Do conservatives want to ban transgenderism for the same reasons they want to ban abortion?

[Anonymous]

To show you how far things have been pushed some transwomen are attempting to breastfeed their baby despite no studies showing the safety of doing so. Chemical induced secretions produced by a male are in no way comparable to actual breastmilk a mother produces after giving birth. Once again science and safeguarding are ignored and people who point out their concerns on this issue are silenced.

[Anonymous]

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Perspective

No, it's a ridiculous irrelevance. Viagra is for adults, or did you not know that?

Different gender-affirming medical care is appropriate at different stages of life. It is never appropriate for politicians—whether or not they understand that they are huffing QAnon glue—to decide what medical care is appropriate at what stage.

So, you advocate that surgical castration and sterilization is appropriate for minor children. Do I have that correct?

You know not all gender affirming care is surgical, right? That’s a small piece of the puzzle, and you folks are acting like trans 6 year olds are all getting sex reassignment surgery. If you could just deal in reality, this would be an easier conversation for everyone.

So that ANY minors are being subjected to this is fine with you, as long as it’s not widespread? Is that what you’re saying? Just trying to understand your weak, twisted morals.

I’m not a doctor, but I believe some treatment would be appropriate for some minors. It would have to be a later step after a social transition and lots of mental health care, which is what is called for by experts, iirc. It does seem wrong to me to offer things like breast augmentation and breast reduction to some minors, but not to trans minors. Intersex children have been getting gender changing care for a very long time. An adult chooses which sex seems appropriate, and treatment is started very early. A percentage of these kids later detransition because they don’t identify with the gender their parents and doctors chose for them.

Circumcision is widely accepted, even though I believe the whole things seems rather barbaric. I’ve only ever had girls, so I stay in my own lane. Similarly, I don’t have kids in sports, and I don’t care about sports. I don’t have an opinion on trans athletes because I don’t care. People affected, and people who know more than me will sort that out.

NP.

I won’t ever be impacted by prison policies. I do not know anyone affected by prison policies. But I came to my current position that gender ideology is at heart an ideology rooted in misogyny because I was doing work on expungement, asylum, and immigrant rights as a volunteer. I have spent years working to help people who are impacted by policies that will never impact me. I get that you don’t care about people other than your immediate family, but we aren’t all like that.

In the course of that work, I started to hear stories years ago. Women being assaulted, women being hurt, but the prison system and the immigrant detention system standing firmly with the rapists. I mean, that’s not unusual for the prison/immigration system—I can tell you horror stories about abuse of inmates/refugees that have nothing to do with trans ideology—but what was different here was the extent to which the prison system protected the trans women in women’s prison. Women weren’t just prevented from telling their stories, they experienced the additional and new horror of being told that sharing their stories of assault and rape was transphobic. They are victimized even further than they have been in the past. And the media, typically happy to report on stories of prison abuse, won’t touch their stories. They are alone in the system, with the safety of their rapists and assaulters protected above their own.

I’ve traditionally been liberal. I mean, I have spent years working on very liberal causes as a volunteer. But I can’t call myself a liberal any more because of the sharp dive into misogyny that liberals have taken. I am of course not conservative. But as a woman who has spent years trying to make the world a better place for vulnerable people, especially women, it’s clear to me I don’t have a home with liberals any more. Hatred of women is now the political rule of the day for both major political parties. I am politically homeless.

But I get it, you don’t care because it doesn’t affect you.

It’s f-n sports. It’s literally a game.

People who have kids in sports know how to handle it better than I do.

To be clear, you don’t care about the safety of women in prisons either because it doesn’t affect you personally. That’s your position.

Others consider that immoral.

I specifically said I don’t care about sports, and have no opinion on how trans athletes should be handled. But, sure, get back to pretending sports are holding our society together.

If it hasn't dawned on you yet that we're talking about far more than sports, there really isn't a whole lot of hope for you.

It’s not my problem someone bonded the part about trans athletes and my apathy and went off the deep end. Ya’ll are nuts.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If the GOP was the Nazis some of you claim they are, then wouldn't it be more likely that they would be for the use of hormones, puberty blockers and surgery to sterilize these "undesirables" to prevent them for further contaminating the gene pool? That's what real Nazis did to people they thought were not up to par.

No. They are all about rigid gender roles.

[Anonymous]

I used to follow Buck Angel on Twitter. He is a trans man who has been very open about his opposition to some of the new age views on trans gender politics. He is against medical transition for trans youth. Trans adults have always had access to gender affirming care, including surgery. This is nothing new in the U.S. Most of the new trans issues are not about rights or access to healthcare, it's about validation. The new breed (of trans women) are only interested in validation - they NEED women and straight men to see them as women and this is part of the push to be in women's spaces. It's the reason why you don't here much about trans men. in any of these discussion.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I used to follow Buck Angel on Twitter. He is a trans man who has been very open about his opposition to some of the new age views on trans gender politics. He is against medical transition for trans youth. Trans adults have always had access to gender affirming care, including surgery. This is nothing new in the U.S. Most of the new trans issues are not about rights or access to healthcare, it's about validation. The new breed (of trans women) are only interested in validation - they NEED women and straight men to see them as women and this is part of the push to be in women's spaces. It's the reason why you don't here much about trans men. in any of these discussion.

Right. Because women are always quieter, less aggressive and often silenced in the discussion.

[Anonymous]

This anti-trans freak out dovetails nicely with concerns about the supposed feminization of American men generally.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:

Perspective

No, it's a ridiculous irrelevance. Viagra is for adults, or did you not know that?

Different gender-affirming medical care is appropriate at different stages of life. It is never appropriate for politicians—whether or not they understand that they are huffing QAnon glue—to decide what medical care is appropriate at what stage.

So, you advocate that surgical castration and sterilization is appropriate for minor children. Do I have that correct?

You know not all gender affirming care is surgical, right? That’s a small piece of the puzzle, and you folks are acting like trans 6 year olds are all getting sex reassignment surgery. If you could just deal in reality, this would be an easier conversation for everyone.

So that ANY minors are being subjected to this is fine with you, as long as it’s not widespread? Is that what you’re saying? Just trying to understand your weak, twisted morals.

I’m not a doctor, but I believe some treatment would be appropriate for some minors. It would have to be a later step after a social transition and lots of mental health care, which is what is called for by experts, iirc. It does seem wrong to me to offer things like breast augmentation and breast reduction to some minors, but not to trans minors. Intersex children have been getting gender changing care for a very long time. An adult chooses which sex seems appropriate, and treatment is started very early. A percentage of these kids later detransition because they don’t identify with the gender their parents and doctors chose for them.

Circumcision is widely accepted, even though I believe the whole things seems rather barbaric. I’ve only ever had girls, so I stay in my own lane. Similarly, I don’t have kids in sports, and I don’t care about sports. I don’t have an opinion on trans athletes because I don’t care. People affected, and people who know more than me will sort that out.

NP.

I won’t ever be impacted by prison policies. I do not know anyone affected by prison policies. But I came to my current position that gender ideology is at heart an ideology rooted in misogyny because I was doing work on expungement, asylum, and immigrant rights as a volunteer. I have spent years working to help people who are impacted by policies that will never impact me. I get that you don’t care about people other than your immediate family, but we aren’t all like that.

In the course of that work, I started to hear stories years ago. Women being assaulted, women being hurt, but the prison system and the immigrant detention system standing firmly with the rapists. I mean, that’s not unusual for the prison/immigration system—I can tell you horror stories about abuse of inmates/refugees that have nothing to do with trans ideology—but what was different here was the extent to which the prison system protected the trans women in women’s prison. Women weren’t just prevented from telling their stories, they experienced the additional and new horror of being told that sharing their stories of assault and rape was transphobic. They are victimized even further than they have been in the past. And the media, typically happy to report on stories of prison abuse, won’t touch their stories. They are alone in the system, with the safety of their rapists and assaulters protected above their own.

I’ve traditionally been liberal. I mean, I have spent years working on very liberal causes as a volunteer. But I can’t call myself a liberal any more because of the sharp dive into misogyny that liberals have taken. I am of course not conservative. But as a woman who has spent years trying to make the world a better place for vulnerable people, especially women, it’s clear to me I don’t have a home with liberals any more. Hatred of women is now the political rule of the day for both major political parties. I am politically homeless.

But I get it, you don’t care because it doesn’t affect you.

What about trans men being assaulted in prisons by cis men?

What about cis men being assaulted by prisons by cis men?

Rape is rape and should not be condoned and should be prosecuted. That is the problem. This has nothing to do with my friend's high-schooler who has decided they are non-binary. Nor all the transgender kids who are not in prison and will never be in prison.

Anyone who has been assaulted and raped in prison should be listened to and their assaulter brought to justice, whether this involves two prisoners or a prisoner and a prison official.

It's frightening that you seem to be advocating snuffing out a population because some of that population has committed horrible crimes. Is that really what you want to say? You do realize that every type of group has members of that group who have committed crimes, don't you?

This kind of callous response is how transactivists have made so many enemies. You’re a very mean-spirited, heartless bunch. I’m rooting for you all to be taken down.

It's heartless to be concerned about rape in prison? WTF

And thanks for the threat. Typical of conservatives. That's your preferred way of dealing with people you dislike and whose views are different from your own, to "take them down." We understand your euphemism. Surprised you haven't started talking about a final solution to what you perceive to be the transgender problem or the special treatments you'd like to see imposed. Are you plotting a "major operation" to follow through with your threat?

DP. I'm just going to ignore the threat because WTF? That's just ridiculous and over the top and they'll come back saying that they didn't mean a violent take down, they meant a kind and gentle take down that somehow protects children, and we all know it's not true.

However, one of the things that really bugs me about all of this is pretending to care about prison sexual assault. They literally used to count on men being assaulted in prison as part of the punishment of being in prison. They even made sexual jokes about trans women being in men's prisons and enjoying the experience. It's disgusting. But now that some trans women are being housed with women, all of a sudden trans women are all rapists trying to get into women's prisons so they can rape to their heart's content. (Of course they're saying this in the same breath that they tell us not to medically transition children because they will grow up not being sexually functional, so yeah, that makes sense.) And all of this is happening while they ignore the abuses of women in prison by guards and medical staff, and completely ignore what's happening in the men's prisons re: sexual assault. It's not even about documented cases of sexual violence by trans women, it's the potential of it possibly happening by someone pretending to be a trans woman, while they ignore the actual crimes that are happening in large numbers right now. They're so disgusting.

Well, I have done work on behalf of prisoners and immigrants, and I’m horrified at this new and twisted addition to what vulnerable women are suffering.

I get that you do not care at all, which is why you write nonsense like the above. You are disgusting and exploitative.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I used to follow Buck Angel on Twitter. He is a trans man who has been very open about his opposition to some of the new age views on trans gender politics. He is against medical transition for trans youth. Trans adults have always had access to gender affirming care, including surgery. This is nothing new in the U.S. Most of the new trans issues are not about rights or access to healthcare, it's about validation. The new breed (of trans women) are only interested in validation - they NEED women and straight men to see them as women and this is part of the push to be in women's spaces. It's the reason why you don't here much about trans men. in any of these discussion.

Blaire White is a beautiful, well spoken trans woman with a pretty big following on Twitter and YouTube. She is friends with Buck Angel and they agree on many things including opposing childhood transition, no males in women's sports and other crazy things being pushed. She refers to herself as the black sheep among the transgender community because of the pushback she gets regarding her common sense stance on things. She also exposes some of the perverts who have infiltrated this community. So there are definitely normal transgender people out there who just want to live their lives in peace but unfortunately the crazy narcissistic ones including activists are the most outspoken giving the rest of the community a bad name.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I used to follow Buck Angel on Twitter. He is a trans man who has been very open about his opposition to some of the new age views on trans gender politics. He is against medical transition for trans youth. Trans adults have always had access to gender affirming care, including surgery. This is nothing new in the U.S. Most of the new trans issues are not about rights or access to healthcare, it's about validation. The new breed (of trans women) are only interested in validation - they NEED women and straight men to see them as women and this is part of the push to be in women's spaces. It's the reason why you don't here much about trans men. in any of these discussion.

Historically, no one has given much of a crap about trans men, or lesbian women for that matter. Many cultures, including very sexist ones, have examples of women who assumed men’s clothes and roles for their families in the absence of actual men and were accepted as men in that context. We have plenty in our own history too. It has even been observed with animals.

Maybe it wasn’t the ideal but it wasn’t viewed as transgressive - it still fit within the gender hierarchy. Some trans men report how much better they were treated after transitioning. One trans man reported that someone approached him after a lecture to tell him how much better he was than his “sister”.

Trans women are seen as a lot more transgressive and tend to be subject to the worst abuse.! I’m not surprised they want to be validated. They still underestimate the amount of people that want them dead, though. You’d think men would be over the idea that they could be secret homos for liking a trans girl but male insecurity and violence never dies.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This anti-trans freak out dovetails nicely with concerns about the supposed feminization of American men generally.

Actually what is really happening is that the rise of the trans rights movement dovetails with a global rise in misogyny and a backlash against women’s safety and progress. Conservatives and trans rights activists are united in their hatred and oppression of women.

[Anonymous]

I have a trans brother who I love, and for whom it absolutely made sense for him to transition at the age of 19. There has never been a more obvious case in the world.

HOWEVER, what it happening today is scary. It's not unreasonable to question the parameters of gender treatment in children. Its a fact that many kids going in for treatment are tween girls on the autism spectrum. I know one, there has never been a single inkling of ANY gender dysphoria, but puberty freaked her out, and now she's on blockers.
The doctors IN CHARGE of transgender care, who are trans themselves, have begun to raise flags on the explosion of treatment. I urge you to read it. https://www.thefp.com/p/top-trans-doctors-blow-the-whistle

Why is this happening? Where did we cross a line into rubber stamping a decision with serious consequences?

In my children's DCPS kindergarten hallway, there is a literal poster with Malcolm Shanks on it in a hair wrap and five o'clock shadow that says, "Everybody has the right to choose their own gender by listening to their own heart and mind. Everyone gets to choose if they are a boy or a girl or neither or something else, and no one gets to choose for them."

I support the trans adults in my life. I acknowledge that being trans is real -- and rare. Introducing a five-year-old to a concept that likens gender to choosing an ice cream scoop is absolute madness.

I think if you've transitioned and there is some question on how you want to be identified, or specifically want people to know your pronouns, put them in a bio. Otherwise, can't we just be safe to assume? This is why people are freaked out. There is zero middle ground.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I have a trans brother who I love, and for whom it absolutely made sense for him to transition at the age of 19. There has never been a more obvious case in the world.

HOWEVER, what it happening today is scary. It's not unreasonable to question the parameters of gender treatment in children. Its a fact that many kids going in for treatment are tween girls on the autism spectrum. I know one, there has never been a single inkling of ANY gender dysphoria, but puberty freaked her out, and now she's on blockers.
The doctors IN CHARGE of transgender care, who are trans themselves, have begun to raise flags on the explosion of treatment. I urge you to read it. https://www.thefp.com/p/top-trans-doctors-blow-the-whistle

Why is this happening? Where did we cross a line into rubber stamping a decision with serious consequences?

In my children's DCPS kindergarten hallway, there is a literal poster with Malcolm Shanks on it in a hair wrap and five o'clock shadow that says, "Everybody has the right to choose their own gender by listening to their own heart and mind. Everyone gets to choose if they are a boy or a girl or neither or something else, and no one gets to choose for them."

I support the trans adults in my life. I acknowledge that being trans is real -- and rare. Introducing a five-year-old to a concept that likens gender to choosing an ice cream scoop is absolute madness.

I think if you've transitioned and there is some question on how you want to be identified, or specifically want people to know your pronouns, put them in a bio. Otherwise, can't we just be safe to assume? This is why people are freaked out. There is zero middle ground.

I don’t think it’s unreasonable to question, but it is unreasonable to ban. Especially when so much of the “questioning” is not being done in good faith, the data is far from clear, and it is all being done in the media to serve a political purpose now that the GOP dog has caught the abortion car and is getting run over by it.

I, for one, and am sick of debating matters of people’s health and livelihood at gunpoint.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have a trans brother who I love, and for whom it absolutely made sense for him to transition at the age of 19. There has never been a more obvious case in the world.

HOWEVER, what it happening today is scary. It's not unreasonable to question the parameters of gender treatment in children. Its a fact that many kids going in for treatment are tween girls on the autism spectrum. I know one, there has never been a single inkling of ANY gender dysphoria, but puberty freaked her out, and now she's on blockers.
The doctors IN CHARGE of transgender care, who are trans themselves, have begun to raise flags on the explosion of treatment. I urge you to read it. https://www.thefp.com/p/top-trans-doctors-blow-the-whistle

Why is this happening? Where did we cross a line into rubber stamping a decision with serious consequences?

In my children's DCPS kindergarten hallway, there is a literal poster with Malcolm Shanks on it in a hair wrap and five o'clock shadow that says, "Everybody has the right to choose their own gender by listening to their own heart and mind. Everyone gets to choose if they are a boy or a girl or neither or something else, and no one gets to choose for them."

I support the trans adults in my life. I acknowledge that being trans is real -- and rare. Introducing a five-year-old to a concept that likens gender to choosing an ice cream scoop is absolute madness.

I think if you've transitioned and there is some question on how you want to be identified, or specifically want people to know your pronouns, put them in a bio. Otherwise, can't we just be safe to assume? This is why people are freaked out. There is zero middle ground.

I don’t think it’s unreasonable to question, but it is unreasonable to ban. Especially when so much of the “questioning” is not being done in good faith, the data is far from clear, and it is all being done in the media to serve a political purpose now that the GOP dog has caught the abortion car and is getting run over by it.

I, for one, and am sick of debating matters of people’s health and livelihood at gunpoint.

When the “data is far from clear,” procedures that render children sterile or cause lifelong medicalization should be considered to be last-resort treatments. But yet not here.

Medicine hasn’t policed itself and in fact has a terrible history of policing itself (opioid crisis, etc) which is why politics has come into the void. If medicine properly self-policed, none of this would be an issue.

[Anonymous]

Good faith arguments would include nuance, PP.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Good faith arguments would include nuance, PP.

Politics is rarely nuanced. You must know that.