Wife is interested in opening up our marriage.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:But you’re not pleasing her. You have fairly vanilla sex, she’s clearly wanting more, but you shut down things she asks for. All the while you’re going on about being adventurous and how that should be enough for her. She brought up a possible solution. It doesn’t sound like she’s seeing anyone else already. It doesn’t have to be a big deal unless you make it a big deal. Clearly you’re insecure and will create a problem though. She isn’t excited by vanilla sex and asked to spice it up. Tell her no, she can’t have spice. Then she can decide whether an intact marriage or spice is more important.

Does she know you snooped and read all her texts and emails?

How many times have people on dcum said to have this conversation with their partners? If you aren’t fulfilled, don’t have an affair. Instead tell your spouse you want an open marriage if your needs aren’t being met. That’s what she tried to do and now her DH is jumping to her having affairs. This is why most people cheat instead. If you’re going to get the grief of screwing around, you might as well get the fun of it too.

I didn't get the first part at all from his posts. He said they had done anal, light bdsm, etc. That's not vanilla by most standards, and it shows that he has been making an effort to do what she wants since clearly it was new to him. It isn't like they're just doing missionary every time.

My wife and I got married young by the standards of this area (both in our 20's) but we have great sex, elementary age kids, a strong relationship. However I know I'd be like the OP, I'd be pissed if she came to me with something like this for a variety of reasons. I mean, rationalize it all you will, they made a commitment to each other and like the OP, I'd expect that to be honored the same as I honor it.

That being said, I do agree (assuming the wife in this situation has not cheated yet) that she did the right thing by being honest about it instead of acting behind his back. But my answer would be what someone else said. You opened Pandoras Box and it can't be shut. You have options, but if you take option A or B, I'm leaving, and I'll fight for the kids. And the idea of trust is probably shot forever. And I'm not disagreeing with the person who said this is why people cheat rather than having honest conversations, but again, you made the commitment, be mature enough to stick with it. That's not a moral judgment, making the commitment is what that person did, flat out. Honor it or have the decency to get a divorce first.

I don’t know. I feel just as bad for her as for the guys in sexless marriages. If you have a kink, playing around the edges probably isn’t enough to scratch that itch. Just like the guys who want 4x a week aren’t going to be satisfied when the wife compromises and puts out once a week. It sucks because one person basically holds all the cards and can dole out whatever they want and the other person has to take it and smile. If they try to discuss solutions, they’re treated like they acted on their worse impulses, when their only crime was honesty.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I don’t know. I feel just as bad for her as for the guys in sexless marriages. If you have a kink, playing around the edges probably isn’t enough to scratch that itch. Just like the guys who want 4x a week aren’t going to be satisfied when the wife compromises and puts out once a week. It sucks because one person basically holds all the cards and can dole out whatever they want and the other person has to take it and smile. If they try to discuss solutions, they’re treated like they acted on their worse impulses, when their only crime was honesty.

I'm the person you replied to, and I swear I'm not trying to be overly judgmental even though it came off that way. I just have a pretty black/white view of this sort of thing as far as commitment goes. You either stick with it or end things properly. I suppose it is easier for me to feel this way having a wife who feels the same way, and is sexually compatible, etc.

Understanding that we're only getting his side of the story, I still don't equate this with the sexless marriage complaints. In this case, he admitted this side of her (the kink, etc.) was surprising to him but from what I could gather, he was making an effort to meet her needs there, and it still wasn't enough for her. But at least he's been giving it a shot, which is more than you hear from most. I'm not feeling much sympathy for the wife here, absent her side of the whole thing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:But you’re not pleasing her. You have fairly vanilla sex, she’s clearly wanting more, but you shut down things she asks for. All the while you’re going on about being adventurous and how that should be enough for her. She brought up a possible solution. It doesn’t sound like she’s seeing anyone else already. It doesn’t have to be a big deal unless you make it a big deal. Clearly you’re insecure and will create a problem though. She isn’t excited by vanilla sex and asked to spice it up. Tell her no, she can’t have spice. Then she can decide whether an intact marriage or spice is more important.

Does she know you snooped and read all her texts and emails?

How many times have people on dcum said to have this conversation with their partners? If you aren’t fulfilled, don’t have an affair. Instead tell your spouse you want an open marriage if your needs aren’t being met. That’s what she tried to do and now her DH is jumping to her having affairs. This is why most people cheat instead. If you’re going to get the grief of screwing around, you might as well get the fun of it too.

I didn't get the first part at all from his posts. He said they had done anal, light bdsm, etc. That's not vanilla by most standards, and it shows that he has been making an effort to do what she wants since clearly it was new to him. It isn't like they're just doing missionary every time.

My wife and I got married young by the standards of this area (both in our 20's) but we have great sex, elementary age kids, a strong relationship. However I know I'd be like the OP, I'd be pissed if she came to me with something like this for a variety of reasons. I mean, rationalize it all you will, they made a commitment to each other and like the OP, I'd expect that to be honored the same as I honor it.

That being said, I do agree (assuming the wife in this situation has not cheated yet) that she did the right thing by being honest about it instead of acting behind his back. But my answer would be what someone else said. You opened Pandoras Box and it can't be shut. You have options, but if you take option A or B, I'm leaving, and I'll fight for the kids. And the idea of trust is probably shot forever. And I'm not disagreeing with the person who said this is why people cheat rather than having honest conversations, but again, you made the commitment, be mature enough to stick with it. That's not a moral judgment, making the commitment is what that person did, flat out. Honor it or have the decency to get a divorce first.

I don’t know. I feel just as bad for her as for the guys in sexless marriages. If you have a kink, playing around the edges probably isn’t enough to scratch that itch. Just like the guys who want 4x a week aren’t going to be satisfied when the wife compromises and puts out once a week. It sucks because one person basically holds all the cards and can dole out whatever they want and the other person has to take it and smile. If they try to discuss solutions, they’re treated like they acted on their worse impulses, when their only crime was honesty.

Yes, exactly. It's a problem without an obvious solution and people who dismiss the power of libido do so at their own peril. To simply say "you made a commitment in your early 20s, deal with it" doesn't actually deal with it. You can't shut off a desire for variety, for a kink, any more than a gay person can go to conversion therapy or pray away the gay.

Two people who deeply love each other can find workable compromises. Ultimatums don't work, and I promise you if the ultimatum is to be monogamous in an unfulfilling marriage or "ball is in your court to file for divorce and break up the family home" the deprived person will cheat 100% of the time.

OP needs to dive deeper into his wife's fantasies, his insecurity in seeing them fulfilled and if they can come with a compromise. Or he can close his eyes to the inevitable.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Op again

I don’t think she’s actively pursuing anyone from what I can tell (checking texts, messages, emails, phone bill) but I can’t know if that means she does or doesn’t have someone in mind. I also don’t buy into this hippie new age stuff as someone put it that open marriages or polyamory or whatever you wanna call it is normal or acceptable. At this point I’m just mad. Of all the women out there who just want to marry a man that faithfully commits she isn’t one of them? Really? I’d take vanilla sex over this any day

You chose the kinky fun lady and this came with the package. Sorry. There are so many vanilla women out there it is not even funny. YOU chose your partner.

So, you are blaming this guy for his wife's behavior and hang ups? Really?

If "this came with the package," the wife should have made that known before they tied the knot.
This is all on her, friend.

No, it’s certainly not his fault. Sorry OP I didn’t mean it that way. But he seems shocked and this seems like one of those problems that is foreseeable to all but the aggrieved party. I think the majority of women are not interested in their partner choking them during sex. I am the high libido partner and that seems too weird for me. I would like more sex but I would not consider an open marriage on a million years. This lady is into weird stuff and open marriage seems like a logical next step to me. I don’t think she is cheating, just making her needs known and if OP handles it sensitively maybe it won’t be as dire as pps are suggesting.

And for God’s sake stop hanging out with swingers. Geez what a disaster. Maybe other pp is right and you need Jesus!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:But you’re not pleasing her. You have fairly vanilla sex, she’s clearly wanting more, but you shut down things she asks for. All the while you’re going on about being adventurous and how that should be enough for her. She brought up a possible solution. It doesn’t sound like she’s seeing anyone else already. It doesn’t have to be a big deal unless you make it a big deal. Clearly you’re insecure and will create a problem though. She isn’t excited by vanilla sex and asked to spice it up. Tell her no, she can’t have spice. Then she can decide whether an intact marriage or spice is more important.

Does she know you snooped and read all her texts and emails?

How many times have people on dcum said to have this conversation with their partners? If you aren’t fulfilled, don’t have an affair. Instead tell your spouse you want an open marriage if your needs aren’t being met. That’s what she tried to do and now her DH is jumping to her having affairs. This is why most people cheat instead. If you’re going to get the grief of screwing around, you might as well get the fun of it too.

I didn't get the first part at all from his posts. He said they had done anal, light bdsm, etc. That's not vanilla by most standards, and it shows that he has been making an effort to do what she wants since clearly it was new to him. It isn't like they're just doing missionary every time.

My wife and I got married young by the standards of this area (both in our 20's) but we have great sex, elementary age kids, a strong relationship. However I know I'd be like the OP, I'd be pissed if she came to me with something like this for a variety of reasons. I mean, rationalize it all you will, they made a commitment to each other and like the OP, I'd expect that to be honored the same as I honor it.

That being said, I do agree (assuming the wife in this situation has not cheated yet) that she did the right thing by being honest about it instead of acting behind his back. But my answer would be what someone else said. You opened Pandoras Box and it can't be shut. You have options, but if you take option A or B, I'm leaving, and I'll fight for the kids. And the idea of trust is probably shot forever. And I'm not disagreeing with the person who said this is why people cheat rather than having honest conversations, but again, you made the commitment, be mature enough to stick with it. That's not a moral judgment, making the commitment is what that person did, flat out. Honor it or have the decency to get a divorce first.

I don’t know. I feel just as bad for her as for the guys in sexless marriages. If you have a kink, playing around the edges probably isn’t enough to scratch that itch. Just like the guys who want 4x a week aren’t going to be satisfied when the wife compromises and puts out once a week. It sucks because one person basically holds all the cards and can dole out whatever they want and the other person has to take it and smile. If they try to discuss solutions, they’re treated like they acted on their worse impulses, when their only crime was honesty.

Yes, exactly. It's a problem without an obvious solution and people who dismiss the power of libido do so at their own peril. To simply say "you made a commitment in your early 20s, deal with it" doesn't actually deal with it. You can't shut off a desire for variety, for a kink, any more than a gay person can go to conversion therapy or pray away the gay.

Two people who deeply love each other can find workable compromises. Ultimatums don't work, and I promise you if the ultimatum is to be monogamous in an unfulfilling marriage or "ball is in your court to file for divorce and break up the family home" the deprived person will cheat 100% of the time.

OP needs to dive deeper into his wife's fantasies, his insecurity in seeing them fulfilled and if they can come with a compromise. Or he can close his eyes to the inevitable.

+1

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:But you’re not pleasing her. You have fairly vanilla sex, she’s clearly wanting more, but you shut down things she asks for. All the while you’re going on about being adventurous and how that should be enough for her. She brought up a possible solution. It doesn’t sound like she’s seeing anyone else already. It doesn’t have to be a big deal unless you make it a big deal. Clearly you’re insecure and will create a problem though. She isn’t excited by vanilla sex and asked to spice it up. Tell her no, she can’t have spice. Then she can decide whether an intact marriage or spice is more important.

Does she know you snooped and read all her texts and emails?

How many times have people on dcum said to have this conversation with their partners? If you aren’t fulfilled, don’t have an affair. Instead tell your spouse you want an open marriage if your needs aren’t being met. That’s what she tried to do and now her DH is jumping to her having affairs. This is why most people cheat instead. If you’re going to get the grief of screwing around, you might as well get the fun of it too.

I didn't get the first part at all from his posts. He said they had done anal, light bdsm, etc. That's not vanilla by most standards, and it shows that he has been making an effort to do what she wants since clearly it was new to him. It isn't like they're just doing missionary every time.

My wife and I got married young by the standards of this area (both in our 20's) but we have great sex, elementary age kids, a strong relationship. However I know I'd be like the OP, I'd be pissed if she came to me with something like this for a variety of reasons. I mean, rationalize it all you will, they made a commitment to each other and like the OP, I'd expect that to be honored the same as I honor it.

That being said, I do agree (assuming the wife in this situation has not cheated yet) that she did the right thing by being honest about it instead of acting behind his back. But my answer would be what someone else said. You opened Pandoras Box and it can't be shut. You have options, but if you take option A or B, I'm leaving, and I'll fight for the kids. And the idea of trust is probably shot forever. And I'm not disagreeing with the person who said this is why people cheat rather than having honest conversations, but again, you made the commitment, be mature enough to stick with it. That's not a moral judgment, making the commitment is what that person did, flat out. Honor it or have the decency to get a divorce first.

I don’t know. I feel just as bad for her as for the guys in sexless marriages. If you have a kink, playing around the edges probably isn’t enough to scratch that itch. Just like the guys who want 4x a week aren’t going to be satisfied when the wife compromises and puts out once a week. It sucks because one person basically holds all the cards and can dole out whatever they want and the other person has to take it and smile. If they try to discuss solutions, they’re treated like they acted on their worse impulses, when their only crime was honesty.

Yes, exactly. It's a problem without an obvious solution and people who dismiss the power of libido do so at their own peril. To simply say "you made a commitment in your early 20s, deal with it" doesn't actually deal with it. You can't shut off a desire for variety, for a kink, any more than a gay person can go to conversion therapy or pray away the gay.

Two people who deeply love each other can find workable compromises. Ultimatums don't work, and I promise you if the ultimatum is to be monogamous in an unfulfilling marriage or "ball is in your court to file for divorce and break up the family home" the deprived person will cheat 100% of the time.

OP needs to dive deeper into his wife's fantasies, his insecurity in seeing them fulfilled and if they can come with a compromise. Or he can close his eyes to the inevitable.

Yuck. I have a higher sex drive than my partner but I would never cheat.

The purpose of my marriage is not to indulge my every kink and desire. Marriage is about making the other person happy, too.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:And for God’s sake stop hanging out with swingers. Geez what a disaster. Maybe other pp is right and you need Jesus!

I think there's something to this as well. The first part, not the second. Though it does assume that the person is weak-minded enough to just go along with these things.

My wife has a sister who is like that, depending on who her newest boyfriend is. Suddenly she has all these new hobbies she's really into that just happen to be the same hobbies as her current flame. Is she ever starts dating a swinger, lets say I would not be shocked to hear her start talking about what an interesting lifestyle it is, despite her never having participate before to our knowledge.

I'm not saying swingers should be pariahs, but I'm always leery of anyone whose hobbies or lifestyle would directly cause issues in my personal life.

[Anonymous]

What kind of 32 year old talks about "hippie new age" stuff? That is a much older person way of framing it. Hippies were the 60s and new age was in the 80s. "Ethical non-monogamy" is totally millennial.

The fact that he calls it "hippie new age" stuff and has such distain for the kinky things he's already been doing with his wife makes me think they are just a mismatch and there's not a lot of room for compromise here. He feels like he's already compromised, and doesn't seem to value much of anything that's come out of it. If anything, he's tolerated his wife's "sluttyness" thus far but ultimately just wishes it would go away.

I think he should listen to the entire archives of Dan Savage's podcast and if, after that, he still feels the same way, then they may have to have a conversation about going their separate ways.

And that doesn't mean I think he has to agree to open up the marriage. I just think he has to be willing to talk about it and his feelings associated without seeing her interest in it as disgusting and shameful. There are plenty of kinks that are physically impossible to actually do, but people get off thinking about them and talking about them and whatnot. He doesn't have to do it, but if he continues to be disgusted by the fact that he even has to think about it, well, that doesn't bode well for these two.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:But you’re not pleasing her. You have fairly vanilla sex, she’s clearly wanting more, but you shut down things she asks for. All the while you’re going on about being adventurous and how that should be enough for her. She brought up a possible solution. It doesn’t sound like she’s seeing anyone else already. It doesn’t have to be a big deal unless you make it a big deal. Clearly you’re insecure and will create a problem though. She isn’t excited by vanilla sex and asked to spice it up. Tell her no, she can’t have spice. Then she can decide whether an intact marriage or spice is more important.

Does she know you snooped and read all her texts and emails?

How many times have people on dcum said to have this conversation with their partners? If you aren’t fulfilled, don’t have an affair. Instead tell your spouse you want an open marriage if your needs aren’t being met. That’s what she tried to do and now her DH is jumping to her having affairs. This is why most people cheat instead. If you’re going to get the grief of screwing around, you might as well get the fun of it too.

I didn't get the first part at all from his posts. He said they had done anal, light bdsm, etc. That's not vanilla by most standards, and it shows that he has been making an effort to do what she wants since clearly it was new to him. It isn't like they're just doing missionary every time.

My wife and I got married young by the standards of this area (both in our 20's) but we have great sex, elementary age kids, a strong relationship. However I know I'd be like the OP, I'd be pissed if she came to me with something like this for a variety of reasons. I mean, rationalize it all you will, they made a commitment to each other and like the OP, I'd expect that to be honored the same as I honor it.

That being said, I do agree (assuming the wife in this situation has not cheated yet) that she did the right thing by being honest about it instead of acting behind his back. But my answer would be what someone else said. You opened Pandoras Box and it can't be shut. You have options, but if you take option A or B, I'm leaving, and I'll fight for the kids. And the idea of trust is probably shot forever. And I'm not disagreeing with the person who said this is why people cheat rather than having honest conversations, but again, you made the commitment, be mature enough to stick with it. That's not a moral judgment, making the commitment is what that person did, flat out. Honor it or have the decency to get a divorce first.

I think it's a little much to say that trust is shot forever (assuming she isn't cheating now). She had something she was interested in and she asked. I don't see the big deal with asking although I agree the default is to remain monogamous or to divorce.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:And for God’s sake stop hanging out with swingers. Geez what a disaster. Maybe other pp is right and you need Jesus!

I think there's something to this as well. The first part, not the second. Though it does assume that the person is weak-minded enough to just go along with these things.

My wife has a sister who is like that, depending on who her newest boyfriend is. Suddenly she has all these new hobbies she's really into that just happen to be the same hobbies as her current flame. Is she ever starts dating a swinger, lets say I would not be shocked to hear her start talking about what an interesting lifestyle it is, despite her never having participate before to our knowledge.

I'm not saying swingers should be pariahs, but I'm always leery of anyone whose hobbies or lifestyle would directly cause issues in my personal life.

Golf. If my husband takes up golf, we're getting a divorce.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
No, it’s certainly not his fault. Sorry OP I didn’t mean it that way. But he seems shocked and this seems like one of those problems that is foreseeable to all but the aggrieved party. I think the majority of women are not interested in their partner choking them during sex. I am the high libido partner and that seems too weird for me. I would like more sex but I would not consider an open marriage on a million years. This lady is into weird stuff and open marriage seems like a logical next step to me. I don’t think she is cheating, just making her needs known and if OP handles it sensitively maybe it won’t be as dire as pps are suggesting.

"Weird?" That's mature. And I think you'd be surprised at how many women have a choking or throat-holding fetish.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My wife has a sister who is like that, depending on who her newest boyfriend is. Suddenly she has all these new hobbies she's really into that just happen to be the same hobbies as her current flame.

ALL women are like that. Which is why, if your wife or girlfriend suddenly shows an interest in something she's never shown any interest in before - be it BDSM or European politics - you can bet she's cheating on you with some dude who likes that.

[Anonymous]

The older I get, the more I think it just comes down to how sexually jealous a person is. It's probably hard-wired at some level. As someone who just isn't that sexually jealous, if my wife came to me about wanting to open the marriage, I would be game for the discussion. Even if she cheated, I can't see the headache of divorce being worth it. And the folks on here who chime on about infidelity is worse than physical abuse, it just makes no sense to me. I know I am not alone on this.

OP, if the thought of your wife with someone else causes revulsion, there is probably no real solution other than to hope your wife can cover her tracks.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:But you’re not pleasing her. You have fairly vanilla sex, she’s clearly wanting more, but you shut down things she asks for. All the while you’re going on about being adventurous and how that should be enough for her. She brought up a possible solution. It doesn’t sound like she’s seeing anyone else already. It doesn’t have to be a big deal unless you make it a big deal. Clearly you’re insecure and will create a problem though. She isn’t excited by vanilla sex and asked to spice it up. Tell her no, she can’t have spice. Then she can decide whether an intact marriage or spice is more important.

Does she know you snooped and read all her texts and emails?

How many times have people on dcum said to have this conversation with their partners? If you aren’t fulfilled, don’t have an affair. Instead tell your spouse you want an open marriage if your needs aren’t being met. That’s what she tried to do and now her DH is jumping to her having affairs. This is why most people cheat instead. If you’re going to get the grief of screwing around, you might as well get the fun of it too.

I didn't get the first part at all from his posts. He said they had done anal, light bdsm, etc. That's not vanilla by most standards, and it shows that he has been making an effort to do what she wants since clearly it was new to him. It isn't like they're just doing missionary every time.

My wife and I got married young by the standards of this area (both in our 20's) but we have great sex, elementary age kids, a strong relationship. However I know I'd be like the OP, I'd be pissed if she came to me with something like this for a variety of reasons. I mean, rationalize it all you will, they made a commitment to each other and like the OP, I'd expect that to be honored the same as I honor it.

That being said, I do agree (assuming the wife in this situation has not cheated yet) that she did the right thing by being honest about it instead of acting behind his back. But my answer would be what someone else said. You opened Pandoras Box and it can't be shut. You have options, but if you take option A or B, I'm leaving, and I'll fight for the kids. And the idea of trust is probably shot forever. And I'm not disagreeing with the person who said this is why people cheat rather than having honest conversations, but again, you made the commitment, be mature enough to stick with it. That's not a moral judgment, making the commitment is what that person did, flat out. Honor it or have the decency to get a divorce first.

I don’t know. I feel just as bad for her as for the guys in sexless marriages. If you have a kink, playing around the edges probably isn’t enough to scratch that itch. Just like the guys who want 4x a week aren’t going to be satisfied when the wife compromises and puts out once a week. It sucks because one person basically holds all the cards and can dole out whatever they want and the other person has to take it and smile. If they try to discuss solutions, they’re treated like they acted on their worse impulses, when their only crime was honesty.

Yes, exactly. It's a problem without an obvious solution and people who dismiss the power of libido do so at their own peril. To simply say "you made a commitment in your early 20s, deal with it" doesn't actually deal with it. You can't shut off a desire for variety, for a kink, any more than a gay person can go to conversion therapy or pray away the gay.

Two people who deeply love each other can find workable compromises. Ultimatums don't work, and I promise you if the ultimatum is to be monogamous in an unfulfilling marriage or "ball is in your court to file for divorce and break up the family home" the deprived person will cheat 100% of the time.

OP needs to dive deeper into his wife's fantasies, his insecurity in seeing them fulfilled and if they can come with a compromise. Or he can close his eyes to the inevitable.

+1

This is insane. So the new rule is that every spouse is morally compelled to get over their "insecurities" and give their spouse the right to screw around, wedding vows be damned?

Would you all really be spouting this crap if this was some dude wanting to explore his "polyamory" with 19 year old in Thailand?

[Anonymous]

It’s not at all clear to me that OP’s wife is even particularly invested in this idea, as opposed to having a friend who’s doing it and thinking “oh that sounds interesting.” Which is the issue with normalizing this deviance!