like?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
NP. Then it sounds like it is time for you to move on. Your complaints sound valid. But, moving on, you'd be happier, or at least less bitter. And maybe the kids would get the meaningful feedback that they need from someone who still wants to be there.

I’m not the person you replied to but lol how clueless. Teachers moving on is what’s causing the problem. The mythical person you want to teach your kids isn’t coming and the more that leave the faster those remain burn out and leave too, and all that will be left are the teachers that can’t leave and those are generally not the ones you want. People with all the right training as well as infinite passion in the face of awful conditions does not exist at the scale FCPS needs.

Not clueless. It's spot on. Plenty of teachers at my kid's school are stellar. and have found a way to make it work and work well Then there are the ones that are not and have not (luckily for us that has been the exception not the rule). And we'd all be happier, them and us, if they just moved on. Conditions are not changing in the way that teachers want them to and so the "survival of the fittest" is going to have to act to cull out those who don't like the current situation. And let's face it, even paying more isn't going to fix those things.

Whatever.

I only have a few more years in FCPS. So in the end, this is not going to affect us. So, if you all want to go around hurling insults at parents for what are LEGITIMATE concerns, have at it. Literally, I don't care.

Those stellar teachers who make it work? They are sacrificing their nights and weekends. They just aren’t telling you that. Teachers who will “make it work and work well” give up their work / life balance.

Survival of the fittest? I don’t want my job to be a “survival” situation. Your word choice alone shows what you really think of teachers. We are expected to martyr ourselves: just shut up and take the conditions, or be “weak” and leave.

But by your own admission: you don’t care. I am not one of the posters hurling insults at parents, but I am a teacher who endures tons FROM parents on DCUM. I have to remind myself that most parents aren’t as disrespectful as what I see here.

- stellar teacher here

Well, good for you. I stand by my comments and some of the others on here. And, with only a few years left, no I really don't care. And as for "work/life" you have all summer off and are not the only profession that struggles with that. So, I really don't want to hear it.

I’m the PP.

I do not have summers off. I need to work a 2nd job because my pay isn’t sufficient. I also put in many unpaid hours prepping for the next year. I easily work 80 unpaid hours each summer.

You “don’t want to hear it.” Fine. Then don’t visit this thread. We take enough abuse as teachers, so there’s really no need for you to come here and pile it on.

It’s a good life lesson: If you have nothing nice to say…

Take your own advice. And anyone can visit what they choose.

Your issue is you don't like to be told you are not doing the full extent of your job. I get it. I wouldn't like it either. But that doesn't mean that the posters on here have not raised valid points. You just want to complain, throw a tantrum, etc. and have people say "it's ok that you do the minimum." It's not.

I know many teachers. None have second jobs other than maybe a fun one at Jiffy Lube so they can watch free concerts. Not one. They are traveling. HItting the pools. Beaches, etc. And good for them. They should be. So I'm always curious about these posts on here where they are all supposedly having second and third jobs . . . . And in any event, I have known LOTS of of people with multiple jobs. I used to be one of them.

I'm the PP and I am going to clarify your major misconception. First: I said nothing mean. You're welcome to check. Second: My issue is that doing my job takes 60 hours a week. I leave meticulous comments and many of them. I have my students reflect and revise, and then I comment AGAIN. So your assumption that I am lazy is wrong, unnecessary, and (I suspect) stems from a place of extreme ignorance.

This is why I'm planning on quitting. I do everything right, work my tail off, and then I get criticized for commenting on the fact it's hard work. Heck, I didn't even complain. I simply commented.

And your comment about teachers having these lazy summers? You realize we have different situations, correct? Some of us are single mothers and have to provide for a whole family on our salary. Some of us need second and third jobs. You claim you used to be in a similar situation. Perhaps it's time for you to find some kindness then? Remember what it was like?

DP. I agree that this thread has been combative in a lot of posts. It sounds like you are a teacher who provides student feedback albeit one who is unsustainably overworked. So there is a serious problem but in your case it is not providing no feedback to students, therefore the complaint isn't about you. Your complaint is different.

[Anonymous]

Complaining about the lack of margin comments is the new way of complaining about how math is being taught differently now. The truth is the standards and expectations in school districts have been lowered while student and parent behaviors have also escalated, resulting in subpar education across the board. But parents want to pin that directly on teachers so they gripe about stupid stuff like “they no longer carry the one” and “I don’t see red pen comments in the margin of papers.” That’s not the issue.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Also my understanding is that 5th, 8th, and 3nd of course no longer require actual essays like they used to
https://www.doe.virginia.gov/teaching-learnin...ol-writing-resources

8th grade test still requires an essay. However, they are piloting a reading/writing test for 8th grade for next year. Not sure how much writing will be on it.

My point. There is no writing these teachers need to teach. So there is less writing to teach. And honestly chat gtp can probably give feedback in the margins if teachers don’t want to do it.

Most teachers do not have summers off as they work multiple jobs. They do not make enough money to take a two month vacation.

Who does?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I normally skip over all the FCPS/teacher bashing posts here, but the one post about teachers not providing feedback really got me thinking.

If the new norm is that teachers just put a score in the grade book and it’s on the student to come talk to the teachers to understand why they got that score, we have a serious problem. I can’t imagine not getting an essay back that I wrote without any feedback on how to improve my writing. Let alone a math test…

This is a core function to learning in my opinion and not something that can just be done away with or on a request only basis.

Teachers say this is because they are overworked and have too many students. The lack of teachers at the moment probably isn’t making this any easier. And with all the mud being thrown in their face on a daily basis, I can’t imagine anyone would want to go into teaching. So now we have a retention and recruiting problem…

At some point someone needs to throw up the red flag on a national level and turn this ship around. And by that I mean addressing the real issues and not these BS “CRT” and “GET THE PORN OUT OF SCHOOLS” distractions. The real issues i see are:

1. Retention- (fix this by better pay, benefits)
2. Recruiting- this is a nationwide issue. Perhaps full ride scholarships for teachers like the military does with ROTC. No one wants to go into student debt to get treated like a subhuman
3. Morale- give the teachers their dignity back. They are professionals and should be treated as such. No, Karen, just because you have children in school does not mean the teachers work for you or you should be able to dictate how they run their classroom. They are public servants - like police or judges. Treat them with respect.
4. State Testing- just get rid of it already. It takes away from the students learning and puts pressure on teachers to only teach towards the test (this is what happens when you tie teacher raises and school funding to test scores). Let’s be honest- rich people care about it because the high test scores affect their property value. We don’t need to be making decisions about public education to benefit some rich people and their property values

I’m sure there are a lot of other problems, but this really jumped out to me. Just my thoughts. And this isn’t just high school- my middle schooler also hasn’t received feedback on assignments all year

I agree with you on most points but as a former high school English teacher who left the profession because I was working 60-80 hours a week and still never done:

I absolutely support teachers not writing in margins of papers. Seriously. For the vast majority of students it is a complete waste of time. I’d spend hours and hours writing detailed feedback…let’s say, 10 mins per student x 120 students = 20 hours of work. 20 hours! And I got 5 hours is planning time per week to plan all of my lessons, not even counting grading. So it was never done, and I was always feeling inadequate and a failure and stressed.

Of those 120 students, fewer than 10 would actually read the comments, and maybe 5 per assignment might ask for the chance to re-write something. The rest just looked for a grade and threw out the paper…or at best maybe skimmed comments looking for praise and ignored everything else.

I might have at most 5-10% of students who acted upon suggestions even when I gave time to do revisions and rewriting in class.

So, of those 20 hours…only 1 hour actually had any impact on student achievement. I literally gave up that many hours every week that I could have spent with my friends, family, fitness, and my own goals and joys…all
Of which I neglected because I was constantly grading papers.

Now, if I were to go back (and if I could turn back time and get back those literally YEARS of my life I lost trying to earn gold stars for being a great English teacher) I would give just a grade and would conference with students in class who asked. Each student could get 5-10 mins and 3 actionable tips for improvement. All in the school day. They’d be able to revise. Win/win.

Virginia state law says secondary teachers are to have 20:1 students per teacher. English is just a lot more writing and time. But fcps gets away with not doing this somehow. All classes are not equal and English should have smaller classes than the other core classes

20:1 is in a classroom. Teachers teach multiple sections

I am astonished that you just had to explain that to an adult.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I teach HS science and saw about 90 students today. I asked how many wanted to be a teacher and not a single hand went up. I asked them why not and they just started laughing because they know what the job requires, but they continue to joke around and hold side conversations, play on phones, watch cartoons on laptops they are "using to see the notes better", etc. I had multiple students write passes to the bathroom today only to be gone for 20 minutes, out of a 90 min period. I don't have time to write emails to parents about behavior that, despite parents speaking with their students, does not change. I actually had a student today take a phone back off of my desk after I confiscated it while my back was turned. I'm one of the teachers kids say they really want to get for my subject. I still get incredible levels of disrespect every day.

This made me so sad to read. I am so sorry for you. Thank you for continuing to teach despite what you have to endure because you ARE making a difference in many of these kids lives, I assure you. Hugs.

I am sorry too-this is not ok.

I just want to back up everything they said. I teach English and I would say I am well liked and seen as a good teacher to have among the kids generally but they just do not respect anyone. Not eachother and not us. I had a student go in my work bag recently and take a whole pack of gum. Actually multiple colleagues had small stuff like this taken. When we confront the kid they just say “it’s not a big deal it’s like $3.” They’re kinda like little boomers honestly … everyone else’s feelings don’t matter, they’re going to do what they want. I came home and cried a few weeks ago to my husband about what has happened when I used to love this job so much. I don’t think most adults can even imagine what it’s really like in a high school these days , even for the good teachers who the kids generally enjoy and admire.

And if you report to the parent(s), the vast majority blow it off and excuse it away. The many bad apples don’t fall far from rotten trees.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I teach HS science and saw about 90 students today. I asked how many wanted to be a teacher and not a single hand went up. I asked them why not and they just started laughing because they know what the job requires, but they continue to joke around and hold side conversations, play on phones, watch cartoons on laptops they are "using to see the notes better", etc. I had multiple students write passes to the bathroom today only to be gone for 20 minutes, out of a 90 min period. I don't have time to write emails to parents about behavior that, despite parents speaking with their students, does not change. I actually had a student today take a phone back off of my desk after I confiscated it while my back was turned. I'm one of the teachers kids say they really want to get for my subject. I still get incredible levels of disrespect every day.

You saw 90 students today, and I’m assuming will see another 40 tomorrow. It sounds like part of them problem is pure math- there are too many students per teacher for meaningful feedback to occur. If a high school teacher has 125 students on their case load, we are looking at over 2 hours to give each student 1 minute of feedback. Class sizes need to dramatically drop for things to be sustainable.

So assuming you’re cool with the massive tax hike this will require?

No, I didn’t think so.