Hate having kids

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:OP has posted many, many times. She is completely lacking in insight. Not quite sure what she’s hoping to get from these repeated threads. Just letting everyone know so they can stop wasting their time. OP, just give your kids to their dad already.

They are not comfortable with him. I am the preferred parent. He did 0 for the first 6 years of parenting. Literally ZERO.

That still would not solve the problem. I've already wasted 10 years into this nonsense and I can't fix the trajectory. Him having the kids only would not improve anything and in fact, make it worse.

I wanted to know if people could enjoy kids as adults if they did not like parenting. So far, no one really has that answer. That was the point of the post. I know my life sucks so I don't need more piling on. Be fortunate that you did not have circumstances take your life in a direction you absolutely did not want and then have to deal with the lifelong consequences. There is no "coping" or "therapy" that can fix that. It is what it is and I just have to deal with it.

No one has answered because there are virtually no people who get to year 10 of parenting that feel like you feel. There are people who don't like certain parts of parenting, there are people who feel resentment because they have kids but they still love their kids, but what YOU describe points to a person in a mental health crisis.

People are saying that for YOU, with these problems and your outlook on life, it will not get better, because life is not just about things magically getting better. You have to make them better.

It will get better when your kids get older and more independent and drift from you. And you can become a distant mother and not interact with grandchildren if you don't want.

I'm going to give you a different piece of advice OP, since you clearly aren't really interested in fixing yourself. Get your kids in therapy, and explain these thoughts you have to their therapists. So your children can figure out how to grapple with having a parent like you in a healthy way. I grew up in a very privileged home, my childhood was 'so much better than my parents' and yet, all the money in the world can't buy you emotionally stable parents. And unfortunately kids need that a lot more than they need whatever it is you're buying for them.

So no, your situation will not improve but again, it is because you seem committed to doing literally nothing to improve it.

I am not having a mental health crisis. This is how I feel every day. I survive. That is it. It's drudgery but it is what it is. A mental health crisis is sudden and drastic and an overwhelming feeling of depression. I am not depressed. I was just hoping someone would say, "yeah, I did not particularly like parenting but I enjoy having adult kids."

Being depressed for 10 years and being unable to have a constant love an attachment to children entering double digits is in fact a mental health crisis. It sounds like its been doing on for a very long time.

I know what you were hoping for, but instead you are getting a chorus of people saying your mindset is extremely troubling and abnormal and suggesting you need a medical intervention. You are saying 'you guys are crazy' because you have existed this way for so long you don't recognize the harm and critical nature of the crisis. You're a frog in a hot pot OP. Maybe it will never actually boil, but its close, and its certainly not going to get any cooler.

I am not depressed. I know what depression is. This is not depression. It's not a mental health crisis. People are beginning to understand that a lot of women don't want children...well, I felt this way many years ago, which was unacceptable for many to believe. I am simply the reality of what happens when people have kids that they don't want. They don't enjoy it. They don't change their mind. It is okay not to want kids. Unfortunately, I got myself into a situation in which the last thing I wanted (and I was vocal about it and there was a no kids agreement) became my reality. I'm not depressed. I am just being honest about how I truly feel on an anonymous board.

No one is saying it is wrong or unnatural to not want children. Of course it is ok to not want kids. But it is unnatural to be unable to form a normal bond with another human you are hard wired to love. Which is what you are describing. And many people are saying that you are FAR from the first or last person to face a life circumstance that they did not want to face, and many people in your situation are able to find joy where they can and be happy while still being disappointed or upset about the bad. The fact that you are unable to do this is a sign that you need help.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I’m sorry OP. I’d encourage you to talk to a therapist just to come up with strategies. Our US system of child rearing doesn’t help. In many other cultures, having multiple households and/or generations living together helps alleviate the stress. Many of my cousins loved basically nannying their nieces and nephews. We are so nuclear-family oriented that there can be drawbacks (obviously varies based on individuals and the family dynamics). Wealthy people have the resources for endless sitters, boarding schools, etc. Thats just a different reality.

Parenting can be a slog sometimes but hopefully you love your children and can hold on to the positives.

What positives? I really feel like there literally are none.

Do you love your children?

Sometimes. Not worth it.

I'm getting the sense from your responses that you view love as transactional. But most people would say that relationships are transformational . . . the act of loving makes us happier (because creating joy in others creates joy in ourselves -- we are all connected). It's not just about receiving love.

It sounds like the part of you capable of caring for others for their own sake was never developed or hidden away to protect yourself in childhood.

DP.. I figured out what OP's problem is... OP is a narcissist.

How can you only love your kids "sometimes", and think they are not worth that love?

It means you only love them when it's probably easy to love them, and even that moment is not worth having kids.

You don't really love them, which is obviously incredibly sad.

Your problem is that you are a narcissist. It's all about *you*.

You are correct that you should never have had any children. Narcissists really shouldn't. But, it's too late now, and I would suggest you get therapy for your narcissim. I 100% think that your kids will need therapy in the future for having a narcissistic parent.

And I'm a PP who stated that I don't really enjoy all aspects of parenting, and never thought about having kids myself. I firmly believe women can be happy without kids, but OP's issue is that she is a narcissist, not that she doesn't like kids. OP may even be anti-social. I know several women who don't like kids, but love theirs unconditionally, including myself. But, narcissists cannot love anyone but themselves, and even the love they *sometimes* have is conditional, and as a PP noted, transactional.

I don't think OP or her grandmothers were depressed. I think they had a mental condition.

I am not a narcissist. My dad is. You have no idea.

I don't like kids and have said that. I'm not antisocial and I've been in love. I don't like large groups but I like close relationships. I know far more about narcs than you.

Let me understand...

Your dad is a narcissist.
Your grandmothers also hated having kids; presumably, one was the mother to your narcissistic father.

You have a family history of mental health issues. You need therapy.

I'm the PP who also wrote that if your kids were a product of rape, then it's understandable how you don't really love them. You said you only love them "sometimes", but you can't love someone only "sometimes". That's a completely narcissistic way of loving someone.

You can feel a rush of love sometimes and not other times. But no, I don't love them like I love a sibling. I love him no matter what. I used to say I love my kids no matter what but I don't think that is really the case. Sometimes I am too angry at the circumstances to feel that love.

Almost every parent would describe the reverse of what you describe (siblings vs kids). This is a narcissistic way of loving someone. You do need help.

agree

I raised my sibling. That sibling was not forced upon me. It's different.

once again.. your issue with your kid is resentment. You need therapy to get over the resentment of your kids. I understand that they were foisted on you, that you felt you did not have much of a choice. You need to learn to deal with that resentment. You have let it fester for a decade. It's no wonder you take little enjoyment of your kids, and probably can't love them, not really.

[Anonymous]

For somebody stating such overtly abnormal thoughts and feelings, you are awfully confident that you couldn't benefit at all from therapy or have any mental health needs yourself.

Often, it is the people with the most to learn who think they have the least. Meanwhile, well-adjusted people are open to finding even more and better ways to be a healthy and whole person. Your knee-jerk rejection of all suggestions of practical help is just another symptom of your serious and deep problems.

I had a really loving upbringing without any real trauma, but sometimes in life I've still hit difficult times and benefited from therapy. For instance, I needed to grieve the sudden loss of a parent, and another time I discovered my spouse was having an affair. Grief at loss and betrayal is a very normal and natural thing -- it doesn't mean that there was anything wrong with me -- but I still benefited from dedicating that hour every week to working through my feelings with a professional. And again, despite my history of no known mental illness or FOO issues, I've never had a chorus of therapists telling me, "Oh you? No way should you do therapy!" I wonder if you heard what you wanted to hear in what they said (if for no other reason than therapists would be out of business if they went around telling people with trauma as deep as yours that they are fine and should just not bother with therapy).


The fact that you didn't want children and the fact that you haven't bonded with your children are two separate issues. The former is fairly common, as you assert. The latter is not. As I mentioned in another comment, we are biologically designed to bond with our children. Our survival is literally at stake. Your genetic history and upbringing combined to cause you great difficulty in this area. In your rational mind, you aware that your children have needs that you need to provide. Emotional closeness is one of those needs. If you still won't go to therapy, I suggest reading up on healthy attachment.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Am I the only one getting troll vibes from this whole thread?

The OP posts about this same thing ALL THE TIME. I don't think she's a troll, unfortunately. Unless she's a really determined, relentless troll who just loves to trot out the same exact topic over and over.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I’m sorry OP. I’d encourage you to talk to a therapist just to come up with strategies. Our US system of child rearing doesn’t help. In many other cultures, having multiple households and/or generations living together helps alleviate the stress. Many of my cousins loved basically nannying their nieces and nephews. We are so nuclear-family oriented that there can be drawbacks (obviously varies based on individuals and the family dynamics). Wealthy people have the resources for endless sitters, boarding schools, etc. Thats just a different reality.

Parenting can be a slog sometimes but hopefully you love your children and can hold on to the positives.

What positives? I really feel like there literally are none.

Do you love your children?

Sometimes. Not worth it.

I'm getting the sense from your responses that you view love as transactional. But most people would say that relationships are transformational . . . the act of loving makes us happier (because creating joy in others creates joy in ourselves -- we are all connected). It's not just about receiving love.

It sounds like the part of you capable of caring for others for their own sake was never developed or hidden away to protect yourself in childhood.

DP.. I figured out what OP's problem is... OP is a narcissist.

How can you only love your kids "sometimes", and think they are not worth that love?

It means you only love them when it's probably easy to love them, and even that moment is not worth having kids.

You don't really love them, which is obviously incredibly sad.

Your problem is that you are a narcissist. It's all about *you*.

You are correct that you should never have had any children. Narcissists really shouldn't. But, it's too late now, and I would suggest you get therapy for your narcissim. I 100% think that your kids will need therapy in the future for having a narcissistic parent.

And I'm a PP who stated that I don't really enjoy all aspects of parenting, and never thought about having kids myself. I firmly believe women can be happy without kids, but OP's issue is that she is a narcissist, not that she doesn't like kids. OP may even be anti-social. I know several women who don't like kids, but love theirs unconditionally, including myself. But, narcissists cannot love anyone but themselves, and even the love they *sometimes* have is conditional, and as a PP noted, transactional.

I don't think OP or her grandmothers were depressed. I think they had a mental condition.

I am not a narcissist. My dad is. You have no idea.

I don't like kids and have said that. I'm not antisocial and I've been in love. I don't like large groups but I like close relationships. I know far more about narcs than you.

Narcissism usually develops as a result of childhood trauma and is more likely when one of the parents, or both, are narcissistic or have narcissistic traits. The fact that you think your dad was one is reason enough to go to therapy to explore yourself. Ask me how I know... so yea... please go and get yourself help.

newsflash: I have been to therapy. I am not a narc. I have been told by more than one therapist I don't need to be there and I know what to do. It is not helpful. There is nothing a therapist says or does that I do not know already. I've been down that road. It's not useful or helpful. This is just my life. That is it. I will likely not enjoy kids any more as adults. No one really seems to have an answer about that and that was the point of the post.

What is it that you have to do?

Newsflash: a ton of people have had bad sh1t happen to them that changed their trajectory: from deaths, to divorce, unwanted pregnancy (with or without rape), and people learn to deal with it or seek therapy to help deal with it.

Your attitude is deafetist at best, and miserable at worst.

You won't enjoy your adult kids because you are a miserable person. You won't care if your kids don't visit you, call you on your bday, xmas, spend Thanksgiving with you. Is that what you want to hear? Or are you expecting your kids to be more interesting when they become adults, and only then can you really feel some kind of connection to them? I think this is what Trump was like as a parent. He had zero to do with his kids until they turned 18. And we all know Trump is a narcissist.

I don’t like holidays. It would be sheer relief to opt out of all of them forever. No, I am not expecting kids to be more interesting as adults—I am expecting to not have it be so annoying to have them. I do not like being around kids. The worst is a group of kids.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Am I the only one getting troll vibes from this whole thread?

The OP posts about this same thing ALL THE TIME. I don't think she's a troll, unfortunately. Unless she's a really determined, relentless troll who just loves to trot out the same exact topic over and over.

I have posted twice maybe in two years.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:You're all wasting your time. Op posts the same thing every few months
She isn't going to do a damn thing to improve her circumstances.
Hopefully the kids have someone in their lives who loves them

+1. She posts here all the time and then responds to almost every poster who tries to post helpful comments to tell them why their suggestions won't work.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Am I the only one getting troll vibes from this whole thread?

The OP posts about this same thing ALL THE TIME. I don't think she's a troll, unfortunately. Unless she's a really determined, relentless troll who just loves to trot out the same exact topic over and over.

I have posted twice maybe in two years.

OK then there are 2 posters who post this same scenario constantly.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:OP has posted many, many times. She is completely lacking in insight. Not quite sure what she’s hoping to get from these repeated threads. Just letting everyone know so they can stop wasting their time. OP, just give your kids to their dad already.

They are not comfortable with him. I am the preferred parent. He did 0 for the first 6 years of parenting. Literally ZERO.

That still would not solve the problem. I've already wasted 10 years into this nonsense and I can't fix the trajectory. Him having the kids only would not improve anything and in fact, make it worse.

I wanted to know if people could enjoy kids as adults if they did not like parenting. So far, no one really has that answer. That was the point of the post. I know my life sucks so I don't need more piling on. Be fortunate that you did not have circumstances take your life in a direction you absolutely did not want and then have to deal with the lifelong consequences. There is no "coping" or "therapy" that can fix that. It is what it is and I just have to deal with it.

No one has answered because there are virtually no people who get to year 10 of parenting that feel like you feel. There are people who don't like certain parts of parenting, there are people who feel resentment because they have kids but they still love their kids, but what YOU describe points to a person in a mental health crisis.

People are saying that for YOU, with these problems and your outlook on life, it will not get better, because life is not just about things magically getting better. You have to make them better.

It will get better when your kids get older and more independent and drift from you. And you can become a distant mother and not interact with grandchildren if you don't want.

I'm going to give you a different piece of advice OP, since you clearly aren't really interested in fixing yourself. Get your kids in therapy, and explain these thoughts you have to their therapists. So your children can figure out how to grapple with having a parent like you in a healthy way. I grew up in a very privileged home, my childhood was 'so much better than my parents' and yet, all the money in the world can't buy you emotionally stable parents. And unfortunately kids need that a lot more than they need whatever it is you're buying for them.

So no, your situation will not improve but again, it is because you seem committed to doing literally nothing to improve it.

I am not having a mental health crisis. This is how I feel every day. I survive. That is it. It's drudgery but it is what it is. A mental health crisis is sudden and drastic and an overwhelming feeling of depression. I am not depressed. I was just hoping someone would say, "yeah, I did not particularly like parenting but I enjoy having adult kids."

Being depressed for 10 years and being unable to have a constant love an attachment to children entering double digits is in fact a mental health crisis. It sounds like its been doing on for a very long time.

I know what you were hoping for, but instead you are getting a chorus of people saying your mindset is extremely troubling and abnormal and suggesting you need a medical intervention. You are saying 'you guys are crazy' because you have existed this way for so long you don't recognize the harm and critical nature of the crisis. You're a frog in a hot pot OP. Maybe it will never actually boil, but its close, and its certainly not going to get any cooler.

I am not depressed. I know what depression is. This is not depression. It's not a mental health crisis. People are beginning to understand that a lot of women don't want children...well, I felt this way many years ago, which was unacceptable for many to believe. I am simply the reality of what happens when people have kids that they don't want. They don't enjoy it. They don't change their mind. It is okay not to want kids. Unfortunately, I got myself into a situation in which the last thing I wanted (and I was vocal about it and there was a no kids agreement) became my reality. I'm not depressed. I am just being honest about how I truly feel on an anonymous board.

No one is saying it is wrong or unnatural to not want children. Of course it is ok to not want kids. But it is unnatural to be unable to form a normal bond with another human you are hard wired to love. Which is what you are describing. And many people are saying that you are FAR from the first or last person to face a life circumstance that they did not want to face, and many people in your situation are able to find joy where they can and be happy while still being disappointed or upset about the bad. The fact that you are unable to do this is a sign that you need help.

You can love them and not feel it is worth it the effort, time or sacrifice.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:For somebody stating such overtly abnormal thoughts and feelings, you are awfully confident that you couldn't benefit at all from therapy or have any mental health needs yourself.

Often, it is the people with the most to learn who think they have the least. Meanwhile, well-adjusted people are open to finding even more and better ways to be a healthy and whole person. Your knee-jerk rejection of all suggestions of practical help is just another symptom of your serious and deep problems.

I had a really loving upbringing without any real trauma, but sometimes in life I've still hit difficult times and benefited from therapy. For instance, I needed to grieve the sudden loss of a parent, and another time I discovered my spouse was having an affair. Grief at loss and betrayal is a very normal and natural thing -- it doesn't mean that there was anything wrong with me -- but I still benefited from dedicating that hour every week to working through my feelings with a professional. And again, despite my history of no known mental illness or FOO issues, I've never had a chorus of therapists telling me, "Oh you? No way should you do therapy!" I wonder if you heard what you wanted to hear in what they said (if for no other reason than therapists would be out of business if they went around telling people with trauma as deep as yours that they are fine and should just not bother with therapy).


The fact that you didn't want children and the fact that you haven't bonded with your children are two separate issues. The former is fairly common, as you assert. The latter is not. As I mentioned in another comment, we are biologically designed to bond with our children. Our survival is literally at stake. Your genetic history and upbringing combined to cause you great difficulty in this area. In your rational mind, you aware that your children have needs that you need to provide. Emotional closeness is one of those needs. If you still won't go to therapy, I suggest reading up on healthy attachment.

I have been an editor of a mental health journal. I assure you I do not need to read anything. I’ve read it all. I know a ton about mental health issues. People can really stop posting the therapy stuff. I know it all.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m sorry OP. I’d encourage you to talk to a therapist just to come up with strategies. Our US system of child rearing doesn’t help. In many other cultures, having multiple households and/or generations living together helps alleviate the stress. Many of my cousins loved basically nannying their nieces and nephews. We are so nuclear-family oriented that there can be drawbacks (obviously varies based on individuals and the family dynamics). Wealthy people have the resources for endless sitters, boarding schools, etc. Thats just a different reality.

Parenting can be a slog sometimes but hopefully you love your children and can hold on to the positives.

What positives? I really feel like there literally are none.

Do you love your children?

Sometimes. Not worth it.

I'm getting the sense from your responses that you view love as transactional. But most people would say that relationships are transformational . . . the act of loving makes us happier (because creating joy in others creates joy in ourselves -- we are all connected). It's not just about receiving love.

It sounds like the part of you capable of caring for others for their own sake was never developed or hidden away to protect yourself in childhood.

DP.. I figured out what OP's problem is... OP is a narcissist.

How can you only love your kids "sometimes", and think they are not worth that love?

It means you only love them when it's probably easy to love them, and even that moment is not worth having kids.

You don't really love them, which is obviously incredibly sad.

Your problem is that you are a narcissist. It's all about *you*.

You are correct that you should never have had any children. Narcissists really shouldn't. But, it's too late now, and I would suggest you get therapy for your narcissim. I 100% think that your kids will need therapy in the future for having a narcissistic parent.

And I'm a PP who stated that I don't really enjoy all aspects of parenting, and never thought about having kids myself. I firmly believe women can be happy without kids, but OP's issue is that she is a narcissist, not that she doesn't like kids. OP may even be anti-social. I know several women who don't like kids, but love theirs unconditionally, including myself. But, narcissists cannot love anyone but themselves, and even the love they *sometimes* have is conditional, and as a PP noted, transactional.

I don't think OP or her grandmothers were depressed. I think they had a mental condition.

I am not a narcissist. My dad is. You have no idea.

I don't like kids and have said that. I'm not antisocial and I've been in love. I don't like large groups but I like close relationships. I know far more about narcs than you.

Narcissism usually develops as a result of childhood trauma and is more likely when one of the parents, or both, are narcissistic or have narcissistic traits. The fact that you think your dad was one is reason enough to go to therapy to explore yourself. Ask me how I know... so yea... please go and get yourself help.

newsflash: I have been to therapy. I am not a narc. I have been told by more than one therapist I don't need to be there and I know what to do. It is not helpful. There is nothing a therapist says or does that I do not know already. I've been down that road. It's not useful or helpful. This is just my life. That is it. I will likely not enjoy kids any more as adults. No one really seems to have an answer about that and that was the point of the post.

What is it that you have to do?

Newsflash: a ton of people have had bad sh1t happen to them that changed their trajectory: from deaths, to divorce, unwanted pregnancy (with or without rape), and people learn to deal with it or seek therapy to help deal with it.

Your attitude is deafetist at best, and miserable at worst.

You won't enjoy your adult kids because you are a miserable person. You won't care if your kids don't visit you, call you on your bday, xmas, spend Thanksgiving with you. Is that what you want to hear? Or are you expecting your kids to be more interesting when they become adults, and only then can you really feel some kind of connection to them? I think this is what Trump was like as a parent. He had zero to do with his kids until they turned 18. And we all know Trump is a narcissist.

I don’t like holidays. It would be sheer relief to opt out of all of them forever. No, I am not expecting kids to be more interesting as adults—I am expecting to not have it be so annoying to have them. I do not like being around kids. The worst is a group of kids.

Ok OP - let's try this - why WOULDN'T it be better once they are adults? You could go weeks or months or years without seeing them, and when you do see them, they will not be kids anymore.

Why do you have to ask this question at all? It seems obvious that if the problem is not liking kids, it will be solved when your kids are no longer kids. Yes?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m sorry OP. I’d encourage you to talk to a therapist just to come up with strategies. Our US system of child rearing doesn’t help. In many other cultures, having multiple households and/or generations living together helps alleviate the stress. Many of my cousins loved basically nannying their nieces and nephews. We are so nuclear-family oriented that there can be drawbacks (obviously varies based on individuals and the family dynamics). Wealthy people have the resources for endless sitters, boarding schools, etc. Thats just a different reality.

Parenting can be a slog sometimes but hopefully you love your children and can hold on to the positives.

What positives? I really feel like there literally are none.

Do you love your children?

Sometimes. Not worth it.

I'm getting the sense from your responses that you view love as transactional. But most people would say that relationships are transformational . . . the act of loving makes us happier (because creating joy in others creates joy in ourselves -- we are all connected). It's not just about receiving love.

It sounds like the part of you capable of caring for others for their own sake was never developed or hidden away to protect yourself in childhood.

DP.. I figured out what OP's problem is... OP is a narcissist.

How can you only love your kids "sometimes", and think they are not worth that love?

It means you only love them when it's probably easy to love them, and even that moment is not worth having kids.

You don't really love them, which is obviously incredibly sad.

Your problem is that you are a narcissist. It's all about *you*.

You are correct that you should never have had any children. Narcissists really shouldn't. But, it's too late now, and I would suggest you get therapy for your narcissim. I 100% think that your kids will need therapy in the future for having a narcissistic parent.

And I'm a PP who stated that I don't really enjoy all aspects of parenting, and never thought about having kids myself. I firmly believe women can be happy without kids, but OP's issue is that she is a narcissist, not that she doesn't like kids. OP may even be anti-social. I know several women who don't like kids, but love theirs unconditionally, including myself. But, narcissists cannot love anyone but themselves, and even the love they *sometimes* have is conditional, and as a PP noted, transactional.

I don't think OP or her grandmothers were depressed. I think they had a mental condition.

I am not a narcissist. My dad is. You have no idea.

I don't like kids and have said that. I'm not antisocial and I've been in love. I don't like large groups but I like close relationships. I know far more about narcs than you.

Narcissism usually develops as a result of childhood trauma and is more likely when one of the parents, or both, are narcissistic or have narcissistic traits. The fact that you think your dad was one is reason enough to go to therapy to explore yourself. Ask me how I know... so yea... please go and get yourself help.

newsflash: I have been to therapy. I am not a narc. I have been told by more than one therapist I don't need to be there and I know what to do. It is not helpful. There is nothing a therapist says or does that I do not know already. I've been down that road. It's not useful or helpful. This is just my life. That is it. I will likely not enjoy kids any more as adults. No one really seems to have an answer about that and that was the point of the post.

What is it that you have to do?

Newsflash: a ton of people have had bad sh1t happen to them that changed their trajectory: from deaths, to divorce, unwanted pregnancy (with or without rape), and people learn to deal with it or seek therapy to help deal with it.

Your attitude is deafetist at best, and miserable at worst.

You won't enjoy your adult kids because you are a miserable person. You won't care if your kids don't visit you, call you on your bday, xmas, spend Thanksgiving with you. Is that what you want to hear? Or are you expecting your kids to be more interesting when they become adults, and only then can you really feel some kind of connection to them? I think this is what Trump was like as a parent. He had zero to do with his kids until they turned 18. And we all know Trump is a narcissist.

I don’t like holidays. It would be sheer relief to opt out of all of them forever. No, I am not expecting kids to be more interesting as adults—I am expecting to not have it be so annoying to have them. I do not like being around kids. The worst is a group of kids.

Ok OP - let's try this - why WOULDN'T it be better once they are adults? You could go weeks or months or years without seeing them, and when you do see them, they will not be kids anymore.

Why do you have to ask this question at all? It seems obvious that if the problem is not liking kids, it will be solved when your kids are no longer kids. Yes?

No. Will I feel like it will be worth the misery when they are adults? It seems pretty doubtful.

[Anonymous]

The only people who should even be responding to this post are people adult children. If you don’t have any, stop commenting.

[Anonymous]

what are you hoping to get out of this thread, OP? You have an answer for every poster that makes it seem as though you're not interested in what anyone has to say...why post then?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:I’m sorry OP. I’d encourage you to talk to a therapist just to come up with strategies. Our US system of child rearing doesn’t help. In many other cultures, having multiple households and/or generations living together helps alleviate the stress. Many of my cousins loved basically nannying their nieces and nephews. We are so nuclear-family oriented that there can be drawbacks (obviously varies based on individuals and the family dynamics). Wealthy people have the resources for endless sitters, boarding schools, etc. Thats just a different reality.

Parenting can be a slog sometimes but hopefully you love your children and can hold on to the positives.

What positives? I really feel like there literally are none.

Do you love your children?

Sometimes. Not worth it.

I'm getting the sense from your responses that you view love as transactional. But most people would say that relationships are transformational . . . the act of loving makes us happier (because creating joy in others creates joy in ourselves -- we are all connected). It's not just about receiving love.

It sounds like the part of you capable of caring for others for their own sake was never developed or hidden away to protect yourself in childhood.

DP.. I figured out what OP's problem is... OP is a narcissist.

How can you only love your kids "sometimes", and think they are not worth that love?

It means you only love them when it's probably easy to love them, and even that moment is not worth having kids.

You don't really love them, which is obviously incredibly sad.

Your problem is that you are a narcissist. It's all about *you*.

You are correct that you should never have had any children. Narcissists really shouldn't. But, it's too late now, and I would suggest you get therapy for your narcissim. I 100% think that your kids will need therapy in the future for having a narcissistic parent.

And I'm a PP who stated that I don't really enjoy all aspects of parenting, and never thought about having kids myself. I firmly believe women can be happy without kids, but OP's issue is that she is a narcissist, not that she doesn't like kids. OP may even be anti-social. I know several women who don't like kids, but love theirs unconditionally, including myself. But, narcissists cannot love anyone but themselves, and even the love they *sometimes* have is conditional, and as a PP noted, transactional.

I don't think OP or her grandmothers were depressed. I think they had a mental condition.

I am not a narcissist. My dad is. You have no idea.

I don't like kids and have said that. I'm not antisocial and I've been in love. I don't like large groups but I like close relationships. I know far more about narcs than you.

Narcissism usually develops as a result of childhood trauma and is more likely when one of the parents, or both, are narcissistic or have narcissistic traits. The fact that you think your dad was one is reason enough to go to therapy to explore yourself. Ask me how I know... so yea... please go and get yourself help.

newsflash: I have been to therapy. I am not a narc. I have been told by more than one therapist I don't need to be there and I know what to do. It is not helpful. There is nothing a therapist says or does that I do not know already. I've been down that road. It's not useful or helpful. This is just my life. That is it. I will likely not enjoy kids any more as adults. No one really seems to have an answer about that and that was the point of the post.

What is it that you have to do?

Newsflash: a ton of people have had bad sh1t happen to them that changed their trajectory: from deaths, to divorce, unwanted pregnancy (with or without rape), and people learn to deal with it or seek therapy to help deal with it.

Your attitude is deafetist at best, and miserable at worst.

You won't enjoy your adult kids because you are a miserable person. You won't care if your kids don't visit you, call you on your bday, xmas, spend Thanksgiving with you. Is that what you want to hear? Or are you expecting your kids to be more interesting when they become adults, and only then can you really feel some kind of connection to them? I think this is what Trump was like as a parent. He had zero to do with his kids until they turned 18. And we all know Trump is a narcissist.

I don’t like holidays. It would be sheer relief to opt out of all of them forever. No, I am not expecting kids to be more interesting as adults—I am expecting to not have it be so annoying to have them. I do not like being around kids. The worst is a group of kids.

Ok OP - let's try this - why WOULDN'T it be better once they are adults? You could go weeks or months or years without seeing them, and when you do see them, they will not be kids anymore.

Why do you have to ask this question at all? It seems obvious that if the problem is not liking kids, it will be solved when your kids are no longer kids. Yes?

No. Will I feel like it will be worth the misery when they are adults? It seems pretty doubtful.

Ok, so what you are actually asking is will your children be so awesome as adults that it will make all the parenting (which you hate) worthwhile?