How are kids supposed to address professors? Dr., Professor, first name? Daughter got rude reaction

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Professor here.

My experience has been humorous. I introduce myself at the first class and tell the students it's fine to call me by my first name. Then, over the course of the semester, I find that the students who call me professor are the ones I'd be happy to call me by my first name, and the students who call me by my first name are the ones I really wish would call me professor.

Why do you think that is? My kid would be the one continuing to call you Professor, because you are in a position of authority and deserve that sign of respect. You aren’t his peer or his equal. I’ve had people tell me that it is disrespectful for my son to call them Mr. or Mrs. when they want to be called by their first name. I find that the more insecure they are, the more adults insist on first names.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
I have a PhD and I’m not calling every random person I meet “Mr” or “Mrs” something. That’s ridiculous. I’m not 5 years old and we don’t live in Germany. In that case they should be calling me “Dr” which I would never expect them to do outside an academic setting.

It's odd to me that you believe your PhD is relevant to the issue of using Mr. and Ms. You should call adults you don't know Mr. and Ms. They don't have to call you Dr. outside of an academic setting or professional setting directly tied to your education. This is simple manners.

I live in California and I literally do not know anyone who calls adults they don't know Mr. and Ms. That is bizarre behavior.

+1

Maybe it's the confidence thing that other PPs were referring to. People are a lot more relaxed and confident on the West Coast.

[Anonymous]

It takes some of my students years after graduating for them to get comfortable calling me by my first name. It is humorous.

But again, shows they have a natural sense of what is appropriate. Unfortunately, the OP here did not bring up her daughter that way.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Your daughter is now in the world of academia. This is how academia works: You err on the side of respect until you are invited into a more informal relationship.

Don't like it? You don't have to stay in academia.

I have a master's degree and have worked as an administrative staff member at four universities and a law school. This is how academia is. Now you know, too.

What exactly is disrespectful about using someone's first name?

I think one of the PPs already addressed this...but in case you didn't scroll up to read it...the disrespect is in your daughter assuming a level of familiarity or even-footing as though she is a chummy peer of her instructor. She is not. They earned the title of Dr. (or Professor if the teacher is a full professor) through many years of study and the PhD degree. Using the appropriate moniker is a way of expressing understanding of this earned title and level of expertise in his or her field of study. It is also a way for her to express her understanding of the hierarchy AND professionalism of the student/professor relationship. Just as your daughter should have addressed her pediatrician as Dr. House unless/until she was invited to call her Judy...she should not address a college teacher by their first name unless INVITED to do so.

You use the first name to address a peer or a friend (or even a friend of a friend if that is how you are introduced)--but you should teach your daughter to use appropriate titles for those who are in positions of authority as a sign of respect. It will serve her well in life.

[Anonymous]

Why does it matter if the person's PhD is in humanities (deemed worthless here apparently) or neuroscience?

You are not saying "Dr. Smith" because that person is superior to you (i.e. studied something that YOU thinks sounds hard). It is all about context, and who has authority in a given circumstance (the one who knows more is the teacher, the one who gets to give grades has more authority).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Imagine what a miserable and insufferable son of a b**** you have to be for “Hi [your first name]” to bother you! Up the SSRI dose, jeez.

I totally agree. They could have responded in a kinder/more informative way. They could have gently said something like "hey I don't really mind if you call me by my first name when you know me, but until then, would you please call me "XYZ". I work at a university and am a lawyer. I don't care who calls me by my first name. Some people with PhDs do seem very sensitive. To me, a "dr." is someone who went to med school, not some idiot PhD in a worthless humanities department.

The funny thing about your perception is that it isn't reality. A Dr. is literally someone who has earned a doctoral degree. One who has earned a PhD and is employed as a teacher of university courses has earned the title of "Dr. Smith"...but he may not yet have earned a promotion to PROFESSOR. (Most start as Assistant Professors...then move to Associate Professor once they achieve tenure...and then they are promoted to FULL professor. And many do not feel comfortable being addressed as "Professor Smith" until that point, whereas being addressed as "Dr. Smith" is accurate for all three levels.)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Imagine what a miserable and insufferable son of a b**** you have to be for “Hi [your first name]” to bother you! Up the SSRI dose, jeez.

I totally agree. They could have responded in a kinder/more informative way. They could have gently said something like "hey I don't really mind if you call me by my first name when you know me, but until then, would you please call me "XYZ". I work at a university and am a lawyer. I don't care who calls me by my first name. Some people with PhDs do seem very sensitive. To me, a "dr." is someone who went to med school, not some idiot PhD in a worthless humanities department.

The funny thing about your perception is that it isn't reality. A Dr. is literally someone who has earned a doctoral degree. One who has earned a PhD and is employed as a teacher of university courses has earned the title of "Dr. Smith"...but he may not yet have earned a promotion to PROFESSOR. (Most start as Assistant Professors...then move to Associate Professor once they achieve tenure...and then they are promoted to FULL professor. And many do not feel comfortable being addressed as "Professor Smith" until that point, whereas being addressed as "Dr. Smith" is accurate for all three levels.)

I have the same idea/experience as you, although I did my PhD outside the US. I think in most parts of the world it's very strange to call everyone who teaches a "professor". It's quite a prestigious (and very well earned) thing and it comes waaayyyy after getting your PhD.

It seems that anybody who is in front of a class is supposed to be called "professor" in the US. Funny, isn't it

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Imagine what a miserable and insufferable son of a b**** you have to be for “Hi [your first name]” to bother you! Up the SSRI dose, jeez.

I totally agree. They could have responded in a kinder/more informative way. They could have gently said something like "hey I don't really mind if you call me by my first name when you know me, but until then, would you please call me "XYZ". I work at a university and am a lawyer. I don't care who calls me by my first name. Some people with PhDs do seem very sensitive. To me, a "dr." is someone who went to med school, not some idiot PhD in a worthless humanities department.

The funny thing about your perception is that it isn't reality. A Dr. is literally someone who has earned a doctoral degree. One who has earned a PhD and is employed as a teacher of university courses has earned the title of "Dr. Smith"...but he may not yet have earned a promotion to PROFESSOR. (Most start as Assistant Professors...then move to Associate Professor once they achieve tenure...and then they are promoted to FULL professor. And many do not feel comfortable being addressed as "Professor Smith" until that point, whereas being addressed as "Dr. Smith" is accurate for all three levels.)

I have the same idea/experience as you, although I did my PhD outside the US. I think in most parts of the world it's very strange to call everyone who teaches a "professor". It's quite a prestigious (and very well earned) thing and it comes waaayyyy after getting your PhD.

It seems that anybody who is in front of a class is supposed to be called "professor" in the US. Funny, isn't it

P.S. I forgot to add the most interesting part - that they apparently still call the person "professor" even when they don't even have a PhD! I asked the question a few pages back and it seems like 'real professors' are also just called "professor".

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
I have a PhD and I’m not calling every random person I meet “Mr” or “Mrs” something. That’s ridiculous. I’m not 5 years old and we don’t live in Germany. In that case they should be calling me “Dr” which I would never expect them to do outside an academic setting.

It's odd to me that you believe your PhD is relevant to the issue of using Mr. and Ms. You should call adults you don't know Mr. and Ms. They don't have to call you Dr. outside of an academic setting or professional setting directly tied to your education. This is simple manners.

I live in California and I literally do not know anyone who calls adults they don't know Mr. and Ms. That is bizarre behavior.

+1

Maybe it's the confidence thing that other PPs were referring to. People are a lot more relaxed and confident on the West Coast.

Even in DC I never call folks Mr./ Ms.

Only insecure people demand such treatment, and I guess I'm fortunate not to work with them

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Why does it matter if the person's PhD is in humanities (deemed worthless here apparently) or neuroscience?

You are not saying "Dr. Smith" because that person is superior to you (i.e. studied something that YOU thinks sounds hard). It is all about context, and who has authority in a given circumstance (the one who knows more is the teacher, the one who gets to give grades has more authority).

Because someone who just did some PhD in Kenyan Transgender Ethnic Studies from U-Hahaha is kinda not comparable to someone with an MD and a PhD in Cognitive Neuroscience from Hopkins?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why does it matter if the person's PhD is in humanities (deemed worthless here apparently) or neuroscience?

You are not saying "Dr. Smith" because that person is superior to you (i.e. studied something that YOU thinks sounds hard). It is all about context, and who has authority in a given circumstance (the one who knows more is the teacher, the one who gets to give grades has more authority).

Because someone who just did some PhD in Kenyan Transgender Ethnic Studies from U-Hahaha is kinda not comparable to someone with an MD and a PhD in Cognitive Neuroscience from Hopkins?

I hear what you're saying, but if they're giving out your grade it would be wise to call them what they prefer to be called.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why does it matter if the person's PhD is in humanities (deemed worthless here apparently) or neuroscience?

You are not saying "Dr. Smith" because that person is superior to you (i.e. studied something that YOU thinks sounds hard). It is all about context, and who has authority in a given circumstance (the one who knows more is the teacher, the one who gets to give grades has more authority).

Because someone who just did some PhD in Kenyan Transgender Ethnic Studies from U-Hahaha is kinda not comparable to someone with an MD and a PhD in Cognitive Neuroscience from Hopkins?

My, somebody's insecure. It doesn't lessen your degree to afford others respect.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Imagine what a miserable and insufferable son of a b**** you have to be for “Hi [your first name]” to bother you! Up the SSRI dose, jeez.

I totally agree. They could have responded in a kinder/more informative way. They could have gently said something like "hey I don't really mind if you call me by my first name when you know me, but until then, would you please call me "XYZ". I work at a university and am a lawyer. I don't care who calls me by my first name. Some people with PhDs do seem very sensitive. To me, a "dr." is someone who went to med school, not some idiot PhD in a worthless humanities department.

The funny thing about your perception is that it isn't reality. A Dr. is literally someone who has earned a doctoral degree. One who has earned a PhD and is employed as a teacher of university courses has earned the title of "Dr. Smith"...but he may not yet have earned a promotion to PROFESSOR. (Most start as Assistant Professors...then move to Associate Professor once they achieve tenure...and then they are promoted to FULL professor. And many do not feel comfortable being addressed as "Professor Smith" until that point, whereas being addressed as "Dr. Smith" is accurate for all three levels.)

Actually no. You are professor at the assistant professor level. You are doctor at the lecturer level but no undergrad can be expected to understand academic rankings like these.

[Anonymous]

So, you will respect them if they impress you. Should they give your student their CV in advance, to ensure that the major was something YOU think is hard (like you would know) AND at a school with sufficient ranking. That is so stupid and illogical.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Imagine what a miserable and insufferable son of a b**** you have to be for “Hi [your first name]” to bother you! Up the SSRI dose, jeez.

I totally agree. They could have responded in a kinder/more informative way. They could have gently said something like "hey I don't really mind if you call me by my first name when you know me, but until then, would you please call me "XYZ". I work at a university and am a lawyer. I don't care who calls me by my first name. Some people with PhDs do seem very sensitive. To me, a "dr." is someone who went to med school, not some idiot PhD in a worthless humanities department.

The funny thing about your perception is that it isn't reality. A Dr. is literally someone who has earned a doctoral degree. One who has earned a PhD and is employed as a teacher of university courses has earned the title of "Dr. Smith"...but he may not yet have earned a promotion to PROFESSOR. (Most start as Assistant Professors...then move to Associate Professor once they achieve tenure...and then they are promoted to FULL professor. And many do not feel comfortable being addressed as "Professor Smith" until that point, whereas being addressed as "Dr. Smith" is accurate for all three levels.)

Actually no. You are professor at the assistant professor level. You are doctor at the lecturer level but no undergrad can be expected to understand academic rankings like these.

What? Of course undergrads understand whether someone is a "Lecturer" or "Ass. Prof" or "Prof".. i.e. whether they should be referred to as "Dr X" or "Prof X". What type of university are you talking about, anyway? Are you referring to community college?