MIL cuts us off, then demands holiday access. Advice?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Been married nearly 20 years. My MIL has long-standing BPD-type behaviors, victim mentality, crying to manipulate, and a pattern of “discarding” my husband several times a year. DH has always had a distant, strained relationship with her, but he still tries to pretend things are “normal,” especially around holidays and birthdays.

This past summer, after one of their typical disagreements, she initiated no-contact with him, and by extension, with me and our kids. Then, right before our child’s birthday, she tried to come back and blamed us for not seeing the kids all summer. When that didn’t work, she cut us off again. That was my breaking point. You can’t repeatedly abandon your grandchildren and then complain that you didn’t get to see them.

Now she wants “in” again for Christmas. I’m done. I understand DH is conditioned to accept this cycle, but I’m not willing to let our kids be dragged into this cycle, or to think this is normal, or to tolerate the holiday tension and eggshell-walking anymore. If she chooses to disappear for months at a time, she doesn’t get to reappear at her convenience.

How do I talk to DH about this in a way that’s firm but fair? This is the third Christmas she’s pulled this. It’s also the second time she’s pulled this before one of our kids’ birthdays. I need to set a boundary, but I want to approach it constructively.

If your DH is a sensible person, let him handle her as you don't want him to subconsciously have this against you, even though she is the problem. People have complicated relationships with their parents but ending it can be traumatic. Holidays aren't a good time to take a stand.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Been married nearly 20 years. My MIL has long-standing BPD-type behaviors, victim mentality, crying to manipulate, and a pattern of “discarding” my husband several times a year. DH has always had a distant, strained relationship with her, but he still tries to pretend things are “normal,” especially around holidays and birthdays.

This past summer, after one of their typical disagreements, she initiated no-contact with him, and by extension, with me and our kids. Then, right before our child’s birthday, she tried to come back and blamed us for not seeing the kids all summer. When that didn’t work, she cut us off again. That was my breaking point. You can’t repeatedly abandon your grandchildren and then complain that you didn’t get to see them.

Now she wants “in” again for Christmas. I’m done. I understand DH is conditioned to accept this cycle, but I’m not willing to let our kids be dragged into this cycle, or to think this is normal, or to tolerate the holiday tension and eggshell-walking anymore. If she chooses to disappear for months at a time, she doesn’t get to reappear at her convenience.

How do I talk to DH about this in a way that’s firm but fair? This is the third Christmas she’s pulled this. It’s also the second time she’s pulled this before one of our kids’ birthdays. I need to set a boundary, but I want to approach it constructively.

You said she likes to be around for holidays and birthdays. You said your husband likes to play normal for holidays/birthdays. Why not see her then? Ignore any gaslighting; what difference does it make? If your husband likes to play normal (and this is his normal; it’s not really playing) at these times, why do you have to “set a boundary” or do anything? Tell your kids grandma is flaky, but she’s doing the best you can; they’ll figure things out on their own. I don’t get why you need to assert some sort of power over this. And your poor husband caught between the two of you; why can’t he just have the relationship he already had with his mom before you came along?

As a daughter and mother, I refuse to agree that it’s normal to make a grand stand proclamation that you refuse to speak to your child for months at a time, 2-3 times a year. I simply can’t believe this is typical or healthy or normal!

—OP

Obviously not typical, but you’re not going to get typical, right? When she makes a grand proclamation, just let her know that she’s welcome when she’s ready. You’ll know that this will likely be before a birthday/holiday. If she comes back and says it was your fault, you can ignore it or you could have some innocuous stock phrase, like “sorry you feel that way.” That’s it! Problem solved (I know you won’t actually do this, but you could simply do….nothing.)

This sounds fair, honestly.

—OP

[Anonymous]

What are her major complaints? What is she wanting and not getting?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I don't think you need to do anything. A lot of kids don't see their grandparents consistently and only on major holidays. Your kids don't need to know all the details of every conversation and drama between your MIL and you / your DH. Keep it away from them and when you see grandma you see her. If she is as horrible as you say, I doubt the kids care that they don't see her more often.

See her around the holidays and ignore her the rest of the time (or be ignored by her the rest of the time).

Trying to turn this into a confrontation is only going to backfire on you.

The only thing that bothers me is the awkward tension she brings. The kids definitely feel it and we all walk on eggshells. This is the thing I’m tired of and don’t really know how to navigate.

—OP

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Are you inviting her and she’s refusing? More importantly do your kids invite them and she’s refuses? Do you really want more than birthdays and holidays?

I mean if all the kids know is that they any see granny on birthdays and Christmas and you have dragged them into your drama, I don’t get what’s so bad. That’s all that many kids see their grandparents.

Honestly, I don’t mind hosting or visiting when things are “normal”, but they are never normal after she goes off the grid, and I’m tired of her disappearing until she feels the loneliness of holidays without family. You can’t abandon us all year in between birthdays and holidays. Am I crazy to think this isn’t normal? Is it typical for parents/grandparents to cut off all contact between holidays after creating drama or not getting their way?

—OP

Why not? Why do you want her constant involvement if she is so difficult to be around?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't think you need to do anything. A lot of kids don't see their grandparents consistently and only on major holidays. Your kids don't need to know all the details of every conversation and drama between your MIL and you / your DH. Keep it away from them and when you see grandma you see her. If she is as horrible as you say, I doubt the kids care that they don't see her more often.

See her around the holidays and ignore her the rest of the time (or be ignored by her the rest of the time).

Trying to turn this into a confrontation is only going to backfire on you.

The only thing that bothers me is the awkward tension she brings. The kids definitely feel it and we all walk on eggshells. This is the thing I’m tired of and don’t really know how to navigate.

—OP

Talk to them about it. You all stop walking on eggshells . . . she WANTS you to walk on eggshells. "If grammy gets grumpy, just avoid her and do your thing."

My mom's mother was like this (worse than you describe, honestly). We just learned to ignore it when around her. My dad was really good at not giving in to her drama, and she pretty much left him alone.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't think you need to do anything. A lot of kids don't see their grandparents consistently and only on major holidays. Your kids don't need to know all the details of every conversation and drama between your MIL and you / your DH. Keep it away from them and when you see grandma you see her. If she is as horrible as you say, I doubt the kids care that they don't see her more often.

See her around the holidays and ignore her the rest of the time (or be ignored by her the rest of the time).

Trying to turn this into a confrontation is only going to backfire on you.

The only thing that bothers me is the awkward tension she brings. The kids definitely feel it and we all walk on eggshells. This is the thing I’m tired of and don’t really know how to navigate.

—OP

Tell kids that grandma has mental health issues because she clearly does. You should just relax and treat her kindly.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't think you need to do anything. A lot of kids don't see their grandparents consistently and only on major holidays. Your kids don't need to know all the details of every conversation and drama between your MIL and you / your DH. Keep it away from them and when you see grandma you see her. If she is as horrible as you say, I doubt the kids care that they don't see her more often.

See her around the holidays and ignore her the rest of the time (or be ignored by her the rest of the time).

Trying to turn this into a confrontation is only going to backfire on you.

The only thing that bothers me is the awkward tension she brings. The kids definitely feel it and we all walk on eggshells. This is the thing I’m tired of and don’t really know how to navigate.

—OP

Talk to them about it. You all stop walking on eggshells . . . she WANTS you to walk on eggshells. "If grammy gets grumpy, just avoid her and do your thing."

My mom's mother was like this (worse than you describe, honestly). We just learned to ignore it when around her. My dad was really good at not giving in to her drama, and she pretty much left him alone.

I’m genuinely curious what that looks like; can you describe what interactions look like? My MIL will come, won’t speak to anyone, will sit in a corner chair and twirl the ends of her shirt, speak in hushed murmurs, etc. None of us knows what to do with that. I’d love to hear your experience. Nothing we do or say breaks her out of it, so we all just watch awkwardly.

—OP

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't think you need to do anything. A lot of kids don't see their grandparents consistently and only on major holidays. Your kids don't need to know all the details of every conversation and drama between your MIL and you / your DH. Keep it away from them and when you see grandma you see her. If she is as horrible as you say, I doubt the kids care that they don't see her more often.

See her around the holidays and ignore her the rest of the time (or be ignored by her the rest of the time).

Trying to turn this into a confrontation is only going to backfire on you.

The only thing that bothers me is the awkward tension she brings. The kids definitely feel it and we all walk on eggshells. This is the thing I’m tired of and don’t really know how to navigate.

—OP

Talk to them about it. You all stop walking on eggshells . . . she WANTS you to walk on eggshells. "If grammy gets grumpy, just avoid her and do your thing."

My mom's mother was like this (worse than you describe, honestly). We just learned to ignore it when around her. My dad was really good at not giving in to her drama, and she pretty much left him alone.

I’m genuinely curious what that looks like; can you describe what interactions look like? My MIL will come, won’t speak to anyone, will sit in a corner chair and twirl the ends of her shirt, speak in hushed murmurs, etc. None of us knows what to do with that. I’d love to hear your experience. Nothing we do or say breaks her out of it, so we all just watch awkwardly.

—OP

You just leave her there to pout. Don't try to break her out of it. Let her stew and do your thing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't think you need to do anything. A lot of kids don't see their grandparents consistently and only on major holidays. Your kids don't need to know all the details of every conversation and drama between your MIL and you / your DH. Keep it away from them and when you see grandma you see her. If she is as horrible as you say, I doubt the kids care that they don't see her more often.

See her around the holidays and ignore her the rest of the time (or be ignored by her the rest of the time).

Trying to turn this into a confrontation is only going to backfire on you.

The only thing that bothers me is the awkward tension she brings. The kids definitely feel it and we all walk on eggshells. This is the thing I’m tired of and don’t really know how to navigate.

—OP

Talk to them about it. You all stop walking on eggshells . . . she WANTS you to walk on eggshells. "If grammy gets grumpy, just avoid her and do your thing."

My mom's mother was like this (worse than you describe, honestly). We just learned to ignore it when around her. My dad was really good at not giving in to her drama, and she pretty much left him alone.

I’m genuinely curious what that looks like; can you describe what interactions look like? My MIL will come, won’t speak to anyone, will sit in a corner chair and twirl the ends of her shirt, speak in hushed murmurs, etc. None of us knows what to do with that. I’d love to hear your experience. Nothing we do or say breaks her out of it, so we all just watch awkwardly.

—OP

Watch what? Just carry on with your holiday; treat her normally. This sounds like self-imposed awkwardness.

[Anonymous]

Ues, i the kids like her, life is too short, let in good feelings and let out anger

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't think you need to do anything. A lot of kids don't see their grandparents consistently and only on major holidays. Your kids don't need to know all the details of every conversation and drama between your MIL and you / your DH. Keep it away from them and when you see grandma you see her. If she is as horrible as you say, I doubt the kids care that they don't see her more often.

See her around the holidays and ignore her the rest of the time (or be ignored by her the rest of the time).

Trying to turn this into a confrontation is only going to backfire on you.

The only thing that bothers me is the awkward tension she brings. The kids definitely feel it and we all walk on eggshells. This is the thing I’m tired of and don’t really know how to navigate.

—OP

Talk to them about it. You all stop walking on eggshells . . . she WANTS you to walk on eggshells. "If grammy gets grumpy, just avoid her and do your thing."

My mom's mother was like this (worse than you describe, honestly). We just learned to ignore it when around her. My dad was really good at not giving in to her drama, and she pretty much left him alone.

I’m genuinely curious what that looks like; can you describe what interactions look like? My MIL will come, won’t speak to anyone, will sit in a corner chair and twirl the ends of her shirt, speak in hushed murmurs, etc. None of us knows what to do with that. I’d love to hear your experience. Nothing we do or say breaks her out of it, so we all just watch awkwardly.

—OP

Watch what? Just carry on with your holiday; treat her normally. This sounds like self-imposed awkwardness.

She’s local and DH has no other local family, so she is hosted alone. It’s awkward when she sits and won’t speak. How do we carry on with that? Just talk between the four of us? It’s honestly the strangest thing.

—OP

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The anti-MIL posts have become so extreme to the point of being comical.

This is an advice forum. What are you expecting to see on an advice forum?

What gave you the idea that this is an advice forum?

What exactly do you think it is? An unconditional support forum for venting where only hair pats and commiserating are allowed? This OP literally asked for advice.

[Anonymous]

You keep moving the goals posts - changing the issues.

Do I this highly confrontational woman who is always arguing shows up and sits silently in a corner murmuring - no.

Now you are just making things up.

[Anonymous]

Banish her from the house. Your DH can go visit if he wants.