Second Shift - sucks for dads too

[Anonymous]

Yes, that's how it was when the kids were little, but that's like, what, at most 10 years? Things are now MUCH easier, and you can get through this, and it will teach you how to be efficient and make you a better person.

I literally don't remember ever having time to sit down and watch TV in those days. But the time passed in a blur and we survived it.

[Anonymous]

For various reasons we stopped at one child. DC is in 1st grade and life is pretty easy now. But the first 5 years were rough and I honestly don't know if my marriage or mental health would have survived another child. Working full time and raising young kids is so, so hard and it doesn't feel like anyone else cares or has any empathy or understanding about it. Even though their futures depend on there being a next generation (we can't even get self driving cars right, the AI hype is way overblown)

[Anonymous]

When I see these posts, I always wonder if the OP had a SAHP or is generally unobservant. I and most of my millennial friends came from dual income families and our lives are pretty similar to what we grew up with (particularly those with transplant parents). In many ways, I have it easier than my parents: remote work exists, I have more disposable income, cities are much safer. Yeah, it’s a ton of work, but that’s not new.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:When I see these posts, I always wonder if the OP had a SAHP or is generally unobservant. I and most of my millennial friends came from dual income families and our lives are pretty similar to what we grew up with (particularly those with transplant parents). In many ways, I have it easier than my parents: remote work exists, I have more disposable income, cities are much safer. Yeah, it’s a ton of work, but that’s not new.

Exactly. With remote work now being an option, it’s exponentially easier for dual working millennials than it was for earlier generations of parents.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:When I see these posts, I always wonder if the OP had a SAHP or is generally unobservant. I and most of my millennial friends came from dual income families and our lives are pretty similar to what we grew up with (particularly those with transplant parents). In many ways, I have it easier than my parents: remote work exists, I have more disposable income, cities are much safer. Yeah, it’s a ton of work, but that’s not new.

I’m a little older that you (tail end of Gen X) but agree with this. My parents both worked FT and had four kids. My mom did work PT for a couple of years (5?) when she had all four of us kids back to back. I don’t remember my parents really having any free time until we were much older. Maybe after 9pm or on a Saturday night or something. They also didn’t have much $. We were working class.

I will say that some things were different then, which probably made things easier. We didn’t have any family in our town but there was more of a sense of community & seemed to be more flexible childcare options. My parents used daycare but also knew several middle aged or younger elderly women (neighbors, friends from church etc) who babysat for pocket money. Also teenagers actually wanted to babysit to earn spending $ and did not charge terribly much. So when daycare or main options fell through, there were always affordable/accessible alternatives.

There were also fewer expectations of parents in terms of “entertainment”, activities, etc. We mostly just played with whatever other kids were around, went to the park etc. They were not running us back and forth to various sports etc. I think I grew up on the very tail end of the era where this was “normal”.

Kids also had a lot more chores and responsibilities, and were expected to fend for themselves for a few hours (or supervise younger siblings) from much younger ages than would be considered normal now.

I don’t know that all of the above is necessarily “better” but it was different than most families today, for sure.

[Anonymous]

One of the reasons I knew I wanted to WOH is that my mom was a SAHP and she was utterly miserable. I am grateful for the ability to keep working, even though it is so, so hard sometimes. But for many families, they don't have a real choice one way or the other and they don't get to decide what they want.

[Anonymous]

It looked miserable for my parents. They were stressed to the max - both worked and commuted. I now SAH with one elementary school child. We chose a home we could afford on one salary. Life is much easier comparied to the life of my parents. My other sibling will not marry or have kids.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:https://www.fastcompany.com/91496750/new-second-shift-burning-out-both-parents

We are a dual working parent household and I so wish we had understood how awful it would be.

We both work in office, commute 30-60 min each way, and work 8-9 hour days. We thought this would be a reasonable setup, with one going in a little early and the other late to handle the morning and evening kid wrangling.

But it has just drained our entire life away. There is always a mess in the house (and now the yard, yay spring), weekends are errands, 7 piles of laundry, cleaning, yardwork.

We don’t make the kind of money we can outsource, like in the article above where they order out for dinner (I think us Millennials order the most takeout of any generation?).

We have no nearby family, no extra cash, and every moment is spoken for. And of course now apparently the good schools we slaved to afford to buy zoned for don’t matter because there won’t be any jobs for our kids.

Just a PSA to GenZ…

The things that helped us during those younger children years:

Prioritizing sleep- getting enough sleep made us more efficient and less tired.
Getting an every other week cleaning lady
Doing laundry one load at a time throughout the week
Double or triple batch cooking on the weekend, we also cooked enough to bring in leftovers for lunch

Its was still a slog, but it was much more manageable when we did those things.

We cook from scratch every night. We dont eat casseroles or things that keep well for 2-3 days nor pack well for lunch. Plus my spouse and one daughter is a vegetarian which complicates meal planning.

What are you cooking that goes bad immediately and can’t even last in the fridge for 2 days? Whatever it is, that’s a choice you could change if you feel rushed/stressed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:When I see these posts, I always wonder if the OP had a SAHP or is generally unobservant. I and most of my millennial friends came from dual income families and our lives are pretty similar to what we grew up with (particularly those with transplant parents). In many ways, I have it easier than my parents: remote work exists, I have more disposable income, cities are much safer. Yeah, it’s a ton of work, but that’s not new.

I’m a little older that you (tail end of Gen X) but agree with this. My parents both worked FT and had four kids. My mom did work PT for a couple of years (5?) when she had all four of us kids back to back. I don’t remember my parents really having any free time until we were much older. Maybe after 9pm or on a Saturday night or something. They also didn’t have much $. We were working class.

I will say that some things were different then, which probably made things easier. We didn’t have any family in our town but there was more of a sense of community & seemed to be more flexible childcare options. My parents used daycare but also knew several middle aged or younger elderly women (neighbors, friends from church etc) who babysat for pocket money. Also teenagers actually wanted to babysit to earn spending $ and did not charge terribly much. So when daycare or main options fell through, there were always affordable/accessible alternatives.

There were also fewer expectations of parents in terms of “entertainment”, activities, etc. We mostly just played with whatever other kids were around, went to the park etc. They were not running us back and forth to various sports etc. I think I grew up on the very tail end of the era where this was “normal”.

Kids also had a lot more chores and responsibilities, and were expected to fend for themselves for a few hours (or supervise younger siblings) from much younger ages than would be considered normal now.

I don’t know that all of the above is necessarily “better” but it was different than most families today, for sure.

My parents had a nanny and housekeeper, so their lives were much easier and they didn't allow activities. Now child care is crazy expensive. It didn't pay for me to work with my income as child care was more than my take home.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:When I see these posts, I always wonder if the OP had a SAHP or is generally unobservant. I and most of my millennial friends came from dual income families and our lives are pretty similar to what we grew up with (particularly those with transplant parents). In many ways, I have it easier than my parents: remote work exists, I have more disposable income, cities are much safer. Yeah, it’s a ton of work, but that’s not new.

I definitely think this is right. Ever since our second was born, DH has been bemoaning the lack of free time and the amount of chores and childcare he now needs to do. Like… what did he expect?! He also spends at least an hour each day working out, so it’s not like he gets zero time to himself. Plus we have local family who are able to help us out with sick days, school breaks, date night babysitting, etc. All in all, I think we have it pretty good for a dual-working parent family!

However, DH grew up with a SAHM, a dad who worked a lot and did minimal housework/childcare, au pairs/nannies, and housekeepers. I think that has got to be coloring his expectations. I grew up in a family with two parents who worked outside the house, so our lifestyle - which DH maintains is SO difficult - just seems normal to me.

[Anonymous]

For meals, I basically make the same 5-7 weekday meals on repeat (with slight seasonal variation), and nearly always have the ingredients for those. Boring, but helps a lot. Eventually we get sick of one meal and switch it out for a newer recipe.

And one load of laundry per day is a must. However you can make that happen. Otherwise I would be drowning in dirty laundry. That said, we always have baskets of (folded) clean clothes that seem to sit awhile. I have started keeping a bin of hangers in the laundry room to hang shirts and other hanging items right away at least. Then just grab them all by the hangers & can put everyone’s away in one trip. I also keep a kitchen trash bag next to the washing machine for outgrown or donation clothes. I throw them straight into it out of the dryer & drop off when full

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I guess it just depends on how you look at it. I’m sure unemployed people would love your situation. Ditto for parents of kids with health issues/special needs. I’m a single parent so I to what you go by myself 24/7 on one meager salary.

Remember to stop sometimes and feel grateful for everything you do have. Today I felt grateful that I was able to get outside and take a walk in the sunshine. The laundry and errands and negative bank balance will always be there but a 60+ degree sunny day in February is what I choose to be grateful for.

OMG, stop. OP's concerns/complaints are valid, even if someone has it harder.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:https://www.fastcompany.com/91496750/new-second-shift-burning-out-both-parents

We are a dual working parent household and I so wish we had understood how awful it would be.

We both work in office, commute 30-60 min each way, and work 8-9 hour days. We thought this would be a reasonable setup, with one going in a little early and the other late to handle the morning and evening kid wrangling.

But it has just drained our entire life away. There is always a mess in the house (and now the yard, yay spring), weekends are errands, 7 piles of laundry, cleaning, yardwork.

We don’t make the kind of money we can outsource, like in the article above where they order out for dinner (I think us Millennials order the most takeout of any generation?).

We have no nearby family, no extra cash, and every moment is spoken for. And of course now apparently the good schools we slaved to afford to buy zoned for don’t matter because there won’t be any jobs for our kids.

Just a PSA to GenZ…

The things that helped us during those younger children years:

Prioritizing sleep- getting enough sleep made us more efficient and less tired.
Getting an every other week cleaning lady
Doing laundry one load at a time throughout the week
Double or triple batch cooking on the weekend, we also cooked enough to bring in leftovers for lunch

Its was still a slog, but it was much more manageable when we did those things.

We cook from scratch every night. We dont eat casseroles or things that keep well for 2-3 days nor pack well for lunch. Plus my spouse and one daughter is a vegetarian which complicates meal planning.

Hilarious you think casseroles are the only thing that will “keep”.

Batch cook and use your freezer. Buy those one cup silicone freezer molds. Make a giant pot of pasta sauce and freeze in one cup blocks. Does your family eat chili? That also freezes well.

Roasted potatoes and sweet potatoes also freeze really well and can be heated up in an air fryer in 7 minutes.

Get creative with your meal planning. Make a double portion of protein Monday. Eat it with a side of roasted potatoes and some kind of vegetable. Tuesday can be rice/other grain depending on preference bowls with the same protein. Get a rice cooker. That night while you’re prepping dinner make a big pot of pasta. Wednesday will be pasta night, using your delicious frozen premade sauce.

Our time is not in making sauce — what exactly are you doing there, cooking down raw tomatoes? We mix olive oil, pureed tomatoes, fresh garlic and herbs and it’s ready in 15 minutes of simmering.

The time suck in food prep is vegetables. We roast eggplant, sautéed green beans, salads which have cut cherry tomatoes, onions, cukes, carrots. The fresh vegetables take a lot of prep, and frozen precut veggie do not cook right unless you are making a blended soup.

I do cook meat ahead of time.

[Anonymous]

There are 5 tasks that gets done in my house every single day - rain or shine - healthy or sick - that makes life easier. I have gone through stupid stressful times and even in the worst of worst situations at least these things were getting done.

1 - Make beds (takes just a few minutes). Its the biggest piece of furniture in the bedroom and instantly makes the rooms look neat

2 - Wash dishes. Run dishwasher - at least twice a day. I make use of small load size options, I also make use of quick rinse to keep the loaded dished clean and not stinky as I wait for dishwasher to be full before I start it. If I have space in the dishwasher - I often just wash the range exhaust hood fiters. I keep the sinks clean.

3 - Paperwork. Pay bills, submit reimbursements, tackle mail, put appointments on calendar, accept invites, send greetings etc...

4 - Laundry. Run at least 1-2 loads of laundry. Easier to fold and put away. I also make use of "small load" or "fast wash" options. Some loads run for only 15 minutes.

5 - Trash and recycling. Remove trash from each room and empty out waste/trash bin and sort stuff for recycling. Don't let trash and recycling pile up.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:https://www.fastcompany.com/91496750/new-second-shift-burning-out-both-parents

We are a dual working parent household and I so wish we had understood how awful it would be.

We both work in office, commute 30-60 min each way, and work 8-9 hour days. We thought this would be a reasonable setup, with one going in a little early and the other late to handle the morning and evening kid wrangling.

But it has just drained our entire life away. There is always a mess in the house (and now the yard, yay spring), weekends are errands, 7 piles of laundry, cleaning, yardwork.

We don’t make the kind of money we can outsource, like in the article above where they order out for dinner (I think us Millennials order the most takeout of any generation?).

We have no nearby family, no extra cash, and every moment is spoken for. And of course now apparently the good schools we slaved to afford to buy zoned for don’t matter because there won’t be any jobs for our kids.

Just a PSA to GenZ…

Sorry, what's the message of the PSA?