Custody and verbal/emotional abuse of kids?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:advice for OP until she gets divorced.

1. Get your kid involved in some sort of hobby that keeps her busy and away from home.
2. On weekends, beyond the sport, do all your shopping then so you all can leave on a Saturday morning and not come back until it’s nearly bed time.
3. Arrange a ton of play dates. Offer to take her to the mall with a friend. Take them to the movies, out to dinner etc. Anything to stay out of the house.
4. If there us some sort of Mommy and me course, sign up for it. For example there is Yoga class I saw for parents and kids together.
5. If you all can afford it, send her away to sleep away camp for the summer or send her to stay with Grandparents for a month over the summer. Anything to give her a break.
6. Hire a sitter/mother’s helper to pick her ip
from school and help her with her homework afterwards. He will act out less with with another person present.
7. Do what you can to appease him and not suspect that you loathe him. Pitch everything as a favor to him. “I arranged for Larla to have a play date after baseball practice so you don’t have to worry about picking her up from practice.” “I arranged a carpool with another family so you don’t have to worry about driving her to her games anymore.”

One last thought, as soon as she is able to join, take her to the gym with you to work out together. I think most gyms allow kids as young as 12. It’s good in general for mental and physical health. It releases stress. This also gives you flexibility to leave the house at a moments notice with that excuse. Naturally, always have your gym bags packed.

This is perfect advice.

- divorced with an emotionally abusive ex who didn’t want custody and then went back and was granted 50/50 custody, pretty much just bc he asked for it and that’s the presumption. My dc has a GAL who does not like my ex and has even said she thinks he has narcissistic and sociopathic tendencies, but who has still never challenged his ‘parenting rights’ to 50 time.

That stinks. How is your DD handing it?

Very very tough periods, including when ex dh had her convinced that I had done things I hadn’t and that I was the problem (in contrast, I never ever bad mouthed my ex). I would not wish court on any child, and I’d think long and hard about anyone who gives advice to run and involve your family in the court system. Once you’re in, it can drag on

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You won’t get more than 50/50.

Yes, I understand that and so I’m wondering:

1) at what age does DD get to pick where she gets to go and for how long

2) if the choice is 50/50, is it better to be in an abusive household 100 percent of the time with a mom to protect you and run interference, or an abusive household just 50 percent of the time but with no protection?

Question 2 is what I’m really stuck on.

These are questions to ask an attorney and a psychologist, not random strangers on the internet.

Please. This is a great place to ask.

An attorney doesn’t know. They handle paperwork, collect their fees and then move on. A psych might know only slightly more.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The best advice I got from lawyer was a strategy that allowed xDH to save face re custody. He could not / would not ever say he didn't want 50/50 but he didn't want it (the impact on his career, the responsibility, all of it). So he had to basically be handed a cover story that made it sound like he would be a super involved dad but with a flexible schedule for his "VERY IMPORTANT JOB" that in reality resulted in me having the large majority of custody. The catch is you can't get child support that undermines the facade of equal involvement

This. This is the secret to how I ended up with full physical custody. I offered 50/50 and then made it very easy for DH to cancel -- never complained, just took the kids. I did every doctor's appointment, day off school, etc. He travelled for work a few times a year for 2-6 weeks. I'm sure he told himself and other people that he travelled too much for work to have custody of the kids.

I never told him he was a bad dad for not spending time with his kids. As long as he looked good in front of others, that's all he cared about.

All those people who say you "can't get child support" are wrong. My DH earned more than me, so I got child support that reflected a 50/50 split in time with a difference in incomes. I chose not to go to court to show legalize the de facto full custody and did not ask for commensurate increase in CS. That would have pissed him off.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:advice for OP until she gets divorced.

1. Get your kid involved in some sort of hobby that keeps her busy and away from home.
2. On weekends, beyond the sport, do all your shopping then so you all can leave on a Saturday morning and not come back until it’s nearly bed time.
3. Arrange a ton of play dates. Offer to take her to the mall with a friend. Take them to the movies, out to dinner etc. Anything to stay out of the house.
4. If there us some sort of Mommy and me course, sign up for it. For example there is Yoga class I saw for parents and kids together.
5. If you all can afford it, send her away to sleep away camp for the summer or send her to stay with Grandparents for a month over the summer. Anything to give her a break.
6. Hire a sitter/mother’s helper to pick her ip
from school and help her with her homework afterwards. He will act out less with with another person present.
7. Do what you can to appease him and not suspect that you loathe him. Pitch everything as a favor to him. “I arranged for Larla to have a play date after baseball practice so you don’t have to worry about picking her up from practice.” “I arranged a carpool with another family so you don’t have to worry about driving her to her games anymore.”

One last thought, as soon as she is able to join, take her to the gym with you to work out together. I think most gyms allow kids as young as 12. It’s good in general for mental and physical health. It releases stress. This also gives you flexibility to leave the house at a moments notice with that excuse. Naturally, always have your gym bags packed.

This is perfect advice.

- divorced with an emotionally abusive ex who didn’t want custody and then went back and was granted 50/50 custody, pretty much just bc he asked for it and that’s the presumption. My dc has a GAL who does not like my ex and has even said she thinks he has narcissistic and sociopathic tendencies, but who has still never challenged his ‘parenting rights’ to 50 time.

To get a change in custody, you have to prove "substantial change of circumstances" and "best interests of the child." It's actually quite challenging to prove a "substantial change of circumstances" if you have a good attorney, which is why you want to get the custody right on the first go if at all possible.

Also, OP, can you get your daughter in therapy and sell it to your DH as doing it to help her through the divorce? Many children whose parents are going through a divorce see a therapist. If you sell it to him as something she needs for reasons unrelated to him, he might be supportive, and therapy could really benefit her if she's dealing with emotional abuse, anxiety, or anything else.

I'm over 10 years deep into coparenting with an abuser, and things have gotten much better for me and our child because I learned how to communicate with him so as not to trigger him. You have to avoid poking the bear, as they say. You deliver information in a friendly, neutral, never accusatory tone. You avoid casting blame. Not to sound dramatic, but it is almost like you are dealing with a known terrorist holding your child. You do what you need to do to keep them safe. You can use AI to write your texts for you in a friendly tone if you can't do it yourself (I can't, so I do this).

I don’t totally disagree with you, but you’re not seeing it through a real life lens… there is a strong presumption of equal parenting time being ‘in the best interests’ of kids in today’s family courts.

Yes, there is a standard for a custody change but a ‘substantial change’ is pretty much at a judges discretion. And many judges and Gal etc think it’s best for everyone to get equal time… even if there are parenting imperfections, and trust me, even if OP thinks she’s the far better parent, a good lawyer can come up with something she did wrong, even if it’s just that dd prefers her too much and therefore must be ‘gate keeping’

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The best advice I got from lawyer was a strategy that allowed xDH to save face re custody. He could not / would not ever say he didn't want 50/50 but he didn't want it (the impact on his career, the responsibility, all of it). So he had to basically be handed a cover story that made it sound like he would be a super involved dad but with a flexible schedule for his "VERY IMPORTANT JOB" that in reality resulted in me having the large majority of custody. The catch is you can't get child support that undermines the facade of equal involvement

This. This is the secret to how I ended up with full physical custody. I offered 50/50 and then made it very easy for DH to cancel -- never complained, just took the kids. I did every doctor's appointment, day off school, etc. He travelled for work a few times a year for 2-6 weeks. I'm sure he told himself and other people that he travelled too much for work to have custody of the kids.

I never told him he was a bad dad for not spending time with his kids. As long as he looked good in front of others, that's all he cared about.

All those people who say you "can't get child support" are wrong. My DH earned more than me, so I got child support that reflected a 50/50 split in time with a difference in incomes. I chose not to go to court to show legalize the de facto full custody and did not ask for commensurate increase in CS. That would have pissed him off.

Ok but Child support is determined by state, and the calculations depend on that states laws. Do you happen to live in NY?

[Anonymous]

OP - it is hard and even a very mature 14.5 year old will have little say in making a choice if parent in a court custody situation. And Dd was advised that it could be turned around on her.
Number one you need to get your own therapist to get professional help in getting yourself on firm ground. Then you will be able to get sound advice on how to help DD through the coming phases of life with an unbalanced dad,

Get your DD a therapist as this will be her outlet as she matures and recognizes what her Dad is doing is not OK. It would be a professional who has a relationship with DD.

ItIs much easier for a teen to just be out and involved in her own life and limiting time either dear dad than for a child if 10.

I believe your EX travels a lot do have it written in ad noted that you have right if first refusal to have DD at your place. BUT zi would also add that it will not change your regular custody time.

A schedule if 2-2-5 has worked well or as well as one could expect DD had noted exactly how much time she had to put up with his behavior.
She will be a clear no more time at age 18 unless he has a sudden recognition of his
mental illness.

You are correct that you must be neutral on dad, unless you have a good reason for safety such as one asking “ to sign and notarize a foreign trip with no dates, itinerary etc, supplied?? “

You can over time acknowledge how DD feels or responds as valid as situations unfold.
It is a process,but if you have an unbalanced SIL, you backup the hard decisions your DD makes for her child or children given the usual 59/50 decisions today.

[Anonymous]

One addition a lawyer working for DD suggested asking if the 14 could share her thoughts with both parent’s attorney alone in confidence so they would have a common understanding of her wishes in terms of time spent on the idea that perhaps there could be more cooperation on seeing how her voice could be considered. It was a long shot she had seen used, but a solid no go. It was attempted so our daughter could say later to DD she had tried her best. GAL can be a big risk and any court very traumatic. Snd you need hard evidence.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You won’t get more than 50/50.

Yes, I understand that and so I’m wondering:

1) at what age does DD get to pick where she gets to go and for how long

2) if the choice is 50/50, is it better to be in an abusive household 100 percent of the time with a mom to protect you and run interference, or an abusive household just 50 percent of the time but with no protection?

Question 2 is what I’m really stuck on.

These are questions to ask an attorney and a psychologist, not random strangers on the internet.

They will tell you whatever makes them the most money.

Dp. Smart people on this board. Op, take whatever your lawyer says with a grain of salt. And get a second opinion.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You won’t get more than 50/50.

Yes, I understand that and so I’m wondering:

1) at what age does DD get to pick where she gets to go and for how long

2) if the choice is 50/50, is it better to be in an abusive household 100 percent of the time with a mom to protect you and run interference, or an abusive household just 50 percent of the time but with no protection?

Question 2 is what I’m really stuck on.

These are questions to ask an attorney and a psychologist, not random strangers on the internet.

They will tell you whatever makes them the most money.

Dp. Smart people on this board. Op, take whatever your lawyer says with a grain of salt. And get a second opinion.

Thanks to all with the good advice here. I’m so frustrated with the advice of attorneys. At this point I have 3 consultations complete and all have very different approaches. None of them feel right to me so I guess I have to keep looking. I’m naive but I thought the legal side of things would be straightforward and rational and getting myself to take action would be the hardest part. It’s been the opposite.

I have two friends I’ve confided in who know DD. I feel embarrassed but relieved for them to know what we’re dealing with. I wish I could have something settled before school starts but I’m afraid that it is going to be at least a few months of uncertainty the way things are panning out.

This is sucky.

[Anonymous]

I'm sorry op, but glad you confided in friends and consulted attorneys.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You won’t get more than 50/50.

Yes, I understand that and so I’m wondering:

1) at what age does DD get to pick where she gets to go and for how long

2) if the choice is 50/50, is it better to be in an abusive household 100 percent of the time with a mom to protect you and run interference, or an abusive household just 50 percent of the time but with no protection?

Question 2 is what I’m really stuck on.

These are questions to ask an attorney and a psychologist, not random strangers on the internet.

They will tell you whatever makes them the most money.

Dp. Smart people on this board. Op, take whatever your lawyer says with a grain of salt. And get a second opinion.

Thanks to all with the good advice here. I’m so frustrated with the advice of attorneys. At this point I have 3 consultations complete and all have very different approaches. None of them feel right to me so I guess I have to keep looking. I’m naive but I thought the legal side of things would be straightforward and rational and getting myself to take action would be the hardest part. It’s been the opposite.

I have two friends I’ve confided in who know DD. I feel embarrassed but relieved for them to know what we’re dealing with. I wish I could have something settled before school starts but I’m afraid that it is going to be at least a few months of uncertainty the way things are panning out.

This is sucky.

Do you documented the abuse. The only way you will get full custody is proof and having your daughter lie to destroy her relationship. Do you think that’s healthy for her?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You won’t get more than 50/50.

Yes, I understand that and so I’m wondering:

1) at what age does DD get to pick where she gets to go and for how long

2) if the choice is 50/50, is it better to be in an abusive household 100 percent of the time with a mom to protect you and run interference, or an abusive household just 50 percent of the time but with no protection?

Question 2 is what I’m really stuck on.

These are questions to ask an attorney and a psychologist, not random strangers on the internet.

They will tell you whatever makes them the most money.

Dp. Smart people on this board. Op, take whatever your lawyer says with a grain of salt. And get a second opinion.

Thanks to all with the good advice here. I’m so frustrated with the advice of attorneys. At this point I have 3 consultations complete and all have very different approaches. None of them feel right to me so I guess I have to keep looking. I’m naive but I thought the legal side of things would be straightforward and rational and getting myself to take action would be the hardest part. It’s been the opposite.

I have two friends I’ve confided in who know DD. I feel embarrassed but relieved for them to know what we’re dealing with. I wish I could have something settled before school starts but I’m afraid that it is going to be at least a few months of uncertainty the way things are panning out.

This is sucky.

Do you documented the abuse. The only way you will get full custody is proof and having your daughter lie to destroy her relationship. Do you think that’s healthy for her?

I didn't say I am trying to get full custody nor having her lie. I'm not sure where you got that from. I'm just trying to understand how to best keep her safe in the future knowing that without documented physical abuse it will probably just be a basic 50/50 settlement.

[Anonymous]

Eventually she will refuse to go to your ex on her own if she does not feel safe or supported there. Hopefully at that point your ex will not force the issue.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You won’t get more than 50/50.

Yes, I understand that and so I’m wondering:

1) at what age does DD get to pick where she gets to go and for how long

2) if the choice is 50/50, is it better to be in an abusive household 100 percent of the time with a mom to protect you and run interference, or an abusive household just 50 percent of the time but with no protection?

Question 2 is what I’m really stuck on.

These are questions to ask an attorney and a psychologist, not random strangers on the internet.

They will tell you whatever makes them the most money.

Dp. Smart people on this board. Op, take whatever your lawyer says with a grain of salt. And get a second opinion.

Thanks to all with the good advice here. I’m so frustrated with the advice of attorneys. At this point I have 3 consultations complete and all have very different approaches. None of them feel right to me so I guess I have to keep looking. I’m naive but I thought the legal side of things would be straightforward and rational and getting myself to take action would be the hardest part. It’s been the opposite.

I have two friends I’ve confided in who know DD. I feel embarrassed but relieved for them to know what we’re dealing with. I wish I could have something settled before school starts but I’m afraid that it is going to be at least a few months of uncertainty the way things are panning out.

This is sucky.

Do you documented the abuse. The only way you will get full custody is proof and having your daughter lie to destroy her relationship. Do you think that’s healthy for her?

I didn't say I am trying to get full custody nor having her lie. I'm not sure where you got that from. I'm just trying to understand how to best keep her safe in the future knowing that without documented physical abuse it will probably just be a basic 50/50 settlement.

You have to have the abuse documented. Doctors, therapist or police reports. Just leave and take her with you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You won’t get more than 50/50.

Yes, I understand that and so I’m wondering:

1) at what age does DD get to pick where she gets to go and for how long

2) if the choice is 50/50, is it better to be in an abusive household 100 percent of the time with a mom to protect you and run interference, or an abusive household just 50 percent of the time but with no protection?

Question 2 is what I’m really stuck on.

These are questions to ask an attorney and a psychologist, not random strangers on the internet.

They will tell you whatever makes them the most money.

Dp. Smart people on this board. Op, take whatever your lawyer says with a grain of salt. And get a second opinion.

Thanks to all with the good advice here. I’m so frustrated with the advice of attorneys. At this point I have 3 consultations complete and all have very different approaches. None of them feel right to me so I guess I have to keep looking. I’m naive but I thought the legal side of things would be straightforward and rational and getting myself to take action would be the hardest part. It’s been the opposite.

I have two friends I’ve confided in who know DD. I feel embarrassed but relieved for them to know what we’re dealing with. I wish I could have something settled before school starts but I’m afraid that it is going to be at least a few months of uncertainty the way things are panning out.

This is sucky.

Do you documented the abuse. The only way you will get full custody is proof and having your daughter lie to destroy her relationship. Do you think that’s healthy for her?

I didn't say I am trying to get full custody nor having her lie. I'm not sure where you got that from. I'm just trying to understand how to best keep her safe in the future knowing that without documented physical abuse it will probably just be a basic 50/50 settlement.

You have to have the abuse documented. Doctors, therapist or police reports. Just leave and take her with you.

Dp

Op, this is crazy advice and it seems like this poster is projecting her trauma on your situation. Unless it’s very extreme, no one will bat an eye at ‘verbal or emotional abuse’ in the court system, so you are much better served at trying to find a way to want your ex to have less time with dd.

I posted above, but again my suggestion is to build a life as independent as dh as possible, especially for dd, and ride it out a little longer. By 16, courts typically won’t force a kid to go to a parents house (unless they can show you’ve ‘alienated’ them so be careful). Your best bet is to not rush, but prepare.