it should be ok to question sudden revelations about gender dysphoria

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As a parent of a teen, I am seeing — what to call it? — a trend? A fad? A rash? of girls wanting to be known by male names and pronouns. I can’t say if they’re “transitioning” or not because I don’t really know the status of hormones or surgery or anything. But it’s happening quite suddenly. I am a “live and let live” type in general but I would be concerned if our generally welcoming community’s embrace of this will mean that girls make irreversible decisions based on momentary trends. I have seen absolutely no similar transitioning on the part of teen boys.

I remember being a less girly girl who was very uncomfortable with male attention. I solved it then by wearing short hair and non-revealing clothes. I’m concerned to see girls who think the only solution is a permanent gender change.

Agree 100%.

+1. This trend is particularly troubling when it is the only thing the child is latching on to- not school work, not sports or drama club, not family, not a hands on hobby. Just trans/bi, internet influencers, and new friend groups focused on the same gender changes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My totally uneducated opinion is that kids always want to not just be accepted for who they are, but also validated and celebrated for who they are.

So, in a very open-minded, accepting, and loving community they have seen trans people accepted, celebrate and commended for their bravery.

They want that same validation and in some way, maybe they see that as the avenue to get it.

I'm not trying to diminish the courage it takes for trans people to open up and live their best life. But is it possible that straight cis kids want to be hugged and told that people love them just as they are? As straight and cisgendered, instead of just accepting that as the default

Wow, I wonder if there is something to this. I feel like as a youth and now as a middle aged mom I have generally failed at conventional femininity (not as in "I liked sports," which I never saw as contradictory, but as in "I never really understood how to be pretty or flirt, I was too smart and aggressive, my boobs were too small and my thighs were too big," etc). I think for a lot of people my age, feminism was a balm that helped us create spaces and define femininity in different ways. I do often wonder if younger people define themselves as nonbinary as a way of rejecting the standards that hurt a lot of us women and creating their own more accepting spaces. I'm ok with that, especially because I think the nonbinary adults I know are actually modeling all kinds of acceptance and self definition, but maybe we are not doing the best job showing kids how many amazing ways there are to be girls and women and celebrating that too.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My totally uneducated opinion is that kids always want to not just be accepted for who they are, but also validated and celebrated for who they are.

So, in a very open-minded, accepting, and loving community they have seen trans people accepted, celebrate and commended for their bravery.

They want that same validation and in some way, maybe they see that as the avenue to get it.

I'm not trying to diminish the courage it takes for trans people to open up and live their best life. But is it possible that straight cis kids want to be hugged and told that people love them just as they are? As straight and cisgendered, instead of just accepting that as the default

Wow, I wonder if there is something to this. I feel like as a youth and now as a middle aged mom I have generally failed at conventional femininity (not as in "I liked sports," which I never saw as contradictory, but as in "I never really understood how to be pretty or flirt, I was too smart and aggressive, my boobs were too small and my thighs were too big," etc). I think for a lot of people my age, feminism was a balm that helped us create spaces and define femininity in different ways. I do often wonder if younger people define themselves as nonbinary as a way of rejecting the standards that hurt a lot of us women and creating their own more accepting spaces. I'm ok with that, especially because I think the nonbinary adults I know are actually modeling all kinds of acceptance and self definition, but maybe we are not doing the best job showing kids how many amazing ways there are to be girls and women and celebrating that too.

Honestly I don’t know if that’s it (the last part)- my sons elementary school has giant “girls rule!” signs in the gym for instance, among other motivating signs, but they’ve actually complained to me that there isn’t one that says boys rule. Their school also has a girls on the run club but no running club for boys, and a girls coding club but no coding club for boys. There are a handful of other coed clubs but none just for boys , and the only one my sons were vaguely interested in was the running one which , unfortunately, they couldn’t join. I have often secretly been thinking the pendulum has swung too far in terms of promoting girls and excluding boys. Being a girl gives someone a higher chance of earning a college degree at the moment for example. I don’t know how much more energy we need to spend on lifting up girls in girl- specific ways at least in my own Maryland community which is very high on girl power and very high on “we need to teach our boys to be better than todays men”- which on one hand I agree with and on the other hand, this isn’t the message my innocent 5 and 8 year old boys really need

[Anonymous]

I believe Rapid Onset Gender Dysphoria (ROGD) is a thing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Has anyone in real life told you that you are taking the wrong approach, OP? I'm part of a progressive community and I know a lot of trans and non-binary people. Your approach is what most of the therapists who would with teens would suggest and what most supportive parents are doing: ask questions, talk about it, weigh the costs and benefits of interventions, understand that feelings and identities of young people often change over time. I feel like what you are doing is standard for a supportive parent and you are setting up a strawman arguement.

This honestly

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My totally uneducated opinion is that kids always want to not just be accepted for who they are, but also validated and celebrated for who they are.

So, in a very open-minded, accepting, and loving community they have seen trans people accepted, celebrate and commended for their bravery.

They want that same validation and in some way, maybe they see that as the avenue to get it.

I'm not trying to diminish the courage it takes for trans people to open up and live their best life. But is it possible that straight cis kids want to be hugged and told that people love them just as they are? As straight and cisgendered, instead of just accepting that as the default

Wow, I wonder if there is something to this. I feel like as a youth and now as a middle aged mom I have generally failed at conventional femininity (not as in "I liked sports," which I never saw as contradictory, but as in "I never really understood how to be pretty or flirt, I was too smart and aggressive, my boobs were too small and my thighs were too big," etc). I think for a lot of people my age, feminism was a balm that helped us create spaces and define femininity in different ways. I do often wonder if younger people define themselves as nonbinary as a way of rejecting the standards that hurt a lot of us women and creating their own more accepting spaces. I'm ok with that, especially because I think the nonbinary adults I know are actually modeling all kinds of acceptance and self definition, but maybe we are not doing the best job showing kids how many amazing ways there are to be girls and women and celebrating that too.

Honestly I don’t know if that’s it (the last part)- my sons elementary school has giant “girls rule!” signs in the gym for instance, among other motivating signs, but they’ve actually complained to me that there isn’t one that says boys rule. Their school also has a girls on the run club but no running club for boys, and a girls coding club but no coding club for boys. There are a handful of other coed clubs but none just for boys , and the only one my sons were vaguely interested in was the running one which , unfortunately, they couldn’t join. I have often secretly been thinking the pendulum has swung too far in terms of promoting girls and excluding boys. Being a girl gives someone a higher chance of earning a college degree at the moment for example. I don’t know how much more energy we need to spend on lifting up girls in girl- specific ways at least in my own Maryland community which is very high on girl power and very high on “we need to teach our boys to be better than todays men”- which on one hand I agree with and on the other hand, this isn’t the message my innocent 5 and 8 year old boys really need

Completely agree and unfortunately, you haven't seen anything yet. Wait until they get to high school and see how toxic the atmosphere is against boys.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My totally uneducated opinion is that kids always want to not just be accepted for who they are, but also validated and celebrated for who they are.

So, in a very open-minded, accepting, and loving community they have seen trans people accepted, celebrate and commended for their bravery.

They want that same validation and in some way, maybe they see that as the avenue to get it.

I'm not trying to diminish the courage it takes for trans people to open up and live their best life. But is it possible that straight cis kids want to be hugged and told that people love them just as they are? As straight and cisgendered, instead of just accepting that as the default

Wow, I wonder if there is something to this. I feel like as a youth and now as a middle aged mom I have generally failed at conventional femininity (not as in "I liked sports," which I never saw as contradictory, but as in "I never really understood how to be pretty or flirt, I was too smart and aggressive, my boobs were too small and my thighs were too big," etc). I think for a lot of people my age, feminism was a balm that helped us create spaces and define femininity in different ways. I do often wonder if younger people define themselves as nonbinary as a way of rejecting the standards that hurt a lot of us women and creating their own more accepting spaces. I'm ok with that, especially because I think the nonbinary adults I know are actually modeling all kinds of acceptance and self definition, but maybe we are not doing the best job showing kids how many amazing ways there are to be girls and women and celebrating that too.

Honestly I don’t know if that’s it (the last part)- my sons elementary school has giant “girls rule!” signs in the gym for instance, among other motivating signs, but they’ve actually complained to me that there isn’t one that says boys rule. Their school also has a girls on the run club but no running club for boys, and a girls coding club but no coding club for boys. There are a handful of other coed clubs but none just for boys , and the only one my sons were vaguely interested in was the running one which , unfortunately, they couldn’t join. I have often secretly been thinking the pendulum has swung too far in terms of promoting girls and excluding boys. Being a girl gives someone a higher chance of earning a college degree at the moment for example. I don’t know how much more energy we need to spend on lifting up girls in girl- specific ways at least in my own Maryland community which is very high on girl power and very high on “we need to teach our boys to be better than todays men”- which on one hand I agree with and on the other hand, this isn’t the message my innocent 5 and 8 year old boys really need

Completely agree and unfortunately, you haven't seen anything yet. Wait until they get to high school and see how toxic the atmosphere is against boys.

So it seems we are now failing both boys AND girls, if suddenly lots of girls are exploring identify as male and yet males are treated as inferior in high school. What are we doing wrong?

[Anonymous]

Its a fad, and my 19 year old DD is eating it up. Never, ever saw any gender questioning coming. Really, all I am referring to is that she goes by she/they pronouns and says she is bisexual. I'm supportive, but sometimes it's hard when I am suspect. I only hope she figures out her own path.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The issues I find with your post is that you speak as if you are “sure” about things that you clearly don’t understand. It’s okay to just say I don’t understand.

Maybe the issue also is the book you posted is trash and has your brain in knots ... after being peer reviewed the author had to put a disclaimer on it.

You might get less backlash if you came from a place of learning instead of knowing. Also don’t talk about the book it makes you sound crazy.

Also, you are seeking a clear and definitive answer/solution. It doesn’t exist. Maybe a boy just likes to wear nail polish and now we think .., hmm what is his label and actually he’s just a boy who wears nail polish.

Your daughter is a girl biologically who does not follow female social norms and you want a label for that and a solution to fix it.

There is no problem, hence no solution.... if I was a she/they and my mom/society was trying to fix me I’d have anxiety and depression too.

There is not “explosion” of girls being trans, it’s just new to you.

Also men ogling women is disgusting ... she not liking it is not the problem.

Thank you for saying everything that needed to be said

NP. I disagree. I think OP sounds like a thoughtful, caring, and good parent, while the poster you replied to sounds reactionary and unthoughtful.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Its a fad, and my 19 year old DD is eating it up. Never, ever saw any gender questioning coming. Really, all I am referring to is that she goes by she/they pronouns and says she is bisexual. I'm supportive, but sometimes it's hard when I am suspect. I only hope she figures out her own path.

Go ahead and flame me, but I think being "supportive" of this is a big mistake. She's testing boundaries and is probably secretly dismayed to see that her own mother has lost her mind, along with the rest of the world.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Its a fad, and my 19 year old DD is eating it up. Never, ever saw any gender questioning coming. Really, all I am referring to is that she goes by she/they pronouns and says she is bisexual. I'm supportive, but sometimes it's hard when I am suspect. I only hope she figures out her own path.

Go ahead and flame me, but I think being "supportive" of this is a big mistake. She's testing boundaries and is probably secretly dismayed to see that her own mother has lost her mind, along with the rest of the world.

I’m not going to flame you. By supportive I mean we just don’t really talk about it. I’m not racing to chop off all her (absolutely gorgeous) hair so she can appear more “they.” But she isn’t asking either, which is why I feel it’s little disingenuous and more for show.

[Anonymous]

OP here. Wow, I didnt realize I wrote that in 2020.

DD now 15 is doing so much better. She still identifies as non binary, but has completey accepted her feminine body. She has a girlfriend going on one year now who also identifies as non binary.

DD accepts that I tried but failed to integrate they them pronouns into our communications, but she understands that its not because I do not accept her identification. In fact her acceptance of they/she is organic to her.

She has also for reasons unknown suddenly decided she wants a male therapist, and I found one! A DBT therapist who happens to be male. Wasnt looking for that, but its who was available, and she later revealed this was something she wanted. Prior to that, she definitely did NOT want that.

She worked with a (female) therapist for some time who helped her work through some traumas. Good work done at the time when she was ready to do it.

Her level of self acceptance has been hard won, but its arrived. At least the foundations for it have been laid.

She no longer has an interest in binders. She alternates between different looks, and I find her sports bras that allow her to have different levels of support/flatness. A creature of comfort, she doesnt wear them for long.

Antidepressant medication made a HUGE difference along with the therapy.

We talk openly about her attraction to girls and boys, and I playfully tease her about being clearly more attracted to girls. SHe jokes that the saying that bi girls/non binaries have is: "Im bi, which means Im attracted to girls and a few anime characters".

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I agree OP.

Ds's first girlfriend identified as gender fluid. Very confusing for him because it didn't come up until a few months in. She continued to call herself his girlfriend so I will use feminine pronouns.

Her mom wasn't 100% on board. She refused to buy a binder, and continued to use her given name. The girl would decide mid day to change genders.

Anyway, kids in ds's class at the time (9th grade) said it seemed like a lot of the gender identity declarations were a fad. Now, 7 years later, all but two have reclaimed their biological genders
One is ( or has) transitioned female to male. Two are bi.

Let your kids be who they are, but talk. Ask questions. Is this genuinely a factor in your child's life? Are they questioning themselves and expermenting?

Also, don't jump on people for asking questions. It's how people learn.

I'm going to be the outlier here and say I hate this piece of advice. What does it even mean? The child that you describe is a young girl clearly confused about her gender, so how are we supposed to "let her be who she is" when she doesn't even think she knows herself?

Kids like this clearly need more parental help and guidance than they are getting. To "let her be who she is" is to get her help in accepting that she is becoming a young woman.

Sorry, but you can't have it both ways.

I'm the person you quoted, and you're right, I didn't think of it in those terms. It's not a good phrase for this.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP here. Wow, I didnt realize I wrote that in 2020.

DD now 15 is doing so much better. She still identifies as non binary, but has completey accepted her feminine body. She has a girlfriend going on one year now who also identifies as non binary.

DD accepts that I tried but failed to integrate they them pronouns into our communications, but she understands that its not because I do not accept her identification. In fact her acceptance of they/she is organic to her.

She has also for reasons unknown suddenly decided she wants a male therapist, and I found one! A DBT therapist who happens to be male. Wasnt looking for that, but its who was available, and she later revealed this was something she wanted. Prior to that, she definitely did NOT want that.

She worked with a (female) therapist for some time who helped her work through some traumas. Good work done at the time when she was ready to do it.

Her level of self acceptance has been hard won, but its arrived. At least the foundations for it have been laid.

She no longer has an interest in binders. She alternates between different looks, and I find her sports bras that allow her to have different levels of support/flatness. A creature of comfort, she doesnt wear them for long.

Antidepressant medication made a HUGE difference along with the therapy.

We talk openly about her attraction to girls and boys, and I playfully tease her about being clearly more attracted to girls. SHe jokes that the saying that bi girls/non binaries have is: "Im bi, which means Im attracted to girls and a few anime characters".

Wow, sounds great OP. Thanks for the update!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As a parent of a teen, I am seeing — what to call it? — a trend? A fad? A rash? of girls wanting to be known by male names and pronouns. I can’t say if they’re “transitioning” or not because I don’t really know the status of hormones or surgery or anything. But it’s happening quite suddenly. I am a “live and let live” type in general but I would be concerned if our generally welcoming community’s embrace of this will mean that girls make irreversible decisions based on momentary trends. I have seen absolutely no similar transitioning on the part of teen boys.

I remember being a less girly girl who was very uncomfortable with male attention. I solved it then by wearing short hair and non-revealing clothes. I’m concerned to see girls who think the only solution is a permanent gender change.

Agree 100%.

+1. This trend is particularly troubling when it is the only thing the child is latching on to- not school work, not sports or drama club, not family, not a hands on hobby. Just trans/bi, internet influencers, and new friend groups focused on the same gender changes.

Nailed it!