2024 JonBenet Documentary

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The intruder theory is hard to buy because of the extended timeline. JB was alive for 45 mins to 2 hours after the blow to the head, then the garrote was used. And an intruder hung around to write a long "ransom" note when the child was dead and the body still in the house? With three other people in the house? Thought to retrieve a blanket from the drier to wrap up the body? Why would an intruder even look in the drier? It makes zero sense. Only Patsy would have thought to do that, likely after finding the body.

The CBS special showing how exactly the toy train track pins lined up with the marks on JB's body (which did not fit with taser marks) first made me believe it was not an intruder. The brother accidentally killing her then not understanding what he'd done is what makes the most sense to me. But there is not enough conclusive evidence to try this case successfully. Nothing adds up perfectly.

I think the garrote has always been the biggest question. Because it was made with materials in the house, and again would have taken time. Burke in his interview said something about one of his Swiss army knives having a hook that "helped tied knots." So maybe he could have tied the knots but it is very hard to believe a 9 year old boy would have thought to fashion a garrote. And JB was alive until the garrote was used. It's all just so weird.

Supposedly it wasn't really a garrote. That Burke might have fashioned to drag the body to hide it because he was afraid of getting in trouble. Thinking she was dead after he poked her with the train tracks and "played doctor" with the paint brush. It was made with a simple slip knot, which he would have learned in sailing if not Scouts. This theory is that it wasn't meant as a torture or killing instrument.

There was a theory that she was hit on the head with a large flashlight. Was there one in the house, and was it tested?

There was one and it was tested, but John Ramsey said it didn't belong to the family. Possibly a cop had set it down and left it. Other theories are that Burke's baseball bat or a gold club was used. I don't think they ever worked it out with any specificity.

Honestly I'm surprised they got as far as an indictment. There are far too many unknowns in this case. Although I find the intruder theory hard to swallow, for all the reasons outlined on this thread, I don't think there is enough evidence to determine what happened and who was responsible if it was a family member either. Looks like we'll never know. That poor child.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Former BFFs of the Ramseys wrote a long letter attributing the "failure of justice" to the corruption of the Boulder PD and the AG's office, but most of all to the Ramseys' failure to cooperate with authorities.

https://extras.denverpost.com/news/whiteltr.htm


They called for the Ramsey indictment to be unsealed, clearly think their former friends did it.

Eye opening letter. It's dry and hard to follow, but accuses the well-connected Ramsey legal team of using their influence and connections to throw up road blocks in the murder investigation. The authors even use the term "malfeasance" when outlining how the political establishment up to the Governor of Colorado and the prosecutors worked together to muddy the waters. The authors are careful to state how law enforcement worked hard to solve the case, but political machinations hampered their efforts.

You'd think the parents would have been in agony, believing their child's murderer was still out there. But never seemed to be. They obstructed the investigation at every turn.

They did what anyone would do if they were the prime suspect, according to the police, in a crime they didn’t commit. Why would you help the police in that case if the were going the wrong direction? Of course they lawyered up.

It was clear from day one the police decided to pin it on them. They were likely embarrassed that they contaminated the crime scene, thinking it was a kidnapping when it was not. It’s a wealthy community and people wanted the case solved.

The Ramseys hired top defense attorneys because they’re wealthy and that’s what anyone with half a brain who could afford it would do. The attorneys advised them not to talk to police. The one lawyer said there are a ton of innocent people in prison because they decided to talk to the police.

I think a lot of people deep down, want it to be the parents because it’s agonizing to think that maybe parents who did mostly the right things, but made a few mistakes like possibly exposing their daughter to more pedophiles than she normally she would’ve been exposed because of the pageant and things could have something like this happen to them. It’s why when somebody finds out someone has lung cancer immediately they want to know did you smoke people don’t like to think you can do mostly the right things and have something upsetting like this happen.

Exactly . Social psychologists call this “the just world hypothesis.”

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The intruder theory is hard to buy because of the extended timeline. JB was alive for 45 mins to 2 hours after the blow to the head, then the garrote was used. And an intruder hung around to write a long "ransom" note when the child was dead and the body still in the house? With three other people in the house? Thought to retrieve a blanket from the drier to wrap up the body? Why would an intruder even look in the drier? It makes zero sense. Only Patsy would have thought to do that, likely after finding the body.

The CBS special showing how exactly the toy train track pins lined up with the marks on JB's body (which did not fit with taser marks) first made me believe it was not an intruder. The brother accidentally killing her then not understanding what he'd done is what makes the most sense to me. But there is not enough conclusive evidence to try this case successfully. Nothing adds up perfectly.

I think the garrote has always been the biggest question. Because it was made with materials in the house, and again would have taken time. Burke in his interview said something about one of his Swiss army knives having a hook that "helped tied knots." So maybe he could have tied the knots but it is very hard to believe a 9 year old boy would have thought to fashion a garrote. And JB was alive until the garrote was used. It's all just so weird.

Supposedly it wasn't really a garrote. That Burke might have fashioned to drag the body to hide it because he was afraid of getting in trouble. Thinking she was dead after he poked her with the train tracks and "played doctor" with the paint brush. It was made with a simple slip knot, which he would have learned in sailing if not Scouts. This theory is that it wasn't meant as a torture or killing instrument.

But JB had her fingernail marks in her neck whee she clawed at it to get it off. It was a torture device. To choke her, then let her breath. It was not a set up after the fact. It was used in her for a specific purpose. Sorry but I can’t see Burke doing that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The intruder theory is hard to buy because of the extended timeline. JB was alive for 45 mins to 2 hours after the blow to the head, then the garrote was used. And an intruder hung around to write a long "ransom" note when the child was dead and the body still in the house? With three other people in the house? Thought to retrieve a blanket from the drier to wrap up the body? Why would an intruder even look in the drier? It makes zero sense. Only Patsy would have thought to do that, likely after finding the body.

The CBS special showing how exactly the toy train track pins lined up with the marks on JB's body (which did not fit with taser marks) first made me believe it was not an intruder. The brother accidentally killing her then not understanding what he'd done is what makes the most sense to me. But there is not enough conclusive evidence to try this case successfully. Nothing adds up perfectly.

Some loon on Reddit did a recreation with the same model of train tracks and it did seem to line up perfectly with the size and appearance of the marks. But there evidently wasn't a lot of attention paid to the marks on her back or face by the medical examiner because they were viewed as incidental in relation to the attack and murder. So the skin tissue wasn't closely analyzed and train tracks were not collected as evidence because this theory didn't even come up until years later. So it remains yet another intriguing but inconclusive piece of the puzzle.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The intruder theory is hard to buy because of the extended timeline. JB was alive for 45 mins to 2 hours after the blow to the head, then the garrote was used. And an intruder hung around to write a long "ransom" note when the child was dead and the body still in the house? With three other people in the house? Thought to retrieve a blanket from the drier to wrap up the body? Why would an intruder even look in the drier? It makes zero sense. Only Patsy would have thought to do that, likely after finding the body.

The CBS special showing how exactly the toy train track pins lined up with the marks on JB's body (which did not fit with taser marks) first made me believe it was not an intruder. The brother accidentally killing her then not understanding what he'd done is what makes the most sense to me. But there is not enough conclusive evidence to try this case successfully. Nothing adds up perfectly.

I think the garrote has always been the biggest question. Because it was made with materials in the house, and again would have taken time. Burke in his interview said something about one of his Swiss army knives having a hook that "helped tied knots." So maybe he could have tied the knots but it is very hard to believe a 9 year old boy would have thought to fashion a garrote. And JB was alive until the garrote was used. It's all just so weird.

Supposedly it wasn't really a garrote. That Burke might have fashioned to drag the body to hide it because he was afraid of getting in trouble. Thinking she was dead after he poked her with the train tracks and "played doctor" with the paint brush. It was made with a simple slip knot, which he would have learned in sailing if not Scouts. This theory is that it wasn't meant as a torture or killing instrument.

But JB had her fingernail marks in her neck where she clawed at it to get it off. It was a torture device. To choke her, then let her breath. It was not a set up after the fact. It was used in her for a specific purpose. Sorry but I can’t see Burke doing that.

The marks on her neck were from an altercation prior to the garrote being applied. She was wearing a turtleneck which her attacker grabbed in a fist and twisted. It is speculated that jonbenet clutched at her throat at that point defensively (hence the defense marks) and shortly thereafter was hit in the back of her head with the flashlight rendering her unconscious.

Once she was unconscious, she was poked at with the electric train tracks, experimented with the paintbrush and ultimately the paintbrush and string were used to fashion some of garrote or ligature which is what ultimately killed her. Autopsy stated that she died between 45 minutes-2 hours post brain injury. Her bladder emptied on the carpet outside the cellar where she was ultimately found.

The paintbrush and train tracks were in the basement and belonged to patsy and Burke, respectively. Patsy had purchased the string at a hardware store several weeks prior which was confirmed by the store and a receipt they produced.

After she died, JB was wiped down (stated in the autopsy), duct tape was applied on her mouth and string was loosely applied on her wrists to make it look like she’d been abducted. A multi page ransom note was written using a pad of paper and marker found in the kitchen.

All evidence and logic points to the family’s involvement.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The intruder theory is hard to buy because of the extended timeline. JB was alive for 45 mins to 2 hours after the blow to the head, then the garrote was used. And an intruder hung around to write a long "ransom" note when the child was dead and the body still in the house? With three other people in the house? Thought to retrieve a blanket from the drier to wrap up the body? Why would an intruder even look in the drier? It makes zero sense. Only Patsy would have thought to do that, likely after finding the body.

The CBS special showing how exactly the toy train track pins lined up with the marks on JB's body (which did not fit with taser marks) first made me believe it was not an intruder. The brother accidentally killing her then not understanding what he'd done is what makes the most sense to me. But there is not enough conclusive evidence to try this case successfully. Nothing adds up perfectly.

I think the garrote has always been the biggest question. Because it was made with materials in the house, and again would have taken time. Burke in his interview said something about one of his Swiss army knives having a hook that "helped tied knots." So maybe he could have tied the knots but it is very hard to believe a 9 year old boy would have thought to fashion a garrote. And JB was alive until the garrote was used. It's all just so weird.

Supposedly it wasn't really a garrote. That Burke might have fashioned to drag the body to hide it because he was afraid of getting in trouble. Thinking she was dead after he poked her with the train tracks and "played doctor" with the paint brush. It was made with a simple slip knot, which he would have learned in sailing if not Scouts. This theory is that it wasn't meant as a torture or killing instrument.

But JB had her fingernail marks in her neck where she clawed at it to get it off. It was a torture device. To choke her, then let her breath. It was not a set up after the fact. It was used in her for a specific purpose. Sorry but I can’t see Burke doing that.

The marks on her neck were from an altercation prior to the garrote being applied. She was wearing a turtleneck which her attacker grabbed in a fist and twisted. It is speculated that jonbenet clutched at her throat at that point defensively (hence the defense marks) and shortly thereafter was hit in the back of her head with the flashlight rendering her unconscious.

Once she was unconscious, she was poked at with the electric train tracks, experimented with the paintbrush and ultimately the paintbrush and string were used to fashion some of garrote or ligature which is what ultimately killed her. Autopsy stated that she died between 45 minutes-2 hours post brain injury. Her bladder emptied on the carpet outside the cellar where she was ultimately found.

The paintbrush and train tracks were in the basement and belonged to patsy and Burke, respectively. Patsy had purchased the string at a hardware store several weeks prior which was confirmed by the store and a receipt they produced.

After she died, JB was wiped down (stated in the autopsy), duct tape was applied on her mouth and string was loosely applied on her wrists to make it look like she’d been abducted. A multi page ransom note was written using a pad of paper and marker found in the kitchen.

All evidence and logic points to the family’s involvement.

Yes, agreed, but there still isn't enough evidence to convict.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Former BFFs of the Ramseys wrote a long letter attributing the "failure of justice" to the corruption of the Boulder PD and the AG's office, but most of all to the Ramseys' failure to cooperate with authorities.

https://extras.denverpost.com/news/whiteltr.htm


They called for the Ramsey indictment to be unsealed, clearly think their former friends did it.

Eye opening letter. It's dry and hard to follow, but accuses the well-connected Ramsey legal team of using their influence and connections to throw up road blocks in the murder investigation. The authors even use the term "malfeasance" when outlining how the political establishment up to the Governor of Colorado and the prosecutors worked together to muddy the waters. The authors are careful to state how law enforcement worked hard to solve the case, but political machinations hampered their efforts.

You'd think the parents would have been in agony, believing their child's murderer was still out there. But never seemed to be. They obstructed the investigation at every turn.

They were distraught upon finding out Burke did it. The 911 call pointed to this. They had to go into survival mode to protect their remaining family.

[Anonymous]

She knew John was guilty of something. Linda Arndt.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y3hT8hn9Y6M

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Former BFFs of the Ramseys wrote a long letter attributing the "failure of justice" to the corruption of the Boulder PD and the AG's office, but most of all to the Ramseys' failure to cooperate with authorities.

https://extras.denverpost.com/news/whiteltr.htm


They called for the Ramsey indictment to be unsealed, clearly think their former friends did it.

Eye opening letter. It's dry and hard to follow, but accuses the well-connected Ramsey legal team of using their influence and connections to throw up road blocks in the murder investigation. The authors even use the term "malfeasance" when outlining how the political establishment up to the Governor of Colorado and the prosecutors worked together to muddy the waters. The authors are careful to state how law enforcement worked hard to solve the case, but political machinations hampered their efforts.

You'd think the parents would have been in agony, believing their child's murderer was still out there. But never seemed to be. They obstructed the investigation at every turn.

They were distraught upon finding out Burke did it. The 911 call pointed to this. They had to go into survival mode to protect their remaining family.

I just can't envision a 9 year old hitting with enough force to cause an 8" skull fracture. Or breaking the paintbrush to use it in different ways in the assault. But I also can't see an intruder hanging around the house for hours, when Burke and Patsy seem to have been awake at various points, either.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:John's story just doesn't add up. He broke the basement window himself weeks or months ago. He thought someone repaired it. So is that how the intruder entered the house?

I don't get how the kids were using the room as a toy train room and play room with a broken window. Did the parents never go to the room? Patsy supposedly had paint supplies nearby.

Wouldn't it be cold with a broken window?

My thoughts exactly. Every time you walked down stairs, you’d feel cold air pumping in.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Former BFFs of the Ramseys wrote a long letter attributing the "failure of justice" to the corruption of the Boulder PD and the AG's office, but most of all to the Ramseys' failure to cooperate with authorities.

https://extras.denverpost.com/news/whiteltr.htm


They called for the Ramsey indictment to be unsealed, clearly think their former friends did it.

Eye opening letter. It's dry and hard to follow, but accuses the well-connected Ramsey legal team of using their influence and connections to throw up road blocks in the murder investigation. The authors even use the term "malfeasance" when outlining how the political establishment up to the Governor of Colorado and the prosecutors worked together to muddy the waters. The authors are careful to state how law enforcement worked hard to solve the case, but political machinations hampered their efforts.

You'd think the parents would have been in agony, believing their child's murderer was still out there. But never seemed to be. They obstructed the investigation at every turn.

They were distraught upon finding out Burke did it. The 911 call pointed to this. They had to go into survival mode to protect their remaining family.

Exactly. One person was not distraught: Burke. When they arranged for him to go to their friends house the day JB was missing, he grabbed his game boy and asked no questions. When a police officer went over to informally interview him, Burke said he was hungry and asked for a sandwich. Every family members picture was taken that day - Jon and patsy looked exhausted and anguished. Burke smiled.

There isn’t enough evidence to convict the family, and Burke was under 10 when it happened, but family involvement is pretty clear.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Former BFFs of the Ramseys wrote a long letter attributing the "failure of justice" to the corruption of the Boulder PD and the AG's office, but most of all to the Ramseys' failure to cooperate with authorities.

https://extras.denverpost.com/news/whiteltr.htm


They called for the Ramsey indictment to be unsealed, clearly think their former friends did it.

Eye opening letter. It's dry and hard to follow, but accuses the well-connected Ramsey legal team of using their influence and connections to throw up road blocks in the murder investigation. The authors even use the term "malfeasance" when outlining how the political establishment up to the Governor of Colorado and the prosecutors worked together to muddy the waters. The authors are careful to state how law enforcement worked hard to solve the case, but political machinations hampered their efforts.

You'd think the parents would have been in agony, believing their child's murderer was still out there. But never seemed to be. They obstructed the investigation at every turn.

They were distraught upon finding out Burke did it. The 911 call pointed to this. They had to go into survival mode to protect their remaining family.

Exactly. One person was not distraught: Burke. When they arranged for him to go to their friends house the day JB was missing, he grabbed his game boy and asked no questions. When a police officer went over to informally interview him, Burke said he was hungry and asked for a sandwich. Every family members picture was taken that day - Jon and patsy looked exhausted and anguished. Burke smiled.

There isn’t enough evidence to convict the family, and Burke was under 10 when it happened, but family involvement is pretty clear.

Those of us with autistic kids don't find Burke's reaction at all unusual. These kids live in their own world and are pretty emotionally detached as a rule.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Former BFFs of the Ramseys wrote a long letter attributing the "failure of justice" to the corruption of the Boulder PD and the AG's office, but most of all to the Ramseys' failure to cooperate with authorities.

https://extras.denverpost.com/news/whiteltr.htm


They called for the Ramsey indictment to be unsealed, clearly think their former friends did it.

Eye opening letter. It's dry and hard to follow, but accuses the well-connected Ramsey legal team of using their influence and connections to throw up road blocks in the murder investigation. The authors even use the term "malfeasance" when outlining how the political establishment up to the Governor of Colorado and the prosecutors worked together to muddy the waters. The authors are careful to state how law enforcement worked hard to solve the case, but political machinations hampered their efforts.

You'd think the parents would have been in agony, believing their child's murderer was still out there. But never seemed to be. They obstructed the investigation at every turn.

They were distraught upon finding out Burke did it. The 911 call pointed to this. They had to go into survival mode to protect their remaining family.

Exactly. One person was not distraught: Burke. When they arranged for him to go to their friends house the day JB was missing, he grabbed his game boy and asked no questions. When a police officer went over to informally interview him, Burke said he was hungry and asked for a sandwich. Every family members picture was taken that day - Jon and patsy looked exhausted and anguished. Burke smiled.

There isn’t enough evidence to convict the family, and Burke was under 10 when it happened, but family involvement is pretty clear.

Those of us with autistic kids don't find Burke's reaction at all unusual. These kids live in their own world and are pretty emotionally detached as a rule.

Okay and it’s not a huge leap to believe that the brother who had a history of harming jonbenet and behaviors (like his fecal matter that was found in two places in her bedroom) was responsible for harming her and remaining detached from it.

And while Burke may have been on what would today be defined as the spectrum, he was verbal and in a mainstream classroom - so, high functioning so to speak. It was a lot less common for similarly afflicted kids to be diagnosed and treated with psychiatric medications in the 90s.

[Anonymous]

Lou Smit seemed the competent investigator on the whole lot so in inclined to believe him.

That wide eyed Linda Arndt from the boulder police force looked like something straight out of central casting. What a loon.

And Steve Thomas went to work in the private sector after resigning in disgrace. Speaks volumes that he never returned to police work.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Former BFFs of the Ramseys wrote a long letter attributing the "failure of justice" to the corruption of the Boulder PD and the AG's office, but most of all to the Ramseys' failure to cooperate with authorities.

https://extras.denverpost.com/news/whiteltr.htm


They called for the Ramsey indictment to be unsealed, clearly think their former friends did it.

Eye opening letter. It's dry and hard to follow, but accuses the well-connected Ramsey legal team of using their influence and connections to throw up road blocks in the murder investigation. The authors even use the term "malfeasance" when outlining how the political establishment up to the Governor of Colorado and the prosecutors worked together to muddy the waters. The authors are careful to state how law enforcement worked hard to solve the case, but political machinations hampered their efforts.

You'd think the parents would have been in agony, believing their child's murderer was still out there. But never seemed to be. They obstructed the investigation at every turn.

They were distraught upon finding out Burke did it. The 911 call pointed to this. They had to go into survival mode to protect their remaining family.

Exactly. One person was not distraught: Burke. When they arranged for him to go to their friends house the day JB was missing, he grabbed his game boy and asked no questions. When a police officer went over to informally interview him, Burke said he was hungry and asked for a sandwich. Every family members picture was taken that day - Jon and patsy looked exhausted and anguished. Burke smiled.

There isn’t enough evidence to convict the family, and Burke was under 10 when it happened, but family involvement is pretty clear.

Those of us with autistic kids don't find Burke's reaction at all unusual. These kids live in their own world and are pretty emotionally detached as a rule.

Okay and it’s not a huge leap to believe that the brother who had a history of harming jonbenet and behaviors (like his fecal matter that was found in two places in her bedroom) was responsible for harming her and remaining detached from it.

And while Burke may have been on what would today be defined as the spectrum, he was verbal and in a mainstream classroom - so, high functioning so to speak. It was a lot less common for similarly afflicted kids to be diagnosed and treated with psychiatric medications in the 90s.

It actually is a huge leap to go from sibling fighting to sadistic ritual killing.