If 1st yr grades were subpar, unreasonable to demand DC live on campus 2nd yr?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Dorm living may very well have made her sick! Dorms are disgusting. I don't think living off campus at a school where most do is the problem. She is not doing well academically. She may need a tutor and some serious thought as to course selection. Give it one semester. If academic results are lacking, she may need to re-think college choice. Also, easier to wiggle out of off-campus lease.

This is bs. If you're not enrolled 2nd semester there is no dorm charge. A lease is 12 months, period, unless you sub -- which is a headache and easy to get scammed, and you'll never get 100% of monthly.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Define “subpar” grades: what is her gpa right now?

around a 2.0 GPA

Okay.
So put the housing situation aside for a moment. What does your kid have to say about her grades? How much does she “own?” Is she blaming “unfair professors” or is she admitting that she didn’t ask for help when she needed it or focused on partying and not studying? What’s her plan for a different outcome?

Don't take this the wrong way, why would answers to those questions appeal to us as parents? I promise I'll study harder and longer, mum and pa? Meaningless words, while we write very hefty cheques. A 19 yearold is going to say whatever they think we want to hear. But bottom line, tell me how living a mile from classes and libraries is in any way beneficial to a struggling student. No campus security, no RA, no proximity to academics. Seems antithesis of wise idea. And I'm not quite so sure we should be rewarding the poor performance with such fun and freedom?

Well, clearly living in the dorm didn't work out for her, so I'm not exactly sure what you're trying to do here...

"my kid got sh*t grades when she lived in the dorms! since she performed so poorly while living in the dorms and we want her to do better, we're going to make her live in the dorms again."

Gee, how logical.

Rewarding her with a more expensive apartment, which gives far more freedom, detachment from campus, and less university oversight is logical? I don't follow.

[Anonymous]

There is no university oversight of students in a dorm, so long as they don’t obviously break any laws or break the furniture, etc.

This isn’t a boarding school. RAs do little with respect to students’ academics.

[Anonymous]

When I was in college, I found studying easier when I lived off campus. When I lived on campus and needed to study, I’d head to the library but wouldn’t make sure I had all my books with me, and then when I realized I needed something I didn’t have, I’d head back to my dorm to get it, then waste some time chatting, then join my roommate on her way to the campus center for coffee, and then finally back to the library a couple of hours later to start studying again. When I lived off campus and was planning to study at the library after class, I made sure I had everything with me before I left the apartment because I didn’t want to make the trip back. Not having built-in excuses to leave the library meant I spent more time there and got more done.

[Anonymous]

Establish gpa cutoff for next semester. If she does not make the grades, pull the plug on tuition payments. Make her get a student loan in her name for next year to have some skin in the game. Arguing about dorm is pointless.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Define “subpar” grades: what is her gpa right now?

around a 2.0 GPA

Okay.
So put the housing situation aside for a moment. What does your kid have to say about her grades? How much does she “own?” Is she blaming “unfair professors” or is she admitting that she didn’t ask for help when she needed it or focused on partying and not studying? What’s her plan for a different outcome?

Don't take this the wrong way, why would answers to those questions appeal to us as parents? I promise I'll study harder and longer, mum and pa? Meaningless words, while we write very hefty cheques. A 19 yearold is going to say whatever they think we want to hear. But bottom line, tell me how living a mile from classes and libraries is in any way beneficial to a struggling student. No campus security, no RA, no proximity to academics. Seems antithesis of wise idea. And I'm not quite so sure we should be rewarding the poor performance with such fun and freedom?

The conversation treats her as an adult. I would want to hear what my kid says and not assume she’s saying something just to get her off her back. Listen to her with some respect. AND in a calm voice, share with her the conditions upon which you’re going to move forward: set a GPA of 3.0 as a minimum for first semester. Anything less than that, and payments for second semester stop.

New poster here. The posts above about asking what DD has to say about her grades, whether she is owning these grades as being on her, and treating her like an adult who SHOULD own this problem--those are spot on.

It's telling that OP, if it was OP posting, responded with, "Why would answers to those questions appeal to us as parents?" and an assumption that the DD wil simply make up stuff to say.

That sounds like there's a real lack of belief on the parents' part that DD is going to be honest or take any responsibility for her own grades or admit if she's been slacking. Maybe OP has previous experience with this lack of maturity in the DD and treason to expect DD to lie or shirk responsibility. OP definitely seems to view an apartment as a "fun and freedom" privilege and not a necessity (I agree it's something of a privilege, but--at many colleges it's totally a necessity due to lack of dorm space for anyone beyond freshmen).

OP, if she's this immature and you're this skeptical, and neither side can have a real discussion, you need to do as others have noted and tell her what minimum GPA is acceptable; how long she gets to reach that GPA; what happens if she slips below it.

I myself would not do anything other than set the minimum GPA and the consequence for a slip. And tell her that the privilege isn't the apartment but the tuition and if she demonstrates lack of interest in doing her job (school) she will lose that job and have to move home and work full-time while going to community college. Period. And she needs to believe you will follow through and reel her in.

It's probably too late now to get her into campus housing this fall anyway, isn't it?

It's sad that you feel there's no point in having an adult conversation with a college age child. One thing to note--be 100 percent certain that the academic problem is only that, academic, and that there is not something else going on like mental health issues or a relationship you don't know about that is either distracting her or causing her distress. If she would "say what you want to hear" about grades, she may also be a person who would hide problems from you. Maybe you have solid reason to assume her problem really is too much "fun and freedom" and living off campus. But if you're assuming that and she was previously a better student--I'd wonder if more is going on than just off-campus fun.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If his grades were subpar when living in the dorms, why would living in the dorms a second year be the solution?

Instead of making rules for your adult child, you need to discuss with him what he thinks about his grades and what he thinks he should do differently.

This
Obviously

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Establish gpa cutoff for next semester. If she does not make the grades, pull the plug on tuition payments. Make her get a student loan in her name for next year to have some skin in the game. Arguing about dorm is pointless.

What does GPA cutoff mean, how does one come up with the cutoff #? Sounds like something written on message boards but not practical in real life. Never in my 50 years of life have I had a parent tell me their kid is home from college because they didn’t hit or just missed some arbitrary 3.0 or whatever GPA. Flunking is flunking but no middle class to well to do parents are going to kick their kid out of college for too many Cs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I had terrible 1st year grades, while living in a dorm. I found living in a dorm torturous - loud, distracting, overwhelming. I moved into a group house Sophomore year and my grades improved every year beyond. I had my own bedroom, a kitchen to cook in, a little space between the intensity of campus and my own home. I had a sense of HOME living in a shared apartment that I never had in a dorm, and for me that was important. So, I don't think that linking grades to living situation is necessarily valid.

she was not in a loud or so called party dorm. my husband went to the same college.

I wonder if the problem is that her dad went to the same college. Did she grow up with the expectation that she would go there and now that she's there, it isn't as great as she thought it would be? Is it a good fit school, both academically and culturally, or did she go there because she was a legacy? Either of those things could cause depression and/or trouble working as hard as she needs to.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I had terrible 1st year grades, while living in a dorm. I found living in a dorm torturous - loud, distracting, overwhelming. I moved into a group house Sophomore year and my grades improved every year beyond. I had my own bedroom, a kitchen to cook in, a little space between the intensity of campus and my own home. I had a sense of HOME living in a shared apartment that I never had in a dorm, and for me that was important. So, I don't think that linking grades to living situation is necessarily valid.

she was not in a loud or so called party dorm. my husband went to the same college.

Newsflash, Mom: they're 18 year olds living on their own for the first time. Every dorm has parties.

[Anonymous]

So what does dad think about this situation?

[Anonymous]

Rather than fight about where to live when she is AWAY at college, have you tried saying that if her grades do not improve, she will have to move back home (assuming she cannot support herself independently)?

That may do the trick.

But I do agree, you need to get some sense from her about what is wrong (does she feel incapable of the work? is it time management? too much partying? unmotivated/immature?)

Good luck. I am sure this is stressful and disappointing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Rather than fight about where to live when she is AWAY at college, have you tried saying that if her grades do not improve, she will have to move back home (assuming she cannot support herself independently)?

That may do the trick.

But I do agree, you need to get some sense from her about what is wrong (does she feel incapable of the work? is it time management? too much partying? unmotivated/immature?)

Good luck. I am sure this is stressful and disappointing.

This sounds like the right strategy to me. In our family we make it pretty clear that our children have the right to go to whichever college they prefer and that accepts them but that they have a responsibility to the family to do well while they are there. We talk about what 'doing well' looks like and means because it has looked like different things for different kids.

OP, I don't see that you mentioned it but what transpired when you received the first semester or first trimester grades? Were they adequate so that there was no conversation or were they low but there still wasn't a conversation or did you all talk and you thought the grades were coming up?

For the specific question though unless OP's daughter specifically states that the dorm situation is so bad that it contributed negatively to the grades then I would be hesitant to see living off-campus as an alternative that would have merit. Does she need a break this year? Maybe a year at home doing community college and working? Or does she have a plan on how to change her path so that next year's outcomes are substantially improved over this year's?

[Anonymous]

I'm a professor and an advisor. Students playing house off campus does not necessarily contribute to their academic achievement, but it can contribute (sometimes well and sometimes very, very badly) to their general development as adults. Kids (and let us not forget that they are kids) get stressed about things like rent and bills and furniture and sick cats and housemates and parties and dishes and city ordinances and weird neighbors and illnesses and parking and groceries, and none of this helps them do their homework. If anything, it gives them the excuse to compartmentalize academics into a smaller part of their dazzlingly complex lives.

[Anonymous]

Could your daughter benefit from one semester working with an executive functioning coach? Someone to talk with her about deadlines and breaking big goals into small goals? Someone besides mom? I'm asking this because I could have really used one of these in college!