I’m confused! Trans swimmers Lia Thomas and Iszac Henig went head-to-head in the pool

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The solution is to have a separate category for trans[/quote

To a large extent; USA Swimming's policy makes some sense. No one cares unless we are talking Olympics and money is essentially their view. If that is the case then there will be a testing procedure that meets Olympic standards. The end. Otherwise -- do whatever you want.

The reality is that there are no trans athletes. Out of about 6,500,000 high school and college athletes every year -- about 30 are trans athletes (and about half of those are FtM who no one seems to care about -- except some states that did not even bother to read their own anti-trans laws (looking at you Tenn).

So - it is all a load of crap and a way for people who no longer can be openly racist, or anti-sematic, or whatever to get a chance to hate someone. I am sure they are happy that way more trans kids will kill themselves this year than will play a high school or college sport.

[Anonymous]

https://katv.com/news/nation-world/new-rules-may-keep-trans-athlete-lia-thomas-from-competing-in-ncaa-championships-university-transgender-pennsylvania-usa-swimming-athletes-college-girls-gender-sex-lgbtq-competition?fbclid=IwAR2iS7NJ5O9Th-mojFcL6hG06rBwXRDXCaQQgs-ZpIeHEQ3nllzaGiEslzg

USA Swimming: How long has Lia Thomas been on HRT?

32 months

USA Swimming: How long until Lia Thomas graduates?

4 months

USA Swimming: Let’s make the new rule 36 months, no one will suspect a thing.

Should we put out documentation to justify this policy?

USA Swimming: No

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I anticipate that sports will eventually be sorted by testosterone level without regard to gender, which will shake everything up for all gender identities, but it will be fair.

This is not fair. My son grew up to be 6' tall, my daughter 5'8" because of their sex. Now if my son takes hormones he gets to benefit from growing up male and dominate his sister? WTH. It's like doping if you benefitted your whole life from male hormones. I don't care how long you've taken testosterone blockers, you've cheated. I am worried about trans people, but eliminating biological women from sports is not the answer. This is so effed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I anticipate that sports will eventually be sorted by testosterone level without regard to gender, which will shake everything up for all gender identities, but it will be fair.

It’s not just about testosterone. It’s about height, bones, lung capacity and muscles. A 6’ 4” swimmer will most likely get to the end of the pool faster than a 5’ 6” swimmer.

Doesn't matter. NCAA said look to USA Swimming. USA Swimming said we don't care at all unless you are an Elite swimmer who we define as xyz (that does not include college), and if you are an Elite swimmer then we have a 3 person committee to review and approve things if you meet basically the Olympic competition standard.

But the problem is that XY people should never compete in women's sports. The committee would be useful for intersex people, but beyond that sex is black & white. Gender isn't, but gender isn't how we divide sports, sex is.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:https://katv.com/news/nation-world/new-rules-may-keep-trans-athlete-lia-thomas-from-competing-in-ncaa-championships-university-transgender-pennsylvania-usa-swimming-athletes-college-girls-gender-sex-lgbtq-competition?fbclid=IwAR2iS7NJ5O9Th-mojFcL6hG06rBwXRDXCaQQgs-ZpIeHEQ3nllzaGiEslzg

USA Swimming: How long has Lia Thomas been on HRT?

32 months

USA Swimming: How long until Lia Thomas graduates?

4 months

USA Swimming: Let’s make the new rule 36 months, no one will suspect a thing.

Should we put out documentation to justify this policy?

USA Swimming: No

They should have just banned all XYs from women’s sports. Lia Thomas has no place in women’s sports because Lia Thomas is not a woman.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The solution is to have a separate category for trans

Simpler solution:

Women’s division: ONLY biological XX women who aren’t doping.

Open division: Men, transgender women, transgender men, non-binary, shim, zhe, hir, donkey, whatever.

Let the men’s category be the dumping ground. Right now, men are self-IDing into the women’s category for easy competition and it’s disgusting.

[Anonymous]

Until men are out of women’s sports, I’m rerouting my annual ACLU donation to the Alliance Defending Freedom. No group backing this shambolic, disastrous agenda can have my money. Everyone who is sane enough to realize men don’t belong in women’s spaces needs to join hands and fight this invasion.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The solution is to have a separate category for trans[/quote

To a large extent; USA Swimming's policy makes some sense. No one cares unless we are talking Olympics and money is essentially their view. If that is the case then there will be a testing procedure that meets Olympic standards. The end. Otherwise -- do whatever you want.

The reality is that there are no trans athletes. Out of about 6,500,000 high school and college athletes every year -- about 30 are trans athletes (and about half of those are FtM who no one seems to care about -- except some states that did not even bother to read their own anti-trans laws (looking at you Tenn).

So - it is all a load of crap and a way for people who no longer can be openly racist, or anti-sematic, or whatever to get a chance to hate someone. I am sure they are happy that way more trans kids will kill themselves this year than will play a high school or college sport.

While I agree the outsized publicity looks like people making a mountain out of a molehill due to the small numbers participating, the large gap between male and female athletes in almost every sport means that those few very quickly become the top performers of the women’s field. In that sense we are sacrificing fairness for many to meet the needs of a very few in the name of equity. It seems to be a problem with modern individualism we haven’t quite worked out yet. Is it usually reasonable to add ramps to buildings to improve accessibility, yes. Should we remove all stairs so everyone must take the ramp to be equal with those who must, no.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The solution is to have a separate category for trans[/quote

To a large extent; USA Swimming's policy makes some sense. No one cares unless we are talking Olympics and money is essentially their view. If that is the case then there will be a testing procedure that meets Olympic standards. The end. Otherwise -- do whatever you want.

The reality is that there are no trans athletes. Out of about 6,500,000 high school and college athletes every year -- about 30 are trans athletes (and about half of those are FtM who no one seems to care about -- except some states that did not even bother to read their own anti-trans laws (looking at you Tenn).

So - it is all a load of crap and a way for people who no longer can be openly racist, or anti-sematic, or whatever to get a chance to hate someone. I am sure they are happy that way more trans kids will kill themselves this year than will play a high school or college sport.

If there are no trans athletes, then why does legislation requiring them to compete with their own sex matter? No one is affected, right?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The solution is to have a separate category for trans[/quote

To a large extent; USA Swimming's policy makes some sense. No one cares unless we are talking Olympics and money is essentially their view. If that is the case then there will be a testing procedure that meets Olympic standards. The end. Otherwise -- do whatever you want.

The reality is that there are no trans athletes. Out of about 6,500,000 high school and college athletes every year -- about 30 are trans athletes (and about half of those are FtM who no one seems to care about -- except some states that did not even bother to read their own anti-trans laws (looking at you Tenn).

So - it is all a load of crap and a way for people who no longer can be openly racist, or anti-sematic, or whatever to get a chance to hate someone. I am sure they are happy that way more trans kids will kill themselves this year than will play a high school or college sport.

While I agree the outsized publicity looks like people making a mountain out of a molehill due to the small numbers participating, the large gap between male and female athletes in almost every sport means that those few very quickly become the top performers of the women’s field. In that sense we are sacrificing fairness for many to meet the needs of a very few in the name of equity. It seems to be a problem with modern individualism we haven’t quite worked out yet. Is it usually reasonable to add ramps to buildings to improve accessibility, yes. Should we remove all stairs so everyone must take the ramp to be equal with those who must, no.

It’s actually worse than your eliminating stairs analogy. Cis females lose opportunities to trans women due to their biological advantage. It’s not like the Penn swimmer who gets kicked off the Ivy Champs squad can take the ramp. She stays home and doesn’t get to compete.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The solution is to have a separate category for trans

To a large extent; USA Swimming's policy makes some sense. No one cares unless we are talking Olympics and money is essentially their view. If that is the case then there will be a testing procedure that meets Olympic standards. The end. Otherwise -- do whatever you want.

The reality is that there are no trans athletes. Out of about 6,500,000 high school and college athletes every year -- about 30 are trans athletes (and about half of those are FtM who no one seems to care about -- except some states that did not even bother to read their own anti-trans laws (looking at you Tenn).

So - it is all a load of crap and a way for people who no longer can be openly racist, or anti-sematic, or whatever to get a chance to hate someone. I am sure they are happy that way more trans kids will kill themselves this year than will play a high school or college sport.

If there are “no” trans athletes, then why does legislation requiring them to compete with their own sex matter? No one is affected by the legislation, right?

[Anonymous]

A letter from Penn Swimmers. https://www.swimmingworldmagazine.com/news/penn-swim-team-members-ask-school-ivy-league-to-refrain-from-litigation-to-allow-lia-thomas-to-race-at-ncaas/

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Until men are out of women’s sports, I’m rerouting my annual ACLU donation to the Alliance Defending Freedom. No group backing this shambolic, disastrous agenda can have my money. Everyone who is sane enough to realize men don’t belong in women’s spaces needs to join hands and fight this invasion.

Yeah, unfortunately ACLU has been captured by extremeists and their leaders advocate for banning books. It’s not the same organization that it once was.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:A letter from Penn Swimmers. https://www.swimmingworldmagazine.com/news/penn-swim-team-members-ask-school-ivy-league-to-refrain-from-litigation-to-allow-lia-thomas-to-race-at-ncaas/

This is an excellent letter.

[Anonymous]

Disgusted to read today that Lia beat Torri Huske. As a male he was pretty mediocre (Ivy League is D1 but not greet - he was like 500th in the country) and now is beating Olympic caliber females.