Considering Divorce

[Anonymous]

You were arguing and swearing at each other. What was the actual threat of physical violence? What did he say exactly?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP. Threatened me with physical violence, did not physically harm me. We were arguing, both yelling, both swearing and it escalated.

I have a long ago history in an abusive relationship that was life threatening violence and it’s not something I’m going to deal with. DH is aware of the history.

DH has gotten himself into individual counseling and anger management, but I’m waiting to see if it sticks.

Hmm. Good luck.

Never worked for my angry explosive husband. And he was “too busy” for DBT programs or 12 step anger mgmt programs. Both recommended after 6 months of therapy with a phd psychologist

[Anonymous]

I’m sorry. I can’t imagine how hard this is to navigate. I don’t excuse his behavior but I made a similar comment once in the heat of the moment (DW here) which was very unlike me and due to some hormonal changes I was undergoing. My husband forgave me largely because it turned out to be partially medical. If it’s his first offense, I wonder if he’s had a recent health exam to check stuff out including hormonal changes. And of course therapy for everyone - it’s helpful when navigating divorce especially for your son (we did family counseling when my parents were going through a divorce).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP. Threatened me with physical violence, did not physically harm me. We were arguing, both yelling, both swearing and it escalated.

I have a long ago history in an abusive relationship that was life threatening violence and it’s not something I’m going to deal with. DH is aware of the history.

DH has gotten himself into individual counseling and anger management, but I’m waiting to see if it sticks.

Guess what, if you were in an all-out fight, swearing, yelling at each other, you were BOTH being verbally abusive to EACH OTHER. You both lost it and you don’t get to just arbitrarily say “oh this thing he said crossed my red line,” you BOTH crossed several lines before you got to that point. That’s not the dynamic of an abuser-victim relationship, that’s two people abusing each other.

You both need professional help and you need to get off your high horse, OP.

Swearing is not the same thing as threatening violence, especially if the person threatening violence is much larger and more powerful.

Serious question, are there really couples who never, ever yell?

Yes. I yell at my kids infrequently but I have never yelled at DH.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So much fallacious thinking on here. Your DH made a very serious mistake. He should take steps to ensure that it never happens again, rules to prevent arguments from getting so hot, etc.

As bad as his threatening words were, they do not mean that A. He will now hit you. B. He will now hurt your kid. C. He is going to kill you.

His bad actions do mean he has to get his f*ing act together or life as he knows it is over.

UTTER BS.

People do not change who have anger issues like this.

Next he will hit and next he will touch her kid.

Yes, your are utter BS. Just because a person used to have anger issues doesn't mean they don't change. My father used to have anger issues. Now he's very kind. I used to have anger issues. Now I'm controlled and calm.

Wake up. Grow up.

NP. Frankly, you don’t sound that controlled or calm. Just saying.

[Anonymous]

Things get crazy when both people are stressed out so bad. He threatened to hit you or slap you but didn't? This could be the one and only time he goes this low. Glad he didn't lay a hand on you. It sounds like he apologized, took accountability and entered anger management counseling so he is taking this seriously. That's good and something positive. He knows he pushed a boundary. Maybe a 2 week separation will make it clear to YOU whether you want to work it out with him. And it will be real eye opening for HIM. Most men do not do well and miss us more than we miss them during this time.

[Anonymous]

Did he say, "when you keep doing XXX it makes me want to slap you" (in a general sense) or did he say "next time you say XXX, I will slap you"? Did he invade your space? Was his posture threatening?

Context does matter, in my view. The first statement, I've hear a lot from people in different contexts "I wanna punch Joe when he does XXXX in meetings." It's hyperbole and expressing a general annoyance and never any real intent to "punch Joe." You may not like the type of hyperbole, but some people don't think it's a big deal. The latter statements and posture would be a problem, imo.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP. Threatened me with physical violence, did not physically harm me. We were arguing, both yelling, both swearing and it escalated.

I have a long ago history in an abusive relationship that was life threatening violence and it’s not something I’m going to deal with. DH is aware of the history.

DH has gotten himself into individual counseling and anger management, but I’m waiting to see if it sticks.

Guess what, if you were in an all-out fight, swearing, yelling at each other, you were BOTH being verbally abusive to EACH OTHER. You both lost it and you don’t get to just arbitrarily say “oh this thing he said crossed my red line,” you BOTH crossed several lines before you got to that point. That’s not the dynamic of an abuser-victim relationship, that’s two people abusing each other.

You both need professional help and you need to get off your high horse, OP.

Swearing is not the same thing as threatening violence, especially if the person threatening violence is much larger and more powerful.

The people here that act like swearing and yelling at their spouse is SO uncommon like it NEVER happens! I can't.

[Anonymous]

I would go to couples counseling. It will eventually become clear if things are salvageable. Every marriage has low points. If this this the lowest and uncommon then it’s not that extreme.

[Anonymous]

Last week must have been fight week because my husband and I got into it too.
First, op, your history as painful and scary as it is doesn’t mean you aren’t responsible for your behavior. What I mean is that either the fight was really bad, and some are, or you need to tell him “Certain things are triggering to me, if we are to stay married, I need you” and then you need to know what you yourself will do. You can’t get to the point where *you* are screaming at somebody and expecting them to be calm cool and collected. As I told my kid, a disinterested person might do that, but someone who loves you and cares about the situation won’t, they too are as scared and as angry and as emotional as you, so expect them to well, act poorly.
Maybe this fight with your husband can serve as a “hey we need to change how we do things and how we fight” and that doesn’t mean one person keeps doing what they want to do and the other one says “okay”.
For us what happened was very productive, my husband and I could have gotten into it today about something I wanted him to order, and when he asked “Why didn’t you say something” he really listened when I told him “because you ordered before you talked to me” which he’d done and so he ordered the items I asked for. Before our fight, I think he would have doubled down, “you knew I was ordering, I’m not ordering again, next time you’ll be more sure of what you want” today he truly grasped what I wanted, why he didn’t know about it before he placed the first order and what I needed him to do “order the things I would have ordered had you just asked me before you hit the buy button”.
Some fights can be productive. I might suggest *you* talk to a therapist especially if your husband who hasn’t been bad to you before, who you still feel safe enough to share a bed with, is doing something the ttriggers you. This couldn’t have been the first fight you two ever had, and it might not so much be your husband and other things going on in the room, the furniture say looked the same as your bad boyfriend the light shined through the window exactly as it did with the boyfriend when your husband threatened you, it might have had a lot less to do with your husband then you think.
I wouldn’t divorce, op, not yet. He is good to your kid. You like him enough to still share a bed and a home with him, you didn’t even set up an air mattress in the living room. You worry about who he dates after you, one reason I’m hanging onto my husband, he won’t find anybody better for my kids than what he’s already got which is why it mattered so much that we resolve our fight. I also do love him.
I think this is fixable, op. He cares enough to get counseling and he has a history of being good to you, and again, you still feel safe enough to share a home and bed. That is very telling. This is why I’m really not sure if it was a terrible fight, or if you are using normal human emotion to hold him to a standard most people couldn’t meet. Threatening isn’t nice, though I suspect you gave pretty good in that fight too, op. Most of us ladies have had a man do something bad to us physically which hasn’t been our fault. That can sometimes make it difficult to deal with our husbands. If it were me, I’d go to your husband, tell him you know about the counseling, and talk. Use this as a reset for what you’ll do going forward. Think of it like a history lesson like the Titanic, “we used to do it this way, something bad happened, we now do things very differently because something bad happened”. That is just sometimes how we learn as individuals, as families, as larger groups. And, you can divorce your husband whenever you’d like, op. You just can’t expect him not to date, not to find a woman he likes, not to have more children, he’ll never agree to just live in the house with you, and I don’t know why you’d want that anyway. If you are so concerned about your kid, you don’t want him/her seeing you go out and believe me they will know what you are up to. Kids are way smarter then adults realize, and they get there a lot quicker then we realize.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP. Threatened me with physical violence, did not physically harm me. We were arguing, both yelling, both swearing and it escalated.

I have a long ago history in an abusive relationship that was life threatening violence and it’s not something I’m going to deal with. DH is aware of the history.

DH has gotten himself into individual counseling and anger management, but I’m waiting to see if it sticks.

Guess what, if you were in an all-out fight, swearing, yelling at each other, you were BOTH being verbally abusive to EACH OTHER. You both lost it and you don’t get to just arbitrarily say “oh this thing he said crossed my red line,” you BOTH crossed several lines before you got to that point. That’s not the dynamic of an abuser-victim relationship, that’s two people abusing each other.

You both need professional help and you need to get off your high horse, OP.

Swearing is not the same thing as threatening violence, especially if the person threatening violence is much larger and more powerful.

Serious question, are there really couples who never, ever yell?

My husband and I don't yell at each other and we have definitely never cursed at each other.

[Anonymous]

Did he start taking any medications recently or change the dose of medications. There are some psychiatric medications that can cause aggression or violent behavior in otherwise non-violent people. This is rare, but if he is on any medications it is possible.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP. Threatened me with physical violence, did not physically harm me. We were arguing, both yelling, both swearing and it escalated.

I have a long ago history in an abusive relationship that was life threatening violence and it’s not something I’m going to deal with. DH is aware of the history.

DH has gotten himself into individual counseling and anger management, but I’m waiting to see if it sticks.

Guess what, if you were in an all-out fight, swearing, yelling at each other, you were BOTH being verbally abusive to EACH OTHER. You both lost it and you don’t get to just arbitrarily say “oh this thing he said crossed my red line,” you BOTH crossed several lines before you got to that point. That’s not the dynamic of an abuser-victim relationship, that’s two people abusing each other.

You both need professional help and you need to get off your high horse, OP.

Swearing is not the same thing as threatening violence, especially if the person threatening violence is much larger and more powerful.

Serious question, are there really couples who never, ever yell?

My husband and I don't yell at each other and we have definitely never cursed at each other.

DP.

DH and I yell sometimes, but never cursing or threats.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If you hate your kid you should definitely get divorced. But if you don't, then you should just work through it and heal.

Also, what kind of wacko bright line is this if it's not infidelity or substance abuse? Did he kill the dog with his bare hands or something? Or say that Tucker Carlson "kind of has a point on there"?

"To be honest, I do actually believe it's not butter"

That is unacceptable, straight to jail

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Immediately saying you want a divorce, in the heat of an argument of mutual combat, that is as you say uncharacteristic for your otherwise peaceful marriage, is unhinged and abusive behavior in itself.

+1. OP sounds like she is using this as a pretext.

I have a friend who had a fight like this with her husband and considered it unforgivable abuse (I think she called the police!) and eventually divorced. It really doesn’t seem like it turned out that great for any of them. The divorce was very high conflict and cost tons of money. She later developed health problems that she had to navigate by herself. Neither spouse remarried. Their kid is just dealing with the consequences of divorce. Before the divorce I always felt like they were such a well matched couple and had so much in common. I wish they had been able to work it out.