The reason I can't go with DE

[Anonymous]

So don't do DE, then? I understand that you have ethical issues with it and I agree with some of your points; I myself have issues with IVF, so I didn't do it. I adopted, and some people have issues with that. My RE was dismissive of adoption, which, as adult adoptee myself, bothered me. But I understand that their business is to get people pregnant, not make them parents through any means possible, and if your medical issues point to DE as the best way to get pregnant, than that's why they suggested it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP sounds very young to me - like she is in her twenties or something like that.
How old are you OP?

37, with DOR and autoimmune issues. Apparently, too difficult of a case for local REs (did not fit neatly into one of categories that they get results with). They nevertheless took my money for several IVF rounds and then gave me DE pep talk.

Or maybe the doctors are just presenting you with what they view as your best option to carry a pregnancy at this point?

This isn't personal, OP. I'm so sorry that you're struggling to conceive and that your options appear to be limited at this point. That is a really hard situation. But don't blame the system for offering women their options. To some women, carrying a pregnancy is more important than where the egg's genes come from. Others would rather continue doing OE IVF. Still others will turn to adoption. There are a wide range of choices out there and you, as the consumer, have to choose the one that is best for you and your family.

You've started this thread with the apparent attempt to educate a forum that is generally made up of highly-educated women who are in their 30s and 40s. All of these women have access to the same resources you do. You apparently find it shocking that some of these women made a different choice from you. Real talk, though -- you are not doing anyone any favors by coming here and suggesting that they are just brood mares for their husband's offspring. And it's incredibly insulting to tell those women that the children they carried are not really their own.

BTW, I have no real dog in this fight. I conceived with OE. But during my pregnancy, I remember thinking that it would not have mattered one bit if I was carrying a DE baby -- that baby was MY baby. It's not up to you, internet stranger, to convince women otherwise.

You must be very unnerved thats someone dares to bring up issues that are on minds of many women. Get off your high (educated) horse.

Some introspection and therapy might be in order, OP. Why are you so unnerved and made angry by other people's choices? Is anyone forcing you to do DE IVF?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP who are you trying to convince ?

OP here - I am expressing my own thoughts and feelings about issues that are for some reason not discussed openly. We are told, mostly by REs, that this is a normal thing and that we should accept it at face value.

I think you are bashing those of us who made a different choice and it is not nice, you can have your thoughts but to keep going and going, ugh! I have an amazing daughter from DE. She probably has better genes than I could have given her ( my son with my own eggs has all sorts of issues). Also not raising someone else’s child. She’s mine and my husbands, she prefers me over him anyways!!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP I well remember the day my RE said anonymous DE. We had tried with sister but she had health issues. So ... anonymous.
This was long ago as my kids are 24.
For us, adoption was not an option for a number of reasons. So it was this or nothing. The thought of DE shattered my world and I was so very disappointed. But LOR is hard if not impossible to overcome.
Back then DE was new. Once we agreed they treated the donor like a goddess and us like beggars with nothing to offer but money. It wasn’t the most pleasant experience. The donor must have been ok with it because she donated multiple times.
The children were born, we were delighted and spent the next years raising them. They look a lot like my DH and not much like me. I never felt like a surrogate mom. I kept the whole thing private: our family’s business not the worlds. We’re comfortable with that.
There are times when I wish they were ... this or that positive thing about my genetics (but none of the negative!)
They are great kids. The absolute best I could have asked for and exactly as I imagined. It’s not a decision I regret.
Best of luck with your further decisions.

OP here -thank you for your sharing your experience and for your well wishes.

Your post is very insightful because if after 25 years DE option is still going very strong it shows me that during almost 3 decades the ART industry obviously concluded that DE (along with corollary services such as donor agencies, banks, freezing facilities, lawyers etc.) is much more profitable option than actually curing infertility (investing in research to cure common problems such as PCOS, endometriosis, recurrent loss). There would be actually little to no money in curing infertility. However, offering various expensive options before offering DE as the final option is extremely profitable. They get to sell more services and products.

I also have few genuine questions for you and I hope you will not get offended since you had gone through the process so long ago. From what I understand you did not tell your kids (correct me if I am wrong). The questions are:

1. Why are you interested in infertility board 24 years later?
2. Do you think your kids deserve to know the truth as adults?
3. What do you think the impact would be on your relationship with your kids if they inadvertently found out through genetic testing services or through medical procedures that ask for their family medical history?

Thank you so much.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I understand that using DE isn't for everyone. It is a little weird to think that half of your child's genetics are potentially a stranger's. But I think for most women using DEs, there really isn't another option other than doing a ton of IVF cycles and hoping they can get that one good egg. You could say "just adopt", but so many women want the pregnancy experience. So why not have your baby be half your spouse rather than doing embryo adoption? After all, wouldn't be nice if you could potentially see a little bit of the one you love in your children?

Well, I am not the OP, but, no, this is not the way we personally thought of it. TO US, once we could not have biological children, it just seemed perverse to engineer a human with just one of our genetics, rather than realize, "Well, no, it's not meant to be," and adopt a child who was already alive and living who needed a parent. So, that is what we did. We ended up adopting two with "minor" (of course everyone knows this is a subjective term) special needs.

[Anonymous]

OP:

I am a different DE recipient. My twins are 8 years old. I began telling them that I conceived them using DE eggs starting at about age 3. At this point in time they understand that I had trouble conceiving due to DOR and male factor issues. They understand that they are not genetically related to my side of the family. Both the donor and I are direct descendants of Caribbean slaves from the same island, so we all share a similar history and similar genetics (we could very well be distant relatives!). We all have very open discussions about the issues and the kids ask intelligent questions and I try to give honest answers.

My twins are so wonderful and sweet and they are every bit my children! I was not able to adopt for a number of reasons, so I am so happy I had this option.

I understand that DE may not work for you but for me, I am so thankful to have them in my life.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I understand that using DE isn't for everyone. It is a little weird to think that half of your child's genetics are potentially a stranger's. But I think for most women using DEs, there really isn't another option other than doing a ton of IVF cycles and hoping they can get that one good egg. You could say "just adopt", but so many women want the pregnancy experience. So why not have your baby be half your spouse rather than doing embryo adoption? After all, wouldn't be nice if you could potentially see a little bit of the one you love in your children?

Well, I am not the OP, but, no, this is not the way we personally thought of it. TO US, once we could not have biological children, it just seemed perverse to engineer a human with just one of our genetics, rather than realize, "Well, no, it's not meant to be," and adopt a child who was already alive and living who needed a parent. So, that is what we did. We ended up adopting two with "minor" (of course everyone knows this is a subjective term) special needs.

OP here - Thank you for this.

Watch the haters come on and write how I bashed them (protection is a tricky thing) for their choice of DE. I never did that. I exclusively wrote about myself and my views on ART and DE industry. But they'll conveniently skip over that and over posts like yours.

[Anonymous]

^projection

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP:

I am a different DE recipient. My twins are 8 years old. I began telling them that I conceived them using DE eggs starting at about age 3. At this point in time they understand that I had trouble conceiving due to DOR and male factor issues. They understand that they are not genetically related to my side of the family. Both the donor and I are direct descendants of Caribbean slaves from the same island, so we all share a similar history and similar genetics (we could very well be distant relatives!). We all have very open discussions about the issues and the kids ask intelligent questions and I try to give honest answers.

My twins are so wonderful and sweet and they are every bit my children! I was not able to adopt for a number of reasons, so I am so happy I had this option.

I understand that DE may not work for you but for me, I am so thankful to have them in my life.

OP here - I am glad it worked out for you. Sounds like you have a wonderful family. I am glad that the kids are so closely related to your culture and will have a tight knit community to grow up in.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I understand that using DE isn't for everyone. It is a little weird to think that half of your child's genetics are potentially a stranger's. But I think for most women using DEs, there really isn't another option other than doing a ton of IVF cycles and hoping they can get that one good egg. You could say "just adopt", but so many women want the pregnancy experience. So why not have your baby be half your spouse rather than doing embryo adoption? After all, wouldn't be nice if you could potentially see a little bit of the one you love in your children?

Well, I am not the OP, but, no, this is not the way we personally thought of it. TO US, once we could not have biological children, it just seemed perverse to engineer a human with just one of our genetics, rather than realize, "Well, no, it's not meant to be," and adopt a child who was already alive and living who needed a parent. So, that is what we did. We ended up adopting two with "minor" (of course everyone knows this is a subjective term) special needs.

OP here - Thank you for this.

Watch the haters come on and write how I bashed them (protection is a tricky thing) for their choice of DE. I never did that. I exclusively wrote about myself and my views on ART and DE industry. But they'll conveniently skip over that and over posts like yours.

You keep expressing your views and bash other people when they express theirs. I don't understand your point. Is it just to lecture others about the evils of DE as you see it?

[Anonymous]

To the OP-
The issue with your initial post is the way it's presented. You started a thread just to state your state your opinions, which can come off as a bit judgemental to those using DEs. You didn't come to this board asking for support because you're having issues and you're just not comfortable with DEs. It comes off as a lecture on how DE is just a scam for fertility clinics to get more $$. I also have no stake in this debate as I am using my OEs, but it still rubbed me the wrong way. Please be respectful that it is the correct choice for some women, even if it's not right for you. Go ahead and share your opinions, but this isn't a debate club, you don't need to win the argument.

[Anonymous]

OP I realize now you have to be the person who comes on every now and then to bash DE. It’s fine if it’s not for you but why are you going on about it? Just move on.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I understand that using DE isn't for everyone. It is a little weird to think that half of your child's genetics are potentially a stranger's. But I think for most women using DEs, there really isn't another option other than doing a ton of IVF cycles and hoping they can get that one good egg. You could say "just adopt", but so many women want the pregnancy experience. So why not have your baby be half your spouse rather than doing embryo adoption? After all, wouldn't be nice if you could potentially see a little bit of the one you love in your children?

Well, I am not the OP, but, no, this is not the way we personally thought of it. TO US, once we could not have biological children, it just seemed perverse to engineer a human with just one of our genetics, rather than realize, "Well, no, it's not meant to be," and adopt a child who was already alive and living who needed a parent. So, that is what we did. We ended up adopting two with "minor" (of course everyone knows this is a subjective term) special needs.

We also adopted. I concur with you.

[Anonymous]

OP (I’m PP with twins 24) to try to answer your questions:
Why am I here all these years later?

* Home sick and it came up in recent topics. It’s a big part of my life. I remembered how I first felt and wanted to share that with you. Also that another solution— adoption — didn’t work for me/us
* Of course they have a right to know. They know, just not in preschool.
* Yes issues came up in genetic testing. Turns out my very healthy DH passed on some not perfect things along with his other great qualities
* Keeping genetics secret will be increasingly difficult, but privacy and secrecy are different things.
Hope this helps.
Of course REs make BANK. As I said some aspects of infertility can make you pretty mad.

[Anonymous]

Infertility is all about making hard choices. The crux of the issue is how, you, personally define being a parent and parenting. If a bio-link to your child is essential to you, you basically have three options (none of them are guaranteed, nothing is guaranteed, when it comes to IF.)

1. You keep doing retrieval after retrieval, hoping that you get lucky and get that golden egg, assuming you're able to absorb the financial, emotional, health, etc. risk indefinitely. I know people that have done 10+ retrievals. Some eventually get lucky, others do not. As long as you're ovulating, there's always hope.
2. Try to find a younger female relative and talk her into becoming an egg donor for you. That option is ethically-loaded in its own right, but if your position is "genetic link or bust," then it might be worth exploring.
3. Research and try to get into one of the "three-parent" IVF trials oversees, where your egg would receive mitochondrial DNA from a younger donor. Don't know much about this one, besides the basics.

If none of these are palatable, and you don't want to do DE, because your husband will be procreating, while you'd effectively be a gestational carrier (if I understand your position correctly), then it might be worth looking into a donated embryo -- this way neither you nor DH will have a direct genetic link to the child/would be a level playing field.

This is what modern science can offer currently. Maybe it will be different 5, 10, 15 years down the line. Who knows. You're not wrong for feeling your feelings. Others might and do feel differently about the DE issue, because they view parenthood differently. It's not normatively better or worse, just different, because we're all different people and bring our own life experiences and preconceptions to the infertility journey. In either case, it's heartbreaking and messed up that any of us have to face these choices. ART is and will continue to be big business, because there's good money to be made out of people's desperation. Good luck to you.