A Generation of American Men Give Up on College: ‘I Just Feel Lost’

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:"College." What about specific majors? Men are still overrepresented in the hard stuff, girls in the fluff stuff "studies" etc. That's what "college"
has become today. Relax, men do just fine.

+1 seriously. Do they need a cookie and a hug?

-mom of DD and DS who is doing just fine.

Maybe your DS is ok but not every other young man is "doing just fine." Google deaths of despair in Appalachia or just look at what's happening right here in DC.

+1 "My kid is fine," therefore there is not problem? There fore everyone else must be doing something wrong? Yikes.

No, not everyone is doing fine, but it's not like they don't have any opportunities. They just choose not to take them. What happened to personal responsibility?

In any case, 1/3 of working age men aren't in the workforce for various reasons: homeless, working under the table; trading bitcoin; retired early. They made their choices. Yes, it is a choice. You may not like the choices, but you do have choices.

It's a lot easier for white men to get a job than black men, that's for sure.

This is so disingenuous.

why?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I just question what most college degrees are really good for these days. And do those women who attend really make use of their degrees? I mean, seriously what is college attendance an indicator of anyway.?

Yes, even the dullest of the dull who can graduate with a bachelor's are good enough for some freeloading office make work "job". Often working from home for $60,000+ a year. Enough to get their own place, buy a new Jeep, and travel with friends and/or boyfriend. They at least demonstrate they have some semblance of ambition and an ability to follow through. Much better than their idiot unmotivated male peers who are on their parents' couch addicted to video games and vape (after quietly dropping out of college). And no, I'm not being cruel or funny, I see this in my own family. 20-something girls went to college AND GRADUATED, now they're most often nurses, teachers, and the make work office jobs I mentioned. 20-something boys are more often than not failing to launch. The boys are proving themselves to be dumb unmotivated immature jerk-offs and you want corporations to take a risk on them and give them a career? Why? Would you hire losers addicted to video games who failed out of college at your fictitious company? Unless it's flipping burgers or delivering for Amazon for $15 to $18/hr, of course you wouldn't.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:ok, I have 3 daughters and the reason boys fail at American schools has been very clear to me - because curricula are dumbed down and academic competition is suppressed. Classes are taught by overwhelmingly female teachers who know very little and prioritize discipline and busywork.

We are immigrants but moved back to our old country mainly because schools are much better. And boy, do boys thrive here. They are so much better academically (about equal with girls) and more confident. Society needs both men and women, and men and women need each other.

Teachers have been overwhelmingly female in the US for more than a century.

I do agree the curriculum has been dumbed down, but I don't see that as a reason boys in particular are generally less successful or less prepared.

because they can't handle boredom as well as girls can.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:ok, I have 3 daughters and the reason boys fail at American schools has been very clear to me - because curricula are dumbed down and academic competition is suppressed. Classes are taught by overwhelmingly female teachers who know very little and prioritize discipline and busywork.

We are immigrants but moved back to our old country mainly because schools are much better. And boy, do boys thrive here. They are so much better academically (about equal with girls) and more confident. Society needs both men and women, and men and women need each other.

Teachers have been overwhelmingly female in the US for more than a century.

I do agree the curriculum has been dumbed down, but I don't see that as a reason boys in particular are generally less successful or less prepared.

didn't you read the article: The admissions official at UCLA said "“We do not see male applicants being less competitive than female applicants,” UCLA Vice Provost Youlonda Copeland-Morgan said, but fewer men appl[y]"

[Anonymous]

maybe we should be asking why so many women want to spend 4 perfectly useful and potentially productive years of their lives getting liberal arts degrees in the fluff majors. Wonder what % of these are really Mrs. degrees.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is a bigger problem for liberal arts colleges than it is for men. They are losing half of their potential “customers.” The gender ratios are reversed in STEM programs, while the women go get degrees in gender studies or art history.

These top schools used to be finishing schools for the children of the wealthy, who would then go to work at Daddy’s firm. Now, only a small portion of those kids can get in, and the first Gen kids that are replacing them are just now starting to figure out that the degree itself was just a small part of the package that allowed those kids to succeed in life. (See, the sudden spate of articles whining about how their $320,000 SLAC degrees don’t lead to careers that can provide a good lifestyle without generational wealth.)

Not to mention that there are more men who are foregoing degrees altogether, and going straight into business. Go straight into business, have four years of income vs. no income and a $80,000 to $320,000 expenditure? Unless you think you’re going to be one of the tiny fraction that end up in investment banking or at a T-14 law school, it’s an easy call.

How many women posting on this board have Ivy League degrees and are SAHMs? These colleges have become finishing schools for the UC/UMC. They were just gatekeeping for certain jobs, and now people are realizing that it isn’t necessary as these colleges have begun to price themselves out of the market. It wasn’t that long ago that the press and stock traders, for example, didn’t have college degrees (and the press, for one, was better for it). “College for all” has devalued the product to the point that we’re realizing it never really added that much value in the first place.

FWIW, I’m not anti-intellectual. I love to sit around and read history, and would have done it for a living had I been born wealthy. But doing that for a living is not really feasible for people without generational wealth, and we had to see a whole generation of students who didn’t know any better figure that out for themselves.

+1. You said it much better than I did above, but the premise that men giving up college is a "problem" is just bogus. The worthlessness of liberal arts degrees is the problem.

This is what is happening. There are still plenty of men in STEM where, when you graduate as an engineer or system administrator you can pay the bills. A degree in Music Therapy, Gender Studies, or other areas, there are not that many good jobs out there so men are wising up and staying away.

Men are also finding out that if you are broke or don't have a bright career path, many women will turn their nose up and turn away so men are motivated to show the money now. When on a date, you do not come across as a convincing breadwinner saying, "Yeah, I have a degree in Medieval History and yes, I'm working at Starbucks but no, there are no jobs out there that I can find in my field. I cannot stand in front of a classroom so being a school teacher or assistant professor at a university is off the table. But I know a lot about heraldry and battle axes!"

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:ok, I have 3 daughters and the reason boys fail at American schools has been very clear to me - because curricula are dumbed down and academic competition is suppressed. Classes are taught by overwhelmingly female teachers who know very little and prioritize discipline and busywork.

We are immigrants but moved back to our old country mainly because schools are much better. And boy, do boys thrive here. They are so much better academically (about equal with girls) and more confident. Society needs both men and women, and men and women need each other.

Teachers have been overwhelmingly female in the US for more than a century.

I do agree the curriculum has been dumbed down, but I don't see that as a reason boys in particular are generally less successful or less prepared.

The schools say that the boys are not less successful or less prepared. However, as the mother of a boy that is an excellent student, I have observed time and again that most teachers are women, and they reward things that girls are good at — sitting quietly, producing neat, tidy work, etc. This was a common topic of conversation among fellow boy parents, especially in the upper grades of elementary and middle school. If I had it to do over again, I would send my DC to an all-boys’ school, at least for the lower grades.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is a bigger problem for liberal arts colleges than it is for men. They are losing half of their potential “customers.” The gender ratios are reversed in STEM programs, while the women go get degrees in gender studies or art history.

These top schools used to be finishing schools for the children of the wealthy, who would then go to work at Daddy’s firm. Now, only a small portion of those kids can get in, and the first Gen kids that are replacing them are just now starting to figure out that the degree itself was just a small part of the package that allowed those kids to succeed in life. (See, the sudden spate of articles whining about how their $320,000 SLAC degrees don’t lead to careers that can provide a good lifestyle without generational wealth.)

Not to mention that there are more men who are foregoing degrees altogether, and going straight into business. Go straight into business, have four years of income vs. no income and a $80,000 to $320,000 expenditure? Unless you think you’re going to be one of the tiny fraction that end up in investment banking or at a T-14 law school, it’s an easy call.

How many women posting on this board have Ivy League degrees and are SAHMs? These colleges have become finishing schools for the UC/UMC. They were just gatekeeping for certain jobs, and now people are realizing that it isn’t necessary as these colleges have begun to price themselves out of the market. It wasn’t that long ago that the press and stock traders, for example, didn’t have college degrees (and the press, for one, was better for it). “College for all” has devalued the product to the point that we’re realizing it never really added that much value in the first place.

FWIW, I’m not anti-intellectual. I love to sit around and read history, and would have done it for a living had I been born wealthy. But doing that for a living is not really feasible for people without generational wealth, and we had to see a whole generation of students who didn’t know any better figure that out for themselves.

+1. You said it much better than I did above, but the premise that men giving up college is a "problem" is just bogus. The worthlessness of liberal arts degrees is the problem.

This is what is happening. There are still plenty of men in STEM where, when you graduate as an engineer or system administrator you can pay the bills. A degree in Music Therapy, Gender Studies, or other areas, there are not that many good jobs out there so men are wising up and staying away.

Men are also finding out that if you are broke or don't have a bright career path, many women will turn their nose up and turn away so men are motivated to show the money now. When on a date, you do not come across as a convincing breadwinner saying, "Yeah, I have a degree in Medieval History and yes, I'm working at Starbucks but no, there are no jobs out there that I can find in my field. I cannot stand in front of a classroom so being a school teacher or assistant professor at a university is off the table. But I know a lot about heraldry and battle axes!"

Holy sh#t you people are like a broken record. The vast majority of women don't major in this stuff. You're spinning a yarn.



Further, the vast majority of men are not studying hard sciences in college.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is a bigger problem for liberal arts colleges than it is for men. They are losing half of their potential “customers.” The gender ratios are reversed in STEM programs, while the women go get degrees in gender studies or art history.

These top schools used to be finishing schools for the children of the wealthy, who would then go to work at Daddy’s firm. Now, only a small portion of those kids can get in, and the first Gen kids that are replacing them are just now starting to figure out that the degree itself was just a small part of the package that allowed those kids to succeed in life. (See, the sudden spate of articles whining about how their $320,000 SLAC degrees don’t lead to careers that can provide a good lifestyle without generational wealth.)

Not to mention that there are more men who are foregoing degrees altogether, and going straight into business. Go straight into business, have four years of income vs. no income and a $80,000 to $320,000 expenditure? Unless you think you’re going to be one of the tiny fraction that end up in investment banking or at a T-14 law school, it’s an easy call.

How many women posting on this board have Ivy League degrees and are SAHMs? These colleges have become finishing schools for the UC/UMC. They were just gatekeeping for certain jobs, and now people are realizing that it isn’t necessary as these colleges have begun to price themselves out of the market. It wasn’t that long ago that the press and stock traders, for example, didn’t have college degrees (and the press, for one, was better for it). “College for all” has devalued the product to the point that we’re realizing it never really added that much value in the first place.

FWIW, I’m not anti-intellectual. I love to sit around and read history, and would have done it for a living had I been born wealthy. But doing that for a living is not really feasible for people without generational wealth, and we had to see a whole generation of students who didn’t know any better figure that out for themselves.

+1. You said it much better than I did above, but the premise that men giving up college is a "problem" is just bogus. The worthlessness of liberal arts degrees is the problem.

This is what is happening. There are still plenty of men in STEM where, when you graduate as an engineer or system administrator you can pay the bills. A degree in Music Therapy, Gender Studies, or other areas, there are not that many good jobs out there so men are wising up and staying away.

Men are also finding out that if you are broke or don't have a bright career path, many women will turn their nose up and turn away so men are motivated to show the money now. When on a date, you do not come across as a convincing breadwinner saying, "Yeah, I have a degree in Medieval History and yes, I'm working at Starbucks but no, there are no jobs out there that I can find in my field. I cannot stand in front of a classroom so being a school teacher or assistant professor at a university is off the table. But I know a lot about heraldry and battle axes!"

Holy sh#t you people are like a broken record. The vast majority of women don't major in this stuff. You're spinning a yarn.



Further, the vast majority of men are not studying hard sciences in college.

This chart doesn’t prove what you think it does. Aside from the fact that teaching is on the list of women’s majors twice, the only “science” women are taking in great numbers is nursing, which is a classic “pink collar” career (engineering isn’t even on the list). And women are over represented in the “soft” majors, while men are over represented in the business/finance/engineering majors. Business is the only major that’s close to equity, and that’s because business schools are very competitive and they try to admit equal numbers of men and women.

[Anonymous]

Great, male college enrollment is down, and 1 in 3 men are unemployed. Not good.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:ok, I have 3 daughters and the reason boys fail at American schools has been very clear to me - because curricula are dumbed down and academic competition is suppressed. Classes are taught by overwhelmingly female teachers who know very little and prioritize discipline and busywork.

We are immigrants but moved back to our old country mainly because schools are much better. And boy, do boys thrive here. They are so much better academically (about equal with girls) and more confident. Society needs both men and women, and men and women need each other.

Teachers have been overwhelmingly female in the US for more than a century.

I do agree the curriculum has been dumbed down, but I don't see that as a reason boys in particular are generally less successful or less prepared.

The schools say that the boys are not less successful or less prepared. However, as the mother of a boy that is an excellent student, I have observed time and again that most teachers are women, and they reward things that girls are good at — sitting quietly, producing neat, tidy work, etc. This was a common topic of conversation among fellow boy parents, especially in the upper grades of elementary and middle school. If I had it to do over again, I would send my DC to an all-boys’ school, at least for the lower grades.

+1. It is built into the system. It’s fine to have a high school specializing in the Arts or STEM or engineering but the lower grades have cut recess and MCPS repeatedly ends any consideration of a Sports Academy. Schools are designed and built for girls/women.

[Anonymous]

This would be my son’s dream school...

https://yscacademy.com/soccer/programs/

Not to be a professional athlete but to have a sport incorporated into his day in a consistent fashion.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The biggest takeaway from this data is that guys have a better chance of getting laid.

Is that even allowed these days? Won't that get you kicked out (unless you have written consent)?

Not all college women are "woke" and require full written consent. Verbal consent is OK.

I find your mocking of consent -which is a real problem and has nothing to do with being "woke" (Please just stop using this word)- to be disgusting.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I just question what most college degrees are really good for these days. And do those women who attend really make use of their degrees? I mean, seriously what is college attendance an indicator of anyway.?

Yes, even the dullest of the dull who can graduate with a bachelor's are good enough for some freeloading office make work "job". Often working from home for $60,000+ a year. Enough to get their own place, buy a new Jeep, and travel with friends and/or boyfriend. They at least demonstrate they have some semblance of ambition and an ability to follow through. Much better than their idiot unmotivated male peers who are on their parents' couch addicted to video games and vape (after quietly dropping out of college). And no, I'm not being cruel or funny, I see this in my own family. 20-something girls went to college AND GRADUATED, now they're most often nurses, teachers, and the make work office jobs I mentioned. 20-something boys are more often than not failing to launch. The boys are proving themselves to be dumb unmotivated immature jerk-offs and you want corporations to take a risk on them and give them a career? Why? Would you hire losers addicted to video games who failed out of college at your fictitious company? Unless it's flipping burgers or delivering for Amazon for $15 to $18/hr, of course you wouldn't.

Whoa. Are you a parent? Terrifying screed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:ok, I have 3 daughters and the reason boys fail at American schools has been very clear to me - because curricula are dumbed down and academic competition is suppressed. Classes are taught by overwhelmingly female teachers who know very little and prioritize discipline and busywork.

We are immigrants but moved back to our old country mainly because schools are much better. And boy, do boys thrive here. They are so much better academically (about equal with girls) and more confident. Society needs both men and women, and men and women need each other.

Teachers have been overwhelmingly female in the US for more than a century.

I do agree the curriculum has been dumbed down, but I don't see that as a reason boys in particular are generally less successful or less prepared.

because they can't handle boredom as well as girls can.

Clearly, they are more fragile.