How are kids supposed to address professors? Dr., Professor, first name? Daughter got rude reaction

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm the professor who wrote at the top of this page. Even staff who do not work directly with someone initially refer to faculty by "professor." It is simply the formal title used in this professional setting. It is the default unless someone insists on a first name. My belief is that professors should not ask students to refer to them by their first name. If they do insist students use their first name, I would worry they have boundary isssues.

I am flabbergasted to read all these parents who are shocked or resentful that there are formal boundaries in academia. It's not about subservience. It's about professionalism.

I am someone who has a title that could be used and doesn't, not a shocked parent. I will not insist another adult address me in a subservient manner.

OK, but do you really feel that college students are adults just because they have reached the legal adult age? I think we are talking about undergrads here.

Come to think of it, when I was in business school and most of the students were in fact adults, we still called our professors by their last name as they did with us.

Nobody's saying that's not perfect fine and that's your prerogative. Would your b-school professors harm or dock you or slight you in any way for simply using their first name? Probably not. But folks in these thread are arguing it's okay for professors to do just that if a young adult doesn't bow down and kiss the pinky ring every email.

There it is again -- that weird fetish for hyperbole.

Something tells me that this PP's life has been full of consternation and rage.

I'm not full of rage. I think an adult who goes nuclear because a 18-22 year old called them their first name is the one harboring psychological demons.

So telling an undergraduate that professional norms do not include calling your professor by first name without being invited to is … "going nuclear?"

Yeah, there's some unacknowledged issues there.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm the professor who wrote at the top of this page. Even staff who do not work directly with someone initially refer to faculty by "professor." It is simply the formal title used in this professional setting. It is the default unless someone insists on a first name. My belief is that professors should not ask students to refer to them by their first name. If they do insist students use their first name, I would worry they have boundary isssues.

I am flabbergasted to read all these parents who are shocked or resentful that there are formal boundaries in academia. It's not about subservience. It's about professionalism.

I am someone who has a title that could be used and doesn't, not a shocked parent. I will not insist another adult address me in a subservient manner.

May I ask what your title is?

Doctor of Naturopathy

Ahhhhhhh.

Well, there you go.

Yeah. I’m still laughing at this one.

I am the one who doesn't insist on title. I didn't write the bit about naturopathy. One of you insecure lunatics who feel their life worth is based on an honorific wrote that, and I think it's telling that you feel the need to insult a profession to make your point. I am jointly degreed in engineering and work in industry and academia.

"Jointly degreed" means what, exactly? Interested here.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm the professor who wrote at the top of this page. Even staff who do not work directly with someone initially refer to faculty by "professor." It is simply the formal title used in this professional setting. It is the default unless someone insists on a first name. My belief is that professors should not ask students to refer to them by their first name. If they do insist students use their first name, I would worry they have boundary isssues.

I am flabbergasted to read all these parents who are shocked or resentful that there are formal boundaries in academia. It's not about subservience. It's about professionalism.

I am someone who has a title that could be used and doesn't, not a shocked parent. I will not insist another adult address me in a subservient manner.

OK, but do you really feel that college students are adults just because they have reached the legal adult age? I think we are talking about undergrads here.

Come to think of it, when I was in business school and most of the students were in fact adults, we still called our professors by their last name as they did with us.

Good point. My professors also referred to me as Ms. X, so it wasn't an issue of ego/subservience it was just decorum.

But kids can't use Ms and Mr anymore because the pronoun police will turn you in if you use the wrong one. Everyone in academia has "preferred pronouns" now. Kids walk on eggshells fearing all these perceived slights. So, I don't see the problem playing it safe with first names. Everyone loves their first name; it's familiar and comforting, unless you're on a cocktail of SSRIs and have seven cats, of course.

I smell more hyperbole.

[Anonymous]

I think Jeff needs to figure out this poster's IP address so we can get a wellness check to her house ASAP.

[Anonymous]

PP that is hung up on "servitude:" Do you think regular citizens should call our president either "Mr. Trump" or "President Trump" on meeting him, out of respect for the position (even if they personally think he's an ass), or should they jump straight to "Donnie?"

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not OP and haven't read the thread.

Personally I think honorifics should be done away with entirely. I don't think doctors should insist on Dr. I don't think professors should be Prof. I think the use of honorifics perpetuates power imbalances that on the whole aren't good. Let everyone go by first name. And yes, I have honorifics I could use but I don't.

An adult insisting another adult use a title is just cringeworthy behavior to me.

I respect your opinion. Would you consider reading the NYT article linked in this thread to see if any of the issues outlined there might, in your opinion, warrant an exception?

I will find it and read it.

Mostly I find the insistence on honorifics to be the vestiges of a racist and misogynistic history in which those honorifics were used as a way of keeping people who deserved it on their merits out of power.

You want respect? Earn it based on your behavior, not by insisting another adult address you with a title.

I am a woman of color, PhD holder, and professor and you could not be more off base here.

Nope. I've been in the trenches myself and I completely disagree with you.

DP, I agree with the professor PP. The NYT article also noted that professors with doctoral degrees who are younger, minority, and/or female are more likely to be referred to by their first names. Anecdotally, I’ve found this to be true among my academic colleagues who’ve mentioned this issue.

The solution is to not use title at all, not to insist other adults use it.

I do make an exception in the military. But beyond that, no.

Why does the military get an exception?

Well it should be obvious, but if you are in the service you can't call General Smith, Phil, or Mr. Smith. Only other generals can do that. It's not done, period. If anyone did that did, it'd be a career-ender. Being in the military is not like being an undergrad, where you pay to attend and have the option to drop a class if you don't like the prof.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I think Jeff needs to figure out this poster's IP address so we can get a wellness check to her house ASAP.

which one?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not OP and haven't read the thread.

Personally I think honorifics should be done away with entirely. I don't think doctors should insist on Dr. I don't think professors should be Prof. I think the use of honorifics perpetuates power imbalances that on the whole aren't good. Let everyone go by first name. And yes, I have honorifics I could use but I don't.

An adult insisting another adult use a title is just cringeworthy behavior to me.

I respect your opinion. Would you consider reading the NYT article linked in this thread to see if any of the issues outlined there might, in your opinion, warrant an exception?

I will find it and read it.

Mostly I find the insistence on honorifics to be the vestiges of a racist and misogynistic history in which those honorifics were used as a way of keeping people who deserved it on their merits out of power.

You want respect? Earn it based on your behavior, not by insisting another adult address you with a title.

I am a woman of color, PhD holder, and professor and you could not be more off base here.

Nope. I've been in the trenches myself and I completely disagree with you.

DP, I agree with the professor PP. The NYT article also noted that professors with doctoral degrees who are younger, minority, and/or female are more likely to be referred to by their first names. Anecdotally, I’ve found this to be true among my academic colleagues who’ve mentioned this issue.

The solution is to not use title at all, not to insist other adults use it.

I do make an exception in the military. But beyond that, no.

Why does the military get an exception?

Well it should be obvious, but if you are in the service you can't call General Smith, Phil, or Mr. Smith. Only other generals can do that. It's not done, period. If anyone did that did, it'd be a career-ender. Being in the military is not like being an undergrad, where you pay to attend and have the option to drop a class if you don't like the prof.

So what about Trump?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not OP and haven't read the thread.

Personally I think honorifics should be done away with entirely. I don't think doctors should insist on Dr. I don't think professors should be Prof. I think the use of honorifics perpetuates power imbalances that on the whole aren't good. Let everyone go by first name. And yes, I have honorifics I could use but I don't.

An adult insisting another adult use a title is just cringeworthy behavior to me.

I respect your opinion. Would you consider reading the NYT article linked in this thread to see if any of the issues outlined there might, in your opinion, warrant an exception?

I will find it and read it.

Mostly I find the insistence on honorifics to be the vestiges of a racist and misogynistic history in which those honorifics were used as a way of keeping people who deserved it on their merits out of power.

You want respect? Earn it based on your behavior, not by insisting another adult address you with a title.

I am a woman of color, PhD holder, and professor and you could not be more off base here.

Nope. I've been in the trenches myself and I completely disagree with you.

DP, I agree with the professor PP. The NYT article also noted that professors with doctoral degrees who are younger, minority, and/or female are more likely to be referred to by their first names. Anecdotally, I’ve found this to be true among my academic colleagues who’ve mentioned this issue.

The solution is to not use title at all, not to insist other adults use it.

I do make an exception in the military. But beyond that, no.

Why does the military get an exception?

Well it should be obvious, but if you are in the service you can't call General Smith, Phil, or Mr. Smith. Only other generals can do that. It's not done, period. If anyone did that did, it'd be a career-ender. Being in the military is not like being an undergrad, where you pay to attend and have the option to drop a class if you don't like the prof.

Ohhhh -- so respect should only be shown to people who can coerce it from you.

Well, that's an interested take. Not really very modern, though.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not OP and haven't read the thread.

Personally I think honorifics should be done away with entirely. I don't think doctors should insist on Dr. I don't think professors should be Prof. I think the use of honorifics perpetuates power imbalances that on the whole aren't good. Let everyone go by first name. And yes, I have honorifics I could use but I don't.

An adult insisting another adult use a title is just cringeworthy behavior to me.

I respect your opinion. Would you consider reading the NYT article linked in this thread to see if any of the issues outlined there might, in your opinion, warrant an exception?

I will find it and read it.

Mostly I find the insistence on honorifics to be the vestiges of a racist and misogynistic history in which those honorifics were used as a way of keeping people who deserved it on their merits out of power.

You want respect? Earn it based on your behavior, not by insisting another adult address you with a title.

I am a woman of color, PhD holder, and professor and you could not be more off base here.

Nope. I've been in the trenches myself and I completely disagree with you.

DP, I agree with the professor PP. The NYT article also noted that professors with doctoral degrees who are younger, minority, and/or female are more likely to be referred to by their first names. Anecdotally, I’ve found this to be true among my academic colleagues who’ve mentioned this issue.

The solution is to not use title at all, not to insist other adults use it.

I do make an exception in the military. But beyond that, no.

Why does the military get an exception?

In the military everyone is known by his or her rank. It's just the culture.

[Anonymous]

^^interesting

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not OP and haven't read the thread.

Personally I think honorifics should be done away with entirely. I don't think doctors should insist on Dr. I don't think professors should be Prof. I think the use of honorifics perpetuates power imbalances that on the whole aren't good. Let everyone go by first name. And yes, I have honorifics I could use but I don't.

An adult insisting another adult use a title is just cringeworthy behavior to me.

I respect your opinion. Would you consider reading the NYT article linked in this thread to see if any of the issues outlined there might, in your opinion, warrant an exception?

I will find it and read it.

Mostly I find the insistence on honorifics to be the vestiges of a racist and misogynistic history in which those honorifics were used as a way of keeping people who deserved it on their merits out of power.

You want respect? Earn it based on your behavior, not by insisting another adult address you with a title.

I am a woman of color, PhD holder, and professor and you could not be more off base here.

Nope. I've been in the trenches myself and I completely disagree with you.

DP, I agree with the professor PP. The NYT article also noted that professors with doctoral degrees who are younger, minority, and/or female are more likely to be referred to by their first names. Anecdotally, I’ve found this to be true among my academic colleagues who’ve mentioned this issue.

The solution is to not use title at all, not to insist other adults use it.

I do make an exception in the military. But beyond that, no.

Why does the military get an exception?

In the military everyone is known by his or her rank. It's just the culture.

You have very flexible definitions and logic, don't you?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I'm the professor who wrote at the top of this page. Even staff who do not work directly with someone initially refer to faculty by "professor." It is simply the formal title used in this professional setting. It is the default unless someone insists on a first name. My belief is that professors should not ask students to refer to them by their first name. If they do insist students use their first name, I would worry they have boundary isssues.

I am flabbergasted to read all these parents who are shocked or resentful that there are formal boundaries in academia. It's not about subservience. It's about professionalism.

+1

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm the professor who wrote at the top of this page. Even staff who do not work directly with someone initially refer to faculty by "professor." It is simply the formal title used in this professional setting. It is the default unless someone insists on a first name. My belief is that professors should not ask students to refer to them by their first name. If they do insist students use their first name, I would worry they have boundary isssues.

I am flabbergasted to read all these parents who are shocked or resentful that there are formal boundaries in academia. It's not about subservience. It's about professionalism.

I am someone who has a title that could be used and doesn't, not a shocked parent. I will not insist another adult address me in a subservient manner.

May I ask what your title is?

Doctor of Naturopathy

Ahhhhhhh.

Well, there you go.

Yeah. I’m still laughing at this one.

I am the one who doesn't insist on title. I didn't write the bit about naturopathy. One of you insecure lunatics who feel their life worth is based on an honorific wrote that, and I think it's telling that you feel the need to insult a profession to make your point. I am jointly degreed in engineering and work in industry and academia.

"Jointly degreed" means what, exactly? Interested here.

Oh for Pete's sake. It means that I could be Dr. or Prof.

[Anonymous]

So you're saying you have a PhD in engineering? and have a professorship position? Still not quite sure what you are claiming.

Thanks.