Dating/marrying outside of your social class?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I grew up UMC in DC and my DH, while being an educated professional, grew up LMC in a small southern town.

It is challenging. Unwritten rules I have to explain to him, manners, etc. We're still in our twenties and I expect he'll fully assimilate.

Same here. I was married for a couple of years before I realized that the reason my husband doesn't know how to set the table is that his mother doesn't know! She literally can't tell you how to arrange the fork, knife and spoon around the plate.

Worse than not knowing how to arrange them is not knowing how to use them properly. If I go on a date and a man wraps is fist around his fork when cutting meat or switches hands to eat becuause he doesnt know how to use his left to cut with a knife he's not getting a second date. Table manners are a sign of someone's upbringing.

Seems you don't know how to use cutleries either. You cut with your knife in your right hand. Whether you switch hands to then eat with your fork in your right hand after cutting your food is a matter of preference, not etiquette.

[Anonymous]

I am the one who posted about blue collar men definitely existing. It seems that post ruffled some feathers (hit dogs hollering?), but I make no apologies for my experiences. Get over it.

[Anonymous]

I think it depends on the educational attainment level of your parents. My friends who are first generation college graduates are more likely to marry men with blue collar professions. My friends who are second or third generation college graduates wouldn't even consider dating a man working in a blue collar field.

[Anonymous]

Another thought: I have found that manners tend to differ by class, although Americans of all backgrounds tend to be an oafish bunch compared to their foreign counterparts.

I am the one who wrote of my blue collar FIL. In addition to holding unspeakably bigoted and parochial views, he also farts and burps at will, cracks crude jokes regardless of the audience, and just generally has no sense of propriety.

I have definitely noticed that those from blue collar backgrounds tend to conflate politeness with putting on airs and eschew any attempt at manners in favor of being "free" or "comfortable." This is not actually completely linked to class because I have met well to do people in blue collar fields who have this stubborn vein of mannerlessness running through them. Meanwhile even broke pediatricians seem to pick up at some point that you really shouldn't make that gay joke in front of mixed company.

Perhaps it is because there are swift repercussions to mannerlessness in white collar fields, while some blue collar people actually bond over racism, homophobia, and crassness on the job.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I grew up UMC in DC and my DH, while being an educated professional, grew up LMC in a small southern town.

It is challenging. Unwritten rules I have to explain to him, manners, etc. We're still in our twenties and I expect he'll fully assimilate.

Same here. I was married for a couple of years before I realized that the reason my husband doesn't know how to set the table is that his mother doesn't know! She literally can't tell you how to arrange the fork, knife and spoon around the plate.

Worse than not knowing how to arrange them is not knowing how to use them properly. If I go on a date and a man wraps is fist around his fork when cutting meat or switches hands to eat becuause he doesnt know how to use his left to cut with a knife he's not getting a second date. Table manners are a sign of someone's upbringing.

Seems you don't know how to use cutleries either. You cut with your knife in your right hand. Whether you switch hands to then eat with your fork in your right hand after cutting your food is a matter of preference, not etiquette.

If the PP wants to be a modern day Emily Post then don't argue...let her castigate potential companions over dumb shit like the fact that they (GASP!!) switch the knife to their right hand!!!! THE HORROR!!!!
It's no coincidence the PP was married and odds are she's not going to find herself in a meaningful relationship ever again but leave her be...let her stick her nose up at everyone and enjoy the air up there all by her lonesome.

[Anonymous]

Blue collar guy here, wearing a wife beater and watching Fox News before I head out to my welding job. No way those pissy white collars guys who sit in a cube all day are better than me. Most of those needy Lexus driving know-it-alls couldn't fix a flat tire if their family's life depended on it.

So go ahead ladies, marry that effete desk jockey you are so attracted to and leave defending the country and fixing the kitchen sink to real men like me.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Blue collar guy here, wearing a wife beater and watching Fox News before I head out to my welding job. No way those pissy white collars guys who sit in a cube all day are better than me. Most of those needy Lexus driving know-it-alls couldn't fix a flat tire if their family's life depended on it.

So go ahead ladies, marry that effete desk jockey you are so attracted to and leave defending the country and fixing the kitchen sink to real men like me.

We are perfectly happy to use you as cannon fodder and let you plumb our toilets. Glad you are happy too.

[Anonymous]

I've seen these marriages too, several girlfriends of mine married blue collar guys (lawyer friend married a plumber).
You know what? Everything was great until they had kids. Then totally different approaches caused friction. They disagree on what to spend $ on, if they should move for better schools, if OT therapy for one kid is a waste, even what kind of food is good. It's like they are from different cultures. The worst guy has a chip on his shoulder about college education, resentful of people with it, doesn't value education for his kids. He's obviously just insecure around his wife's friends, but I feel bad for his kids. He is hampering their opportunities. Wife goes along with it to keep the peace, like they didn't apply to
Immersion programs because he thinks they are elitist. Instead they send DD to one of the worst elementary schools around. He talks big about supporting our local schools to justify it. So lame.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I grew up UMC in DC and my DH, while being an educated professional, grew up LMC in a small southern town.

It is challenging. Unwritten rules I have to explain to him, manners, etc. We're still in our twenties and I expect he'll fully assimilate.

Same here. I was married for a couple of years before I realized that the reason my husband doesn't know how to set the table is that his mother doesn't know! She literally can't tell you how to arrange the fork, knife and spoon around the plate.

Worse than not knowing how to arrange them is not knowing how to use them properly. If I go on a date and a man wraps is fist around his fork when cutting meat or switches hands to eat becuause he doesnt know how to use his left to cut with a knife he's not getting a second date. Table manners are a sign of someone's upbringing.

Seems you don't know how to use cutleries either. You cut with your knife in your right hand. Whether you switch hands to then eat with your fork in your right hand after cutting your food is a matter of preference, not etiquette.

Eating with your left hand in low-class, not the pp.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I've seen these marriages too, several girlfriends of mine married blue collar guys (lawyer friend married a plumber).
You know what? Everything was great until they had kids. Then totally different approaches caused friction. They disagree on what to spend $ on, if they should move for better schools, if OT therapy for one kid is a waste, even what kind of food is good. It's like they are from different cultures. The worst guy has a chip on his shoulder about college education, resentful of people with it, doesn't value education for his kids. He's obviously just insecure around his wife's friends, but I feel bad for his kids. He is hampering their opportunities. Wife goes along with it to keep the peace, like they didn't apply to
Immersion programs because he thinks they are elitist. Instead they send DD to one of the worst elementary schools around. He talks big about supporting our local schools to justify it. So lame.

Thanks for posting this. This is exactly the kind of friction I imagine would come up.

[Anonymous]

Switching hands to eat is also low-class.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I was wondering how often this happens? I know of two coworkers who are married to blue collar men. I was surprised when I found out. Felt a little sorry for them like the had to settle, but they are both pretty charming smart and nice. I immediately rule on guys based on education and or profession. I just didn't think differences like that could work. Am I wrong?

"Blue collar" men often make more than the white collar. So some people are laughing all the way to the bank that they don't have college and grad school loans to pay.

+1 My extended family is a mix of blue collar and white collar jobs. The blue collars are mostly in electrical work and one uncle is the CEO of a large commercial electrical contractor (no college degree). He makes way more money than my white collar DH.

It's not about money.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I think it depends on the educational attainment level of your parents. My friends who are first generation college graduates are more likely to marry men with blue collar professions. My friends who are second or third generation college graduates wouldn't even consider dating a man working in a blue collar field.

I'm a third generation attorney and didn't expect to marry someone who lacks a graduate degree.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Blue collar guy here, wearing a wife beater and watching Fox News before I head out to my welding job. No way those pissy white collars guys who sit in a cube all day are better than me. Most of those needy Lexus driving know-it-alls couldn't fix a flat tire if their family's life depended on it.

So go ahead ladies, marry that effete desk jockey you are so attracted to and leave defending the country and fixing the kitchen sink to real men like me.

We are perfectly happy to use you as cannon fodder and let you plumb our toilets. Glad you are happy too.

Just a horribly fucked up thing to say.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Switching hands to eat is also low-class.

There is nothing more low class than misstating etiquette rules. I went to boarding school in Europe where both dining etiquette and elocution were required. Even there, switching one's fork to the right hand after cutting with the knife in right and fork in left hand was recognized as a matter of preference. Americans tend to prefer to switch and until recently, Europeans did too. There actually used to be a stigma against NOT switching because it was thought rude to put food in one's mouth with the much-maligned left hand. You probably are not aware that there is a strong cultural bias against the left hand and leftness in general in many cultures, including Western cultures. The words sinister and gauche reflect this.