How many minor transitions do you know ow

[Anonymous]

Just with minors:
-my sibling’s child
-children of 4 acquaintances (2 legally changed the kids’ names at around age 6 & 12)
-a lot of females in my kid’s school were nonbinary in 7th grade but back to identifying as female by 9th grade.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have 5 friends who have children who have transitioned and am completely supportive of them. I don’t understand why MAGAts are so obsessed with this.

same.
I'm a teacher. Those transitioning are so much happier than they were previously. Why can't we allow this to happen without MAGA and their dirty hands.

Because:

1) there's no biological evidence to support the concept of being born the wrong gender, so it's a question of truth.

2) minor transitions can involve prepuberty blockers and more drastic surgery, which is irreversible and with drastic consequences for things like adult sexual enjoyment. This is why European countries have enacted laws and policies blocking such treatments of minors.

3) As time goes on, more and more of the "trans" have detransitioned back to their birth sex/gender, making #2 particularly problematic.

4) There is a clear overlap between kids who claim a trans identity and autism. Which does open up a whole set of questions around appropriateness of supporting transitions.

5) one of the leading pro-trans doctor received a $10M grant funding research into the well-being of kids who transitioned following usage of treatment and suddenly, after nine years of collecting data, refuses to release her finding because she's afraid it will be "weaponized." Can we guess what the findings were? You can google her easily.

6) many have noticed that girls who transition share similar characteristics of girls in previous generations who were came out in adulthood as lesbians, and are worried that sending these "kind" messages promoting and encouraging transitions to these girls is harming them and their growth of sexual maturity.

7) however your stances on trans, it's undeniable that the Biden administration and the progressive groups were proactively redefining the meaning of men and women, particularly women, to accommodate trans. Who can forget KBJ's famous utterance that she can't define a woman because she's not a scientist. For many women in real life, this was a serious affront to them and their existence, especially following a strong generational long feminist movement that sought to remove male dominance of women's existence only to turn around and effectively give men the back door back into women's spaces.

8) Some people certainly abused the concept of trans to get privileged treatment/placement in venues like prisons, so you saw prosecuted violent rapists in women's prisons.

9) Certain school districts/states passed laws banning schools from telling parents if a kid wanted to transition and didn't want the parents to know. This had major implications for the rights of parents over their children.

I could go on. But the idea that you can't understand why people are so "unkind" about trans is burying your head in the sand. And I will also say I remember a post on DCUM sometime ago that commented it's never the country club Republican families that have trans kids, it's always something that seems to happen in Takoma Park type places. And while a simplified statement, I do think there's truth to it.

You need to include citations for your BS if you want to be taken seriously, particularly for bullets 3, 4, 9

4 and 9 are common knowledge. You can just google that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Realizing that every family in our boring upper middle class suburb has a child that is gay. Every family in my extended family has at least one child that is gay. That just seems really high compared to previous generations and it does suggest that a fair amount has to be social contagion or something. There seem to be as many gay weddings as straight weddings in our circle and we are fairly conservative, church going folks. I don't believe there has ever been another time in history where half of the population was homosexual. It certainly seems odd and like some sort of historical anomaly.

it’s the crap in our food and water supply.

Are you really this ignorant? Gay people have ALWAYS existed. But, when mainstream culture tells you that you are going to hell, are a danger to society, are a pedophile etc. you will do anything to NOT be seen as gay. So, people hid their true identities. With more acceptance, more people feel comfortable coming out. It has zero to do with our food/water. How do you not know this?

Are YOU really that ignorant? Clearly you’ve done no research into many different possible external causes of hormonal dysfunction including whether the mother has taken birth control prior to conception.

[Anonymous]

At least 4 that I can think of off the top of my head but I am pretty sure I know more as I feel like I keep hearing about kids who are children of friends or friends of my children transitioning all the time.

2 female to male. One was clear since she was little that she identified as a boy.
2 male to female, both autistic. These concern me (and their parents) as it is becoming more common for autistic kids to want to transition as they are trying to fit in (lots of literature on this), so their parents, while supportive, are worried about the reasons why.

I am very much against the anti-trans rhetoric coming from the Right but I do tend to think there is some social contagion going on.

[Anonymous]

3, but none who have made a full transition. I think 2 will eventually remain their birth gender. Not sure on the third.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:At least 4 that I can think of off the top of my head but I am pretty sure I know more as I feel like I keep hearing about kids who are children of friends or friends of my children transitioning all the time.

2 female to male. One was clear since she was little that she identified as a boy.
2 male to female, both autistic. These concern me (and their parents) as it is becoming more common for autistic kids to want to transition as they are trying to fit in (lots of literature on this), so their parents, while supportive, are worried about the reasons why.

I am very much against the anti-trans rhetoric coming from the Right but I do tend to think there is some social contagion going on.

I agree 100% on your last point re: social contagion.

[Anonymous]

Absolutely there is social contagion going on. What the left fails to understand/accept is that it’s not as simple as “trans people are not hurting you so why do you care?” That argument fails to acknowledge the tremendous power of influence. Kids think this is cool or different and that they need to transition because they are special or whatever. Terrible lack of judgement from the left on this issue that might very well have cost this country its democracy.

[Anonymous]

I don't know... at least five. But I can also think of several adults, too, including a colleague and a former classmate in grad school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Absolutely there is social contagion going on. What the left fails to understand/accept is that it’s not as simple as “trans people are not hurting you so why do you care?” That argument fails to acknowledge the tremendous power of influence. Kids think this is cool or different and that they need to transition because they are special or whatever. Terrible lack of judgement from the left on this issue that might very well have cost this country its democracy.

You make a huge logical leap here from "failing to acknowledge the tremendous power of influence" and costing this country its democracy.

First of all, I without question see the influence and, while I don't totally understand the fluidity of young kids' identities, so what?

And secondly, just because a lot of the country equate hating trans kids with voting for Donald Trump, you can not blame the left.

[Anonymous]

I teach middle school. There are fewer this year than last so maybe, two out of 150 students?

Two years ago, five FTM and one MTF.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Absolutely there is social contagion going on. What the left fails to understand/accept is that it’s not as simple as “trans people are not hurting you so why do you care?” That argument fails to acknowledge the tremendous power of influence. Kids think this is cool or different and that they need to transition because they are special or whatever. Terrible lack of judgement from the left on this issue that might very well have cost this country its democracy.

You make a huge logical leap here from "failing to acknowledge the tremendous power of influence" and costing this country its democracy.

First of all, I without question see the influence and, while I don't totally understand the fluidity of young kids' identities, so what?

And secondly, just because a lot of the country equate hating trans kids with voting for Donald Trump, you can not blame the left.

Countless political observers have said the “she’s for them I’m for you” ad was massively effective in convincing people to vote for trump.

People don’t want their children going to school with trans kids because their children might be influenced. It’s as simple as that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have 5 friends who have children who have transitioned and am completely supportive of them. I don’t understand why MAGAts are so obsessed with this.

same.
I'm a teacher. Those transitioning are so much happier than they were previously. Why can't we allow this to happen without MAGA and their dirty hands.

Because:

1) there's no biological evidence to support the concept of being born the wrong gender, so it's a question of truth.

2) minor transitions can involve prepuberty blockers and more drastic surgery, which is irreversible and with drastic consequences for things like adult sexual enjoyment. This is why European countries have enacted laws and policies blocking such treatments of minors.

3) As time goes on, more and more of the "trans" have detransitioned back to their birth sex/gender, making #2 particularly problematic.

4) There is a clear overlap between kids who claim a trans identity and autism. Which does open up a whole set of questions around appropriateness of supporting transitions.

5) one of the leading pro-trans doctor received a $10M grant funding research into the well-being of kids who transitioned following usage of treatment and suddenly, after nine years of collecting data, refuses to release her finding because she's afraid it will be "weaponized." Can we guess what the findings were? You can google her easily.

6) many have noticed that girls who transition share similar characteristics of girls in previous generations who were came out in adulthood as lesbians, and are worried that sending these "kind" messages promoting and encouraging transitions to these girls is harming them and their growth of sexual maturity.

7) however your stances on trans, it's undeniable that the Biden administration and the progressive groups were proactively redefining the meaning of men and women, particularly women, to accommodate trans. Who can forget KBJ's famous utterance that she can't define a woman because she's not a scientist. For many women in real life, this was a serious affront to them and their existence, especially following a strong generational long feminist movement that sought to remove male dominance of women's existence only to turn around and effectively give men the back door back into women's spaces.

8) Some people certainly abused the concept of trans to get privileged treatment/placement in venues like prisons, so you saw prosecuted violent rapists in women's prisons.

9) Certain school districts/states passed laws banning schools from telling parents if a kid wanted to transition and didn't want the parents to know. This had major implications for the rights of parents over their children.

I could go on. But the idea that you can't understand why people are so "unkind" about trans is burying your head in the sand. And I will also say I remember a post on DCUM sometime ago that commented it's never the country club Republican families that have trans kids, it's always something that seems to happen in Takoma Park type places. And while a simplified statement, I do think there's truth to it.

You need to include citations for your BS if you want to be taken seriously, particularly for bullets 3, 4, 9

4 and 9 are common knowledge. You can just google that.

DP, was going to say exactly that. (4) Autism comorbidity well established.

Van Der Miesen A. I. R., Hurley H., Bal A. M., de Vries A. L. C. (2018). Prevalence of the wish to be of the opposite gender in adolescents and adults with autism spectrum disorder. Archives of Sexual Behavior, 47, 2307–2317.

Walsh R. J., Krabbendam L., Dewinter J., Begeer S. (2018). Brief report: Gender identity differences in autistic adults: Associations with perceptual and socio-cognitive profiles. Journal of Autism and Developmental Disorders, 48(12), 4070–4078.

Warrier V., Greenberg D. M., Weir E., Buckingham C., Smith P., Lai M. C., Allison C., Baron-Cohen S. (2020). Elevated rates of autism, other neurodevelopmental and psychiatric diagnoses, and autistic traits in transgender and gender-diverse individuals. Nature Communications, 11(1), 1–12.

Nobody disputes this.

(9) See https://www.nytimes.com/2023/01/22/us/gender-identity-students-parents.html

(3) Detransitioners have increased over time numerically, but that's not saying anything interesting. I have no idea whether the rate of detransitioning has increased, but obviously detransitioning occurs with a lag so I'm not sure what conclusions you would draw. Percentage of detransition estimates range from 2% to 13%. 2% comes from all Swedish transitions 1960-2010, which was mostly pre-craze.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Absolutely there is social contagion going on. What the left fails to understand/accept is that it’s not as simple as “trans people are not hurting you so why do you care?” That argument fails to acknowledge the tremendous power of influence. Kids think this is cool or different and that they need to transition because they are special or whatever. Terrible lack of judgement from the left on this issue that might very well have cost this country its democracy.

You make a huge logical leap here from "failing to acknowledge the tremendous power of influence" and costing this country its democracy.

First of all, I without question see the influence and, while I don't totally understand the fluidity of young kids' identities, so what?

And secondly, just because a lot of the country equate hating trans kids with voting for Donald Trump, you can not blame the left.

Countless political observers have said the “she’s for them I’m for you” ad was massively effective in convincing people to vote for trump.

People don’t want their children going to school with trans kids because their children might be influenced. It’s as simple as that.

Yes. This is among the dumbest own-goals by any party. Biden squeaked into office (thank goodness) and immediately the far-left went nuts with demands, and moderating voices were basically stomped. The writing was on the wall a year in.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have 5 friends who have children who have transitioned and am completely supportive of them. I don’t understand why MAGAts are so obsessed with this.

same.
I'm a teacher. Those transitioning are so much happier than they were previously. Why can't we allow this to happen without MAGA and their dirty hands.

Because:

1) there's no biological evidence to support the concept of being born the wrong gender, so it's a question of truth.

2) minor transitions can involve prepuberty blockers and more drastic surgery, which is irreversible and with drastic consequences for things like adult sexual enjoyment. This is why European countries have enacted laws and policies blocking such treatments of minors.

3) As time goes on, more and more of the "trans" have detransitioned back to their birth sex/gender, making #2 particularly problematic.

4) There is a clear overlap between kids who claim a trans identity and autism. Which does open up a whole set of questions around appropriateness of supporting transitions.

5) one of the leading pro-trans doctor received a $10M grant funding research into the well-being of kids who transitioned following usage of treatment and suddenly, after nine years of collecting data, refuses to release her finding because she's afraid it will be "weaponized." Can we guess what the findings were? You can google her easily.

6) many have noticed that girls who transition share similar characteristics of girls in previous generations who were came out in adulthood as lesbians, and are worried that sending these "kind" messages promoting and encouraging transitions to these girls is harming them and their growth of sexual maturity.

7) however your stances on trans, it's undeniable that the Biden administration and the progressive groups were proactively redefining the meaning of men and women, particularly women, to accommodate trans. Who can forget KBJ's famous utterance that she can't define a woman because she's not a scientist. For many women in real life, this was a serious affront to them and their existence, especially following a strong generational long feminist movement that sought to remove male dominance of women's existence only to turn around and effectively give men the back door back into women's spaces.

8) Some people certainly abused the concept of trans to get privileged treatment/placement in venues like prisons, so you saw prosecuted violent rapists in women's prisons.

9) Certain school districts/states passed laws banning schools from telling parents if a kid wanted to transition and didn't want the parents to know. This had major implications for the rights of parents over their children.

I could go on. But the idea that you can't understand why people are so "unkind" about trans is burying your head in the sand. And I will also say I remember a post on DCUM sometime ago that commented it's never the country club Republican families that have trans kids, it's always something that seems to happen in Takoma Park type places. And while a simplified statement, I do think there's truth to it.

Most of this is incorrect.

1. What evidence are you looking for specifically? Are you suggesting trans people are lying?

2. Prepuberty blockers are "reversible" in the sense that once you stop them, puberty resumes. They do not leave you permanently pre-pubesecent and have been used for decades for cis children who start puberty too early. There is hormone therapy, but that is typically not done until age 18. Occasionally younger, but that is under certain circumstances and after extensive evaluation. Surgeries are NOT performed on people under 18 except in very specific circumstances and also with extensive evaluation - these are extremely rare. In all cases, people undergo multiple evaluations.

3. Detransition rates are 1%-8%. The study that found a rate of 8% was conducted in the US, and 62% of those people detransitioned because of family, societal, or financial pressures, not because their identity changed.

For comparison, regret rates for medical surgeries such as knee surgery or back surgery reach rates as high as 20-40%, yet we don't question whether or not people should get those surgeries.

4. Correlation doesn't equal causation. There are multiple explanations, such as people with autism as less concerned with fitting in with society, so trans people with autism are more likely to transition than trans people without autism.

However, this is really irrelevant. Are you suggesting that people with autism should not have autonomy over their bodies? Before you say it's kids, remember that teenagers typically are given only puberty blockers, which are reversible, and only after extensive evaluation.

This also goes against your argument #1, that there is no biological basis. If you are suggesting that it is correlated with autism, which does have a biological basis, then it also has a biological basis. You can't have it both ways.

5. Not true. This research project, the Trans Youth Care study, has published 28 papers. You can easily find them on Google Scholar. Her comment on weaponizing research was part of a quote that she is being meticulous and extremely thorough.

6. Source? "Noticing" isn't enough. Human beings are notoriously bad at recollection and generally biased, which is why we have the scientific method.

7. What back door is being given to men? Examples? I'm a woman in a male-dominated industry, and it's had zero impact on my life.

8. So nobody should be allowed to transition because of the rape cases? This doesn't make sense. There can be criteria for which prison people go to, such as have they transitioned. If our standard is "some people sexually assault women, so the entire group should not be allowed to exist", well, then, we should be getting rid of men.

9. Which "right" are you referring to? Parents do not have the right to know everything about their child - everyone is entitled to privacy, even children. Children also have the right to safety, and if telling the parent creates an unsafe environment, they should not be told. If your child doesn't tell you, that's on you for not creating a safe environment for them.

10. Source for your statistic on Republican country club families vs Tacoma park families? You need actual data. There are many other explanations, including that trans kids in those families don't feel safe enough, or that you are only noticing the families that confirm your bias (very common).

[Anonymous]

Entire thread is misleading because it does not clarify if transition means including medical treatment or not and replies do not provide this. Furthermore, yes, families with trans kids are going to be more likely to live in the DC area.