Taylor Swift is awful (and her music isn't even very good)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not only are her lyrics perpetually self-focused, they are also increasingly inauthentic as she continues to write songs as though she is a perpetually unlucky-in-love, middle class, millennial woman starring in a 90s rom com. She writes from the perspective of her fans, not from her own lived experience, and it shows:

(from "Paris" on Midnights, 2022): "Stumbled down pretend alleys, cheap wine, make believe it's champagne, I was taken by the view."

When was the last time Taylor Swift ran around with a guy drinking cheap wine and pretending it was champagne, and was "taken" by the view in a city like Paris? When she wrote this song, she was a multi-millionaire juggernaut with a host of Grammy's, a massive portfolio of homes, had been to Paris many times. When has Swift EVER had to drink cheap wine on a date? She dates successful musicians, actors, and athletes and is herself wealthy and successful.

It just doesn't ring true. It feels like what you write when you are intentionally trying to evoke a moment that the typical 30 year old, middle class, woman will relate to. But it's not real for her.

I don't understand what the point is for her to writing songs like this. I don't believe that came from her heart or was ripped from her actual journal. It feels like a calculated piece of fan service. And a lot of her music feels like this. There are exceptions (Antihero certainly feels like an authentic self reflection of her real life) but a lot of it sounds like this. I'd rather she took a looooong break and wrote an entire album like Antihero and dropped this "I'm just a girls, standing in front of a boy, asking him to love her" schtick. But it to bed. She's done it. It's not who she is (I actually don't really think it's who she ever was, I think it's always been a bit of a put on) and there's no more need for more Swift songs like this in the world.

I would like her a lot more if she released less music and toured less, but what she released was more interesting, more innovative, more creative. I think she has the capacity for it but she has chosen to go the route of making as much money as she can. That's fine and a perfectly acceptable choice. But it's not one I respect *artistically*. I don't think it results in great work. I think it undermines the quality of her music.

You say a lot about a person you don't like..lol
You don't have to like but why not just ignore? How would you like it if we harped on something you loved? Clearly, millions around the world love her. Why not say it isnt for me? Why gaslight fans?

Literally nothing I wrote has anything to do with how I feel about Swift personally. I feel pretty neutral on her as a person. What you are reading is music criticism. When someone creates art and puts it out in the world for other people's consumption, it's normal for people to judge it and discuss its value as art. I'm saying that I think Swift's music often lacks artistic value. I'm not gaslighting anyone, I'm sharing my opinion.

What are your thoughts on Evermore and Folklore?

NP but I found it weird that she created *teenage* personas when she was more than a decade older.

I don't know that the persona on evermore is supposed to be a teenager, but I did find her to be... boring. Like Taylor Swift if she hadn't made it big so early, basically.

I get SO BORED of the songs about the hometown loves and all the descriptions of people breaking up. For real, how many breakup songs has Taylor Swift written. I have been through several terrible breakups and I get the appeal of the breakup song and can even relate to some of hers. But it's the same song over and over with slightly different lyrics and a slightly different tune. It's always some faceless dude who doesn't quite get her and she's not perfect, okay? no one is. And then it's like a list of little details from earlier in their relationship when it was good times but, ho ho ho, here are some details from their breakup and they're similar in a sad way. How many times does Swift have to write this?

You know how there are people who will relate absolutely everything back to Harry Potter books, and people get annoyed and eventually it's like, READ ANOTHER BOOK. That's how I feel about Taylor Swift. I want to read another book. I'm tired of this one.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is old but I just came across it and it sums up everything I can't stand about Taylor Swift:

https://www.thedailybeast.com/reputation-reveals-a-taylor-swift-obsessed-with-fame-money-and-revenge?ref=scroll

I know this will provoke a bunch of Swifties to come and yell at me and say I'm a misogyinist, just jealous, or demand to know why I can't just let other people love things. So I'll defend myself in advance even though I know it won't matter:

1) Criticizing Taylor Swift is not misogyny but she works hard to make sure it looks that way by embracing a very specific brand of girl-power feminism so that if people criticize her, she can play the victim. It's a kind of feminism available only to pretty, rich white women with lots of pretty, rich female friends. Also, don't yell at me for criticizing someone who is "young" and "still learning." She's 32. She likes to play the victim and pretend she's just a teenage nerd with no friends, but as the link above discusses, this is an act designed to garner sympathy and, most importantly, sales.

2) I probably am jealous. But I'm not JUST jealous. I also have a point.

3) People can like whatever they want but I can also dislike whatever I want, and I really, really dislike Taylor Swift and needed to share it with the world today.

Now we can add racist to you as well

I do think there is a racial element at work here and a desire to cancel without any fuel for their fire. People fall just short of calling her racist based on her conventional blonde prettiness. The fact that she isn’t vulgar is evidently infuriating because it quietly indicts artists whose entire catalogue and presentation is based on sexual provocation.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is old but I just came across it and it sums up everything I can't stand about Taylor Swift:

https://www.thedailybeast.com/reputation-reveals-a-taylor-swift-obsessed-with-fame-money-and-revenge?ref=scroll

I know this will provoke a bunch of Swifties to come and yell at me and say I'm a misogyinist, just jealous, or demand to know why I can't just let other people love things. So I'll defend myself in advance even though I know it won't matter:

1) Criticizing Taylor Swift is not misogyny but she works hard to make sure it looks that way by embracing a very specific brand of girl-power feminism so that if people criticize her, she can play the victim. It's a kind of feminism available only to pretty, rich white women with lots of pretty, rich female friends. Also, don't yell at me for criticizing someone who is "young" and "still learning." She's 32. She likes to play the victim and pretend she's just a teenage nerd with no friends, but as the link above discusses, this is an act designed to garner sympathy and, most importantly, sales.

2) I probably am jealous. But I'm not JUST jealous. I also have a point.

3) People can like whatever they want but I can also dislike whatever I want, and I really, really dislike Taylor Swift and needed to share it with the world today.

Now we can add racist to you as well

I do think there is a racial element at work here and a desire to cancel without any fuel for their fire. People fall just short of calling her racist based on her conventional blonde prettiness. The fact that she isn’t vulgar is evidently infuriating because it quietly indicts artists whose entire catalogue and presentation is based on sexual provocation.

^are based.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not only are her lyrics perpetually self-focused, they are also increasingly inauthentic as she continues to write songs as though she is a perpetually unlucky-in-love, middle class, millennial woman starring in a 90s rom com. She writes from the perspective of her fans, not from her own lived experience, and it shows:

(from "Paris" on Midnights, 2022): "Stumbled down pretend alleys, cheap wine, make believe it's champagne, I was taken by the view."

When was the last time Taylor Swift ran around with a guy drinking cheap wine and pretending it was champagne, and was "taken" by the view in a city like Paris? When she wrote this song, she was a multi-millionaire juggernaut with a host of Grammy's, a massive portfolio of homes, had been to Paris many times. When has Swift EVER had to drink cheap wine on a date? She dates successful musicians, actors, and athletes and is herself wealthy and successful.

It just doesn't ring true. It feels like what you write when you are intentionally trying to evoke a moment that the typical 30 year old, middle class, woman will relate to. But it's not real for her.

I don't understand what the point is for her to writing songs like this. I don't believe that came from her heart or was ripped from her actual journal. It feels like a calculated piece of fan service. And a lot of her music feels like this. There are exceptions (Antihero certainly feels like an authentic self reflection of her real life) but a lot of it sounds like this. I'd rather she took a looooong break and wrote an entire album like Antihero and dropped this "I'm just a girls, standing in front of a boy, asking him to love her" schtick. But it to bed. She's done it. It's not who she is (I actually don't really think it's who she ever was, I think it's always been a bit of a put on) and there's no more need for more Swift songs like this in the world.

I would like her a lot more if she released less music and toured less, but what she released was more interesting, more innovative, more creative. I think she has the capacity for it but she has chosen to go the route of making as much money as she can. That's fine and a perfectly acceptable choice. But it's not one I respect *artistically*. I don't think it results in great work. I think it undermines the quality of her music.

Someone above just said she only writes from her own perspective and worldview. Weird.

As for Midnights, what about Snow on the Beach? Vigilante Shit? Lavender Haze? Midnight Rain? Why pick Paris of all of those songs?

Criticism and critically thinking and having different opinions isn’t weitd. It helps people define their likes and dislikes, gives words to feelings and reactions the music/art may evoke and can build on each other.

The PP and I aren’t arguing with each other or against you. We are discussing and refining our opinions.

I wrote the from her own perspective post and can also agree with the PP about her making up stuff that middle Class single white girls can relate to. Makes sense and is still written from her perspective and doesn’t speak to the universality of getting drunk and the feelings behind because she so specifically paints the image of where and when and how it is happening. It isn’t like she is describing calling an ex in the phone (Adele’s hello as an example of another white female
Pop star) which could happen to anyone almost anywhere: the details in Taylor’s songs make you picture her in a movie rather than the universal feeling of falling in love or getting dumped.

So the PP and I are digging into why we dislike Taylor/ why she doesn’t resonate with us. We aren’t trying to win anything or take anything away from u

Ok cool and I was pointing out the opposing criticisms. Also wondering about thoughts on the other songs I named.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
She needs to write at least one really good iconic song that has such good melody and pace that almost everybody knows it. Like Dollys “I will always love you” or Deloris O’Riordens “Linger”,Blondies “Rapture” or Belinda Carlisle’s “Heaven is a place on Earth”

She has a lot of good songs but no really great iconic song with a really smart melody.

Reminds me of this recent Tweet:

I get this but i also agree with the comments. I am happy she stays in her lame. She found something that works for her and that enjoys.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not only are her lyrics perpetually self-focused, they are also increasingly inauthentic as she continues to write songs as though she is a perpetually unlucky-in-love, middle class, millennial woman starring in a 90s rom com. She writes from the perspective of her fans, not from her own lived experience, and it shows:

(from "Paris" on Midnights, 2022): "Stumbled down pretend alleys, cheap wine, make believe it's champagne, I was taken by the view."

When was the last time Taylor Swift ran around with a guy drinking cheap wine and pretending it was champagne, and was "taken" by the view in a city like Paris? When she wrote this song, she was a multi-millionaire juggernaut with a host of Grammy's, a massive portfolio of homes, had been to Paris many times. When has Swift EVER had to drink cheap wine on a date? She dates successful musicians, actors, and athletes and is herself wealthy and successful.

It just doesn't ring true. It feels like what you write when you are intentionally trying to evoke a moment that the typical 30 year old, middle class, woman will relate to. But it's not real for her.

I don't understand what the point is for her to writing songs like this. I don't believe that came from her heart or was ripped from her actual journal. It feels like a calculated piece of fan service. And a lot of her music feels like this. There are exceptions (Antihero certainly feels like an authentic self reflection of her real life) but a lot of it sounds like this. I'd rather she took a looooong break and wrote an entire album like Antihero and dropped this "I'm just a girls, standing in front of a boy, asking him to love her" schtick. But it to bed. She's done it. It's not who she is (I actually don't really think it's who she ever was, I think it's always been a bit of a put on) and there's no more need for more Swift songs like this in the world.

I would like her a lot more if she released less music and toured less, but what she released was more interesting, more innovative, more creative. I think she has the capacity for it but she has chosen to go the route of making as much money as she can. That's fine and a perfectly acceptable choice. But it's not one I respect *artistically*. I don't think it results in great work. I think it undermines the quality of her music.

Someone above just said she only writes from her own perspective and worldview. Weird.

As for Midnights, what about Snow on the Beach? Vigilante Shit? Lavender Haze? Midnight Rain? Why pick Paris of all of those songs?

Criticism and critically thinking and having different opinions isn’t weitd. It helps people define their likes and dislikes, gives words to feelings and reactions the music/art may evoke and can build on each other.

The PP and I aren’t arguing with each other or against you. We are discussing and refining our opinions.

I wrote the from her own perspective post and can also agree with the PP about her making up stuff that middle Class single white girls can relate to. Makes sense and is still written from her perspective and doesn’t speak to the universality of getting drunk and the feelings behind because she so specifically paints the image of where and when and how it is happening. It isn’t like she is describing calling an ex in the phone (Adele’s hello as an example of another white female
Pop star) which could happen to anyone almost anywhere: the details in Taylor’s songs make you picture her in a movie rather than the universal feeling of falling in love or getting dumped.

So the PP and I are digging into why we dislike Taylor/ why she doesn’t resonate with us. We aren’t trying to win anything or take anything away from u

Ok cool and I was pointing out the opposing criticisms. Also wondering about thoughts on the other songs I named.

I don’t know them that well but they all
Seem similarly themed- the writer/speaker is in love or breaking up and has a lot of money. Even if it isn’t Taylor herself the songs are written about the same topic from
The same lens: the speaker in the song fell love and then breaks up- no social
Commentary, and very heavy in concrete imagery, little to no looking into why or what contributed to the break up or how to work through it. Just “woe is me I miss you.”

As an example Maggie rogers, Alaska is a break up song but “cut my hair so I could rock back and forth without thinking of you.” Is a much more mentally healthy and relatable way to describe getting over feelings after a break up. She is clearly processing and moving on and many can relate to getting over someone in this way.

“But if I just showed up at your party would you have me?” That is not healthy it is stalker like AND shows zero processing of any feelings just the heart ache from the speaker: even if the speaker isn’t Taylor it is from the perspective of the speaker in the song.


You just continually see this one perspective and one dimension in her songs. You are given the setting, the main character and the problem will always be love or money. Done- you aren’t imagining or thinking about what she meant.

Speak now: jealous lover insults rival and her family to win back her man on her rivals wedding day (why is it good for young girls to hear this song?)

Champaign problems: rich lady breaks heart

The American dynasty: rich lady parities a lot
because she has money (didn’t Taylor
Buy this house or one next to the Kennedy’s or something ?)

Cardigan- didn’t know this was a song but I can see this worked well for her cardigan sales. I’m not saying she isn’t a marketing genius. Cardigan is a better choice than Britney’s catholic school girl skirt.

Betty: break up as a teenage love experience (either from lesbian or teenage boy perspective)

[Anonymous]

Isn’t this kind of like 40yos saying “we just don’t get and don’t like the Beatles” when they were huge?

She’s not trying to speak to us. She’s not trying to capture the essence of what we are experiencing. Middle aged soccer moms playing 90s rap in their suvs in the pickup like are a great target market for home goods and cleaning products, but we aren’t exactly the target demographic for pop culture

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Not only are her lyrics perpetually self-focused, they are also increasingly inauthentic as she continues to write songs as though she is a perpetually unlucky-in-love, middle class, millennial woman starring in a 90s rom com. She writes from the perspective of her fans, not from her own lived experience, and it shows:

(from "Paris" on Midnights, 2022): "Stumbled down pretend alleys, cheap wine, make believe it's champagne, I was taken by the view."

When was the last time Taylor Swift ran around with a guy drinking cheap wine and pretending it was champagne, and was "taken" by the view in a city like Paris? When she wrote this song, she was a multi-millionaire juggernaut with a host of Grammy's, a massive portfolio of homes, had been to Paris many times. When has Swift EVER had to drink cheap wine on a date? She dates successful musicians, actors, and athletes and is herself wealthy and successful.

It just doesn't ring true. It feels like what you write when you are intentionally trying to evoke a moment that the typical 30 year old, middle class, woman will relate to. But it's not real for her.

I don't understand what the point is for her to writing songs like this. I don't believe that came from her heart or was ripped from her actual journal. It feels like a calculated piece of fan service. And a lot of her music feels like this. There are exceptions (Antihero certainly feels like an authentic self reflection of her real life) but a lot of it sounds like this. I'd rather she took a looooong break and wrote an entire album like Antihero and dropped this "I'm just a girls, standing in front of a boy, asking him to love her" schtick. But it to bed. She's done it. It's not who she is (I actually don't really think it's who she ever was, I think it's always been a bit of a put on) and there's no more need for more Swift songs like this in the world.

I would like her a lot more if she released less music and toured less, but what she released was more interesting, more innovative, more creative. I think she has the capacity for it but she has chosen to go the route of making as much money as she can. That's fine and a perfectly acceptable choice. But it's not one I respect *artistically*. I don't think it results in great work. I think it undermines the quality of her music.

I don’t understand this criticism. I just read and watched the show lessons in chemistry which I really enjoyed. I’m pretty sure the author of that book was never a chemist in the 1950s struggling with sexism in the sciences and then getting a cooking show. But she told the story beautifully and captured some archetypal type themes which I, also not a which I, also not a woman in the 1950s, or in the hard sciences, could relate to beautifully. Which I think is what Taylor does so well.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Isn’t this kind of like 40yos saying “we just don’t get and don’t like the Beatles” when they were huge?

She’s not trying to speak to us. She’s not trying to capture the essence of what we are experiencing. Middle aged soccer moms playing 90s rap in their suvs in the pickup like are a great target market for home goods and cleaning products, but we aren’t exactly the target demographic for pop culture

I get that but then I also see my boss (a 45+ woman) go crazy over her and get puzzled again. Even in my teenage years I was drawn to artists who sang about how to overcome (not just wallow in) heartbreak and social justice themes.

I see it more as she is like an instagram of pop music: she describes one scene/picture jn high detail in each song. So she is a social product of her times that I’m not appreciating. I like more nuance, the ability to imagine different scenarios and think about the larger social and personal implications of the song. That isn’t anything Taylor is offering. I’m sure this could be generational or the fact that I am a first gen white American so I relate differently to American culture in general. Either way, I find her a bit mind numbing and not intriguing. I do find the phenomenon around her very intriguing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not only are her lyrics perpetually self-focused, they are also increasingly inauthentic as she continues to write songs as though she is a perpetually unlucky-in-love, middle class, millennial woman starring in a 90s rom com. She writes from the perspective of her fans, not from her own lived experience, and it shows:

(from "Paris" on Midnights, 2022): "Stumbled down pretend alleys, cheap wine, make believe it's champagne, I was taken by the view."

When was the last time Taylor Swift ran around with a guy drinking cheap wine and pretending it was champagne, and was "taken" by the view in a city like Paris? When she wrote this song, she was a multi-millionaire juggernaut with a host of Grammy's, a massive portfolio of homes, had been to Paris many times. When has Swift EVER had to drink cheap wine on a date? She dates successful musicians, actors, and athletes and is herself wealthy and successful.

It just doesn't ring true. It feels like what you write when you are intentionally trying to evoke a moment that the typical 30 year old, middle class, woman will relate to. But it's not real for her.

I don't understand what the point is for her to writing songs like this. I don't believe that came from her heart or was ripped from her actual journal. It feels like a calculated piece of fan service. And a lot of her music feels like this. There are exceptions (Antihero certainly feels like an authentic self reflection of her real life) but a lot of it sounds like this. I'd rather she took a looooong break and wrote an entire album like Antihero and dropped this "I'm just a girls, standing in front of a boy, asking him to love her" schtick. But it to bed. She's done it. It's not who she is (I actually don't really think it's who she ever was, I think it's always been a bit of a put on) and there's no more need for more Swift songs like this in the world.

I would like her a lot more if she released less music and toured less, but what she released was more interesting, more innovative, more creative. I think she has the capacity for it but she has chosen to go the route of making as much money as she can. That's fine and a perfectly acceptable choice. But it's not one I respect *artistically*. I don't think it results in great work. I think it undermines the quality of her music.

I don’t understand this criticism. I just read and watched the show lessons in chemistry which I really enjoyed. I’m pretty sure the author of that book was never a chemist in the 1950s struggling with sexism in the sciences and then getting a cooking show. But she told the story beautifully and captured some archetypal type themes which I, also not a which I, also not a woman in the 1950s, or in the hard sciences, could relate to beautifully. Which I think is what Taylor does so well.

You are in a way right- I’m posting on the thread but not the poster you are responding to. I just hate Taylor’s themes.
“Look
What you made me do” is awful to me because we are always responsible for our own behavior

Getting revenge on a lover is not ok

Stalking a lover is not ok

End game is equating a person to figure in a chess board and not the way I would want to choose my life partner nor would I want to be chosen that way

Romeo and Juliet died

Even her gay pride video all the people are beautiful are “good” o disagree with that as a strategy.

I think she has vengeful and hurtful themes to her music. Thanks for helping me see that!

[Anonymous]

I don't Taylor's music. It's not for me but it's catchy and i see why lots of people like it. I can't STAND the PR circus she creates around relationship. It's downright ridiculous.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I feel like one of the lessons of this thread ought to be: if you don't want to hear criticism of Taylor Swift, don't read a thread where the theme is "criticism of Taylor Swift."

You don't have to defend liking something you like. But if people want to get together and criticize something, why not? Sometimes there is catharsis in gathering to say "huh, you know that thing everyone loves? I just really don't," and to find others who feel the same.

If you want to criticize TS or anyone, how about not doing it in such a provoking way like this title? Come on. People have a right to their opinions and to not enjoy or be a fan of someone's music/art, but the thing that is so weird about TS is the need to convince others they are WRONG to like her - her lyrics are wrong and if you can relate to them you are wrong and confused and if you find her songs catchy sorry you WRONG. And if you think she is a good marketer or businesswoman you are WRONG. How about just not being a fan?

I get that there are a group of rabid Swifties who descend on anyone who posts anything the least bit critical and I'd argue the same point to them - it definitely works both ways, but this wording and some of the arguments against her are just weird. Most people don't like to be told there is a lone poster who is sooo much smarter than us and we will eventually see the light. It's just a bizarre argument.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not only are her lyrics perpetually self-focused, they are also increasingly inauthentic as she continues to write songs as though she is a perpetually unlucky-in-love, middle class, millennial woman starring in a 90s rom com. She writes from the perspective of her fans, not from her own lived experience, and it shows:

(from "Paris" on Midnights, 2022): "Stumbled down pretend alleys, cheap wine, make believe it's champagne, I was taken by the view."

When was the last time Taylor Swift ran around with a guy drinking cheap wine and pretending it was champagne, and was "taken" by the view in a city like Paris? When she wrote this song, she was a multi-millionaire juggernaut with a host of Grammy's, a massive portfolio of homes, had been to Paris many times. When has Swift EVER had to drink cheap wine on a date? She dates successful musicians, actors, and athletes and is herself wealthy and successful.

It just doesn't ring true. It feels like what you write when you are intentionally trying to evoke a moment that the typical 30 year old, middle class, woman will relate to. But it's not real for her.

I don't understand what the point is for her to writing songs like this. I don't believe that came from her heart or was ripped from her actual journal. It feels like a calculated piece of fan service. And a lot of her music feels like this. There are exceptions (Antihero certainly feels like an authentic self reflection of her real life) but a lot of it sounds like this. I'd rather she took a looooong break and wrote an entire album like Antihero and dropped this "I'm just a girls, standing in front of a boy, asking him to love her" schtick. But it to bed. She's done it. It's not who she is (I actually don't really think it's who she ever was, I think it's always been a bit of a put on) and there's no more need for more Swift songs like this in the world.

I would like her a lot more if she released less music and toured less, but what she released was more interesting, more innovative, more creative. I think she has the capacity for it but she has chosen to go the route of making as much money as she can. That's fine and a perfectly acceptable choice. But it's not one I respect *artistically*. I don't think it results in great work. I think it undermines the quality of her music.

I don’t understand this criticism. I just read and watched the show lessons in chemistry which I really enjoyed. I’m pretty sure the author of that book was never a chemist in the 1950s struggling with sexism in the sciences and then getting a cooking show. But she told the story beautifully and captured some archetypal type themes which I, also not a which I, also not a woman in the 1950s, or in the hard sciences, could relate to beautifully. Which I think is what Taylor does so well.

You are in a way right- I’m posting on the thread but not the poster you are responding to. I just hate Taylor’s themes.
“Look
What you made me do” is awful to me because we are always responsible for our own behavior

Getting revenge on a lover is not ok

Stalking a lover is not ok

End game is equating a person to figure in a chess board and not the way I would want to choose my life partner nor would I want to be chosen that way

Romeo and Juliet died

Even her gay pride video all the people are beautiful are “good” o disagree with that as a strategy.

I think she has vengeful and hurtful themes to her music. Thanks for helping me see that!

Some of this is just being cheeky. Have you actually listened to Look What You Made Me Do or watch her perform? You are taking it really literally. We all have vengeful and negative qualities to us. We all are jealous of people we love and even if we are rooting for them, might have uncomfortable feelings at some point in our life. We struggle with parenting even though most of us would give our lives for our children without a second thought. We think bad thoughts about our spouses at times when they annoy us or piss us off, even though we love them and are in committed marriages. This is just life, the good and the bad, and the simplicity and the complexity of being human.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not only are her lyrics perpetually self-focused, they are also increasingly inauthentic as she continues to write songs as though she is a perpetually unlucky-in-love, middle class, millennial woman starring in a 90s rom com. She writes from the perspective of her fans, not from her own lived experience, and it shows:

(from "Paris" on Midnights, 2022): "Stumbled down pretend alleys, cheap wine, make believe it's champagne, I was taken by the view."

When was the last time Taylor Swift ran around with a guy drinking cheap wine and pretending it was champagne, and was "taken" by the view in a city like Paris? When she wrote this song, she was a multi-millionaire juggernaut with a host of Grammy's, a massive portfolio of homes, had been to Paris many times. When has Swift EVER had to drink cheap wine on a date? She dates successful musicians, actors, and athletes and is herself wealthy and successful.

It just doesn't ring true. It feels like what you write when you are intentionally trying to evoke a moment that the typical 30 year old, middle class, woman will relate to. But it's not real for her.

I don't understand what the point is for her to writing songs like this. I don't believe that came from her heart or was ripped from her actual journal. It feels like a calculated piece of fan service. And a lot of her music feels like this. There are exceptions (Antihero certainly feels like an authentic self reflection of her real life) but a lot of it sounds like this. I'd rather she took a looooong break and wrote an entire album like Antihero and dropped this "I'm just a girls, standing in front of a boy, asking him to love her" schtick. But it to bed. She's done it. It's not who she is (I actually don't really think it's who she ever was, I think it's always been a bit of a put on) and there's no more need for more Swift songs like this in the world.

I would like her a lot more if she released less music and toured less, but what she released was more interesting, more innovative, more creative. I think she has the capacity for it but she has chosen to go the route of making as much money as she can. That's fine and a perfectly acceptable choice. But it's not one I respect *artistically*. I don't think it results in great work. I think it undermines the quality of her music.

I don’t understand this criticism. I just read and watched the show lessons in chemistry which I really enjoyed. I’m pretty sure the author of that book was never a chemist in the 1950s struggling with sexism in the sciences and then getting a cooking show. But she told the story beautifully and captured some archetypal type themes which I, also not a which I, also not a woman in the 1950s, or in the hard sciences, could relate to beautifully. Which I think is what Taylor does so well.

You are in a way right- I’m posting on the thread but not the poster you are responding to. I just hate Taylor’s themes.
“Look
What you made me do” is awful to me because we are always responsible for our own behavior

Getting revenge on a lover is not ok

Stalking a lover is not ok

End game is equating a person to figure in a chess board and not the way I would want to choose my life partner nor would I want to be chosen that way

Romeo and Juliet died

Even her gay pride video all the people are beautiful are “good” o disagree with that as a strategy.

I think she has vengeful and hurtful themes to her music. Thanks for helping me see that!

Some of this is just being cheeky. Have you actually listened to Look What You Made Me Do or watch her perform? You are taking it really literally. We all have vengeful and negative qualities to us. We all are jealous of people we love and even if we are rooting for them, might have uncomfortable feelings at some point in our life. We struggle with parenting even though most of us would give our lives for our children without a second thought. We think bad thoughts about our spouses at times when they annoy us or piss us off, even though we love them and are in committed marriages. This is just life, the good and the bad, and the simplicity and the complexity of being human.

It's one thing to just think or sing about it but she's taken it to real life. Look how she's treated Joe.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not only are her lyrics perpetually self-focused, they are also increasingly inauthentic as she continues to write songs as though she is a perpetually unlucky-in-love, middle class, millennial woman starring in a 90s rom com. She writes from the perspective of her fans, not from her own lived experience, and it shows:

(from "Paris" on Midnights, 2022): "Stumbled down pretend alleys, cheap wine, make believe it's champagne, I was taken by the view."

When was the last time Taylor Swift ran around with a guy drinking cheap wine and pretending it was champagne, and was "taken" by the view in a city like Paris? When she wrote this song, she was a multi-millionaire juggernaut with a host of Grammy's, a massive portfolio of homes, had been to Paris many times. When has Swift EVER had to drink cheap wine on a date? She dates successful musicians, actors, and athletes and is herself wealthy and successful.

It just doesn't ring true. It feels like what you write when you are intentionally trying to evoke a moment that the typical 30 year old, middle class, woman will relate to. But it's not real for her.

I don't understand what the point is for her to writing songs like this. I don't believe that came from her heart or was ripped from her actual journal. It feels like a calculated piece of fan service. And a lot of her music feels like this. There are exceptions (Antihero certainly feels like an authentic self reflection of her real life) but a lot of it sounds like this. I'd rather she took a looooong break and wrote an entire album like Antihero and dropped this "I'm just a girls, standing in front of a boy, asking him to love her" schtick. But it to bed. She's done it. It's not who she is (I actually don't really think it's who she ever was, I think it's always been a bit of a put on) and there's no more need for more Swift songs like this in the world.

I would like her a lot more if she released less music and toured less, but what she released was more interesting, more innovative, more creative. I think she has the capacity for it but she has chosen to go the route of making as much money as she can. That's fine and a perfectly acceptable choice. But it's not one I respect *artistically*. I don't think it results in great work. I think it undermines the quality of her music.

I don’t understand this criticism. I just read and watched the show lessons in chemistry which I really enjoyed. I’m pretty sure the author of that book was never a chemist in the 1950s struggling with sexism in the sciences and then getting a cooking show. But she told the story beautifully and captured some archetypal type themes which I, also not a which I, also not a woman in the 1950s, or in the hard sciences, could relate to beautifully. Which I think is what Taylor does so well.

You are in a way right- I’m posting on the thread but not the poster you are responding to. I just hate Taylor’s themes.
“Look
What you made me do” is awful to me because we are always responsible for our own behavior

Getting revenge on a lover is not ok

Stalking a lover is not ok

End game is equating a person to figure in a chess board and not the way I would want to choose my life partner nor would I want to be chosen that way

Romeo and Juliet died

Even her gay pride video all the people are beautiful are “good” o disagree with that as a strategy.

I think she has vengeful and hurtful themes to her music. Thanks for helping me see that!

Some of this is just being cheeky. Have you actually listened to Look What You Made Me Do or watch her perform? You are taking it really literally. We all have vengeful and negative qualities to us. We all are jealous of people we love and even if we are rooting for them, might have uncomfortable feelings at some point in our life. We struggle with parenting even though most of us would give our lives for our children without a second thought. We think bad thoughts about our spouses at times when they annoy us or piss us off, even though we love them and are in committed marriages. This is just life, the good and the bad, and the simplicity and the complexity of being human.

DP. I agree that we all have negative emotions or qualities at times, and that exploring that is a ripe subject for art. I actually think Antihero is a great example of this and so relatable specifically because Swift is being so honest about the negative aspects of her own relationships and behaviors. I think we've all felt that way at times, and that song is cathartic because it rings so true.

But I actually do think PP has a point about some of the vengeful and hurtful themes in some of Swift's other music. Maybe not Look What You Made Me Do, which I agree is ironic, but Bad Blood and End Game are good examples. Sometimes she's tongue-in-cheek about it, but she's writing about these themes so often.

I think one reason it can annoy, and this might not be fair, is that people (correctly) perceive Swift as a very privileged person and there is only so much complaining about "being wronged" that people will take from someone that privileged. Like people embraced Beyonce's Lemonade revenge album because it was her breaking from a lifelong persona as someone who is in charge and doesn't get taken advantage of. Especially coming after some public reports of Jay's infidelity and the elevator video, I think it made people embrace her vulnerability. But it's the only time she's done that. Most of her music is about feeling powerful and confident and in charge, and a longtime spouse cheating feels like a justifiable reason to drop that and just feel hurt or vengeful.

But Taylor goes to this well over and over, and she's writing about relationships of just months or a few years, no marriage or kids, or sometimes friendships gone bad. While of course everyone feels hurt and vengeful about romantic and friend breakups sometimes, someone who complains about this stuff a lot starts to sound like they are just blaming others for their problems and failing to do the work on themselves to avoid all this conflict.