School has labeled my child as a “problem child”

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't think that any poster is doing the OP -- who says she herself has a well documented mental health problem -- any favors in suggesting the school might be the issue.

I could not disagree more. Schools absolutely flail with kids who diverge from the norm in behavior. OP seems clear that her child needs supports- but the school is literally not doing a single thing to help the kid, and likely a lot of things to make it worse.

OP you have gotten a surprising amount of good advice on this thread - I expected it to be more like PP here. You could also try posting on the SN forum.

My opinion is that you should move schools to a public (if you are not there) or a different public. Privates generally cannot handle defiant behavior or eloping. This teacher and principal have showed you that they have zero understanding or care for your daughter’s challenges. I can’t tell you how much we suffered from the same when my kiddo was younger and had similar issues.

I think that elementary schools struggle with kids that don’t fit a mold. For reasons I don’t totally understand, teachers and administrators never seemed to understand my DS until middle school. Not all of them do, but there are a significant number that really get him now, and the ones that don’t are still more capable of rolling with it. I think maybe that’s because people who choose to work in MS don’t have some illusion that kids are all little rays of sunshine, so they are less thrown off by “bad” behavior.

That said schools and teachers absolutely differ even in elementary. This school is not working for your kid, so you should leave sooner rather than later. That’s hard to do when kids are older but easy in K.

It also sounds like she will need a diagnosis to access more supports eventually. So get going on that. The key to getting an IEP is documenting that her behavior is the issue so this is an easier lift than some other kids. But you still need a disability (or a “developmental delay”) in some school systems. when my child’s main issue was behavioral health got an IEP under the developmental delay code with no diagnosis at all (just severely delayed fine motor). I am a very adamant plaintiff’s lawyer so I was able to make that happen on my own but you may need an advocate. GL! You are not alone.

This explains your attitude.

That’s right - I am my kid’s best advocate.

You mean enabler.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Let me get this straight: your kindergartner hasn’t done anything violent or threatening, but has gotten two in-school suspensions already this year for…being sullen? If that is true, that is bananas.

She’s defiant and running away.

Maybe school stinks! Kid may have good judgment.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't think that any poster is doing the OP -- who says she herself has a well documented mental health problem -- any favors in suggesting the school might be the issue.

I could not disagree more. Schools absolutely flail with kids who diverge from the norm in behavior. OP seems clear that her child needs supports- but the school is literally not doing a single thing to help the kid, and likely a lot of things to make it worse.

OP you have gotten a surprising amount of good advice on this thread - I expected it to be more like PP here. You could also try posting on the SN forum.

My opinion is that you should move schools to a public (if you are not there) or a different public. Privates generally cannot handle defiant behavior or eloping. This teacher and principal have showed you that they have zero understanding or care for your daughter’s challenges. I can’t tell you how much we suffered from the same when my kiddo was younger and had similar issues.

I think that elementary schools struggle with kids that don’t fit a mold. For reasons I don’t totally understand, teachers and administrators never seemed to understand my DS until middle school. Not all of them do, but there are a significant number that really get him now, and the ones that don’t are still more capable of rolling with it. I think maybe that’s because people who choose to work in MS don’t have some illusion that kids are all little rays of sunshine, so they are less thrown off by “bad” behavior.

That said schools and teachers absolutely differ even in elementary. This school is not working for your kid, so you should leave sooner rather than later. That’s hard to do when kids are older but easy in K.

It also sounds like she will need a diagnosis to access more supports eventually. So get going on that. The key to getting an IEP is documenting that her behavior is the issue so this is an easier lift than some other kids. But you still need a disability (or a “developmental delay”) in some school systems. when my child’s main issue was behavioral health got an IEP under the developmental delay code with no diagnosis at all (just severely delayed fine motor). I am a very adamant plaintiff’s lawyer so I was able to make that happen on my own but you may need an advocate. GL! You are not alone.

This explains your attitude.

That’s right - I am my kid’s best advocate.

You mean enabler.

How is advocating for my kid to get an IEP being an “enabler”?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't think that any poster is doing the OP -- who says she herself has a well documented mental health problem -- any favors in suggesting the school might be the issue.

I could not disagree more. Schools absolutely flail with kids who diverge from the norm in behavior. OP seems clear that her child needs supports- but the school is literally not doing a single thing to help the kid, and likely a lot of things to make it worse.

OP you have gotten a surprising amount of good advice on this thread - I expected it to be more like PP here. You could also try posting on the SN forum.

My opinion is that you should move schools to a public (if you are not there) or a different public. Privates generally cannot handle defiant behavior or eloping. This teacher and principal have showed you that they have zero understanding or care for your daughter’s challenges. I can’t tell you how much we suffered from the same when my kiddo was younger and had similar issues.

I think that elementary schools struggle with kids that don’t fit a mold. For reasons I don’t totally understand, teachers and administrators never seemed to understand my DS until middle school. Not all of them do, but there are a significant number that really get him now, and the ones that don’t are still more capable of rolling with it. I think maybe that’s because people who choose to work in MS don’t have some illusion that kids are all little rays of sunshine, so they are less thrown off by “bad” behavior.

That said schools and teachers absolutely differ even in elementary. This school is not working for your kid, so you should leave sooner rather than later. That’s hard to do when kids are older but easy in K.

It also sounds like she will need a diagnosis to access more supports eventually. So get going on that. The key to getting an IEP is documenting that her behavior is the issue so this is an easier lift than some other kids. But you still need a disability (or a “developmental delay”) in some school systems. when my child’s main issue was behavioral health got an IEP under the developmental delay code with no diagnosis at all (just severely delayed fine motor). I am a very adamant plaintiff’s lawyer so I was able to make that happen on my own but you may need an advocate. GL! You are not alone.

Sounds like you had a terrible experience. But, generalizing your experience to say that all schools flail with kids who don't follow the mold is crazy. And to minimize OP's daughter's behaviors is not helpful. Her daughter is eloping. Her daughter is being defiant. Her daughter is throwing fits. Her daughter needs interventions. And, while you talk about the need to document, you fail to realize that this is what the school is actually doing so they are way ahead of your advice. Your anger stands in the way of your ability to be really helpful.

Not the Lawyer poster here but if the school has noted the issue of elopement and shutting down in class and has suspended the student but has not called for a meeting to discuss the need for testing then the school is not handling the situation well.

A child who is eloping should lead to the school initiating meetings with the parents to get permission to test for issues. If the school has reached out to the parents and the parents have not agreed to a meeting, that is a different scenario. OPs post doesn't say how the school has discussed this with the parents or if they have requested, in writing, a meeting to discuss testing and evaluation for their kid. The OPs post does not mention conversations with their pediatrician about their kids' issues. I assume that there has been some type of evaluation because of the play therapy but that has not been stated.

I wouldn't jump straight to needing an advocate but I would not count on the school to be doing the right thing either. The OP needs to start the process with the school. If the school has been reaching out and the parents have not agreed to a meeting or an evaluation, then I can see that the school is gathering data to force the issue.

PP to which you were responding. I see this completely in a different light. OP’s child is a problem child. She displays dangerous behaviors (eloping, throwing fits and being defiant) and is demonstrating that she can’t perform in that environment (shutting down).

She has not been suspended. Instead she is on ISS, which can be their way of removing her from a situation causing her great distress and providing her with time to decompress before returning g to what is likely a chaotic classroom.

The school is trying to involve parents by regular contact but they seem to be burying their heads in the sand until now.

By both of these actions, the school is creating the documentation for potential interventions - kind of like an FBA.

I do agree that OP needs to look into evaluations and also, if this is public school, looking into special education services through either a 504 or an IEP. Personally even with the little information we know, I’d guess an IEP is the more appropriate because of the elopement and possibly the throwing fits. And at that age, the shutting down and need for decompression time might also need an IEP.

Nope. You are incredibly naive if you believe the school is doing anything proactive or helpful here. There is very little OP can do from home to solve school problems - so the school simply calling her to tell her does zero to actually help.

You are just wrong. As a parent who had a seriously mentally ill child at school that frequently eloped by both leaving class and leaving the building and who got frequent calls due to this and so many other problems, I do understand the level of stress that these calls invoke. But, as a parent you need to know. And, it's a no win for the school. If the school waits, the parent complains they weren't notified early enough. If the school calls too much they stress the parent. If the school calls too little, they don't convey the seriousness of the problem. There is always a reason to find fault with the school, when in truth there is no perfect pipeline to convey all of the information everyone needs to know.

That being said, notifying a parent lets them know they may need to take their child for a medical evaluation. Or they may need to let their child's therapist (here a play therapist) know there are serious problems at school so the therapist can do their part. Or they may need a different educational program for their child. Or they may need to partner with their school in a different way than is happening now. Parents are not spectators in the process. But to know where they fit in, they need information, which happens when the school calls to share problems.

[Anonymous]

since you are really benefitting from mental health based on your own successful treatment im surprised you havent been more proactive in getting her better help. please contact a group like kennedy krieger and get her evaluated for more substantial support she needs. the school is not villianizing your kid. they are telling you she needs more serious help than you sre getting her. maybe that means homeschool for a year while you figure out her exact diagnosis and appropriate supports,. Elopement is not a minor issue and could become scary quickly if she decides to leave school grounds.

[Anonymous]

The most surprising thing in this thread is how many different posters are casually familiar with the term elopement. How do you all know that? I worked in education for years, including as a para to a kid who ran out of the classroom on a regular basis, and I never once heard the term elopement to mean anything other than a runaway wedding.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I fault any school that resorts to in-school suspension for a kindergartener. Shame on them.

I'm sorry, OP!! I agree. This kid is 5 or 6..Two suspensions seems over the top to me, too.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:she might have ADHD

I realize adhd is not the same for everyone but my DD has adhd and has none of these behaviors. None.

Sure. But this kid likely needs some label to get services and ADHD is the go-to these days.

You don't know what you're talking about. If a kindergartener is getting suspended multiple times, they need an IEP or something that the school is legally required to adhere to. ADHD isn't going to cut it (and might be addressed with a 504 which isn't as enforceable), and as others have said, eloping from a classroom and being selectively mute aren't typical ADHD behaviors.

OP has disappeared from this thread and didn't answer any questions about whether her child had a diagnosis from a trained professional or an IEP/504. But if I were the OP, I would be less worried about my kid being labeled as "problem child" and more worried about keeping my kid safe because a kindergartener escaping the classroom and walking the halls without an adult is a big deal.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Where is this school located? It doesn't sound like a school around here because school around here aren't giving kindergarten students in school suspension.

How old is she? Did she recently turn 5 or is she 6 or close to 6? If she turned 5 this summer I would pull her out of K and send her back to preschool so she doesn't learn to dislike school. Some kids just aren't ready for an academic kindergarten right at 5.

Is she really verbal at home? Does she have any speech/language delays. The first thing I would do is to get an eye exam at an optometrist's office to make sure she can hear well and a new hearing screening at the pediatrician's office and make sure she doesn't have any fluid in her ears.

My kids DCPS put her in “ISS” in K. They said wasn’t punitive, it was so she had a safe space to calm down and keep her away from a kid that was antagonizing her. Yes, I gave them shit about it because the antagonist should’ve been the one separated (he was in ISS often) and they didn’t call me during the day to notify me! In fact the only reason I learned of it was because I saw the ISS behavior guy on the playground at pickup (because he had a second job working for the after care company…) and he told me then. I will always wonder if they would’ve ever notified me before I called the next morning to complain and see what the hell was going on.

My child no longer attends that school, we go to great lengths to get her to another school we got into via the DCPS lottery. Her new school (also a DCPS) would NEVER do that to a K kiddo. They are quite a bit better resourced, though.

I posted about title 1 schools and this proves my point

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, is she in a title 1 school or similar? I have noticed very strict punitive discipline in a lot of them (I work at a lot is school sites in my district). It’s much more understanding and relaxed at schools with more middle class families. I think it’s both accountability (parents will come fight for their kids) and overall fewer severe discipline issues.

I work full time at a Title I school and it is not like this at ALL at my school. We have a high immigrant population and we know that a lot of our students have had traumatic experiences and that may inform their behavior. We also know that parents can’t always afford therapy like at higher income schools so while the school offers as much counseling as possible, there are many undiagnosed and unresolved issues. Very few suspensions, in or out of school.

Op, the elopement is a big issue. What kind of school is it? Can you afford to pay for 1:1 para support for your child?

I’m sure you’re stressed out. I hope you can find the right space and balance for your child so she can develop healfhy coping strategies as she gets older. GL!!

Your kids are lucky to have such understanding teachers and admin!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, is she in a title 1 school or similar? I have noticed very strict punitive discipline in a lot of them (I work at a lot is school sites in my district). It’s much more understanding and relaxed at schools with more middle class families. I think it’s both accountability (parents will come fight for their kids) and overall fewer severe discipline issues.

I work full time at a Title I school and it is not like this at ALL at my school. We have a high immigrant population and we know that a lot of our students have had traumatic experiences and that may inform their behavior. We also know that parents can’t always afford therapy like at higher income schools so while the school offers as much counseling as possible, there are many undiagnosed and unresolved issues. Very few suspensions, in or out of school.

Op, the elopement is a big issue. What kind of school is it? Can you afford to pay for 1:1 para support for your child?

I’m sure you’re stressed out. I hope you can find the right space and balance for your child so she can develop healfhy coping strategies as she gets older. GL!!

Just to add some nuance - my “problem” kid is also in a T1 school and I do feel like there are more resources and a better overall culture to support kids. Including very clear and tight discipline which may look like “tough love.” But the problem has sometimes been that my kid actually doesn’t have trauma so “trauma informed” doesn’t work for him. In fact “tough love” is sometimes better. But at the end of the day I agree that T1 schools sometimes do it much better.

Original T1 poster here. The schools I’ve been to are pretty bad for kids who aren’t too disruptive but also aren’t those model children who sit still with eyes on teacher. Too punitive

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:since you are really benefitting from mental health based on your own successful treatment im surprised you havent been more proactive in getting her better help. please contact a group like kennedy krieger and get her evaluated for more substantial support she needs. the school is not villianizing your kid. they are telling you she needs more serious help than you sre getting her. maybe that means homeschool for a year while you figure out her exact diagnosis and appropriate supports,. Elopement is not a minor issue and could become scary quickly if she decides to leave school grounds.

This. It may also be selective mutism which must be caught and treated EARLY to be of any value

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The most surprising thing in this thread is how many different posters are casually familiar with the term elopement. How do you all know that? I worked in education for years, including as a para to a kid who ran out of the classroom on a regular basis, and I never once heard the term elopement to mean anything other than a runaway wedding.

I’ve worked in a few schools over the years. That’s been the term in all of them for students leaving the classroom or school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My kindergartener is highly sensitive and will emotionally shut down and stop talking if her feelings are hurt or she thinks she’s in trouble. If she is pushed too much once she gets to this point, she is both silent and defiant. We have tried working on this with her at home and she’s in play therapy.

Since the second month of school, I’ve been getting frequent emails and calls about her behavior. Sometimes it’s just that she’s being quiet and doesn’t want to talk, sometimes it’s that she’s walking through the halls without an adult. She, as a kindergartner, has been put in In School Suspension twice this semester because she gets upset.

I’m not saying that her behavior is perfect, and her dad and I have had many conversations with her about the behavior and how she needs to use her words, participate, not throw a fit if someone hurts her feelings, etc., but at this point, I’m at a loss. I have (medicated and managed) bipolar disorder, so I’m sure she comes by this naturally, and I can fully sympathize with her, but I still remain firm that there are certain expectations for school

Honestly, I’m super frustrated with the school. As I said, they’ve labeled her as a problem child and are quick to use punitive actions for minor offenses (like her not wanting to talk). I’ve had many phone calls and e-mail conversations with both the teacher and the principal, and they both seem beyond annoyed with her. I’m getting to the point where I’m wanting to switch schools and hope for a better outcome, because I don’t necessarily see this getting any better. Does anyone have any input or experience with this sort of situation?

Sounds like the school is run by a bunch of *********. Expecting a kindergartener to be emotionally stable is idiotic. At that age they are still learning how to deal with the emotions and kindergarten is a whole new experience for them.

I struggled with my emotions into high school and was deemed a” bad student”. It was for very different reasons, but I know what it is like to be branded.

[Anonymous]

Your child is the problem. You not seeing it is the bigger problem.
Get her some help.