What I’m noticing from millennial high achieving moms

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm not even going to bother reading the 24 pages of idiocy this post has prompted.

- Young Gen X Mom who thinks OP is stupid.

I’m with you! It takes a few years to figure out how exhausting 3+ kids can be. By the time mom decides to SAH, the couple realizes how expensive 3+ kids can be esp to educate, save for retirement, take care of parents who are getting dementia. But you do you 30-somethings.

I find it shocking that people have a third (or fourth or fifth) kid without realizing this. How???? Especially if you are well-educated and in your late 20s or early 30s by the time you start having kids.

I have friends with 3 who have acted surprised about every feature of their family size since the third was born. They were shocked at how expensive 4-5 bedroom houses are. They were shocked when their nanny expected more money for adding an infant to her workload. They were shocked when their food bill went up, when their eldest became jealous of the baby and started acting out, when their vacations became pricier and unwieldy due to the age spread.

I am empathetic -- it does in fact sound very hard. But I can't help wondering why on earth none of this occurred to them before? How can this be a surprise? I don't get it. This is precisely why we didn't have a third kid. We discussed it, we love kids and there are things about it that were very appealing, but the practicalities are just stacked against you.

I'm not against 3 or more kids (I am one of four, my sister has four) but I don't understand how it happens and then people realize "oh, this is harder and more expensive than having two, why didn't anyone tell me????" Uh, we thought you knew! It seems really obvious.

Newsflash, lady: they were not actually shocked - they were just venting.

No, I agree that I don't think people with 3+ kids really thought it through, they just wanted more babies but then didn't think about logistics. Have 3+ kids? You'll need 2 hotel rooms or have to pay extra for a cot or make your kids sleep 3 to a bed and they will hate you forever for that. Have 3+ kids? You'll need a bigger car that fits 6+ people in case you need to bring a friend along somewhere. Have 3+ kids? One of them will always feel excluded if it's an odd number.

How do people not think this through???

I can’t speak for everyone, but I extensively thought it through before having a third kid. We used to stay at the four seasons type hotels with 2 kids and now we won’t with three because we’ll either need two rooms or a condo. That’s a trade off. Yes, it’s more expensive to have three kids. But we felt we could afford it without making unreasonable compromises. Our kids don’t need to grow up staying at the fanciest hotels, going to Europe every year, or each taking six extracurriculars. They go to a great private school, they can each do a few extracurricular activities every teamster, go to summer camp, and we will take domestic vacations. We have a four bedroom house that we bought before we knew how many kids we’d have. It’s not huge, but my kids don’t need to grow up in a huge house. A lot of people with two kids argue that their kids need all of these extravagant things - they don’t, it’s usually for the parents and things they think their kids “should” have. I’d rather have three kids wearing gap, old navy and target than two kids with a full wardrobe of aviator nation sweatshirts by first grade.

I think for most people the resources they worry about having enough of with more kids are time, attention, and energy. Not "four seasons hotel rooms."

That said, I think it's possible to have more kids and give them the time and attention they need, but not every family is set up for it. It depends on your jobs, your normal energy levels, the support around you (especially family, even though terrific nannies can be amazing too, but great, supportive, energetic grandparents are irreplaceable), etc.

I know people with three kids who are doing great and people with three kids who are struggling and the difference is not money but the broader resource picture. The wealthiest couple I know has just one kid because both sets of grandparents have serious care needs and one of them has a job that requires constant travel. Sure, they can afford multiple full time nannies, but they'd still be emotionally and time stretched if they had more kids because of the other demands in their life. I don't view them as less successful for only having one kid -- I view them as smart and thoughtful.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm not even going to bother reading the 24 pages of idiocy this post has prompted.

- Young Gen X Mom who thinks OP is stupid.

I’m with you! It takes a few years to figure out how exhausting 3+ kids can be. By the time mom decides to SAH, the couple realizes how expensive 3+ kids can be esp to educate, save for retirement, take care of parents who are getting dementia. But you do you 30-somethings.

I find it shocking that people have a third (or fourth or fifth) kid without realizing this. How???? Especially if you are well-educated and in your late 20s or early 30s by the time you start having kids.

I have friends with 3 who have acted surprised about every feature of their family size since the third was born. They were shocked at how expensive 4-5 bedroom houses are. They were shocked when their nanny expected more money for adding an infant to her workload. They were shocked when their food bill went up, when their eldest became jealous of the baby and started acting out, when their vacations became pricier and unwieldy due to the age spread.

I am empathetic -- it does in fact sound very hard. But I can't help wondering why on earth none of this occurred to them before? How can this be a surprise? I don't get it. This is precisely why we didn't have a third kid. We discussed it, we love kids and there are things about it that were very appealing, but the practicalities are just stacked against you.

I'm not against 3 or more kids (I am one of four, my sister has four) but I don't understand how it happens and then people realize "oh, this is harder and more expensive than having two, why didn't anyone tell me????" Uh, we thought you knew! It seems really obvious.

Newsflash, lady: they were not actually shocked - they were just venting.

They are venting because they are surprised. If they really understood all these aspects of having 3 or more kids, why would they need to vent about this stuff?

Also, the way they vent is like "ong can you believe this?" and the truth is that yes, of course I believe it. It is obvious to most people. Am I supposed to get worked up that my friend has to pay for two hotel rooms when they travel or their private school didn't offer them more of a discount for their third kid? Why?

Only a moron would take the bolded statement literally. Again, your “friends” (quotes because you’re less a friend and more a judgmental twat) are JUST.VENTING.

Believe it or not, the people who actually HAVE three kids know how much it costs to have three kids better than the folks with one or two kids. You would think THAT would be obvious.

What should be obvious is that no one wants to hear someone whine and complain ("vent") about a choice they made for themselves. It's sympathy seeking and it's an annoying behavior.

I had fewer kids precisely because I did not want to spread all my resources (especially my time and energy) so thin among so many people. This seemed obvious to me. If it was also obvious to you, why did you make that choice? And why are you asking me to feel sorry for you when you apparently knew going in that it would be like this? I feel sorry for your kids instead. They didn't choose it, and your constant complaining about how hard and expensive everything is will feel to them like you resent or regret having them.

Pretty much everything in life involves choices, so it sounds like you have zero empathy for anyone. Must be fun! I’m sure you’re awesome to spend time with!

I have lots of empathy for people. I also expect the people around me to take responsibility for their choices.

It is not fun to spend time with someone who constantly complains about how hard it is to have three or more kids. You made the choice, now own it. There might be discrete things worth complaining about and of course a friend will listen. But if every time I see you, it's just a laundry list of "it's soooo hard and everything is so expensive and no one understands," I will run out of patience with it. This is the life you chose for yourself. It's not something that just happened to you.

So why are you CHOOSING to continue to spend time with people you look down on and then CHOOSING to whine and complain about how annoying they are on an internet message board? Hanging out with these people isn’t something that just happened to you. This is the social circle you chose for yourself.

(And thanks for confirming that you’re a twat!)

Say you're deeply defensive about your family planning choices without saying you're deeply defensive about your family planning choices.

That was considered clever phrasing about 15 years ago. Why don’t you slink back over to reddit if that’s the best you can do?

(And I’m not defensive in the least. I just don’t like you.)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm not even going to bother reading the 24 pages of idiocy this post has prompted.

- Young Gen X Mom who thinks OP is stupid.

I’m with you! It takes a few years to figure out how exhausting 3+ kids can be. By the time mom decides to SAH, the couple realizes how expensive 3+ kids can be esp to educate, save for retirement, take care of parents who are getting dementia. But you do you 30-somethings.

I find it shocking that people have a third (or fourth or fifth) kid without realizing this. How???? Especially if you are well-educated and in your late 20s or early 30s by the time you start having kids.

I have friends with 3 who have acted surprised about every feature of their family size since the third was born. They were shocked at how expensive 4-5 bedroom houses are. They were shocked when their nanny expected more money for adding an infant to her workload. They were shocked when their food bill went up, when their eldest became jealous of the baby and started acting out, when their vacations became pricier and unwieldy due to the age spread.

I am empathetic -- it does in fact sound very hard. But I can't help wondering why on earth none of this occurred to them before? How can this be a surprise? I don't get it. This is precisely why we didn't have a third kid. We discussed it, we love kids and there are things about it that were very appealing, but the practicalities are just stacked against you.

I'm not against 3 or more kids (I am one of four, my sister has four) but I don't understand how it happens and then people realize "oh, this is harder and more expensive than having two, why didn't anyone tell me????" Uh, we thought you knew! It seems really obvious.

Newsflash, lady: they were not actually shocked - they were just venting.

They are venting because they are surprised. If they really understood all these aspects of having 3 or more kids, why would they need to vent about this stuff?

Also, the way they vent is like "ong can you believe this?" and the truth is that yes, of course I believe it. It is obvious to most people. Am I supposed to get worked up that my friend has to pay for two hotel rooms when they travel or their private school didn't offer them more of a discount for their third kid? Why?

Only a moron would take the bolded statement literally. Again, your “friends” (quotes because you’re less a friend and more a judgmental twat) are JUST.VENTING.

Believe it or not, the people who actually HAVE three kids know how much it costs to have three kids better than the folks with one or two kids. You would think THAT would be obvious.

What should be obvious is that no one wants to hear someone whine and complain ("vent") about a choice they made for themselves. It's sympathy seeking and it's an annoying behavior.

I had fewer kids precisely because I did not want to spread all my resources (especially my time and energy) so thin among so many people. This seemed obvious to me. If it was also obvious to you, why did you make that choice? And why are you asking me to feel sorry for you when you apparently knew going in that it would be like this? I feel sorry for your kids instead. They didn't choose it, and your constant complaining about how hard and expensive everything is will feel to them like you resent or regret having them.

Pretty much everything in life involves choices, so it sounds like you have zero empathy for anyone. Must be fun! I’m sure you’re awesome to spend time with!

I have lots of empathy for people. I also expect the people around me to take responsibility for their choices.

It is not fun to spend time with someone who constantly complains about how hard it is to have three or more kids. You made the choice, now own it. There might be discrete things worth complaining about and of course a friend will listen. But if every time I see you, it's just a laundry list of "it's soooo hard and everything is so expensive and no one understands," I will run out of patience with it. This is the life you chose for yourself. It's not something that just happened to you.

So why are you CHOOSING to continue to spend time with people you look down on and then CHOOSING to whine and complain about how annoying they are on an internet message board? Hanging out with these people isn’t something that just happened to you. This is the social circle you chose for yourself.

(And thanks for confirming that you’re a twat!)

Say you're deeply defensive about your family planning choices without saying you're deeply defensive about your family planning choices.

That was considered clever phrasing about 15 years ago. Why don’t you slink back over to reddit if that’s the best you can do?

(And I’m not defensive in the least. I just don’t like you.)

I feel bad for you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Having a baby during the pandemic and being utterly alone with no support was traumatic. Not gonna go through that again.

That was a choice, PP. Many of us had close friends and family that were part of our "pod" during that time. My parents were over at our house every day.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm not even going to bother reading the 24 pages of idiocy this post has prompted.

- Young Gen X Mom who thinks OP is stupid.

I’m with you! It takes a few years to figure out how exhausting 3+ kids can be. By the time mom decides to SAH, the couple realizes how expensive 3+ kids can be esp to educate, save for retirement, take care of parents who are getting dementia. But you do you 30-somethings.

I find it shocking that people have a third (or fourth or fifth) kid without realizing this. How???? Especially if you are well-educated and in your late 20s or early 30s by the time you start having kids.

I have friends with 3 who have acted surprised about every feature of their family size since the third was born. They were shocked at how expensive 4-5 bedroom houses are. They were shocked when their nanny expected more money for adding an infant to her workload. They were shocked when their food bill went up, when their eldest became jealous of the baby and started acting out, when their vacations became pricier and unwieldy due to the age spread.

I am empathetic -- it does in fact sound very hard. But I can't help wondering why on earth none of this occurred to them before? How can this be a surprise? I don't get it. This is precisely why we didn't have a third kid. We discussed it, we love kids and there are things about it that were very appealing, but the practicalities are just stacked against you.

I'm not against 3 or more kids (I am one of four, my sister has four) but I don't understand how it happens and then people realize "oh, this is harder and more expensive than having two, why didn't anyone tell me????" Uh, we thought you knew! It seems really obvious.

Newsflash, lady: they were not actually shocked - they were just venting.

No, I agree that I don't think people with 3+ kids really thought it through, they just wanted more babies but then didn't think about logistics. Have 3+ kids? You'll need 2 hotel rooms or have to pay extra for a cot or make your kids sleep 3 to a bed and they will hate you forever for that. Have 3+ kids? You'll need a bigger car that fits 6+ people in case you need to bring a friend along somewhere. Have 3+ kids? One of them will always feel excluded if it's an odd number.

How do people not think this through???

Oh, well if YOU agree that must mean it’s gospel

You don’t need a car that fits 6. And there are plenty of families with only two children where the children dislike each other. And if you have a boy and a girl it’s only a matter of time before you need to figure out something different with hotels since it’s weird to force them to share a bed past a certain age. There are plenty of problems every family has to contend with…Insert Anna Karenina reference regarding unhappy families.

If your kids outgrow sharing a bed, you just divide them and each share a bed with a parent. Or you get a room with two beds and a pullout couch. It's not that hard.

Not all families are unhappy.

No on his saying all families are unhappy. One person noted that they know some families that always seem surprised by thing they didn't think through. I know one like that too. No need for moms of 3+ kids to get defensive when people are just making observations. My parents had 3 kids, it really was sometimes a logistical nightmare. It's one of the primary reasons I only had two children (as did my siblings).

[Anonymous]

Should have read "no-one is saying"

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm not even going to bother reading the 24 pages of idiocy this post has prompted.

- Young Gen X Mom who thinks OP is stupid.

I’m with you! It takes a few years to figure out how exhausting 3+ kids can be. By the time mom decides to SAH, the couple realizes how expensive 3+ kids can be esp to educate, save for retirement, take care of parents who are getting dementia. But you do you 30-somethings.

I find it shocking that people have a third (or fourth or fifth) kid without realizing this. How???? Especially if you are well-educated and in your late 20s or early 30s by the time you start having kids.

I have friends with 3 who have acted surprised about every feature of their family size since the third was born. They were shocked at how expensive 4-5 bedroom houses are. They were shocked when their nanny expected more money for adding an infant to her workload. They were shocked when their food bill went up, when their eldest became jealous of the baby and started acting out, when their vacations became pricier and unwieldy due to the age spread.

I am empathetic -- it does in fact sound very hard. But I can't help wondering why on earth none of this occurred to them before? How can this be a surprise? I don't get it. This is precisely why we didn't have a third kid. We discussed it, we love kids and there are things about it that were very appealing, but the practicalities are just stacked against you.

I'm not against 3 or more kids (I am one of four, my sister has four) but I don't understand how it happens and then people realize "oh, this is harder and more expensive than having two, why didn't anyone tell me????" Uh, we thought you knew! It seems really obvious.

Newsflash, lady: they were not actually shocked - they were just venting.

No, I agree that I don't think people with 3+ kids really thought it through, they just wanted more babies but then didn't think about logistics. Have 3+ kids? You'll need 2 hotel rooms or have to pay extra for a cot or make your kids sleep 3 to a bed and they will hate you forever for that. Have 3+ kids? You'll need a bigger car that fits 6+ people in case you need to bring a friend along somewhere. Have 3+ kids? One of them will always feel excluded if it's an odd number.

How do people not think this through???

I can’t speak for everyone, but I extensively thought it through before having a third kid. We used to stay at the four seasons type hotels with 2 kids and now we won’t with three because we’ll either need two rooms or a condo. That’s a trade off. Yes, it’s more expensive to have three kids. But we felt we could afford it without making unreasonable compromises. Our kids don’t need to grow up staying at the fanciest hotels, going to Europe every year, or each taking six extracurriculars. They go to a great private school, they can each do a few extracurricular activities every teamster, go to summer camp, and we will take domestic vacations. We have a four bedroom house that we bought before we knew how many kids we’d have. It’s not huge, but my kids don’t need to grow up in a huge house. A lot of people with two kids argue that their kids need all of these extravagant things - they don’t, it’s usually for the parents and things they think their kids “should” have. I’d rather have three kids wearing gap, old navy and target than two kids with a full wardrobe of aviator nation sweatshirts by first grade.

I think for most people the resources they worry about having enough of with more kids are time, attention, and energy. Not "four seasons hotel rooms."

That said, I think it's possible to have more kids and give them the time and attention they need, but not every family is set up for it. It depends on your jobs, your normal energy levels, the support around you (especially family, even though terrific nannies can be amazing too, but great, supportive, energetic grandparents are irreplaceable), etc.

I know people with three kids who are doing great and people with three kids who are struggling and the difference is not money but the broader resource picture. The wealthiest couple I know has just one kid because both sets of grandparents have serious care needs and one of them has a job that requires constant travel. Sure, they can afford multiple full time nannies, but they'd still be emotionally and time stretched if they had more kids because of the other demands in their life. I don't view them as less successful for only having one kid -- I view them as smart and thoughtful.

Gotcha. Yes, I think it will be different for everyone. I am willing to sacrifice some personal time to have more kids - it’s what I wanted in life and it feels meaningful to me. But my career isn’t as high achieving as some of my friends who chose to stop at 2. They really enjoy their careers, and I really enjoy being at home more. We also have very involved grandparents. I absolutely don’t view people with 1 or 2 or 0 kids as less successful. These are just life choices and everyone fills their cup differently. There is no “having it all” there is just “having different balances”

[Anonymous]

35 y/o millennial- this all rings true to me!

Working parents; most of the people I know have one or both spouses working somewhat flexible jobs where we can wfh a bit, spend limited hours in office, don’t have crazy work schedules.

3 kids. Of my close friends 3 have 3 and 1 has one for financial & health reasons.

We love to travel

The one piece I don’t necessarily see is the posting thing. I post pictures very rarely and while it is of fun/cool/or interesting things I do or see I think people in my cohort see excessive posting and bragging as cringey and embarrassing. This does exclude influencers though and those family influencers are incessant

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm not even going to bother reading the 24 pages of idiocy this post has prompted.

- Young Gen X Mom who thinks OP is stupid.

I’m with you! It takes a few years to figure out how exhausting 3+ kids can be. By the time mom decides to SAH, the couple realizes how expensive 3+ kids can be esp to educate, save for retirement, take care of parents who are getting dementia. But you do you 30-somethings.

I find it shocking that people have a third (or fourth or fifth) kid without realizing this. How???? Especially if you are well-educated and in your late 20s or early 30s by the time you start having kids.

I have friends with 3 who have acted surprised about every feature of their family size since the third was born. They were shocked at how expensive 4-5 bedroom houses are. They were shocked when their nanny expected more money for adding an infant to her workload. They were shocked when their food bill went up, when their eldest became jealous of the baby and started acting out, when their vacations became pricier and unwieldy due to the age spread.

I am empathetic -- it does in fact sound very hard. But I can't help wondering why on earth none of this occurred to them before? How can this be a surprise? I don't get it. This is precisely why we didn't have a third kid. We discussed it, we love kids and there are things about it that were very appealing, but the practicalities are just stacked against you.

I'm not against 3 or more kids (I am one of four, my sister has four) but I don't understand how it happens and then people realize "oh, this is harder and more expensive than having two, why didn't anyone tell me????" Uh, we thought you knew! It seems really obvious.

Newsflash, lady: they were not actually shocked - they were just venting.

No, I agree that I don't think people with 3+ kids really thought it through, they just wanted more babies but then didn't think about logistics. Have 3+ kids? You'll need 2 hotel rooms or have to pay extra for a cot or make your kids sleep 3 to a bed and they will hate you forever for that. Have 3+ kids? You'll need a bigger car that fits 6+ people in case you need to bring a friend along somewhere. Have 3+ kids? One of them will always feel excluded if it's an odd number.

How do people not think this through???

Oh, well if YOU agree that must mean it’s gospel

You don’t need a car that fits 6. And there are plenty of families with only two children where the children dislike each other. And if you have a boy and a girl it’s only a matter of time before you need to figure out something different with hotels since it’s weird to force them to share a bed past a certain age. There are plenty of problems every family has to contend with…Insert Anna Karenina reference regarding unhappy families.

If your kids outgrow sharing a bed, you just divide them and each share a bed with a parent. Or you get a room with two beds and a pullout couch. It's not that hard.

Not all families are unhappy.

No on his saying all families are unhappy. One person noted that they know some families that always seem surprised by thing they didn't think through. I know one like that too. No need for moms of 3+ kids to get defensive when people are just making observations. My parents had 3 kids, it really was sometimes a logistical nightmare. It's one of the primary reasons I only had two children (as did my siblings).

Do y’all react with the same lack of empathy for anyone’s circumstances?

Friend has a kid with special needs? “You should have thought it through better! You knew this was a possibility, stop your whining!”

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm not even going to bother reading the 24 pages of idiocy this post has prompted.

- Young Gen X Mom who thinks OP is stupid.

I’m with you! It takes a few years to figure out how exhausting 3+ kids can be. By the time mom decides to SAH, the couple realizes how expensive 3+ kids can be esp to educate, save for retirement, take care of parents who are getting dementia. But you do you 30-somethings.

I find it shocking that people have a third (or fourth or fifth) kid without realizing this. How???? Especially if you are well-educated and in your late 20s or early 30s by the time you start having kids.

I have friends with 3 who have acted surprised about every feature of their family size since the third was born. They were shocked at how expensive 4-5 bedroom houses are. They were shocked when their nanny expected more money for adding an infant to her workload. They were shocked when their food bill went up, when their eldest became jealous of the baby and started acting out, when their vacations became pricier and unwieldy due to the age spread.

I am empathetic -- it does in fact sound very hard. But I can't help wondering why on earth none of this occurred to them before? How can this be a surprise? I don't get it. This is precisely why we didn't have a third kid. We discussed it, we love kids and there are things about it that were very appealing, but the practicalities are just stacked against you.

I'm not against 3 or more kids (I am one of four, my sister has four) but I don't understand how it happens and then people realize "oh, this is harder and more expensive than having two, why didn't anyone tell me????" Uh, we thought you knew! It seems really obvious.

Newsflash, lady: they were not actually shocked - they were just venting.

No, I agree that I don't think people with 3+ kids really thought it through, they just wanted more babies but then didn't think about logistics. Have 3+ kids? You'll need 2 hotel rooms or have to pay extra for a cot or make your kids sleep 3 to a bed and they will hate you forever for that. Have 3+ kids? You'll need a bigger car that fits 6+ people in case you need to bring a friend along somewhere. Have 3+ kids? One of them will always feel excluded if it's an odd number.

How do people not think this through???

Oh, well if YOU agree that must mean it’s gospel

You don’t need a car that fits 6. And there are plenty of families with only two children where the children dislike each other. And if you have a boy and a girl it’s only a matter of time before you need to figure out something different with hotels since it’s weird to force them to share a bed past a certain age. There are plenty of problems every family has to contend with…Insert Anna Karenina reference regarding unhappy families.

If your kids outgrow sharing a bed, you just divide them and each share a bed with a parent. Or you get a room with two beds and a pullout couch. It's not that hard.

Not all families are unhappy.

No on his saying all families are unhappy. One person noted that they know some families that always seem surprised by thing they didn't think through. I know one like that too. No need for moms of 3+ kids to get defensive when people are just making observations. My parents had 3 kids, it really was sometimes a logistical nightmare. It's one of the primary reasons I only had two children (as did my siblings).

Do y’all react with the same lack of empathy for anyone’s circumstances?

Friend has a kid with special needs? “You should have thought it through better! You knew this was a possibility, stop your whining!”

I mean that's different because it could happen to anyone. No one chooses to have a kid with SNs, it just happens. And everyone who has kids takes that risk.

But the number of kids you have is totally in your control. If you have 3 kids, I don't think "well, that could easily be me." It could not be me because I would not choose to have three children. So yes, it's harder for me to feel sorry for you if having three kids is very hard because you could have done it differently.

Having said that, I do have empathy for anyone struggling with parenting. It can be hard. But ANY parent who complains constantly about it is going to wear on people's nerves. If you have three or more kids, I would not count on people just happily listening to that all the time. You should make choices you can be reasonably happy with and that don't require others to bend over backwards to accommodate.

[Anonymous]

I’m a high achieving millennial mom and I don’t understand why anyone posts on social media about their family.

[Anonymous]

OP here didn’t realize this resurrected. Baby 2 is a year old now and I’m strongly considering a third. Thank God for my IUD. But so far, I’d say I’m continuing to see these themes among my friends … high income jobs … high income status husbands… babies … Travel and Instagram documentation of it all.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm not even going to bother reading the 24 pages of idiocy this post has prompted.

- Young Gen X Mom who thinks OP is stupid.

I’m with you! It takes a few years to figure out how exhausting 3+ kids can be. By the time mom decides to SAH, the couple realizes how expensive 3+ kids can be esp to educate, save for retirement, take care of parents who are getting dementia. But you do you 30-somethings.

I find it shocking that people have a third (or fourth or fifth) kid without realizing this. How???? Especially if you are well-educated and in your late 20s or early 30s by the time you start having kids.

I have friends with 3 who have acted surprised about every feature of their family size since the third was born. They were shocked at how expensive 4-5 bedroom houses are. They were shocked when their nanny expected more money for adding an infant to her workload. They were shocked when their food bill went up, when their eldest became jealous of the baby and started acting out, when their vacations became pricier and unwieldy due to the age spread.

I am empathetic -- it does in fact sound very hard. But I can't help wondering why on earth none of this occurred to them before? How can this be a surprise? I don't get it. This is precisely why we didn't have a third kid. We discussed it, we love kids and there are things about it that were very appealing, but the practicalities are just stacked against you.

I'm not against 3 or more kids (I am one of four, my sister has four) but I don't understand how it happens and then people realize "oh, this is harder and more expensive than having two, why didn't anyone tell me????" Uh, we thought you knew! It seems really obvious.

Newsflash, lady: they were not actually shocked - they were just venting.

No, I agree that I don't think people with 3+ kids really thought it through, they just wanted more babies but then didn't think about logistics. Have 3+ kids? You'll need 2 hotel rooms or have to pay extra for a cot or make your kids sleep 3 to a bed and they will hate you forever for that. Have 3+ kids? You'll need a bigger car that fits 6+ people in case you need to bring a friend along somewhere. Have 3+ kids? One of them will always feel excluded if it's an odd number.

How do people not think this through???

Oh, well if YOU agree that must mean it’s gospel

You don’t need a car that fits 6. And there are plenty of families with only two children where the children dislike each other. And if you have a boy and a girl it’s only a matter of time before you need to figure out something different with hotels since it’s weird to force them to share a bed past a certain age. There are plenty of problems every family has to contend with…Insert Anna Karenina reference regarding unhappy families.

If your kids outgrow sharing a bed, you just divide them and each share a bed with a parent. Or you get a room with two beds and a pullout couch. It's not that hard.

Not all families are unhappy.

No on his saying all families are unhappy. One person noted that they know some families that always seem surprised by thing they didn't think through. I know one like that too. No need for moms of 3+ kids to get defensive when people are just making observations. My parents had 3 kids, it really was sometimes a logistical nightmare. It's one of the primary reasons I only had two children (as did my siblings).

Do y’all react with the same lack of empathy for anyone’s circumstances?

Friend has a kid with special needs? “You should have thought it through better! You knew this was a possibility, stop your whining!”

I mean that's different because it could happen to anyone. No one chooses to have a kid with SNs, it just happens. And everyone who has kids takes that risk.

But the number of kids you have is totally in your control. If you have 3 kids, I don't think "well, that could easily be me." It could not be me because I would not choose to have three children. So yes, it's harder for me to feel sorry for you if having three kids is very hard because you could have done it differently.

Having said that, I do have empathy for anyone struggling with parenting. It can be hard. But ANY parent who complains constantly about it is going to wear on people's nerves. If you have three or more kids, I would not count on people just happily listening to that all the time. You should make choices you can be reasonably happy with and that don't require others to bend over backwards to accommodate.

LOL. Your “point” is stupid on its face, but also just wrong.

You’ve never heard of twins?

I feel sorry for people who have to interact with you on a regular basis. You are a miserable person.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I'm not even going to bother reading the 24 pages of idiocy this post has prompted.

- Young Gen X Mom who thinks OP is stupid.

I’m with you! It takes a few years to figure out how exhausting 3+ kids can be. By the time mom decides to SAH, the couple realizes how expensive 3+ kids can be esp to educate, save for retirement, take care of parents who are getting dementia. But you do you 30-somethings.

I find it shocking that people have a third (or fourth or fifth) kid without realizing this. How???? Especially if you are well-educated and in your late 20s or early 30s by the time you start having kids.

I have friends with 3 who have acted surprised about every feature of their family size since the third was born. They were shocked at how expensive 4-5 bedroom houses are. They were shocked when their nanny expected more money for adding an infant to her workload. They were shocked when their food bill went up, when their eldest became jealous of the baby and started acting out, when their vacations became pricier and unwieldy due to the age spread.

I am empathetic -- it does in fact sound very hard. But I can't help wondering why on earth none of this occurred to them before? How can this be a surprise? I don't get it. This is precisely why we didn't have a third kid. We discussed it, we love kids and there are things about it that were very appealing, but the practicalities are just stacked against you.

I'm not against 3 or more kids (I am one of four, my sister has four) but I don't understand how it happens and then people realize "oh, this is harder and more expensive than having two, why didn't anyone tell me????" Uh, we thought you knew! It seems really obvious.

Newsflash, lady: they were not actually shocked - they were just venting.

No, I agree that I don't think people with 3+ kids really thought it through, they just wanted more babies but then didn't think about logistics. Have 3+ kids? You'll need 2 hotel rooms or have to pay extra for a cot or make your kids sleep 3 to a bed and they will hate you forever for that. Have 3+ kids? You'll need a bigger car that fits 6+ people in case you need to bring a friend along somewhere. Have 3+ kids? One of them will always feel excluded if it's an odd number.

How do people not think this through???

I can’t speak for everyone, but I extensively thought it through before having a third kid. We used to stay at the four seasons type hotels with 2 kids and now we won’t with three because we’ll either need two rooms or a condo. That’s a trade off. Yes, it’s more expensive to have three kids. But we felt we could afford it without making unreasonable compromises. Our kids don’t need to grow up staying at the fanciest hotels, going to Europe every year, or each taking six extracurriculars. They go to a great private school, they can each do a few extracurricular activities every teamster, go to summer camp, and we will take domestic vacations. We have a four bedroom house that we bought before we knew how many kids we’d have. It’s not huge, but my kids don’t need to grow up in a huge house. A lot of people with two kids argue that their kids need all of these extravagant things - they don’t, it’s usually for the parents and things they think their kids “should” have. I’d rather have three kids wearing gap, old navy and target than two kids with a full wardrobe of aviator nation sweatshirts by first grade.

I think for most people the resources they worry about having enough of with more kids are time, attention, and energy. Not "four seasons hotel rooms."

That said, I think it's possible to have more kids and give them the time and attention they need, but not every family is set up for it. It depends on your jobs, your normal energy levels, the support around you (especially family, even though terrific nannies can be amazing too, but great, supportive, energetic grandparents are irreplaceable), etc.

I know people with three kids who are doing great and people with three kids who are struggling and the difference is not money but the broader resource picture. The wealthiest couple I know has just one kid because both sets of grandparents have serious care needs and one of them has a job that requires constant travel. Sure, they can afford multiple full time nannies, but they'd still be emotionally and time stretched if they had more kids because of the other demands in their life. I don't view them as less successful for only having one kid -- I view them as smart and thoughtful.

I had my third and stopped working. I have three very busy kids. I wouldn’t be able to juggle if I still worked.

[Anonymous]

Not reading this whole thread but I am about 8 years older than you and this is somewhat culture/region specific but also not new.

Women who are highly educated and highly trained who are also married to similar people (i.e. two high-earners) are going to be able to pay away their parenting troubles in large part, and they are going to outsource chores, hire childcare, have the houses with the in-law suites, etc... Sure you get your CEO-wives and "I was a lawyer but now I'm a decorator" women, but it seems to be that most doctor/lawyer moms married to the same are just parenting with copious resources. And yeah, they don't see a lot of their kids except for when they take vacations 4x a year.

Then you have more normal hardworking people - like the 5%ers who work hard but also find balance without extravagance - and in my circles these are the people who I find have the TIME to invest in their children with good genes and high capacity, and THESE are the kids who make it to the ivies most often. The super super rich kids of the absent-type rich parents do just fine, but they are less interested and motivated to go to a T10 (and they frankly don't need to).

Basically everyone 55 or younger has seen this same dynamic play out, but as the weather divide gets bigger and bigger, it's more stratified and extreme.