Boundary Review Meetings

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:For everyone estimating impacts to Westfield, here’s a cookie. https://www.fcps.edu/sites/default/files/Coates-Area-Boundary-Maps.pdf

Interesting that Floris is about half and half Westfield and South Lakes.

I'd love to see the Spa for high school--and also to know how old that information is.

I live in this area, and remember this PDF from the Coates study. It's extremely helpful to look at the SPAs, and where local knowledge is critical. For example, SPAs 1504/2403 currently show less than 80 kids however they've finish building most of the new housing development in these SPAs that will probably add another 100 kids in the next couple of years. I'm basing this off of a similar development (SP 2401) that just finished a couple of years ago. Again, this area continues to blow up which is why Coates ES enrollment got out of hand.

Yup. And that's why they had to build McNair Upper (can you believe they had to split the elementary school into two because enrollment is blowing up?!). Many people don’t realize how crowded this area is.

This is why the school board has pretty much ruled out the magnet school idea. They know this area desperately needs relief.

This also shows how completely clueless Reid is.

Agree, they're really clueless with what's going on in the Western area from the Toll Road down to 66. Ultimately, I'm willing the bet they'll make some big F-ups in the first draft of the KAA maps, and then it'll be a matter of who's voice is loudest and we'll see where the pieces fall. Then, 5 years from now, they'll go "Oh s***, we underestimated development" and they'll have to added trailers/Mods to KAA.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Man, I know they really want to keep the boundary review conversation to one thread, but I sure do wish everyone talking about the Springfield high schools could have their own thread. A lot of passionate conversation to be had there... And I want to hear what other people around the county are thinking about the new scenario!

The “passionate conversation” is a very small group of Lewis parents desperately wanting more middle and upper middle income neighborhoods to be rezoned to Lewis so they can feel better about themselves and their poor real estate selection decisions.

Poor real estate decisions? You mean buying a home that we could afford?

🖕you.

Agreed! That was such a gross, elitist comment! So the "poors" are not entitled to a decent education? FCPS is *supposed* to be ranked as one of the best in the US, but Lewis is terrible.

Sorry that we bought pre-COVID what we could afford and thought this would be our starter and not forever home. Now with the way the economy is, prices/interests rates up, plus a one-fed household so who knows if I'll be RIF-ed, it's looking like we'll be in our 'starter' home for a long time. The elementary school close to Lewis, Springfield Estates, is a good school. That is why we chose to live here and thought either Lewis would improve or we'd eventually move. Seems like both might not happen. I'm sure many others have similar situations at Lewis or other not so great schools.

So, why don't you mobilize the parents through volunteering to make Lewis stronger and the pyramid more cohesive?

Does Lewis have pyramid events that bring elementary and middle school families into the high school on a regular basis to make the kids feel like part of the community? A lot of high schools do this.

We are in the WSHS pyramid.

Each year, nearly every sport, every performing arts program, and many clubs host pyramid events for our feeder schools to build community with our younger kids.

So far this year, the football games have hosted the local SYC league to run onto the field with the varsity team and get a VIP sideline experience, the cheerleaders and dance team had the elementary and middle school kids with them cheering on the sidelines, the dance team invited our pyramid elementary schools to do a halftime dance, marching band marched in with Irving's band and played in the pep section, and choir brought in all the pyramid choirs to sing the national anthem. That is just football season.

We have pyramid concerts, where every level performs pieces (elementary through high school choirs) then the entire WSHS pyramid, 100s of students, performs several songs together.

Theater hosts VIP backstage tours of the performances with Irving, and a Saturday workshop with the elementary kids.

There are pyramid fun runs, art shows, performing arts days, elementary school nights at various games.

Some of the high school programs go into the middle and elementary schools to perform or volunteer to run their school carnivals and help with elementary school events like bingo and individual school fun runs.

Is Lewis doing all of these kinds of activities for and with their elementary schools and middle schools?

They really help to build community in the school and make everyone down to the families of little kids connected to the high school and invested in making their community school a success.

Tone deaf. Yes, there are plenty of active parents at Lewis doing what they can, but the problems are bigger than just building community.

This isn’t a Lewis community problem, it’s an FCPS problem and we shouldn’t expect a group of a parents to try and fix it alone.

I agree that there is a FCPS issue.

But repeatedly over the years there are posts like the one from Springfield estates about how their elementary school is good but it is not translating to the high school.

FCPS is going to do what they want to do, but other than complaining, that is pretty much out of our hands.

My question is not if you have involved parents, which it sounds like you do at Springfield Estates. My point is whether the Lewis pyramid is translating your elementary involvement and community into pyramid level events that make everyone from kindergarten up feel like they are part of the Lewis high school community? Do the kids feel like "Lancers"? I gurantee if you ask that question to WSHS pyramid elementary families, they would say that they are "Spartans" and Lake Braddock younger families will say they are "Bruins". They feel connected to their high school specifically due to these community pyramid events, almost to the extreme where they don't even want to get transferred to fantastic schools like SoCo or LBSS or in the case of that Silverbrook neighborhood, from SoCo to LBSS. If you ask other schools fighting rezoning, they would probably say the same, that they are already intertwined with their high school pyramid.

Those types of pyramid events that bring the younger families into the high school on a regular basis don't cost anything but time, and help to make them identify the high school as "their" community where everyone has a stake in the high school being successful.

Does Lewis have those events regularly? Do the high school students come down to the elementary schools to help with their events?

If Springfield Estates has that community, then how can you and other parents help to translate that sense of community into something that moves up the ladder from Springfield Estates into Lewis?

I have sympathy for your plight, truly. I think your elected officials have royally screwed with you.

But this county is a one party system, so that part is mostly out of your hands. No one is going to vote for anything different, and no politician is going to worry about votes they don't need to earn because they have a 70/30 cushion and single party dominance.

What is in your hands is organizing with other parents to work with the high school to improve things. Or, you can do what others do and use the loopholes to leave.

I will add that I feel strongly that it is a travesty that a county as wealthy and educated as FCPS with such high paid leadership would let Lewis fall into such disrepair and neglect, not just the programs at the school, but also the building and facilities.

I do wish you well whether you stay at Lewis and fight for it, or use a loophole to get out. A FCPS family in the richest area of the country should never see their school so neglected by their elected officials.

Same thing is happening at Annandale and McLean. Look for them to close McLean eventually and redistribute the kids to Langley, Marshall, and Falls Church. It's just what they'll need to justify moving a large part of western Great Falls and the small parts of Herndon and Reston currently zoned to Langley to Herndon. Annandale will more likely get a major renovation like Falls Church at some point because they already consolidated Jefferson and Annandale at Annandale decades ago, plus if they close Lewis they may need to move some kids there.

I highly doubt they close McLean. The dashboard has them at 2353 students. Even if you move western Great Falls to Herndon, that’s less than 400 kids. you’d have to move great falls elementary also and herndon can’t take on two more elementary schools. especially if they put AAP at herndon MS. that should keep more kids in pyramid than staying for south lakes with their AAP peers. and can marshall and falls church take on 1550+ kids? they will just have to bite the bullet and expand and renovate it

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:45% of Westfield's student population comes from Carson MS. 50% from Stone MS and the rest from AAP centers which is primarily Rocky Run MS.
If all of the Westfield students at Carson MS get shifted to KAA Westfield's class sizes will drop from 700 to 375-400. Which means in 2-3 years Westfield will have less than 1600 students.

Where are you getting those percentages? And, have you added in Scenario 4?

I feel like even if these numbers are indeed slightly off, the mass exodus from Westfield means not only Oak Hill being moved out of Chantilly but I wonder if they'd look at Brookfield (which someone brough up earlier) or heck even Lees Corner being sent to Westfield to fill that gap. Or, they leave a lot more extra space at Westfield in preparation for all of the development down that way by the HS/Wegmans...

I don't see the 45% at Westfield.

Remember: Carson has roughly 1000 students without the AAP center kids from Franklin.
Take out 250 for Crossfield. 250 for Fox Mill. Say 200 for Floris.
That yields 300 for Westfield X 2 to allow for four years of high school. So, I get about 600 for Westfield. That would still leave them at better than 2000.

LOL. I love how DCUM posters are not good with numbers. The numbers are all out there. Fox Mill and Crossfield are two smallest schools for Carson.

Under Scenario 4

Floris: 731
McNair Upper: 627
McNair Lower: 571
Coates: 688
Fox Mill: 651
Crossfield: 529

Fox Mill sends 29 AAP to Oak Hill
Crossfield sends 51 to Navy
They would go to Carson.

McNair does the AAP for Coates and Floris so there should be no big shifts there, except it would take away from McNair. Floris and Fox Mill would add more to South Lakes and take a handful from Westfield.

And, there is also the TJ contingent. That is a good sized number off of Carson membership.

[Anonymous]

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I doubt the whole Oak Hill would go to KAA. But maybe Emerald Chase goes to South Lakes and the rest of Oak Hill go to KAA.

Remember currently Emerald Chase kids (and Bradley Farm kids south of West Ox) go to Westfield. Moving them to KAA won’t give relief to Chantilly.

I don't take it for granted that Thru and the school board will do what makes sense, but what makes sense is to send Emerald Chase to KAA with the rest of Oak Hill in order to keep pyramids aligned (and, assuming the Franklin Middle School kids get redistricted for Carson, to eliminate a split feeder).

I agree. The school board has an opportunity to build an actual school pyramid with no split feeders with just making a few changes. I hope they don’t find a way to screw that up.

Thru basically gave Emerald Chase two choices: merge with Fox Mill and go to SLHS with other Fox Mill kids (no split feeder scenario 3) or stay with Oak Hill and split at MS/HS level (scenario 4).

I get that Emerald Chase parents may want to avoid SLHS but KAA can take only 2000 kids and Chantilly needs relief.

Emerald Chase parents have been very vocal about what they want. But it’s not like the school board and Thru ignored their original complaints.

I don't live in Emerald Chase, but nearby. I think they sincerely hate the split feeder thing. It seems that any time people object to going to a different school that people assume it is because it is a less desirable school.

I will remind you that during the South Lakes boundary study that Chantilly neighborhoods fought against one another to stay at Chantilly over Oakton--which, at the time, was considered a much more "desirable" school.

Then they can go with Scenario 3. No split feeding under Scenario 3.

But they lobbied hard against Scenario 3 to stay with Oak Hill. Now their wish is granted under Scenario 4. Are they going to complain about split feeding this time?

To be clear FCPS is not creating a new split feeding pattern here. Emerald Chase kids are currenlty going to Westfield, while the most Oak Hill kids are going to Chantilly.

Doubt those Oak Hill kids stay at Chantilly with the opening of KAA. Will be interesting to see what happens with those maps, as Dr. Reid indicated last night there will be changes at the MS and HS level which will be "feathered" into the Scenario 4 map. So basically buckle in.

Non Emerald Chase Oak Hill kids will likely get moved from Chantilly as Chantilly needs some relief.

I thought about this, and Oak Hill doesn’t necessarily need to move.

While Chantilly certainly needs relief, if Floris, McNair, and Coates are moved from Westfield to KAA, Westfield’s enrollment will drop so significantly (by about 1,000 or more students) that the county will likely need to move students from Chantilly to Westfield. For example, Brookfield could go to Westfield.

Oak Hill is right next to KAA though and more than half of it goes to Chantilly.

I get that and some Oak Hill kids may well end up getting moved from Chantily to KAA.

But my question is this: what are you going to do if Westfield enrollment drops from 2700 to 1700?

So far, no one answered to this question.

How are you seeing 1000 kids move from Westfield to KAA? Kids will be coming from Westfield, Chantilly, Oakton, and maybe even South Lakes.

How many kids from Coates, Floris, and McNair? That’s mostly Westfield and they should be the first moved to KAA.

Says who? You?

dp. They look like the obvious choices to me based on the map.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:45% of Westfield's student population comes from Carson MS. 50% from Stone MS and the rest from AAP centers which is primarily Rocky Run MS.
If all of the Westfield students at Carson MS get shifted to KAA Westfield's class sizes will drop from 700 to 375-400. Which means in 2-3 years Westfield will have less than 1600 students.

Where are you getting those percentages? And, have you added in Scenario 4?

I feel like even if these numbers are indeed slightly off, the mass exodus from Westfield means not only Oak Hill being moved out of Chantilly but I wonder if they'd look at Brookfield (which someone brough up earlier) or heck even Lees Corner being sent to Westfield to fill that gap. Or, they leave a lot more extra space at Westfield in preparation for all of the development down that way by the HS/Wegmans...

I don't see the 45% at Westfield.

Remember: Carson has roughly 1000 students without the AAP center kids from Franklin.
Take out 250 for Crossfield. 250 for Fox Mill. Say 200 for Floris.
That yields 300 for Westfield X 2 to allow for four years of high school. So, I get about 600 for Westfield. That would still leave them at better than 2000.

Stone is one of the smallest middle schools in FCPS. Maybe 30-50 kids per year go from Rocky Run to Westfield. Thats not enough numbers to fill a high school even with 600 from Carson.

[Anonymous]

Just looked it up. Stone has fewer than 700 kids.

[Anonymous]

Does scenario move any neighborhoods from CVHS or CHS to Westfield?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:45% of Westfield's student population comes from Carson MS. 50% from Stone MS and the rest from AAP centers which is primarily Rocky Run MS.
If all of the Westfield students at Carson MS get shifted to KAA Westfield's class sizes will drop from 700 to 375-400. Which means in 2-3 years Westfield will have less than 1600 students.

Where are you getting those percentages? And, have you added in Scenario 4?

I feel like even if these numbers are indeed slightly off, the mass exodus from Westfield means not only Oak Hill being moved out of Chantilly but I wonder if they'd look at Brookfield (which someone brough up earlier) or heck even Lees Corner being sent to Westfield to fill that gap. Or, they leave a lot more extra space at Westfield in preparation for all of the development down that way by the HS/Wegmans...

I don't see the 45% at Westfield.

Remember: Carson has roughly 1000 students without the AAP center kids from Franklin.
Take out 250 for Crossfield. 250 for Fox Mill. Say 200 for Floris.
That yields 300 for Westfield X 2 to allow for four years of high school. So, I get about 600 for Westfield. That would still leave them at better than 2000.

Stone is one of the smallest middle schools in FCPS. Maybe 30-50 kids per year go from Rocky Run to Westfield. Thats not enough numbers to fill a high school even with 600 from Carson.

Well, 86 kids go to Rocky Run from Stone. Where do they go to high school? That translates to 160 students.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Does scenario move any neighborhoods from CVHS or CHS to Westfield?

I'm not familiar with all the boundaries, but it moves at least part of Bull Run. Maybe all.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:45% of Westfield's student population comes from Carson MS. 50% from Stone MS and the rest from AAP centers which is primarily Rocky Run MS.
If all of the Westfield students at Carson MS get shifted to KAA Westfield's class sizes will drop from 700 to 375-400. Which means in 2-3 years Westfield will have less than 1600 students.

Where are you getting those percentages? And, have you added in Scenario 4?

I feel like even if these numbers are indeed slightly off, the mass exodus from Westfield means not only Oak Hill being moved out of Chantilly but I wonder if they'd look at Brookfield (which someone brough up earlier) or heck even Lees Corner being sent to Westfield to fill that gap. Or, they leave a lot more extra space at Westfield in preparation for all of the development down that way by the HS/Wegmans...

I don't see the 45% at Westfield.

Remember: Carson has roughly 1000 students without the AAP center kids from Franklin.
Take out 250 for Crossfield. 250 for Fox Mill. Say 200 for Floris.
That yields 300 for Westfield X 2 to allow for four years of high school. So, I get about 600 for Westfield. That would still leave them at better than 2000.

Stone is one of the smallest middle schools in FCPS. Maybe 30-50 kids per year go from Rocky Run to Westfield. Thats not enough numbers to fill a high school even with 600 from Carson.

Well, 86 kids go to Rocky Run from Stone. Where do they go to high school? That translates to 160 students.

No idea where this 86 per year number is coming from but presumably they go to private HS, TJ or they finagle a transfer to another FCPS HS.

I have a sophomore at Westfield and around 40 kids went from RR to Westfield her year. 30-50 is accurate. The class behind hers at the BRES AAP center was so small the center only had one small class every year.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Does scenario move any neighborhoods from CVHS or CHS to Westfield?

I'm not familiar with all the boundaries, but it moves at least part of Bull Run. Maybe all.

Half of Bull run already goes to Westfield.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Does scenario move any neighborhoods from CVHS or CHS to Westfield?

Only the bit of Bull Run west of 66, about 115 kids.

Scenario 3 sends some Lees Corners and the Chantilly portion of Cub Run to Westfield. Scenario 4 sends nothing. The fact that Chantilly is gaining students under scenario 4, I would be shocked if they didn’t lose 2 elementary feeders. Based on the way they’ve been setting up Lees Corner, it’s the most likely candidate for THRU to send to Westfield. They already chiseled it in scenario 3, and they aligned it with the Franklin portion of Cub Run. This is just my reading of tea leaves.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:45% of Westfield's student population comes from Carson MS. 50% from Stone MS and the rest from AAP centers which is primarily Rocky Run MS.
If all of the Westfield students at Carson MS get shifted to KAA Westfield's class sizes will drop from 700 to 375-400. Which means in 2-3 years Westfield will have less than 1600 students.

Where are you getting those percentages? And, have you added in Scenario 4?

I feel like even if these numbers are indeed slightly off, the mass exodus from Westfield means not only Oak Hill being moved out of Chantilly but I wonder if they'd look at Brookfield (which someone brough up earlier) or heck even Lees Corner being sent to Westfield to fill that gap. Or, they leave a lot more extra space at Westfield in preparation for all of the development down that way by the HS/Wegmans...

I don't see the 45% at Westfield.

Remember: Carson has roughly 1000 students without the AAP center kids from Franklin.
Take out 250 for Crossfield. 250 for Fox Mill. Say 200 for Floris.
That yields 300 for Westfield X 2 to allow for four years of high school. So, I get about 600 for Westfield. That would still leave them at better than 2000.

My kids are at Crossfield - your numbers are way off. It's a small school.

[Anonymous]

South Lakes also goes from 96% capacity to 101% under Scenario 4. I have to believe that Emerald Chase would go to KAA and not South Lakes.

I do think that Oak Hill is at least an option for Westfield. Pulling Floris, Coates, and McNair out does mean you need to backfill a good amount to Westfield some how. Centreville is also listed as needing relief so I assume some will come from there. Bull run maybe?

If they take the part of Floris that is west of Centreville rd that doesn't actually have any homes and reassign to Oakhill, then the boundaries with Westfield wouldn't be as bad of an attendance island

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:45% of Westfield's student population comes from Carson MS. 50% from Stone MS and the rest from AAP centers which is primarily Rocky Run MS.
If all of the Westfield students at Carson MS get shifted to KAA Westfield's class sizes will drop from 700 to 375-400. Which means in 2-3 years Westfield will have less than 1600 students.

Where are you getting those percentages? And, have you added in Scenario 4?

I feel like even if these numbers are indeed slightly off, the mass exodus from Westfield means not only Oak Hill being moved out of Chantilly but I wonder if they'd look at Brookfield (which someone brough up earlier) or heck even Lees Corner being sent to Westfield to fill that gap. Or, they leave a lot more extra space at Westfield in preparation for all of the development down that way by the HS/Wegmans...

I don't see the 45% at Westfield.

Remember: Carson has roughly 1000 students without the AAP center kids from Franklin.
Take out 250 for Crossfield. 250 for Fox Mill. Say 200 for Floris.
That yields 300 for Westfield X 2 to allow for four years of high school. So, I get about 600 for Westfield. That would still leave them at better than 2000.

Stone is one of the smallest middle schools in FCPS. Maybe 30-50 kids per year go from Rocky Run to Westfield. Thats not enough numbers to fill a high school even with 600 from Carson.

Just to clarify your comment and perhaps what you meant, but there were 86 Stone to Rocky Run transfers last year, so more like 30-50 per grade.