Less Selective College but the right fit?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Why are people so mysterious about what schools their kid selected?[/quote} Not sure

Anonymous wrote:My kid got into Tulane (with some merit $) and Boston U but chose UVM (also w merit and a significantly lower cost of attendance). It's been a great decision, and that's not even with considering what life must have been like at Tulane during a hurricane evacuation as a brand new freshman a couple of years ago

Once my kid established that Burlington met their definition of being a city where there were things to do other than be on campus, the only hard part of the decision was getting over my own foolish pride

Go to a place where you want to be, that affords opportunities for in-depth learning experiences in your chosen area, and the rankings are meaningless

DD got into CMU, UNC and W&M. While CMU provided some merit to near in-state, she went with her heart and is a happy freshman at W&M. We let her decide and she considered them all in earnest. Seeing the advantages of each, but she had lost her heart to only one campus truly.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:go with fit but make sure notion of “fit” is somewhat tangible. (not just the tour guide!)

OP here, I agree the tour guide has a lot to do with how the school 'shows'. In my daughter's case, the less selective school has a great academic program for her major but doesn't have the name recognition and it's considerably smaller than the other school she has listed as a short list contender. The school which has the more selective status has a good academic program, but is located in a more rural setting which isn't really what she wants. It's more of the location, size of the school and the feeling on campus that she likes better about the lesser known school.

I am very much happy about her attending either. She has done really well in high school but was never going to attend Harvard with her stats. She was accepted into UofM College Park but has already ruled it out because it's too big, but left Berry College in Georgia on the list. It's her #3 on the list though.

My DD's decision came down to two not-well-known LACs and that feel on campus was really a big influence in the end. They both had great programs for her major and the cost was similar. I thought one school had nicer facilities and liked a couple unique things it offered but she felt the "vibe" was off on her 2nd visit/interview while she felt really at home at the other, despite the crappier dorms and rec center. So, the better vibe won, which totally makes sense to me. Which I'll remind her of when she complains next August about not having A/C!

[Anonymous]

My kid went to the lowest ranked school they were accepted to - fell in love with the vibe and tour. Graduated Summa, Phi Beta Kappa and got an almost full ride to a top 7 law school. The financial advantages between choosing a state school that he loved and rejecting others that were not a fit (Tulane, Colgate, Northeastern, Bucknell) is staggering to consider now (and yes, I admit I was not as excited about his choice at the time as DH and DC). His undergrad experience was incredible and he will be graduating this year debt free from law school which is almost unheard of except for the rich. Environment and feel matter alot when it comes to outcomes. My kid went to the school where he felt the most at home and took advantage of all it had to offere. Highly recommend this approach.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Go to the admitted students day at both schools with an open mind. How far apart in rankings are we talking? My DC is in at a private school ranked around 40 (well known in major), but really prefers a public school admitted to that ranks around 120. I feel pretty strongly DC should go with the higher ranked school. DC likes both schools and likes the social scene, football games, etc. at the lower ranked school.

Please let your DC pick themselves! Don't keep mentioning the "rankings" It is their college experience and anyone who can get admitted to ~#40 is smart and motivated and will do well anywhere they go. But they will do best where they are happiest. Imagine if you force them to pick ~#40 and they are miserable--they will blame you forever and that would not be the type of relationship I'd want with my kid

So you would be okay with your kid picking say University of Tennessee (mainly for the social life and football games) over Boston University, Case Western or Tulane? Seriously? I guess I am in the minority on this thread, but I would not be thrilled.

Ok, I may not be thrilled about my kid's choice, but I would not voice my opinion to my kid more than 1-2 times about the ranking. Instead I would find explicit details about their desire major/course of study and provide data points that might convince them BU, CWRU or Tulane is a actually a better fit. I'd explain why it's not smart to pay OOS tuition for such a large university when there are no benefits over our in state universities (if they want the big school experience). If Tenn is In state, then I'm might be excited that they are saving so much money and discuss how we can now help them pay for graduate school with the savings. But I wouldn't belabor it. My goal is for my kid to attend a school that's the best fit for them. At that point if we forced them to choose BU/CWRU/Tulane they might not do as well. They also might be annoyed at us and really not do well at college and that could forever change our relationship. Seriously, they are picking between 44 and 110, not 44 and 500.

Eventually we have to let our kids grow up and make choices. And where to attend college is the starting point. I got to pick where I attended college 30+ years ago, now it's time for my young adult to make their own choice, with some guidance from me and their other parent. I seriously doubt the ONLY reason the kid wants large state u is for football and social scene. As long as it has their desired major (and they can easily get into that major or any other major they might want to switch to), I'd let them make the final choice.

[Anonymous]

We are in the opposite situation - dc got into the more selective school and is dead set on going, but we think the less selective school is a better fit. He has ADHD and we feel he will be better off in a less competitive environment. The thing is that in the end, this is their first big decision and they have to make it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Go to the admitted students day at both schools with an open mind. How far apart in rankings are we talking? My DC is in at a private school ranked around 40 (well known in major), but really prefers a public school admitted to that ranks around 120. I feel pretty strongly DC should go with the higher ranked school. DC likes both schools and likes the social scene, football games, etc. at the lower ranked school.

Please let your DC pick themselves! Don't keep mentioning the "rankings" It is their college experience and anyone who can get admitted to ~#40 is smart and motivated and will do well anywhere they go. But they will do best where they are happiest. Imagine if you force them to pick ~#40 and they are miserable--they will blame you forever and that would not be the type of relationship I'd want with my kid

So you would be okay with your kid picking say University of Tennessee (mainly for the social life and football games) over Boston University, Case Western or Tulane? Seriously? I guess I am in the minority on this thread, but I would not be thrilled.

Ok, I may not be thrilled about my kid's choice, but I would not voice my opinion to my kid more than 1-2 times about the ranking. Instead I would find explicit details about their desire major/course of study and provide data points that might convince them BU, CWRU or Tulane is a actually a better fit. I'd explain why it's not smart to pay OOS tuition for such a large university when there are no benefits over our in state universities (if they want the big school experience). If Tenn is In state, then I'm might be excited that they are saving so much money and discuss how we can now help them pay for graduate school with the savings. But I wouldn't belabor it. My goal is for my kid to attend a school that's the best fit for them. At that point if we forced them to choose BU/CWRU/Tulane they might not do as well. They also might be annoyed at us and really not do well at college and that could forever change our relationship. Seriously, they are picking between 44 and 110, not 44 and 500.

Eventually we have to let our kids grow up and make choices. And where to attend college is the starting point. I got to pick where I attended college 30+ years ago, now it's time for my young adult to make their own choice, with some guidance from me and their other parent. I seriously doubt the ONLY reason the kid wants large state u is for football and social scene. As long as it has their desired major (and they can easily get into that major or any other major they might want to switch to), I'd let them make the final choice.

hear, hear!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My child has been accepted into a college with a less selective ranking. She likes the school, it's a good fit and she was awarded considerable merit aid. She was also accepted into a more selective college and program. It's not as good of a fit. Older campus and not exactly the type of location she feels comfortable living in.

I've told her to go with her gut but she's struggling that she feels like she *should* like the more selective/prestigious school.

Any tips? I'm basically trying to guide her to where she will be happy but even I'm wondering how much I should push.

Consider the career and/or grad school outcomes in their area of interest, geographically speaking where people end up working, the ECs they might continue and how much their potential major helps with applied learning opportunities. To some extent it’s like buying a house - yes you are purchasing a home where you want to live but it is also a big financial investment so you shouldn’t ignore that reality. My kid was considering a lower ranked school but as part of their analysis they realized that they would most definitely need grad school right away for their major if they attended this school while the higher ranked school had more going directly into the job market and if they did get a job directly out of school from the lower ranked school it wouldn’t be in the region/area they wanted to live in.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why are people so mysterious about what schools their kid selected?[/quote} Not sure

Anonymous wrote:My kid got into Tulane (with some merit $) and Boston U but chose UVM (also w merit and a significantly lower cost of attendance). It's been a great decision, and that's not even with considering what life must have been like at Tulane during a hurricane evacuation as a brand new freshman a couple of years ago

Once my kid established that Burlington met their definition of being a city where there were things to do other than be on campus, the only hard part of the decision was getting over my own foolish pride

Go to a place where you want to be, that affords opportunities for in-depth learning experiences in your chosen area, and the rankings are meaningless

DD got into CMU, UNC and W&M. While CMU provided some merit to near in-state, she went with her heart and is a happy freshman at W&M. We let her decide and she considered them all in earnest. Seeing the advantages of each, but she had lost her heart to only one campus truly.

I don't know when your child went to college, but CMU doesn't give any merit aid now.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My child has been accepted into a college with a less selective ranking. She likes the school, it's a good fit and she was awarded considerable merit aid. She was also accepted into a more selective college and program. It's not as good of a fit. Older campus and not exactly the type of location she feels comfortable living in.

I've told her to go with her gut but she's struggling that she feels like she *should* like the more selective/prestigious school.

Any tips? I'm basically trying to guide her to where she will be happy but even I'm wondering how much I should push.

Have an honest discussion with her that rankings do NOT matter that much. She needs to be happy for 4 years at college and FIT is extremely important. A kid who likes where they are and is happy will do so much better than one struggling at a school. Also, merit is huge. Talk about the benefits of significant merit aid. This would leave the door open for more easily paying for grad school if you don't have huge loans from undergrad.

+1 I got into a very selective, elite university and was so wowed that I didn't consider my other options.

The university was a terrible fit, very high pressure and everyone I knew as abusing substances to deal with it. I ended up transferring to a "lesser" school for the sake of my mental health. The second university's students might not have been quite as accomplished, but there was a supportive environment, and I found that the actual classes were just as challenging.

The kids are under pressure to go to the "best" school they are accepted to. It takes a strong character to go for what's best for them, rather than someone else's standard of "best." Support your child in doing what's best for her.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Go to the admitted students day at both schools with an open mind. How far apart in rankings are we talking? My DC is in at a private school ranked around 40 (well known in major), but really prefers a public school admitted to that ranks around 120. I feel pretty strongly DC should go with the higher ranked school. DC likes both schools and likes the social scene, football games, etc. at the lower ranked school.

Please let your DC pick themselves! Don't keep mentioning the "rankings" It is their college experience and anyone who can get admitted to ~#40 is smart and motivated and will do well anywhere they go. But they will do best where they are happiest. Imagine if you force them to pick ~#40 and they are miserable--they will blame you forever and that would not be the type of relationship I'd want with my kid

But did you read the part where I said DC preferred the lower ranked school because of the football games, social scene, etc at a big state school? You think this is a valid reason to prefer one school over another when they are so vastly apart on the rankings?

yes, I did read that. So your smart kid wants a less stressful environment and wants to enjoy college and experience the "big state school" sports environment and social scene. That appears where they will be happiest. Maybe they are sick of you pushing them to the brink for the last 4-8 years. Perhaps they only applied to #40 because you pushed them to and they never really wanted to attend there or liked that school.
IMO, I'd rather my kid do well in school and be happy than attend a higher ranked school. I don't want to be the reason my kid is miserable or worse, commits suicide due to me micromanaging them and stressing them out.
I don't get caught up in the rankings. our kids are under a lot of pressure and I would want my kid to succeed in life, and that includes being happy, not me having bragging rights that they attended a "top ranked university"

So I'll say it again, if you force your kid to attend what you view as the best choice and they are miserable, they will blame you and your relationship will forever be changed. It will be difficult to repair. Sure your kid might graduate from #40, but they may not be happy, may not have done as well academically as they would have at their choice and they might distance themselves from you once out of college and on their own financially, as they might be sick of you forcing them to do what you want. If that's what you want for your kid, sure push them to go where you think is best.

In addition there is very little practical difference between -#40 and -#120. #299? Maybe.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My kid went to the lowest ranked school they were accepted to - fell in love with the vibe and tour. Graduated Summa, Phi Beta Kappa and got an almost full ride to a top 7 law school. The financial advantages between choosing a state school that he loved and rejecting others that were not a fit (Tulane, Colgate, Northeastern, Bucknell) is staggering to consider now (and yes, I admit I was not as excited about his choice at the time as DH and DC). His undergrad experience was incredible and he will be graduating this year debt free from law school which is almost unheard of except for the rich. Environment and feel matter alot when it comes to outcomes. My kid went to the school where he felt the most at home and took advantage of all it had to offere. Highly recommend this approach.

Nice! Congrats on your kid's success and your lack of indebtedness.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Ask her why she thinks she should like the more prestigious school. If it's because she and all of her friends think it's supposedly going to lead to a better life than the less selective school, have her read the essay below and look at relevant lists on this website. This helped my kid and some of her friends see that they'll be fine whichever of their colleges they choose.

https://lesshighschoolstress.com/

What a fantastic website — thanks for introducing it, PP! Our family leans toward not freaking out over selective admissions, but there’s a big gap psychologically between making that decision in theory and actually making the choice that (while best for us for other reasons) might cut down DDs chances at the most selective schools. DD is starts high school next year and I’ve been thinking a lot about this dilemma, so that website came along at exactly the right time.

You're welcome. I like that it comes at the issue from so many different angles, with data to support the points being made.

[Anonymous]

I’ll give an in state example. My kid is a Junior. 4.75 weighted GPA. Strong SATs. One parent is alumni of W&M. It’s not a given (obviously), but our counselor thinks our kid has a very good chance to get into W&M ED. But we visited W&M and didn’t really like it. My kid realizes she wants to be in an urban environment. We’re from Richmond. Where is basically the only urban college in the state college in VA? VCU. VCU would be a great cultural fit for my kid. But I admit we’re both pretty hung up on the huge ranking difference. Like why did she do SO much work? So, I don’t know what we will do. Other options are looking at urban schools in other medium sized cities. (New York, Boston, etc…were too big for her.) Or I mean so what if she DOES go to VCU? She’d get in the honors college. She could easily double major. She’d probably get some kind of scholarship. But I have to admit the snobby part of me would feel like she could go somewhere “better.” But my husband and I both did parts of our education at VCU, and we both had great experiences!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I’ll give an in state example. My kid is a Junior. 4.75 weighted GPA. Strong SATs. One parent is alumni of W&M. It’s not a given (obviously), but our counselor thinks our kid has a very good chance to get into W&M ED. But we visited W&M and didn’t really like it. My kid realizes she wants to be in an urban environment. We’re from Richmond. Where is basically the only urban college in the state college in VA? VCU. VCU would be a great cultural fit for my kid. But I admit we’re both pretty hung up on the huge ranking difference. Like why did she do SO much work? So, I don’t know what we will do. Other options are looking at urban schools in other medium sized cities. (New York, Boston, etc…were too big for her.) Or I mean so what if she DOES go to VCU? She’d get in the honors college. She could easily double major. She’d probably get some kind of scholarship. But I have to admit the snobby part of me would feel like she could go somewhere “better.” But my husband and I both did parts of our education at VCU, and we both had great experiences!

You might consider schools a bit less selective where your kid could get a merit scholarship. GW, American, and Pitt come to mind. Or are DC and Pittsburgh too big? Also, Charlottesville is fast becoming a medium-sized city.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Malcolm Gladwell gave a talk about this. He suggests that students choose the less selective school. https://youtu.be/7J-wCHDJYmo

Julie Lythcott-Haims also suggests this in her podcast, Getting In. She said going to a school where you are at the top will give you more opportunities and attention at that school.