Advice Needed: parents who both work long hours

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This is not sustainable. One of you will have to rethink your job and/or you will need to reorganize your expenses so you can live on less. Why do you need two full blast incomes to sustain your lifestyle?

+1 I think something is wrong if you "need" two big jobs just to get by.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:This is OP again. I want to clear up the notion that I only spend 30 mins per day with my kids which is not at all true. They are up by 7am latest and we spend an hour an a half together until I drop the older one at school at 8:30 and our nanny arrives. I stop working at 5:30pm so I think have another 2 hours with my youngest who goes to bed at 7:30pm, and my oldest who goes to bed at 8 gets 2.5 hours. Where I struggle is that I then need to handle everything else too - cooking, clean up, laundry, schedules, projects, etc. And I choose to stop working at 5:30 and then go back online later most nights so I can spend the time with my kids.

I am genuinely curious - are there moms who work full time and get to spend more time with their kids than this? Even if you work 9-5 with commuting it’s probably about the same I would imagine.

We also don’t work for what would be considered biglaw firms (although my firm is bigger than DH’s). DH is already a partner and makes around $500K per year all in. He has even more earning potential with his recent promotion but isn’t there yet. I make around $250K and made it clear I don’t want to be on partner track because those attorneys work much more than I do.

We also don’t live an overly extravagant lifestyle at all. DH went to private school and is not open to public regardless of how good it is. That’s the only think that would make a reasonable different in our expenditures. So when you add that up, plus FT nanny, summer camp and classes, our families both lives across the country so 2X per year flights, one vacation per year, etc... it really doesn’t go as far as it should. We also save quite a bit as we want to make sure college and possible grad school are covered for our kids.

OP you are effing ridiculous. You make $750k/year and “it doesn’t go as far as it should”?! Wtf. You are LOADED and completely out of touch. I can’t even.

It sounds like you don't live a life similar to OP's. That's ok, but you don't have to act like it's completely unreasonable that OP's expenses are what they are. $750K/year is about $375K/year take home. Being in that tax bracket means you get hit with the highest rates and don't have the benefits of the truly rich (i.e. people living off interest or dividends), since it's all salary.

Nanny is probably $75K given that she's working 45 hours per week, which means 5 hours of overtime, which is 1.5 times normal rates. $25/hour times 40 hours/week is $52K. $37.50/hour (overtime) times 5 hours/week is $9,750, which is $61,750. Then you have to add in the employer's share of Medicare and SS on to that, plus bonus, gifts, etc.

Private school tuition for two is $125K, which would be $55K per kid plus donations, teacher's gifts, etc.

Mortgage is probably at least $75K a year.

So now we're at $275K/year on $375K take home salary. It's not a stretch to assume that 401k contributions plus 529 contributions take up another maybe $75K, plus two car payments totaling $20K a year, and you've practically eaten up the salary. Never mind clothes, country club memberships, sports, vacations, etc.

I'm not saying that's the way anyone should want to live, or even that it makes good financial sense, but it's not completely ludicrous to imagine the lifestyle OP is leading.

“never mind the country club fees”

I mean, you can roll your eyes all you want. I didn't say any of those expenses were necessary, I was just saying it's not that hard to imagine where OP's money is going. I get that you may not have a country club membership, and that's fine, but there are LOTS of people who do, and guess what? They cost money.

so you think we should empathize with OP because she has to work 60 hrs/week to pay for country club fees and is feeling stressed?

I never said you had to empathize with OP. Seriously, can you people read? All I was commenting on was where OP's money went. People were acting like salaries of $750K meant $650K of extra money and I was trying to explain where the money went. I never said anyone needed to empathize with OP. I wouldn't want her life, and in fact I did leave my BigLaw job for one where I make less money but I see my kids and enjoy my life more. But I can't not fathom where the money is going, which was my sole point. I'm sorry you can't understand it.

NP. I understand perfectly well where the money is going, which is why I know how ridiculous it is when OP says things like "we need my salary" and "the money doesn't go as far as you'd think."

I WOTH FT myself and am very familiar with the ongoing work/life balance issues. You won't hear me arguing that OP should quit her job--personally, I'd be wary of relying on her DH as the sole wage earner. It sounds like she is effectively a single parent, and if I were here I'd want to make sure I continued to have the means to support myself if necessary. But that doesn't mean she doesn't have many, many options. At that income, if she can't afford more household help it's because they are spending too much money on other things--whether that be a house/cars that are unnecessarily expensive or things like country club memberships and fancy vacations that aren't necessary at all.

[Anonymous]

I feel bad for your kids, but enjoy your fancy house and cars.

[Anonymous]

SMH at these rich people complaining about no money after spending all the money on every last thing they might possibly want.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:SMH at these rich people complaining about no money after spending all the money on every last thing they might possibly want.

Actually everyone is attacking OP for *not* spending every penny including on multiple full time domestic workers. Which is insane.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I feel bad for your kids, but enjoy your fancy house and cars.

Why? Do you work? Did you actually read her posts? She doesn't spend any less time with her kids than someone who works 9-5. Or are you against women working at all? OP's problem is that she has no time for herself, not her kids.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I feel bad for your kids, but enjoy your fancy house and cars.

Why? Do you work? Did you actually read her posts? She doesn't spend any less time with her kids than someone who works 9-5. Or are you against women working at all? OP's problem is that she has no time for herself, not her kids.

Are your kids babies or something? Because once kids get older, the evening between 6-7:30 isn’t going to cut it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I feel bad for your kids, but enjoy your fancy house and cars.

Why? Do you work? Did you actually read her posts? She doesn't spend any less time with her kids than someone who works 9-5. Or are you against women working at all? OP's problem is that she has no time for herself, not her kids.

Settle down. I’m judging both parents.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I feel bad for your kids, but enjoy your fancy house and cars.

Why? Do you work? Did you actually read her posts? She doesn't spend any less time with her kids than someone who works 9-5. Or are you against women working at all? OP's problem is that she has no time for herself, not her kids.

No that is not op’s problem. Her problem is that neither she nor her dh are willing to take a lower paying job that would allow them to work fewer hours, although they objectively can afford to.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I feel bad for your kids, but enjoy your fancy house and cars.

Why? Do you work? Did you actually read her posts? She doesn't spend any less time with her kids than someone who works 9-5. Or are you against women working at all? OP's problem is that she has no time for herself, not her kids.

No that is not op’s problem. Her problem is that neither she nor her dh are willing to take a lower paying job that would allow them to work fewer hours, although they objectively can afford to.

But that's not the point pp or you made...why do you feel bad for OP's kids?

[Anonymous]

Lot of jealous biddies in this thread.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Lot of jealous biddies in this thread.

DCUM absolutely hates mom that stay in private practice. Hates.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Lot of jealous biddies in this thread.

Oh please, your insecurity is showing.

[Anonymous]

We used to be this and I cut back. I ended up staying home and had a third child. DH earns a seven figure income and I’m a SAHM. We live in a nice house in mclean and our kids attend public school.

I was just missing my career today. Reading this post reminds me of how hard it was when I was working. I used to cry because I missed my baby’s bedtime most nights. Getting an hour with your baby in the morning just wasn’t enough. I actually did cut back and it still was hard. I remember having two drop offs and pick ups when my older child started elementary. I was always scrambling.

I used to have a full time nanny plus preschool. Then I had a housekeeper and cook. It was really hard to get a PT afternoon sitter/driver. I remember writing the description for care.com and I decided I wanted to be the one to take my kids to sports and activities, help kids with homework and feed them dinner. We would never have had our third child if I was still working.

I don’t think your dual long hours are sustainable. We do know families who have multiple nannies or a FT nanny even when kids are in elementary.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:We used to be this and I cut back. I ended up staying home and had a third child. DH earns a seven figure income and I’m a SAHM. We live in a nice house in mclean and our kids attend public school.

I was just missing my career today. Reading this post reminds me of how hard it was when I was working. I used to cry because I missed my baby’s bedtime most nights. Getting an hour with your baby in the morning just wasn’t enough. I actually did cut back and it still was hard. I remember having two drop offs and pick ups when my older child started elementary. I was always scrambling.

I used to have a full time nanny plus preschool. Then I had a housekeeper and cook. It was really hard to get a PT afternoon sitter/driver. I remember writing the description for care.com and I decided I wanted to be the one to take my kids to sports and activities, help kids with homework and feed them dinner. We would never have had our third child if I was still working.

I don’t think your dual long hours are sustainable. We do know families who have multiple nannies or a FT nanny even when kids are in elementary.

That's exactly what this boils down to, PP. I'm happy for you that you are in a better place. Working moms are in a rough spot. We've been fed the line that we must get out into the working world to prove our worth (and pay homage to the feminist leaders before us) but we also have been sold the line that we can have it all. The fact of the matter is that we absolutely cannot. OP, you cannot have it all so you must choose. You either outsource your household duties (and much of that mothering) or you give up your current career path. One of those will have to give. I'm not here to tell you which is more valuable, as that's for you to decide. But if you wish to continue with your hours and DH's schedule, you'll have to hire more help. And you'll need to balance your budget to do that. Figure out what line items are really worth it (good bye cars) and ante up for the extra domestic help.

I know we all read the Atlantic article a few years back about not having it all. I'm 40+, 3 kids and found it out the hard way in law. I now work for myself and am WAHM full time. It works for me but I won't have the upward income mobility as OP. I am raising my own kids, doing all the cooking/cleaning/sports events because that was the choice that I made. OP, figure out your choice and roll with it. Because we don't get it all in this life. And no, your DH doesn't either despite what PPs here may say.