Harvard or Columbia - Where would you go?
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Anonymous
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“ The College and School of Engineering do not manipulate any SAT scores, grades from high school or student to faculty ratio.”
Sure. They just fail to mention that 1/3 of the undergraduates enrolled are taking the same classes with many of the same students whose scores/grades/etc were sent to USNWR. It’s disingenuous at the very least and fraudulent at the worst. |
Anonymous
While this criticizing the university over having non-traditional (a.k.a. non-teenagers) attending is rather weird: "Notable alumni include Nobel Prize winners Simon Kuznets, Baruj Benacerraf, and Louise Glück, as well as Isaac Asimov, J.D. Salinger, Amelia Earhart, and Princess Firyal of Jordan.[8]" https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Columbia_University_School_of_General_Studies So it's essentially way for highly accomplished adults (and in one case, royalty) to attend the school with different criteria for admissions considering these are adults, not high school kids with no professional background where judging GPAs and SATs is the only way. This brings up the value of the university in my eyes, if anything. Makes the school more connected to the real world than having a cloistered 4-year college experience. |
Anonymous
Not sure what your beef is. Harvard's extension is HUGE. U of MD also has extension classes. Who doesn't? So, what's your point? |
Anonymous
| So the very low acceptance rate at Columbia really applies to only 1/3 of its undergraduate student body. Nice manipulation that obviously has worked in its flavor to be overanked at USNWR. |
Anonymous
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The School of General Studies has veterans from the military, business people , writers, etc. I was an undergraduate at Columbia College.The College is clearly a separate institution with separate admissions criteria, a separate admissions office, and a separate degree which says Columbia College on the degree on a separate diploma in Latin.
I met GS students on campus and they ALWAYS ENRICHED my college experience, and became like older brother or sister to me. Rarely were they in my classes as GS has its own faculty, its own building on campus and its own corses. The times when GS students were in my classes, they always enriched the texture of the discusions, provided insights that 18-22 year olds could not possibly obtain otherwise. They always made the classes more meaningful. Most classes however, were with members of the College, and not GS. In any event, my time at Columbia was a fantastic, magical buffet of intellectual and cultrual opportunities. The few GS students I interacted with made this learning experience at Columbia even better. |
Anonymous
"Because the average age of GS students is 26, they usually have 8 to 10 more years of experience in life than traditional college students. That means that diversity at Columbia is not only measured by ethnicity and gender, but also by experience and maturity—a maturity we find leads to great academic success. At GS, you'll join a community of students who after graduation go on to pursue advanced degrees and lead stimulating professional lives." While a portion of Columbia GS students are transfer students, the criteria of nontraditional students extend beyond that to student veterans and others who had interruptions in their educational careers. The presence of GS students (integrated in classes unlike Harvard Extension) makes the experience for Columbia College and Engineering students a very unique one. If a potential CC/SEAS applicant believes that a college environment with classmates that have vastly different life experiences is ideal, that is great. If not, that is fine too; there are many other great options out there. What is not right is to assume that these non-traditional students are inferior to CC/SEAS students; their acceptance rate is higher, but that is mostly due to self-selection, as not many 26 year olds would think about going to college. In fact, their GPA averages are higher than CC students. It may be argued that Columbia is manipulating their data when they don't put in GS admissions statistics along with the CC/SEAS data. However, the higher acceptance rate and lower SAT score average that would result from this would be misleading because those who are eligible to apply to CC/SEAS are usually ineligible to apply to GS. Moreover, USNWR recently stopped using acceptance rates in their methodology. If anything, integrating GS students and giving many a second chance to receive a world-class liberal arts education should be perceived as being an inclusive program to those who may not have had the privilege in their childhood to worry about taking 15 AP classes and making a non-profit and whatnot. |
Anonymous
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“ Columbia GS, along with Brown RUE and Yale Eli Whitney, offer identical classes alongside the normal aged student body at the same tuition and grant the same degree. This, one can actually say they graduated from these schools with all the meaning that implies and with no qualification. HES, unfortunately, does not offer that status and so an extension graduate is left to either hoodwink the public or admit that they did not graduate from “real Harvard.”
Therein lies the difference Once again “Columbia GS, along with Brown RUE and Yale Eli Whitney, offer identical classes alongside the normal aged student body at the same tuition and grant the same degree” |
Anonymous
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“Moreover, USNWR recently stopped using acceptance rates in their methodology.”
This is true. It still doesn’t excuse Columbia however. |
Anonymous
Is Harvard any different with their 30,000 extension students? That's a small city by itself. Are they counted in the acceptance rate at Harvard? |
Anonymous
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"Because the average age of GS students is 26, they usually have 8 to 10 more years of experience in life than traditional college students.”
That’s fine and dandy for older students, but I seriously wonder if the average 18 year old starting out at Columbia realizes that up to 1/3 of his/her class is going to be over the age of 25? Since Columbia shows such a low acceptance rate, is it really that elite considering 1/3 of its undergraduates are way past high school testing/transcripts. Personally, when I was 18, I wouldn’t want to be in a classroom with such a high percentage of older students. Socially I would find it a bit awkward. |
Anonymous
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With respect, you seem to have some hangups about Columbia as a university.
FACT : 18-22 year olds are at the College, and these students who are direct from high school cannot apply to the School of General Studies. Conversely, 21 year olds and older cannot apply to Columbia College or to SEAS. What is your point ? WHY are you deliberately muddying the facts ? USNWR can make a separate entry for General Studies and its rankings with admisssions. USNWR is reporting about Columbia College and SEAS. Everyone understand this - except apparently you. Were you rejected ? Is this the reason for your deliberate blurring of the facts about separate programs ? USNWR is ONLY about the College and SEAS as separate admissions and educational institutions with their own faculties. Please get a life and stop falsely accusing excellent programs and intentions. |
Anonymous
Is Harvard any different with their 30,000 extension students? That's a small city by itself. The irony of it all when Harvard might have invented extension school. Talk about PP shooting himself or herself in the foot. |
Anonymous
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“Rarely were they in my classes as GS has its own faculty, its own building on campus and its own corses.”
Really? That’s not what is reported by the school. SGS students are taking classes right along with you. “ The School of General Studies is Columbia’s college for nontraditional students who want to earn a degree while attending full- or part-time. Nontraditional students have had a break of one year or more in their educational paths or have compelling personal or professional reasons for completing their bachelor’s degrees part time. Students in the School of General Studies take the same courses with the same faculty and undertake the same majors as all other undergraduates at Columbia” Are you sure you attended Columbia University in New York City? |
Anonymous
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ThE GS students have their own faculty and their own classes. I have never heard of a class int he College or SEAS where 'up to 1/3 of the class is GS students.' Complete favbricated nonsense. My classes and all that I saw were 100% College students in the core courses, and in some other courses maybe a few GS students.
Most GS students took their classes with the GS faculty. False and duplicitous remarks by someone who knows nothing about the stuation. Envy maybe ? |
Anonymous
| Are you sure 30,000 students are taking classes each term with Harvard College students., SGS students at Columbia are! |