Disclosing atheism

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP I was raised as an atheist. I would say that the two groups who receive the most blatant intolerance are Mormons and atheists. It was a difficult childhood and I will never forget those who attacked me. I even thought of moving to a communist country because we would be more acceptable. It’s never ok to attack someone for their beliefs or lack thereof.

Who attacked you? Where were you attacked and why? Did your parents not protect you when you were a child? Were you physically attacked by strangers?

NP. These third degree questions come off as victim blaming.

Not victim blaming whatsoever. Being attacked as a child for any reason is criminal! Whomever attacked atheist pp should be in jail. How could a child be attacked and their parents not call police?

Do you have to straw man every thread? You know pp doesn’t mean a physical attack.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP I was raised as an atheist. I would say that the two groups who receive the most blatant intolerance are Mormons and atheists. It was a difficult childhood and I will never forget those who attacked me. I even thought of moving to a communist country because we would be more acceptable. It’s never ok to attack someone for their beliefs or lack thereof.

Who attacked you? Where were you attacked and why? Did your parents not protect you when you were a child? Were you physically attacked by strangers?

I was verbally attacked by the parents of two friends. Insulted as a young adult by acquaintances. Pushed as a child by someone who was mad at me for pretending to have a religion, which I did to get out of a difficult situation.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I don’t see the atheists here trying to genuinely engage with the mission of Christians.

What is "the mission"?

+1 also, do you expect people of other religions to engage with the Christian "mission"?

The mission of Christianity is to spread the good news. Did you go to Sunday school? It is fundamental to the very essence of Christianity. World history has been shaped by this mission. To ignore this fact is to to ignore reality. It is what it is. To genuinely engage in discussion with Christians is to accept what they have been taught over and over again throughout time. You cannot genuinely engage with a Christian in debate if you ignore this about them. No matter how frustrating it is.

Sorry, but I can't really believe that Christians expect people of other religions and no religion to engage with them if it only can mean becoming a Christian. Seems to me that in the US people are taught to respect other religions but not taught to expect others to convert to their religion. Slowly, that respect is being extending to people who do not practice any religion.

We might be arguing past each other. I am talking about those who wish to not insult Christians. You would start by respecting what they believe, nothing more. And I didn’t say that Christians “expect” others to concert.

Are you saying that "spreading the good news" is not related to people who are not Christians becoming Christians?

No I am not saying that. I am saying that is where they are coming from if you would like to understand them so as not to insult them.

I think I understand - you are saying Christians (I used to be one) believe they are doing something good and others who don't share that belief should not express it, to avoid insulting Christians. Is that right?

Not quite. In OP’s situation, I would’ve answered the question the neighbor asked. “What church do you go to?” “Oh, I don’t go to church.” And then see what the neighbor says. Perhaps the neighbor lets it drop because the conversation was getting too personal for that particular social gathering. If the neighbor pushed it, then I would disclose that I was atheist. The neighbor should then respectfully engage in normal conversation and not pass judgment, just as the atheist did.

From the OP:
"...they asked me about my faith, where I go to church etc."

Seems like Christian pp is expecting people to place protecting religious beliefs over expressing their (non)belief. I disagree, but think I can understand how a religious person would feel this way. They are accustomed to it and feel threatened by such a change. It's relatively rare and recent that people would openly express their atheism as OP did.

Atheists no longer "know their place" like women and gays before them.

So atheists have had to struggle for civil rights? No.

Atheists (here) have terrible personalities and are too sensitive, while seeing everything as an attack. They aren’t fighting for rights. Get over yourself.

Atheists as a percentage of American society: 20-29%
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Irreligion_in_the_United_States#

Atheists as a percentage of congress, executive branch or supreme court: < 0.2%
https://www.pewresearch.org/religion/2021/01/04/faith-on-the-hill-2021/

You don't think we struggle for civil rights?

americans vote for people who are qualified, trustworthy, and likable. It’s not the voter’s fault so few atheist candidates are qualified, trustworthy, or likable.

Thanks for saying it out loud! Everyone, there is your evidence.

Candidates for political office aren’t owed anyone’s vote.

If people don’t like atheists, they probably won’t vote for an atheist.

If as pp claimed above that atheists often lie that they are religious to win elections and gain political power- can you blame voters for not trusting them?

No, pp did not say that, as anyone can see by reading that post. Pp said "they identify as Christians". and most likely they are christians, in terms of heritage, church membership, etc, just as many atheists attend religious services.

MD Rep. Jamie Raskin, is Jewish and calls himself a humanist. Humanists (and lots of Jews) don't believe in God. But he chooses not to call himself an atheist. Fine.

It matters only to the atheist-accusatory pp and the few, if any, readers who take that person seriously.

“I think the point was that there are candidates who are atheist and qualified, trustworthy, and likable, but don't identify as atheists because they fear it would cause them to lose. So they identify as Christians as a way to help them win.

Sort of like the way candidates used to hide their homosexuality, but often don't anymore.”

First of all- if you didn’t post this- stop trying to speak for the pp. The pp clearly stated that atheists tell voters they are Christian and deny what they believe publicly and deceive voters.

Please stop trying to talk for pp

“I think the point was that there are candidates who are atheist and qualified, trustworthy, and likable, but don't identify as atheists because they fear it would cause them to lose. So they identify as Christians as a way to help them win.

Sort of like the way candidates used to hide their homosexuality, but often don't anymore.”

These are pp’s own words. Atheists who run for public office have to hide their atheism the way homosexuals used to hide their sexuality. The atheist political candidate hides their atheism and claims to be religious, so people will vote for them.

That’s exactly what pp wrote.

That doesn't sound ethical. Seems like they need a little religion to give them some guidance in life.

Religion in politics drives away from ethics.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP I was raised as an atheist. I would say that the two groups who receive the most blatant intolerance are Mormons and atheists. It was a difficult childhood and I will never forget those who attacked me. I even thought of moving to a communist country because we would be more acceptable. It’s never ok to attack someone for their beliefs or lack thereof.

Who attacked you? Where were you attacked and why? Did your parents not protect you when you were a child? Were you physically attacked by strangers?

NP. These third degree questions come off as victim blaming.

Not victim blaming whatsoever. Being attacked as a child for any reason is criminal! Whomever attacked atheist pp should be in jail. How could a child be attacked and their parents not call police?

You want to lock up all of the evangelicals?

Seems harsh but ok.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP I was raised as an atheist. I would say that the two groups who receive the most blatant intolerance are Mormons and atheists. It was a difficult childhood and I will never forget those who attacked me. I even thought of moving to a communist country because we would be more acceptable. It’s never ok to attack someone for their beliefs or lack thereof.

Who attacked you? Where were you attacked and why? Did your parents not protect you when you were a child? Were you physically attacked by strangers?

NP. These third degree questions come off as victim blaming.

Not victim blaming whatsoever. Being attacked as a child for any reason is criminal! Whomever attacked atheist pp should be in jail. How could a child be attacked and their parents not call police?

You want to lock up all of the evangelicals?

Seems harsh but ok.

Pp who was attacked won’t tell the story. Likely fake and attention seeking troll.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP I was raised as an atheist. I would say that the two groups who receive the most blatant intolerance are Mormons and atheists. It was a difficult childhood and I will never forget those who attacked me. I even thought of moving to a communist country because we would be more acceptable. It’s never ok to attack someone for their beliefs or lack thereof.

Who attacked you? Where were you attacked and why? Did your parents not protect you when you were a child? Were you physically attacked by strangers?

NP. These third degree questions come off as victim blaming.

Not victim blaming whatsoever. Being attacked as a child for any reason is criminal! Whomever attacked atheist pp should be in jail. How could a child be attacked and their parents not call police?

You want to lock up all of the evangelicals?

Seems harsh but ok.

Pp who was attacked won’t tell the story. Likely fake and attention seeking troll.

Hey Einstein, didn’t they respond 10 minutes before your incredibly ironic post?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP I was raised as an atheist. I would say that the two groups who receive the most blatant intolerance are Mormons and atheists. It was a difficult childhood and I will never forget those who attacked me. I even thought of moving to a communist country because we would be more acceptable. It’s never ok to attack someone for their beliefs or lack thereof.

Who attacked you? Where were you attacked and why? Did your parents not protect you when you were a child? Were you physically attacked by strangers?

NP. These third degree questions come off as victim blaming.

Not victim blaming whatsoever. Being attacked as a child for any reason is criminal! Whomever attacked atheist pp should be in jail. How could a child be attacked and their parents not call police?

You want to lock up all of the evangelicals?

Seems harsh but ok.

Pp who was attacked won’t tell the story. Likely fake and attention seeking troll.

see above

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP I was raised as an atheist. I would say that the two groups who receive the most blatant intolerance are Mormons and atheists. It was a difficult childhood and I will never forget those who attacked me. I even thought of moving to a communist country because we would be more acceptable. It’s never ok to attack someone for their beliefs or lack thereof.

Who attacked you? Where were you attacked and why? Did your parents not protect you when you were a child? Were you physically attacked by strangers?

NP. These third degree questions come off as victim blaming.

Not victim blaming whatsoever. Being attacked as a child for any reason is criminal! Whomever attacked atheist pp should be in jail. How could a child be attacked and their parents not call police?

You want to lock up all of the evangelicals?

Seems harsh but ok.

Pp who was attacked won’t tell the story. Likely fake and attention seeking troll.

PP wants to lock up people who attack others about their lack of religion. Seems harsh to lock up all evangelicals.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP I was raised as an atheist. I would say that the two groups who receive the most blatant intolerance are Mormons and atheists. It was a difficult childhood and I will never forget those who attacked me. I even thought of moving to a communist country because we would be more acceptable. It’s never ok to attack someone for their beliefs or lack thereof.

Who attacked you? Where were you attacked and why? Did your parents not protect you when you were a child? Were you physically attacked by strangers?

NP. These third degree questions come off as victim blaming.

Not victim blaming whatsoever. Being attacked as a child for any reason is criminal! Whomever attacked atheist pp should be in jail. How could a child be attacked and their parents not call police?

You want to lock up all of the evangelicals?

Seems harsh but ok.

Pp who was attacked won’t tell the story. Likely fake and attention seeking troll.

PP wants to lock up people who attack others about their lack of religion. Seems harsh to lock up all evangelicals.

What some people don't understand about Evangelicals, is that evangelizing - spreading the "Good news" about Jesus - is central to their beliefs. It would be like asking Catholics to disavow transubstantiation. Worse, perhaps, because belief that turning the bread and wine into the body and blood of Jesus is a Catholic thing, while the mission of evangelizing is to turn everyone into a Christian.

[Anonymous]

I'm a different poster but was also raised as an atheist. My family relocated from a larger city to a small town in the Midwest when I was 10. Basically everyone went to church. Kids went to youth group, sometimes multiple times a week. There were camps and slumber parties at churches and holiday things. I didn't participate in any of those things because my parents were not religious.

I experienced a lot of intrusive personal questions from adults (parents of friends, coworkers of my dad's, teachers) about my family's religion. Lots of attempts by parents, other kids, and several teachers to convert me to Christianity. Repeatedly being invited to church and then told that I didn't need to tell my parents about it. Friends who would say, "You should sleep over on Saturday and then we can go to church in the morning" without asking if that was something I was interested in or comfortable with.

From my side, as a weird kid who had always been interested in religion in general, I would probably have really enjoyed going to a lot of that stuff, particularly the social stuff that it felt like EVERYONE ELSE was doing. But there was no way in that town to just go to one lock-in - I tried that and spent weeks trying to get the girl I attended the lock-in with to stop proselytizing to me. There was a ton of social pressure to conform and people who didn't definitely heard about it.

As an adult, I can see the proselytizing as part of the mission of Christianity. I also don't and didn't think these people were bad people, nor do I think that most of them intended to be exclusionary and apply pressure in ways that felt bad. I understand that the intention was to be welcoming and enthusiastic. But the way I experienced those things, as a child, was not positive. It did not feel supportive and welcoming. It felt like in order to have community support, I had to become a Christian. I just did not believe, and I did not feel like it was okay to pretend that I believed when I did not.

I do not identify as an atheist at this time in my life, but I also do not believe in a god in the way that Christians do. I don't talk about this often because it makes Christians very uncomfortable to even call their god "their god" or "a god."

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I'm a different poster but was also raised as an atheist. My family relocated from a larger city to a small town in the Midwest when I was 10. Basically everyone went to church. Kids went to youth group, sometimes multiple times a week. There were camps and slumber parties at churches and holiday things. I didn't participate in any of those things because my parents were not religious.

I experienced a lot of intrusive personal questions from adults (parents of friends, coworkers of my dad's, teachers) about my family's religion. Lots of attempts by parents, other kids, and several teachers to convert me to Christianity. Repeatedly being invited to church and then told that I didn't need to tell my parents about it. Friends who would say, "You should sleep over on Saturday and then we can go to church in the morning" without asking if that was something I was interested in or comfortable with.

From my side, as a weird kid who had always been interested in religion in general, I would probably have really enjoyed going to a lot of that stuff, particularly the social stuff that it felt like EVERYONE ELSE was doing. But there was no way in that town to just go to one lock-in - I tried that and spent weeks trying to get the girl I attended the lock-in with to stop proselytizing to me. There was a ton of social pressure to conform and people who didn't definitely heard about it.

As an adult, I can see the proselytizing as part of the mission of Christianity. I also don't and didn't think these people were bad people, nor do I think that most of them intended to be exclusionary and apply pressure in ways that felt bad. I understand that the intention was to be welcoming and enthusiastic. But the way I experienced those things, as a child, was not positive. It did not feel supportive and welcoming. It felt like in order to have community support, I had to become a Christian. I just did not believe, and I did not feel like it was okay to pretend that I believed when I did not.

I do not identify as an atheist at this time in my life, but I also do not believe in a god in the way that Christians do. I don't talk about this often because it makes Christians very uncomfortable to even call their god "their god" or "a god."

Yes, we have heard the story of how you were tricked into attending youth group at a church and they had a band to lure the kids in. Just awful. And don’t get you started on the free doughnuts and coffee churches use to lure in unwary families…it’s extremely deceptive. One minute you are eating a doughnut- the next, you are being baptized against your will and your kids are singing “Jesus Loves the Little Children” in a Sunday School classroom and being forced to collect pennies for hungry children in Africa. When will it end?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I'm a different poster but was also raised as an atheist. My family relocated from a larger city to a small town in the Midwest when I was 10. Basically everyone went to church. Kids went to youth group, sometimes multiple times a week. There were camps and slumber parties at churches and holiday things. I didn't participate in any of those things because my parents were not religious.

I experienced a lot of intrusive personal questions from adults (parents of friends, coworkers of my dad's, teachers) about my family's religion. Lots of attempts by parents, other kids, and several teachers to convert me to Christianity. Repeatedly being invited to church and then told that I didn't need to tell my parents about it. Friends who would say, "You should sleep over on Saturday and then we can go to church in the morning" without asking if that was something I was interested in or comfortable with.

From my side, as a weird kid who had always been interested in religion in general, I would probably have really enjoyed going to a lot of that stuff, particularly the social stuff that it felt like EVERYONE ELSE was doing. But there was no way in that town to just go to one lock-in - I tried that and spent weeks trying to get the girl I attended the lock-in with to stop proselytizing to me. There was a ton of social pressure to conform and people who didn't definitely heard about it.

As an adult, I can see the proselytizing as part of the mission of Christianity. I also don't and didn't think these people were bad people, nor do I think that most of them intended to be exclusionary and apply pressure in ways that felt bad. I understand that the intention was to be welcoming and enthusiastic. But the way I experienced those things, as a child, was not positive. It did not feel supportive and welcoming. It felt like in order to have community support, I had to become a Christian. I just did not believe, and I did not feel like it was okay to pretend that I believed when I did not.

I do not identify as an atheist at this time in my life, but I also do not believe in a god in the way that Christians do. I don't talk about this often because it makes Christians very uncomfortable to even call their god "their god" or "a god."

So sorry to hear about the way you were treated as a child, by people who said they were Christians. I hope you had parental support.

You're right that some Christians (not all) would be offended by reference to "their god" but that's changing, as more religious people are exposed to people who don't believe the same things about religion as they do.

I hope that some day soon, you're in a real life situation where you feel comfortable expressing your beliefs. If that happens, perhaps you could write about it here.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm a different poster but was also raised as an atheist. My family relocated from a larger city to a small town in the Midwest when I was 10. Basically everyone went to church. Kids went to youth group, sometimes multiple times a week. There were camps and slumber parties at churches and holiday things. I didn't participate in any of those things because my parents were not religious.

I experienced a lot of intrusive personal questions from adults (parents of friends, coworkers of my dad's, teachers) about my family's religion. Lots of attempts by parents, other kids, and several teachers to convert me to Christianity. Repeatedly being invited to church and then told that I didn't need to tell my parents about it. Friends who would say, "You should sleep over on Saturday and then we can go to church in the morning" without asking if that was something I was interested in or comfortable with.

From my side, as a weird kid who had always been interested in religion in general, I would probably have really enjoyed going to a lot of that stuff, particularly the social stuff that it felt like EVERYONE ELSE was doing. But there was no way in that town to just go to one lock-in - I tried that and spent weeks trying to get the girl I attended the lock-in with to stop proselytizing to me. There was a ton of social pressure to conform and people who didn't definitely heard about it.

As an adult, I can see the proselytizing as part of the mission of Christianity. I also don't and didn't think these people were bad people, nor do I think that most of them intended to be exclusionary and apply pressure in ways that felt bad. I understand that the intention was to be welcoming and enthusiastic. But the way I experienced those things, as a child, was not positive. It did not feel supportive and welcoming. It felt like in order to have community support, I had to become a Christian. I just did not believe, and I did not feel like it was okay to pretend that I believed when I did not.

I do not identify as an atheist at this time in my life, but I also do not believe in a god in the way that Christians do. I don't talk about this often because it makes Christians very uncomfortable to even call their god "their god" or "a god."

Yes, we have heard the story of how you were tricked into attending youth group at a church and they had a band to lure the kids in. Just awful. And don’t get you started on the free doughnuts and coffee churches use to lure in unwary families…it’s extremely deceptive. One minute you are eating a doughnut- the next, you are being baptized against your will and your kids are singing “Jesus Loves the Little Children” in a Sunday School classroom and being forced to collect pennies for hungry children in Africa. When will it end?

Is this the kind of respectful behavior that is being suggested for the OP and other atheists?

I have never posted anything related to this story on this forum. I posted my experience in good faith, and your response was to be sarcastic and dismissive.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm a different poster but was also raised as an atheist. My family relocated from a larger city to a small town in the Midwest when I was 10. Basically everyone went to church. Kids went to youth group, sometimes multiple times a week. There were camps and slumber parties at churches and holiday things. I didn't participate in any of those things because my parents were not religious.

I experienced a lot of intrusive personal questions from adults (parents of friends, coworkers of my dad's, teachers) about my family's religion. Lots of attempts by parents, other kids, and several teachers to convert me to Christianity. Repeatedly being invited to church and then told that I didn't need to tell my parents about it. Friends who would say, "You should sleep over on Saturday and then we can go to church in the morning" without asking if that was something I was interested in or comfortable with.

From my side, as a weird kid who had always been interested in religion in general, I would probably have really enjoyed going to a lot of that stuff, particularly the social stuff that it felt like EVERYONE ELSE was doing. But there was no way in that town to just go to one lock-in - I tried that and spent weeks trying to get the girl I attended the lock-in with to stop proselytizing to me. There was a ton of social pressure to conform and people who didn't definitely heard about it.

As an adult, I can see the proselytizing as part of the mission of Christianity. I also don't and didn't think these people were bad people, nor do I think that most of them intended to be exclusionary and apply pressure in ways that felt bad. I understand that the intention was to be welcoming and enthusiastic. But the way I experienced those things, as a child, was not positive. It did not feel supportive and welcoming. It felt like in order to have community support, I had to become a Christian. I just did not believe, and I did not feel like it was okay to pretend that I believed when I did not.

I do not identify as an atheist at this time in my life, but I also do not believe in a god in the way that Christians do. I don't talk about this often because it makes Christians very uncomfortable to even call their god "their god" or "a god."

So sorry to hear about the way you were treated as a child, by people who said they were Christians. I hope you had parental support.

You're right that some Christians (not all) would be offended by reference to "their god" but that's changing, as more religious people are exposed to people who don't believe the same things about religion as they do.

I hope that some day soon, you're in a real life situation where you feel comfortable expressing your beliefs. If that happens, perhaps you could write about it here.

Thanks, PP. I don't think there is any chance of me posting any of my personal beliefs on spirituality on this site. It has been my experience that the behavior of the Christians of my childhood was not atypical. You need look no further than the reply directly above yours.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm a different poster but was also raised as an atheist. My family relocated from a larger city to a small town in the Midwest when I was 10. Basically everyone went to church. Kids went to youth group, sometimes multiple times a week. There were camps and slumber parties at churches and holiday things. I didn't participate in any of those things because my parents were not religious.

I experienced a lot of intrusive personal questions from adults (parents of friends, coworkers of my dad's, teachers) about my family's religion. Lots of attempts by parents, other kids, and several teachers to convert me to Christianity. Repeatedly being invited to church and then told that I didn't need to tell my parents about it. Friends who would say, "You should sleep over on Saturday and then we can go to church in the morning" without asking if that was something I was interested in or comfortable with.

From my side, as a weird kid who had always been interested in religion in general, I would probably have really enjoyed going to a lot of that stuff, particularly the social stuff that it felt like EVERYONE ELSE was doing. But there was no way in that town to just go to one lock-in - I tried that and spent weeks trying to get the girl I attended the lock-in with to stop proselytizing to me. There was a ton of social pressure to conform and people who didn't definitely heard about it.

As an adult, I can see the proselytizing as part of the mission of Christianity. I also don't and didn't think these people were bad people, nor do I think that most of them intended to be exclusionary and apply pressure in ways that felt bad. I understand that the intention was to be welcoming and enthusiastic. But the way I experienced those things, as a child, was not positive. It did not feel supportive and welcoming. It felt like in order to have community support, I had to become a Christian. I just did not believe, and I did not feel like it was okay to pretend that I believed when I did not.

I do not identify as an atheist at this time in my life, but I also do not believe in a god in the way that Christians do. I don't talk about this often because it makes Christians very uncomfortable to even call their god "their god" or "a god."

Yes, we have heard the story of how you were tricked into attending youth group at a church and they had a band to lure the kids in. Just awful. And don’t get you started on the free doughnuts and coffee churches use to lure in unwary families…it’s extremely deceptive. One minute you are eating a doughnut- the next, you are being baptized against your will and your kids are singing “Jesus Loves the Little Children” in a Sunday School classroom and being forced to collect pennies for hungry children in Africa. When will it end?

Is this the kind of respectful behavior that is being suggested for the OP and other atheists?

I have never posted anything related to this story on this forum. I posted my experience in good faith, and your response was to be sarcastic and dismissive.

A good introduction to the atheist hater.