For all the parents complaining that the admissions process is rigged against their kids--

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is a great article on how to teach your child to have no competitive spirit and be happy with what meager rations they are given.

Kids this bright are quite aware of who is getting into the schools they and their friends have been targeting for 2 or 3 years and they can see the reverse discrimination and unfairness at play. They are not 2 year olds looking for moms reaction on this.

Maybe responsible parenting is acknowledging that while top schools are a stretch for everyone, it IS unfair that qualities outside of their control and baseless to achievement are getting prioritized over what should matter and thus impacting your child's results. It's not fair and there is nothing we can do.

But that they will still go to a good school and because they are brilliant they will make the best of it. The world will level out once they get past the insanity/bubble of college admissions because in the real world results matter more than checking a demographic box and brilliance and hard work will pay off, regardless of liberal agendas.

Companies focus on things that matter and so while this phase of life will illustrate to them the unfairness of racism of discrimination, the good news is that they will be past this BS in four years.

Pp here. My son’s best friend is a black boy. He is not African American. He is black South African. And he and his family refer to themselves as black so I do as well. And no, nobody is laying bricks (what a stupid question). But my son needs to perform better through high school and in extracurriculars to get into the same level of college. His friend faces discrimination now and will later, but that does not change the fact that you son needs to perform better for purposes of gaining admission to the same colleges. It’s not at all a sod story. My kids are incredibly fortunate in many ways and Gi’s willing will have opportunities to do well in whatever they choose. That doesn’t change the fact that they need to do better in school and extracurricular activities than their URM peers to get into the same college. Does anyone actually disagree with that?

That is the article I would write.

Holy entitled brat! Maybe they just picked up on these kids messed up superiority complexes and said no thanks.

That you get "entitled brat" out of the perspective that performance should be rewarded without regard to skin color, religion or socioeconomic status is exactly why we have a problem.

Performance is subjective. Your superstar is great but so are others. Your think the "performance" of your genius is superior and others have a different opinion.

Different poster but the fact is that my kids (white) need to score higher by over 100 points (closer to 200) on SAT and have a higher gpa to get into the same schools as their friends who are black. It’s simply the truth. May be good or bad for out society overall, but it’s true and my kids know it (shouldn’t they?!?). So they need to work harder, perform better and have a more appealing set of extracurricular activities. Other groups have had to do that at other times for admissions and now it is the turn for my kids. It’s important that they know. Our son’s closest friend at a top private will be a full pay black boy. So when my kid asks if he can spend the summer in the same way that his friend does, my answer is no. Because you need to have a higher standard for the same result. And, sadly, your black friend will likely face discrimination later in life and he will need to be a higher standard. I don’t think it’s a problem to give kids, really young adults, the information they need to navigate this.

Oh ease tell us about the "black boy" summer. Is he sitting around eating bon bons and you kid is laying brick?

[Anonymous]

We are visiting colleges now with our DCs. According to DCUM, we should be seeing plenty of URM « black boys » on these campuses. We simply are not. But do carry on lamenting how these Black boys are stealing your white and Asian kids’ spots at Ivy schools and How life will swing the pendulum back and will be fair again. 😏

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is a great article on how to teach your child to have no competitive spirit and be happy with what meager rations they are given.

Kids this bright are quite aware of who is getting into the schools they and their friends have been targeting for 2 or 3 years and they can see the reverse discrimination and unfairness at play. They are not 2 year olds looking for moms reaction on this.

Maybe responsible parenting is acknowledging that while top schools are a stretch for everyone, it IS unfair that qualities outside of their control and baseless to achievement are getting prioritized over what should matter and thus impacting your child's results. It's not fair and there is nothing we can do.

But that they will still go to a good school and because they are brilliant they will make the best of it. The world will level out once they get past the insanity/bubble of college admissions because in the real world results matter more than checking a demographic box and brilliance and hard work will pay off, regardless of liberal agendas.

Companies focus on things that matter and so while this phase of life will illustrate to them the unfairness of racism of discrimination, the good news is that they will be past this BS in four years.

Pp here. My son’s best friend is a black boy. He is not African American. He is black South African. And he and his family refer to themselves as black so I do as well. And no, nobody is laying bricks (what a stupid question). But my son needs to perform better through high school and in extracurriculars to get into the same level of college. His friend faces discrimination now and will later, but that does not cvangectye fact tag my sonneeds

That is the article I would write.

Holy entitled brat! Maybe they just picked up on these kids messed up superiority complexes and said no thanks.

That you get "entitled brat" out of the perspective that performance should be rewarded without regard to skin color, religion or socioeconomic status is exactly why we have a problem.

Performance is subjective. Your superstar is great but so are others. Your think the "performance" of your genius is superior and others have a different opinion.

Different poster but the fact is that my kids (white) need to score higher by over 100 points (closer to 200) on SAT and have a higher gpa to get into the same schools as their friends who are black. It’s simply the truth. May be good or bad for out society overall, but it’s true and my kids know it (shouldn’t they?!?). So they need to work harder, perform better and have a more appealing set of extracurricular activities. Other groups have had to do that at other times for admissions and now it is the turn for my kids. It’s important that they know. Our son’s closest friend at a top private will be a full pay black boy. So when my kid asks if he can spend the summer in the same way that his friend does, my answer is no. Because you need to have a higher standard for the same result. And, sadly, your black friend will likely face discrimination later in life and he will need to be a higher standard. I don’t think it’s a problem to give kids, really young adults, the information they need to navigate this.

Oh ease tell us about the "black boy" summer. Is he sitting around eating bon bons and you kid is laying brick?

[Anonymous]

Legacy admissions is a racist policy. It started out to block non white people, and it is still today an admissions policy that largely benefits rich white people, and to keep the power base "in the family".

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Legacy admissions is a racist policy. It started out to block non white people, and it is still today an admissions policy that largely benefits rich white people, and to keep the power base "in the family".

Agreed. So is sports preferential admissions in sports like swim, cross-country, golf, polo

[Anonymous]

The fact that some of you believe that we live in a solely merit based society after college is cracking me up. It’s the same people who believe that wealth/society’s definition of success always corresponds to hard work. You and yours will never be satisfied.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is a great article on how to teach your child to have no competitive spirit and be happy with what meager rations they are given.

Kids this bright are quite aware of who is getting into the schools they and their friends have been targeting for 2 or 3 years and they can see the reverse discrimination and unfairness at play. They are not 2 year olds looking for moms reaction on this.

Maybe responsible parenting is acknowledging that while top schools are a stretch for everyone, it IS unfair that qualities outside of their control and baseless to achievement are getting prioritized over what should matter and thus impacting your child's results. It's not fair and there is nothing we can do.

But that they will still go to a good school and because they are brilliant they will make the best of it. The world will level out once they get past the insanity/bubble of college admissions because in the real world results matter more than checking a demographic box and brilliance and hard work will pay off, regardless of liberal agendas.

Companies focus on things that matter and so while this phase of life will illustrate to them the unfairness of racism of discrimination, the good news is that they will be past this BS in four years.

That is the article I would write.

Holy entitled brat! Maybe they just picked up on these kids messed up superiority complexes and said no thanks.

That you get "entitled brat" out of the perspective that performance should be rewarded without regard to skin color, religion or socioeconomic status is exactly why we have a problem.

Performance is subjective. Your superstar is great but so are others. Your think the "performance" of your genius is superior and others have a different opinion.

Different poster but the fact is that my kids (white) need to score higher by over 100 points (closer to 200) on SAT and have a higher gpa to get into the same schools as their friends who are black. It’s simply the truth. May be good or bad for out society overall, but it’s true and my kids know it (shouldn’t they?!?). So they need to work harder, perform better and have a more appealing set of extracurricular activities. Other groups have had to do that at other times for admissions and now it is the turn for my kids. It’s important that they know. Our son’s closest friend at a top private will be a full pay black boy. So when my kid asks if he can spend the summer in the same way that his friend does, my answer is no. Because you need to have a higher standard for the same result. And, sadly, your black friend will likely face discrimination later in life and he will need to be a higher standard. I don’t think it’s a problem to give kids, really young adults, the information they need to navigate this.

What is your child being forced to do this summer? Work for money? Something academic? Learn something or accomplish something?

If your point is that your kid wants to sit around making tik toks by the pool but is instead doing something else for the purpose of college admissions, then he or she is the one gaming the system. Plenty of kids want to do something interesting with their summers and your imposter is apparently only pretending to be one of them.

[Anonymous]

I can't believe that some posters are not acknowledging the fact of racist discrimination against Asians. This is not an open topic for debate - the schools admit going it, there is no denial, they are simply claiming that the racist discrimination is a good thing. California tried to pass a proposition to legalist racist discrimination but failed. There is no debate that this is going on to the detriment of Asians.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I can't believe that some posters are not acknowledging the fact of racist discrimination against Asians. This is not an open topic for debate - the schools admit going it, there is no denial, they are simply claiming that the racist discrimination is a good thing. California tried to pass a proposition to legalist racist discrimination but failed. There is no debate that this is going on to the detriment of Asians.

You mention quantitative, documented discrimination and the reaction is either that is is just your opinion (fake news!), or you get a sarcastic "awww poor baby" response.

People either don't understand the history of Asian discrimination in the US or they are racist and heartless. Could you imagine saying this to any other group of Americans who have faced discrimination? Oh, you can't get paid as much as white men for equal work? Poor baby! Your son got stopped by the police for no reason and you're whining about it? Awww, what a snowflake!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:We're tackling this with our DCs at an odd time.

Covid massively messed with grading, and any sense of the playing field in education. There are anecdotes (I have seen a few) of public schools simply handing out grades for submitting papers consisting of the same sentence repeated. A good portion of kids are unable to learn remotely. Many teachers have quit, and others have been fired.

College fairs haven't really happened and visits have been hampered, and so kids I think have less of a sense of the schools they want, and things like rankings loom larger in their minds (though these are of course deeply flawed themselves). The combination of test optional and the common app makes it much more straightforward to simply aim for dozens of schools. And then there's all the deferrals and everyone suddenly coming back, and new algorithms on yield.

Colleges are trying in a very rapidly changing environment to build their brands, and in many cases working to undo the injustices of the past. That's a swing of the pendulum, and suddenly places like Brown go for admissions skewed heavily towards URMs, athletes and others (read the thread on Sidwell). Is this wrong? Meh. Maybe. Unfair? sure, but the process has always been unfair because it's so loosely tied to the idea of actual merit. But this is where we are, and their brand-building matters more to them (based on whatever prioritization they may have of their own strategy) than does our older perceptions of merit.

I think the reason this is upsetting people so much is that the game changed and we weren't really aware of it, and there's not a lot we can do. We used to buy into some vague idea of merit: work hard, put your kid in the best school you can (based on their capabilities and yours, including money), kid gets grades and a few banner ECs and success (alas a narrow definition) will ensue. But that's falling apart, and we feel like we've let down our kids who aren't in the currently preferred categories used to social engineer college brands to be closer to what their strategy tells them they want.

Yes, it's insane. Yes, it hurts the kids who suddenly feel the game changed on them and it stings, because what they were counting on suddenly isn't available in the same way. They've worked hard, and we've worked to keep them focused.

As for DC, so far a few admits and waiting on several. Two good schools, and one great have said yes. Others -- maybe better, maybe not -- will follow in the next week. It'll be ok. And we draw solace in knowing DC is well prepared for college and for life, and to see all of this as some insanity which they survived.

really? Brown undergrads in 2020-21 were 22.03% from URMs. That is below the percentage of population. In 2014-15 that percentage was 20.8%. So it's gone up immateraially in those seven years.

Your assertion is just factually wrong, but by all means, continue with your white victimization rant.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I can't believe that some posters are not acknowledging the fact of racist discrimination against Asians. This is not an open topic for debate - the schools admit going it, there is no denial, they are simply claiming that the racist discrimination is a good thing. California tried to pass a proposition to legalist racist discrimination but failed. There is no debate that this is going on to the detriment of Asians.

Yes there is a debate. The criteria you claim should be the most important form decing access to an elite college is apparently criteria wherein your student and other asiain students excel. What is it? Standardized test scores? GPAs?

The debate about who should get into a top school and why is not decided and there is disagreement about what attributes are most important.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If your kid is white and has parents who graduated college, they are already unfathomably privileged. Of course, they don't realize that, because they have been privileged by it their entire lives.

The United States economic system is performance based. It provides opportunity to all members. Some will have to work harder than others and for many it is their struggles that make them stronger than their peers. I put myself though college due to divorced parents and an alcoholic father. I am now a 1%-er. My journey to this point was a lot harder than many of my peers but nothing in this life says things must be handed to you - THAT is entitlement, not being a hard working teen of now-wealthy parents. If you want a society where outcomes are not driven by effort, stamina and drive; where challenges are all expected to be equalized then there are plenty of socialist democracies that you can join (and I hope you do).

A hard-working teen is working 30 hours a week to put food on the table AND getting perfect grades AND getting excellent SATs. Those kids exist and thats what your kids is competing against in 2022.

If it were only that, I suspect no one would have a problem. Same, if all 1% kids were disadvantaged equally. But they’re not.

[Anonymous]

really? Brown undergrads in 2020-21 were 22.03% from URMs. That is below the percentage of population. In 2014-15 that percentage was 20.8%. So it's gone up immateraially in those seven years.

Your assertion is just factually wrong, but by all means, continue with your white victimization rant.


https://www.brown.edu/news/2021-12-16/early

[Anonymous]

I hope your Asian senior reaches out to blacks at his/her college an learn about the discrimination they face daily - overtly and covertly. Welcome to the real world.

Maybe you need to get out in the real world more yourself. The idea that the ONLY discrimination there is against Asians in the US is in college admissions is laughable. There have been a tidal wave of physical attacks against Asians in the US in the last year. https://www.npr.org/2021/08/12/1027236499/anti-asian-hate-crimes-assaults-pandemic-incidents-aapi

Here's one horrific example: https://www.nbcnews.com/video/new-york-man-charged-with-attempted-murder-in-attack-on-asian-woman-135374405542 Here's another story about a man who allegedly attacked 7 Asian women he did not know at all in one day. https://www.nytimes.com/2022/03/02/nyregion/asian-women-attacked-nypd.html It's not just NYC. See https://www.inquirer.com/news/septa-assault-asian-hate-central-high-safety-students-20211130.html https://www.ctvnews.ca/world/texas-man-who-attacked-and-blamed-an-asian-family-for-covid-19-pleaded-guilty-to-hate-crimes-charges-1.5793995

Then add in the number of males who have fetishes for Asian females, often because they think they will be more docile than "spoiled" American women of other races. Almost all teen girls and young women are cat-called but a lot of men will get much more aggressive with female Asians than females of other races, probably in part because they think it's less likely that they will be asservative.

Meanwhile, many people assume that young Asian men are wimps. While many white male college students want to date Asian female students, Asian males are often seen as undesirable mates by non-Asian females.

And, of course, there are still many Americans who ask Asian-American's "Where are you from?" or "Do you speak English?" simply because they are Asians.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I can't believe that some posters are not acknowledging the fact of racist discrimination against Asians. This is not an open topic for debate - the schools admit going it, there is no denial, they are simply claiming that the racist discrimination is a good thing. California tried to pass a proposition to legalist racist discrimination but failed. There is no debate that this is going on to the detriment of Asians.

Yes there is a debate. The criteria you claim should be the most important form decing access to an elite college is apparently criteria wherein your student and other asiain students excel. What is it? Standardized test scores? GPAs?

The debate about who should get into a top school and why is not decided and there is disagreement about what attributes are most important.

What is the correct criteria?