Is dual-enrollment a scam?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think the thing you have to be careful with is using the DE class for high school credit. Then it may not transfer. That’s the catch.

Your student may not NEED the high school credit because they’ve taken high school classes in middle school so the DE can transfer.

Just read all the details before making decisions.

That’s not an accurate statement at all. It’s called DUAL CREDIT because it counts toward both at the same time (assuming the college has it in their approved credit list).

Ok … my bad. I think maybe there is a distinction in counting toward GPA? I remember some sort of difference that mattered to us when DD did this. Not trying to post misinformation. I do remember a lot of details to understand before signing up but the advisors were extremely helpful.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think the thing you have to be careful with is using the DE class for high school credit. Then it may not transfer. That’s the catch.

Your student may not NEED the high school credit because they’ve taken high school classes in middle school so the DE can transfer.

Just read all the details before making decisions.

That’s not an accurate statement at all. It’s called DUAL CREDIT because it counts toward both at the same time (assuming the college has it in their approved credit list).

Ok … my bad. I think maybe there is a distinction in counting toward GPA? I remember some sort of difference that mattered to us when DD did this. Not trying to post misinformation. I do remember a lot of details to understand before signing up but the advisors were extremely helpful.

Same PP here … we had DD take the DE course but not apply toward HS credit. This was because she wanted to go OOS and they were more likely to take a transfer course that was not used for HS credit. And they did take the 3 credits thankfully. So it all worked out for her. She had some extra room because of taking HS math and foreign language in middle school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Dual enrollment is for kids to get college credit. Some kids have topped out at what their school has to offer, so they go to MC for a math, science etc… class they want/need. A lot of schools may not take an AP credit, but more take an actual college credit. It also looks more impressive on a college application as its a real college class, which is more rigorous than an AP class. Most other counties in MD (and other states) have many more kids doing this than MCPS does.

I would not place a community college class above an AP class. How many kids have topped out HS classes in the area where tons of APs are offered.

There's probably not a meaningful difference in terms of curriculum but there's definitely a difference in expectations and discipline. I'm stunned at the generosity afforded to kids to turn in assignments late and do retakes in AP/IB classes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Dual enrollment is for kids to get college credit. Some kids have topped out at what their school has to offer, so they go to MC for a math, science etc… class they want/need. A lot of schools may not take an AP credit, but more take an actual college credit. It also looks more impressive on a college application as its a real college class, which is more rigorous than an AP class. Most other counties in MD (and other states) have many more kids doing this than MCPS does.

I would not place a community college class above an AP class. How many kids have topped out HS classes in the area where tons of APs are offered.

This. Kids I know who have done both say that AP classes are harder than the MC classes

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Two years of less learning is a good thing? I guess if you are just trying to check a box

Well yeah, that is why most people go to college. Going to college for “learning” and “the experience” is a privilege. Most kids can’t afford four years of it without significant student loans.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Two years of less learning is a good thing? I guess if you are just trying to check a box

Two years of less college-tuition-paying is a good thing, yes. Speaking as a person who is about to write another big check this afternoon, which I am fortunately able to afford.

[Anonymous]

One of my kids is in MC2 and does a mix of AP and dual enrollment. The other is at another school and taking dual enrollment. Neither felt pressured by teachers or MCPS in choosing this path. Neither is missing out on high school experiences. The one in MC2 was financially motivated to avoid college debt. The other wanted to be able to study things his HS doesn’t offer.

[Anonymous]

Many county kids have tapped out of the math available at their school, and go to MC for a higher math. It’s not just the magnet schools in any way. Only a handful of schools have Multivariable, so I have known many who go on to MC. At my kids school, most of the juniors I know are already above what MCPS requires credit wise to graduate, so they might as well get College credit. And this year it is FREE so its a win!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think the thing you have to be careful with is using the DE class for high school credit. Then it may not transfer. That’s the catch.

Your student may not NEED the high school credit because they’ve taken high school classes in middle school so the DE can transfer.

Just read all the details before making decisions.

That’s not an accurate statement at all. It’s called DUAL CREDIT because it counts toward both at the same time (assuming the college has it in their approved credit list).

No... colleges force you to choose - is the class a high school class (then it shows you are taking advanced classes, can place you in higher level courses in college, etc., but you are still a freshman admit) OR is the class a college class, contributing to an Associates' degree (then you receive college credit), but are usually applying as a transfer student. You don't get to count it as high school and then still graduate in two years.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Dual enrollment is for kids to get college credit. Some kids have topped out at what their school has to offer, so they go to MC for a math, science etc… class they want/need. A lot of schools may not take an AP credit, but more take an actual college credit. It also looks more impressive on a college application as its a real college class, which is more rigorous than an AP class. Most other counties in MD (and other states) have many more kids doing this than MCPS does.

I would not place a community college class above an AP class. How many kids have topped out HS classes in the area where tons of APs are offered.

There's probably not a meaningful difference in terms of curriculum but there's definitely a difference in expectations and discipline. I'm stunned at the generosity afforded to kids to turn in assignments late and do retakes in AP/IB classes.

This has been a fairly recent phenomenon. Typically AP courses at a strong MCPS high school would easily surpass the difficulty at MC. I have had many students do both over the years.

[Anonymous]

This is long term thinking but it also is helpful for those who pursue a CPA or some other licenses requiring a certain number of higher education credits. For the CPA, you usulaly need to take more credits than a four year college provides, but you can count college credits earned during high school. Some people were saying they would want their child to have a full four year college experience anyway, but the benefit of APs / IBs / college credit is bypassing large introductory lecture courses and going to the smaller advanced courses. Also, some schools allow you to do a master's for your fourth year if you have completed your undergrad requirements, so your child could still stay on campus for four years with their friends but get an advanced degree.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This is long term thinking but it also is helpful for those who pursue a CPA or some other licenses requiring a certain number of higher education credits. For the CPA, you usulaly need to take more credits than a four year college provides, but you can count college credits earned during high school. Some people were saying they would want their child to have a full four year college experience anyway, but the benefit of APs / IBs / college credit is bypassing large introductory lecture courses and going to the smaller advanced courses. Also, some schools allow you to do a master's for your fourth year if you have completed your undergrad requirements, so your child could still stay on campus for four years with their friends but get an advanced degree.

+1

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This is long term thinking but it also is helpful for those who pursue a CPA or some other licenses requiring a certain number of higher education credits. For the CPA, you usulaly need to take more credits than a four year college provides, but you can count college credits earned during high school. Some people were saying they would want their child to have a full four year college experience anyway, but the benefit of APs / IBs / college credit is bypassing large introductory lecture courses and going to the smaller advanced courses. Also, some schools allow you to do a master's for your fourth year if you have completed your undergrad requirements, so your child could still stay on campus for four years with their friends but get an advanced degree.

OP here. Thank you. I appreciate this example. It's helpful.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's very good for lower income families who cannot afford 4 years of college easily. It also allows you to go in as a transfer student vs. freshman. There are advantages and we consider it but heard too many negative things.

This is actually not always true - dual enrollment students are often still considered freshman. Umd, for example, only considers dual enrollment students transfers if they complete additional college credits post high school graduation.

Faculty at some local OOS schools have noted the DE students are not socially ready for the college experience - academically they may have covered the material, but they have seen much better results with the 2 years of CC and a transfer into a major (like engineering) over the HS DE experience an attending college. So yes it can save money, but the kids have struggles having missed those HS years with their peers.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's very good for lower income families who cannot afford 4 years of college easily. It also allows you to go in as a transfer student vs. freshman. There are advantages and we consider it but heard too many negative things.

This is actually not always true - dual enrollment students are often still considered freshman. Umd, for example, only considers dual enrollment students transfers if they complete additional college credits post high school graduation.

Faculty at some local OOS schools have noted the DE students are not socially ready for the college experience - academically they may have covered the material, but they have seen much better results with the 2 years of CC and a transfer into a major (like engineering) over the HS DE experience an attending college. So yes it can save money, but the kids have struggles having missed those HS years with their peers.

I certainly expect faculty to feel threatened by DE. They need four years of enrollment from every student to keep their jobs.