Disclosing atheism

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Announcing you’re an atheist, is only crass if they don’t bring up religion. If they are talking about church, it’s not tacky. They’re tacky for discussing religion in the first place.

Maybe -- It depends on the context of the conversation. Religion or lack of religion aren't out-of-hand tacky subjects.

I was at daycare dropoff last week and a mom was telling us other parents about her son's baptism over the weekend. "He's not a little heathen anymore," she joked. Maybe that joke is funny in church, where (probably) everyone is Christian and baptized, but in a setting like daycare dropoff where you don't know, yikes!

Agree. This is a good example of it being tacky to mention religion in such a way, even jokingly, that implies that any kids who aren't baptized are "little heathens."

I wonder what could be done to stop this Mom from talking this way. To me, her words seem more insensitive and thoughtless than intentionally cruel.

I think it would take someone she knows better bringing the problematic nature of the joke to her attention in a non-judgmental way. I don't think it would be appropriate for me to do it, because I think coming from a stranger, it would just shame her or embarrass her and, to your point, I don't think it was meant to be intentionally cruel.

I think she could be told in a sensitive way, without feeling shamed. Nothing wrong, though, with feeling a bit embarrassed - which she will likely feel if she can be helped to understand how non-christians would be offended by her off-handed statements.

I think random comments about a lot of things - not just religion - are not meant to be cruel, but are.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Announcing you’re an atheist, is only crass if they don’t bring up religion. If they are talking about church, it’s not tacky. They’re tacky for discussing religion in the first place.

Maybe -- It depends on the context of the conversation. Religion or lack of religion aren't out-of-hand tacky subjects.

I was at daycare dropoff last week and a mom was telling us other parents about her son's baptism over the weekend. "He's not a little heathen anymore," she joked. Maybe that joke is funny in church, where (probably) everyone is Christian and baptized, but in a setting like daycare dropoff where you don't know, yikes!

Agree. This is a good example of it being tacky to mention religion in such a way, even jokingly, that implies that any kids who aren't baptized are "little heathens."

I wonder what could be done to stop this Mom from talking this way. To me, her words seem more insensitive and thoughtless than intentionally cruel.

I think it would take someone she knows better bringing the problematic nature of the joke to her attention in a non-judgmental way. I don't think it would be appropriate for me to do it, because I think coming from a stranger, it would just shame her or embarrass her and, to your point, I don't think it was meant to be intentionally cruel.

I think she could be told in a sensitive way, without feeling shamed. Nothing wrong, though, with feeling a bit embarrassed - which she will likely feel if she can be helped to understand how non-christians would be offended by her off-handed statements.

I think random comments about a lot of things - not just religion - are not meant to be cruel, but are.

Such sensitization could conceivably be done in liberal, Christian churches, that are already sympathetic to the many ways that people are discriminated against - e.g., LGBTQ.

Also, many religious people theses days are very accepting of other religious beliefs (and even atheism), so should be open to the idea that it's an insult to call people who are not Christians "heathen".

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Announcing you’re an atheist, is only crass if they don’t bring up religion. If they are talking about church, it’s not tacky. They’re tacky for discussing religion in the first place.

Maybe -- It depends on the context of the conversation. Religion or lack of religion aren't out-of-hand tacky subjects.

I was at daycare dropoff last week and a mom was telling us other parents about her son's baptism over the weekend. "He's not a little heathen anymore," she joked. Maybe that joke is funny in church, where (probably) everyone is Christian and baptized, but in a setting like daycare dropoff where you don't know, yikes!

Agree. This is a good example of it being tacky to mention religion in such a way, even jokingly, that implies that any kids who aren't baptized are "little heathens."

I wonder what could be done to stop this Mom from talking this way. To me, her words seem more insensitive and thoughtless than intentionally cruel.

I think it would take someone she knows better bringing the problematic nature of the joke to her attention in a non-judgmental way. I don't think it would be appropriate for me to do it, because I think coming from a stranger, it would just shame her or embarrass her and, to your point, I don't think it was meant to be intentionally cruel.

I think she could be told in a sensitive way, without feeling shamed. Nothing wrong, though, with feeling a bit embarrassed - which she will likely feel if she can be helped to understand how non-christians would be offended by her off-handed statements.

I think random comments about a lot of things - not just religion - are not meant to be cruel, but are.

Such sensitization could conceivably be done in liberal, Christian churches, that are already sympathetic to the many ways that people are discriminated against - e.g., LGBTQ.

Also, many religious people theses days are very accepting of other religious beliefs (and even atheism), so should be open to the idea that it's an insult to call people who are not Christians "heathen".

Presumably if she's making a "heathens" joke, she's not part of a liberal church, or her mindset would already include the idea that she lives in a multicultural world. It seems more likely that her life is mainly in her Christian bubble and it just didn't occur to her that the joke might come off wrong to non-religious or non-Christian people around her.

[Anonymous]

No mom sees her kid as a heathen, regardless.

Fake post.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Announcing you’re an atheist, is only crass if they don’t bring up religion. If they are talking about church, it’s not tacky. They’re tacky for discussing religion in the first place.

Maybe -- It depends on the context of the conversation. Religion or lack of religion aren't out-of-hand tacky subjects.

I was at daycare dropoff last week and a mom was telling us other parents about her son's baptism over the weekend. "He's not a little heathen anymore," she joked. Maybe that joke is funny in church, where (probably) everyone is Christian and baptized, but in a setting like daycare dropoff where you don't know, yikes!

Agree. This is a good example of it being tacky to mention religion in such a way, even jokingly, that implies that any kids who aren't baptized are "little heathens."

I wonder what could be done to stop this Mom from talking this way. To me, her words seem more insensitive and thoughtless than intentionally cruel.

I think it would take someone she knows better bringing the problematic nature of the joke to her attention in a non-judgmental way. I don't think it would be appropriate for me to do it, because I think coming from a stranger, it would just shame her or embarrass her and, to your point, I don't think it was meant to be intentionally cruel.

I think she could be told in a sensitive way, without feeling shamed. Nothing wrong, though, with feeling a bit embarrassed - which she will likely feel if she can be helped to understand how non-christians would be offended by her off-handed statements.

I think random comments about a lot of things - not just religion - are not meant to be cruel, but are.

Such sensitization could conceivably be done in liberal, Christian churches, that are already sympathetic to the many ways that people are discriminated against - e.g., LGBTQ.

Also, many religious people theses days are very accepting of other religious beliefs (and even atheism), so should be open to the idea that it's an insult to call people who are not Christians "heathen".

Presumably if she's making a "heathens" joke, she's not part of a liberal church, or her mindset would already include the idea that she lives in a multicultural world. It seems more likely that her life is mainly in her Christian bubble and it just didn't occur to her that the joke might come off wrong to non-religious or non-Christian people around her.

Even people with liberal mindsets screw up occasionally. And I've noticed that even some liberal Christians are not particularly accepting of non-religious people.

It's been noted on this forum before that while there's a standard of civility among people of different religions, it doesn't necessarily extend to people of no religion.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:No mom sees her kid as a heathen, regardless.

Fake post.

It was a joke. I identified it as a joke. Nobody thinks this mom saw her kid as a heathen. It's still problematic to joke that unbaptized kids are heathens.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No mom sees her kid as a heathen, regardless.

Fake post.

It was a joke. I identified it as a joke. Nobody thinks this mom saw her kid as a heathen. It's still problematic to joke that unbaptized kids are heathens.

I agree that it's problematic, but it's what Christians believe - at least it's a tenet of Christianity. It's why some grandmothers secretly take their grandchildren to church to have them baptized without the parents' knowledge.

Some people have their kids baptized as a matter of tradition rather than religious belief. They may not think of their child as a "heathen", but they like the idea of Christening nonetheless. It's a time for the family to get together and for the new baby to be recognized and officially welcomed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No mom sees her kid as a heathen, regardless.

Fake post.

It was a joke. I identified it as a joke. Nobody thinks this mom saw her kid as a heathen. It's still problematic to joke that unbaptized kids are heathens.

Interesting. I’m a heathen with heathen children and I joke about it occasionally.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No mom sees her kid as a heathen, regardless.

Fake post.

It was a joke. I identified it as a joke. Nobody thinks this mom saw her kid as a heathen. It's still problematic to joke that unbaptized kids are heathens.

Interesting. I’m a heathen with heathen children and I joke about it occasionally.

Would you feel differently if the joke came in the context above from a Christian? We joke about ourselves differently than we would feel appropriate for others to joke about us.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No mom sees her kid as a heathen, regardless.

Fake post.

It was a joke. I identified it as a joke. Nobody thinks this mom saw her kid as a heathen. It's still problematic to joke that unbaptized kids are heathens.

Interesting. I’m a heathen with heathen children and I joke about it occasionally.

Would you feel differently if the joke came in the context above from a Christian? We joke about ourselves differently than we would feel appropriate for others to joke about us.

It’s a joke, not a d1ck. Don’t take it so hard.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No mom sees her kid as a heathen, regardless.

Fake post.

It was a joke. I identified it as a joke. Nobody thinks this mom saw her kid as a heathen. It's still problematic to joke that unbaptized kids are heathens.

Interesting. I’m a heathen with heathen children and I joke about it occasionally.

Would you feel differently if the joke came in the context above from a Christian? We joke about ourselves differently than we would feel appropriate for others to joke about us.

Good point. Most people probably wouldn't like to be called fat to their face -- but might refer to themselves that way