A Generation of American Men Give Up on College: ‘I Just Feel Lost’

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Isn’t this because more men go into the trades? It makes sense to me.

Exactly. Most plumbers, carpenters, masons, construction workers, electricians, HVAC techs, etc. are men. Women tend to be nurses, teachers, social workers, etc…all of which need college degrees.

See.. women still need to be more educated than men to have a decent paying job. Women who don't have an education end up in jobs that pay minimum wage, unlike these traditional male trade jobs.

Why aren't more women in these trade jobs?

Apparently for the same reason there aren't more men in college: they aren't applying.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Isn’t this because more men go into the trades? It makes sense to me.

Exactly. Most plumbers, carpenters, masons, construction workers, electricians, HVAC techs, etc. are men. Women tend to be nurses, teachers, social workers, etc…all of which need college degrees.

See.. women still need to be more educated than men to have a decent paying job. Women who don't have an education end up in jobs that pay minimum wage, unlike these traditional male trade jobs.

Why aren't more women in these trade jobs?

much of it requires physical labor that women don't have the strength for.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
Depends. For STEM women still get a boost. Otherwise, yes, men often get a boost because there are fewer applicants and schools don't want to veer past a 60% female/40% male student population since a gender balance that is too tilted can be a turn off for both men and women.

yes, but we are talking about general college population, not specific degree fields.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:[b]

Anonymous wrote:Here’s the words that stand in it to me in the thread title: Give Up. If the first time men aren’t the dominant demo in an institution society places a high value on and their reaction is to give up, maybe they don’t belong in college.

I wonder what would happen to these poor fragile men if large numbers were sexually assaulted and sexually harassed at school and in the workplace with no consequences to the perpetuators; were raped and force to carry pregnancies to term; had their civil rights taken away; were disadvantaged by an old girls network; were paid less for equal work; we forced to bear children the didn’t want; had a glass ceiling; were significantly under-represented in Congress, the judiciary, corporate boardrooms and C-suites; had occupations they participate in in large numbers devalued (financially and in terms of prestige); were expected to do 2x to 4x more work in managing a home and raising children while working full time; etc, etc. it will take years for women’s job market participation to get back to where it was pre-COVID.

So, for the first time in this nation’s history, there is one area where white men don’t a structural advantage that makes everything easier for them and makes them the de facto dominant. Who cares? No one can argue with a straight face that they don’t have equal opportunities. In fact, my kids applied to SLACs and the standards were lower for DS.

If boys don’t have equal outcomes, maybe of the “boys will be boys” “it’s fine to spend hours on video games” mentality that has lowered our expectations of them. Or, maybe they are so unprepared for adversity because they literally never face it that they just “give up.”

Maybe boys and men need more adversity so they develop so coping skills and Grit, and not less.

But, but, but… think of the white men!

Teenage boys didn't create any of these things, nor have they enjoyed a structural advantage in education. But thank you again for pointing out that you want today's youth to suffer as much as possible, and demonstrating that you have no concern or compassion for them that would lead you to consider, for even a moment, whether there are some issues at play when it comes to our schools.

DP.. you are perpetuating a generation of snowflakes and boys with no grit. No one wants a generation of young men to suffer as much as possible. Stop being a drama queen.

We are pointing out that these young men don't have the kinds of road blocks that other groups have had historically, and yet these other groups have managed to rise above it. Why can't these young "men"?

My 17 yr old DS has to compete with smart and driven girls. So, then he needs to rise to the occasion. I am not going to feel "sorry" for him because he has to compete with girls. FFS.

Even with these stats, my DS knows he still has it a lot easier than girls do. He even said he is glad to not be a girl.. that they have it harder in general.

In the examples given, how did women who were not yet adults "rise above" these adult issues. We are talking about the path from childhood to adulthood.

I fully support giving all marginalized groups extra supports to help them succeed, but that doesn't mean that a traditionally advantaged group might face some obstacles in early education.

It infuriates me to hear all of you privileged people talking about how your boys are doing fine. Guess what? Mine are too, but that's mostly because of my privilege in being able to provide tutoring, extra supports, programs to help them explore their interests, etc. Did all of you kids do their college applications all by themselves without any parental support? Half of you probably hired college consultants.

My point is that many boys don't have these extra opportunities and supports. But more than that, my concern is about how the current system causes boys to view themselves in a negative way. In this regard, I worry more about boys of color. Yes, it's good to be diligent and to always complete your homework beginning at a young age. But not everyone has that ability when the system demands it. All children need to be build up, not beaten down. That's how healthy adults of all genders and races are formed. Support, belief, and encouragement should be built into the system and it's not.

you have no idea to whom you are responding to.

I grew up low income. My brother went into the military and then to a public ivy from there.

Privileged? OK, I mean I had parents but they didn't speak any English, couldn't help us navigate anything, and were uneducated.

If any child, boy or girl, has some SN that requires supports, sure, that should be provided.

Are you saying that the ALL of these boys who can't complete a college application with the required information are all SN? Or are many just floundering because they don't realize that you need a good paying job to get by?

The previous system wasn't working for different groups, yet those groups figured it out.

I don't see many colleges preferring females over males. Quite the opposite. If you are a male, you seem to get a boost.

The article isn't about what colleges do. It's more about general . . . purposelessness of a generation.

And no, groups didn't figure it out. That's why we have all of the supports in place for marginalized groups. Or are you a pull yourself by your bootstraps Republican who blames minorities for not getting further ahead?

I am a minority and female. There were no supports when I went to college back in the 80s. I had to figure it out on my own. Not even my parents could help me since they didn't speak any English nor were they educated.

Stop coddling young men. You are not helping them. I have seen what coddling young men can do. It's not pretty.

So you are a Repblican?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:[b]

Anonymous wrote:Here’s the words that stand in it to me in the thread title: Give Up. If the first time men aren’t the dominant demo in an institution society places a high value on and their reaction is to give up, maybe they don’t belong in college.

I wonder what would happen to these poor fragile men if large numbers were sexually assaulted and sexually harassed at school and in the workplace with no consequences to the perpetuators; were raped and force to carry pregnancies to term; had their civil rights taken away; were disadvantaged by an old girls network; were paid less for equal work; we forced to bear children the didn’t want; had a glass ceiling; were significantly under-represented in Congress, the judiciary, corporate boardrooms and C-suites; had occupations they participate in in large numbers devalued (financially and in terms of prestige); were expected to do 2x to 4x more work in managing a home and raising children while working full time; etc, etc. it will take years for women’s job market participation to get back to where it was pre-COVID.

So, for the first time in this nation’s history, there is one area where white men don’t a structural advantage that makes everything easier for them and makes them the de facto dominant. Who cares? No one can argue with a straight face that they don’t have equal opportunities. In fact, my kids applied to SLACs and the standards were lower for DS.

If boys don’t have equal outcomes, maybe of the “boys will be boys” “it’s fine to spend hours on video games” mentality that has lowered our expectations of them. Or, maybe they are so unprepared for adversity because they literally never face it that they just “give up.”

Maybe boys and men need more adversity so they develop so coping skills and Grit, and not less.

But, but, but… think of the white men!

Teenage boys didn't create any of these things, nor have they enjoyed a structural advantage in education. But thank you again for pointing out that you want today's youth to suffer as much as possible, and demonstrating that you have no concern or compassion for them that would lead you to consider, for even a moment, whether there are some issues at play when it comes to our schools.

DP.. you are perpetuating a generation of snowflakes and boys with no grit. No one wants a generation of young men to suffer as much as possible. Stop being a drama queen.

We are pointing out that these young men don't have the kinds of road blocks that other groups have had historically, and yet these other groups have managed to rise above it. Why can't these young "men"?

My 17 yr old DS has to compete with smart and driven girls. So, then he needs to rise to the occasion. I am not going to feel "sorry" for him because he has to compete with girls. FFS.

Even with these stats, my DS knows he still has it a lot easier than girls do. He even said he is glad to not be a girl.. that they have it harder in general.

In the examples given, how did women who were not yet adults "rise above" these adult issues. We are talking about the path from childhood to adulthood.

I fully support giving all marginalized groups extra supports to help them succeed, but that doesn't mean that a traditionally advantaged group might face some obstacles in early education.

It infuriates me to hear all of you privileged people talking about how your boys are doing fine. Guess what? Mine are too, but that's mostly because of my privilege in being able to provide tutoring, extra supports, programs to help them explore their interests, etc. Did all of you kids do their college applications all by themselves without any parental support? Half of you probably hired college consultants.

My point is that many boys don't have these extra opportunities and supports. But more than that, my concern is about how the current system causes boys to view themselves in a negative way. In this regard, I worry more about boys of color. Yes, it's good to be diligent and to always complete your homework beginning at a young age. But not everyone has that ability when the system demands it. All children need to be build up, not beaten down. That's how healthy adults of all genders and races are formed. Support, belief, and encouragement should be built into the system and it's not.

you have no idea to whom you are responding to.

I grew up low income. My brother went into the military and then to a public ivy from there.

Privileged? OK, I mean I had parents but they didn't speak any English, couldn't help us navigate anything, and were uneducated.

If any child, boy or girl, has some SN that requires supports, sure, that should be provided.

Are you saying that the ALL of these boys who can't complete a college application with the required information are all SN? Or are many just floundering because they don't realize that you need a good paying job to get by?

The previous system wasn't working for different groups, yet those groups figured it out.

I don't see many colleges preferring females over males. Quite the opposite. If you are a male, you seem to get a boost.

The article isn't about what colleges do. It's more about general . . . purposelessness of a generation.

And no, groups didn't figure it out. That's why we have all of the supports in place for marginalized groups. Or are you a pull yourself by your bootstraps Republican who blames minorities for not getting further ahead?

I am a minority and female. There were no supports when I went to college back in the 80s. I had to figure it out on my own. Not even my parents could help me since they didn't speak any English nor were they educated.

Stop coddling young men. You are not helping them. I have seen what coddling young men can do. It's not pretty.

So you are a Repblican?

What does politics have to do with this? You don't think there are liberals who think these young men have no grit? I voted for Biden. So did my spouse, and my spouse feels the same way I do.

Are you a liberal? Do liberals not have any fortitude or grit?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Isn’t this because more men go into the trades? It makes sense to me.

Exactly. Most plumbers, carpenters, masons, construction workers, electricians, HVAC techs, etc. are men. Women tend to be nurses, teachers, social workers, etc…all of which need college degrees.

See.. women still need to be more educated than men to have a decent paying job. Women who don't have an education end up in jobs that pay minimum wage, unlike these traditional male trade jobs.

Not only that but women need advanced degrees on top of a BA/BS degree which just puts them further in debt to obtain these mediocre paying jobs. Seems women will have won the battle but lost the war. This is no victory here.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:[b]

Anonymous wrote:Here’s the words that stand in it to me in the thread title: Give Up. If the first time men aren’t the dominant demo in an institution society places a high value on and their reaction is to give up, maybe they don’t belong in college.

I wonder what would happen to these poor fragile men if large numbers were sexually assaulted and sexually harassed at school and in the workplace with no consequences to the perpetuators; were raped and force to carry pregnancies to term; had their civil rights taken away; were disadvantaged by an old girls network; were paid less for equal work; we forced to bear children the didn’t want; had a glass ceiling; were significantly under-represented in Congress, the judiciary, corporate boardrooms and C-suites; had occupations they participate in in large numbers devalued (financially and in terms of prestige); were expected to do 2x to 4x more work in managing a home and raising children while working full time; etc, etc. it will take years for women’s job market participation to get back to where it was pre-COVID.

So, for the first time in this nation’s history, there is one area where white men don’t a structural advantage that makes everything easier for them and makes them the de facto dominant. Who cares? No one can argue with a straight face that they don’t have equal opportunities. In fact, my kids applied to SLACs and the standards were lower for DS.

If boys don’t have equal outcomes, maybe of the “boys will be boys” “it’s fine to spend hours on video games” mentality that has lowered our expectations of them. Or, maybe they are so unprepared for adversity because they literally never face it that they just “give up.”

Maybe boys and men need more adversity so they develop so coping skills and Grit, and not less.

But, but, but… think of the white men!

Teenage boys didn't create any of these things, nor have they enjoyed a structural advantage in education. But thank you again for pointing out that you want today's youth to suffer as much as possible, and demonstrating that you have no concern or compassion for them that would lead you to consider, for even a moment, whether there are some issues at play when it comes to our schools.

DP.. you are perpetuating a generation of snowflakes and boys with no grit. No one wants a generation of young men to suffer as much as possible. Stop being a drama queen.

We are pointing out that these young men don't have the kinds of road blocks that other groups have had historically, and yet these other groups have managed to rise above it. Why can't these young "men"?

My 17 yr old DS has to compete with smart and driven girls. So, then he needs to rise to the occasion. I am not going to feel "sorry" for him because he has to compete with girls. FFS.

Even with these stats, my DS knows he still has it a lot easier than girls do. He even said he is glad to not be a girl.. that they have it harder in general.

In the examples given, how did women who were not yet adults "rise above" these adult issues. We are talking about the path from childhood to adulthood.

I fully support giving all marginalized groups extra supports to help them succeed, but that doesn't mean that a traditionally advantaged group might face some obstacles in early education.

It infuriates me to hear all of you privileged people talking about how your boys are doing fine. Guess what? Mine are too, but that's mostly because of my privilege in being able to provide tutoring, extra supports, programs to help them explore their interests, etc. Did all of you kids do their college applications all by themselves without any parental support? Half of you probably hired college consultants.

My point is that many boys don't have these extra opportunities and supports. But more than that, my concern is about how the current system causes boys to view themselves in a negative way. In this regard, I worry more about boys of color. Yes, it's good to be diligent and to always complete your homework beginning at a young age. But not everyone has that ability when the system demands it. All children need to be build up, not beaten down. That's how healthy adults of all genders and races are formed. Support, belief, and encouragement should be built into the system and it's not.

Point being that women will have to rise above challenges again and again and again in their educational and professional lives and not give up. And, in large numbers they do. Men, with all of their inherent and structural advantages have to do one “hard” thing— limit their video gaming so that it doesn’t interfere with their education. Yet they, and their parents, feel entitled to have college admission handed them without putting in the same work as women.

Men feel entitled to have everything work in their favor and get more reward for less effort. The one time in their lives that doesn’t happen, the “give up”— and their parents argue for affirmative action. Give me a break. Teach your son they aren’t entitled to an easier path than literally everyone else, and then maybe their who world won’t come crashing down the first time things are tough.

— signed, parent of a DS and a DD

[Anonymous]

It shouldn't be a surprise that females do better in the female-dominated K-12 environment. Just like men find it easier to succeed in male-dominated environments. I think more male teachers would make a difference.

Also, I didn't read the whole thread so not sure if someone already commented, but the Baylor "moms and sons" program is the most obnoxious thing ever. Young men don't take responsibility for getting their transcripts in, so your solution is to get their moms to do it for them?? So they aren't taking responsibility AND they are getting the message that detail-level organizational stuff is "mom"/girl stuff, perpetuating the problem. God forbid Dad remind his son to get the transcript in.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:[b]

Anonymous wrote:Here’s the words that stand in it to me in the thread title: Give Up. If the first time men aren’t the dominant demo in an institution society places a high value on and their reaction is to give up, maybe they don’t belong in college.

I wonder what would happen to these poor fragile men if large numbers were sexually assaulted and sexually harassed at school and in the workplace with no consequences to the perpetuators; were raped and force to carry pregnancies to term; had their civil rights taken away; were disadvantaged by an old girls network; were paid less for equal work; we forced to bear children the didn’t want; had a glass ceiling; were significantly under-represented in Congress, the judiciary, corporate boardrooms and C-suites; had occupations they participate in in large numbers devalued (financially and in terms of prestige); were expected to do 2x to 4x more work in managing a home and raising children while working full time; etc, etc. it will take years for women’s job market participation to get back to where it was pre-COVID.

So, for the first time in this nation’s history, there is one area where white men don’t a structural advantage that makes everything easier for them and makes them the de facto dominant. Who cares? No one can argue with a straight face that they don’t have equal opportunities. In fact, my kids applied to SLACs and the standards were lower for DS.

If boys don’t have equal outcomes, maybe of the “boys will be boys” “it’s fine to spend hours on video games” mentality that has lowered our expectations of them. Or, maybe they are so unprepared for adversity because they literally never face it that they just “give up.”

Maybe boys and men need more adversity so they develop so coping skills and Grit, and not less.

But, but, but… think of the white men!

Teenage boys didn't create any of these things, nor have they enjoyed a structural advantage in education. But thank you again for pointing out that you want today's youth to suffer as much as possible, and demonstrating that you have no concern or compassion for them that would lead you to consider, for even a moment, whether there are some issues at play when it comes to our schools.

DP.. you are perpetuating a generation of snowflakes and boys with no grit. No one wants a generation of young men to suffer as much as possible. Stop being a drama queen.

We are pointing out that these young men don't have the kinds of road blocks that other groups have had historically, and yet these other groups have managed to rise above it. Why can't these young "men"?

My 17 yr old DS has to compete with smart and driven girls. So, then he needs to rise to the occasion. I am not going to feel "sorry" for him because he has to compete with girls. FFS.

Even with these stats, my DS knows he still has it a lot easier than girls do. He even said he is glad to not be a girl.. that they have it harder in general.

In the examples given, how did women who were not yet adults "rise above" these adult issues. We are talking about the path from childhood to adulthood.

I fully support giving all marginalized groups extra supports to help them succeed, but that doesn't mean that a traditionally advantaged group might face some obstacles in early education.

It infuriates me to hear all of you privileged people talking about how your boys are doing fine. Guess what? Mine are too, but that's mostly because of my privilege in being able to provide tutoring, extra supports, programs to help them explore their interests, etc. Did all of you kids do their college applications all by themselves without any parental support? Half of you probably hired college consultants.

My point is that many boys don't have these extra opportunities and supports. But more than that, my concern is about how the current system causes boys to view themselves in a negative way. In this regard, I worry more about boys of color. Yes, it's good to be diligent and to always complete your homework beginning at a young age. But not everyone has that ability when the system demands it. All children need to be build up, not beaten down. That's how healthy adults of all genders and races are formed. Support, belief, and encouragement should be built into the system and it's not.

you have no idea to whom you are responding to.

I grew up low income. My brother went into the military and then to a public ivy from there.

Privileged? OK, I mean I had parents but they didn't speak any English, couldn't help us navigate anything, and were uneducated.

If any child, boy or girl, has some SN that requires supports, sure, that should be provided.

Are you saying that the ALL of these boys who can't complete a college application with the required information are all SN? Or are many just floundering because they don't realize that you need a good paying job to get by?

The previous system wasn't working for different groups, yet those groups figured it out.

I don't see many colleges preferring females over males. Quite the opposite. If you are a male, you seem to get a boost.

The article isn't about what colleges do. It's more about general . . . purposelessness of a generation.

And no, groups didn't figure it out. That's why we have all of the supports in place for marginalized groups. Or are you a pull yourself by your bootstraps Republican who blames minorities for not getting further ahead?

I am a minority and female. There were no supports when I went to college back in the 80s. I had to figure it out on my own. Not even my parents could help me since they didn't speak any English nor were they educated.

Stop coddling young men. You are not helping them. I have seen what coddling young men can do. It's not pretty.

So you are a Repblican?

What does politics have to do with this? You don't think there are liberals who think these young men have no grit? I voted for Biden. So did my spouse, and my spouse feels the same way I do.

Are you a liberal? Do liberals not have any fortitude or grit?

+1 2 Biden voters here. And out son needs to work for his grades and for college admission. Of he video games his way through Hs instead, that’s on him. And on us for being crappy parents.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Here’s the words that stand in it to me in the thread title: Give Up. If the first time men aren’t the dominant demo in an institution society places a high value on and their reaction is to give up, maybe they don’t belong in college.

I wonder what would happen to these poor fragile men if large numbers were sexually assaulted and sexually harassed at school and in the workplace with no consequences to the perpetuators; were raped and force to carry pregnancies to term; had their civil rights taken away; were disadvantaged by an old girls network; were paid less for equal work; we forced to bear children the didn’t want; had a glass ceiling; were significantly under-represented in Congress, the judiciary, corporate boardrooms and C-suites; had occupations they participate in in large numbers devalued (financially and in terms of prestige); were expected to do 2x to 4x more work in managing a home and raising children while working full time; etc, etc. it will take years for women’s job market participation to get back to where it was pre-COVID.

So, for the first time in this nation’s history, there is one area where white men don’t a structural advantage that makes everything easier for them and makes them the de facto dominant. Who cares? No one can argue with a straight face that they don’t have equal opportunities. In fact, my kids applied to SLACs and the standards were lower for DS.

If boys don’t have equal outcomes, maybe of the “boys will be boys” “it’s fine to spend hours on video games” mentality that has lowered our expectations of them. Or, maybe they are so unprepared for adversity because they literally never face it that they just “give up.”

Maybe boys and men need more adversity so they develop so coping skills and Grit, and not less.

But, but, but… think of the white men!

Teenage boys didn't create any of these things, nor have they enjoyed a structural advantage in education. But thank you again for pointing out that you want today's youth to suffer as much as possible, and demonstrating that you have no concern or compassion for them that would lead you to consider, for even a moment, whether there are some issues at play when it comes to our schools.

DP.. you are perpetuating a generation of snowflakes and boys with no grit. No one wants a generation of young men to suffer as much as possible. Stop being a drama queen.

We are pointing out that these young men don't have the kinds of road blocks that other groups have had historically, and yet these other groups have managed to rise above it. Why can't these young "men"?

My 17 yr old DS has to compete with smart and driven girls. So, then he needs to rise to the occasion. I am not going to feel "sorry" for him because he has to compete with girls. FFS.

Even with these stats, my DS knows he still has it a lot easier than girls do. He even said he is glad to not be a girl.. that they have it harder in general.

In the examples given, how did women who were not yet adults "rise above" these adult issues. We are talking about the path from childhood to adulthood.

I fully support giving all marginalized groups extra supports to help them succeed, but that doesn't mean that a traditionally advantaged group might face some obstacles in early education.

It infuriates me to hear all of you privileged people talking about how your boys are doing fine. Guess what? Mine are too, but that's mostly because of my privilege in being able to provide tutoring, extra supports, programs to help them explore their interests, etc. Did all of you kids do their college applications all by themselves without any parental support? Half of you probably hired college consultants.

My point is that many boys don't have these extra opportunities and supports. But more than that, my concern is about how the current system causes boys to view themselves in a negative way. In this regard, I worry more about boys of color. Yes, it's good to be diligent and to always complete your homework beginning at a young age. But not everyone has that ability when the system demands it. All children need to be build up, not beaten down. That's how healthy adults of all genders and races are formed. Support, belief, and encouragement should be built into the system and it's not.

Point being that women will have to rise above challenges again and again and again in their educational and professional lives and not give up. And, in large numbers they do. Men, with all of their inherent and structural advantages have to do one “hard” thing— limit their video gaming so that it doesn’t interfere with their education. Yet they, and their parents, feel entitled to have college admission handed them without putting in the same work as women.

Men feel entitled to have everything work in their favor and get more reward for less effort. The one time in their lives that doesn’t happen, the “give up”— and their parents argue for affirmative action. Give me a break. [b]Teach your son they aren’t entitled to an easier path than literally everyone else, and then maybe their who world won’t come crashing down the first time things are tough.

— signed, parent of a DS and a DD

+1 thank you

- mom of boy and girl, and boy loves his computer games, but he knows he has to focus on his education first and foremost, and he does. And he just got a PT job now, too.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Considering the VAST majority of people in power are White males (CEOs, business leaders, politicians, etc.) your post makes zero sense.

That's changing rapidly. People in power tend to be older (takes a while to build experience) and they are retiring and other peopel are filling their roles.

Look at MCPS:
https://bethesdamagazine.com/bethesda-beat/opinion/opinion-its-time-to-honor-heroic-efforts-to-educate-students-during-a-pandemic-year/

Board of Ed: 100% female
Union Presidents: 100% female
Teachers: 80% female
Principals: 66% female
Support workers: 66% female

Everyone position from the very top on down to the very bottom is majority female.

Are you being purposely obtuse? Women have always been in teaching. When we talk about in power let’s talk about Fortune 500.

Stats as of 6/21 - With 41 women on the Fortune 500 list, women leaders hold just 8.1% of Fortune 500 CEO spots.

[Anonymous]

Women make up just over a quarter of all members of the 117th Congress – the highest percentage in U.S. history and a considerable increase from where things stood even a decade ago.

Let’s cry for all the boys. Life is so unfair.

[Anonymous]

Some of you "oh, those poor young men" are not doing those poor young men any favors. You are perpetuating the "I can't handle life" woes.

If they can't handle even the college application process, then that is a total parenting failure.

Generation of snowflakes and helicopter parenting lead to where we are at.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:[b]

Anonymous wrote:Here’s the words that stand in it to me in the thread title: Give Up. If the first time men aren’t the dominant demo in an institution society places a high value on and their reaction is to give up, maybe they don’t belong in college.

I wonder what would happen to these poor fragile men if large numbers were sexually assaulted and sexually harassed at school and in the workplace with no consequences to the perpetuators; were raped and force to carry pregnancies to term; had their civil rights taken away; were disadvantaged by an old girls network; were paid less for equal work; we forced to bear children the didn’t want; had a glass ceiling; were significantly under-represented in Congress, the judiciary, corporate boardrooms and C-suites; had occupations they participate in in large numbers devalued (financially and in terms of prestige); were expected to do 2x to 4x more work in managing a home and raising children while working full time; etc, etc. it will take years for women’s job market participation to get back to where it was pre-COVID.

So, for the first time in this nation’s history, there is one area where white men don’t a structural advantage that makes everything easier for them and makes them the de facto dominant. Who cares? No one can argue with a straight face that they don’t have equal opportunities. In fact, my kids applied to SLACs and the standards were lower for DS.

If boys don’t have equal outcomes, maybe of the “boys will be boys” “it’s fine to spend hours on video games” mentality that has lowered our expectations of them. Or, maybe they are so unprepared for adversity because they literally never face it that they just “give up.”

Maybe boys and men need more adversity so they develop so coping skills and Grit, and not less.

But, but, but… think of the white men!

Teenage boys didn't create any of these things, nor have they enjoyed a structural advantage in education. But thank you again for pointing out that you want today's youth to suffer as much as possible, and demonstrating that you have no concern or compassion for them that would lead you to consider, for even a moment, whether there are some issues at play when it comes to our schools.

DP.. you are perpetuating a generation of snowflakes and boys with no grit. No one wants a generation of young men to suffer as much as possible. Stop being a drama queen.

We are pointing out that these young men don't have the kinds of road blocks that other groups have had historically, and yet these other groups have managed to rise above it. Why can't these young "men"?

My 17 yr old DS has to compete with smart and driven girls. So, then he needs to rise to the occasion. I am not going to feel "sorry" for him because he has to compete with girls. FFS.

Even with these stats, my DS knows he still has it a lot easier than girls do. He even said he is glad to not be a girl.. that they have it harder in general.

In the examples given, how did women who were not yet adults "rise above" these adult issues. We are talking about the path from childhood to adulthood.

I fully support giving all marginalized groups extra supports to help them succeed, but that doesn't mean that a traditionally advantaged group might face some obstacles in early education.

It infuriates me to hear all of you privileged people talking about how your boys are doing fine. Guess what? Mine are too, but that's mostly because of my privilege in being able to provide tutoring, extra supports, programs to help them explore their interests, etc. Did all of you kids do their college applications all by themselves without any parental support? Half of you probably hired college consultants.

My point is that many boys don't have these extra opportunities and supports. But more than that, my concern is about how the current system causes boys to view themselves in a negative way. In this regard, I worry more about boys of color. Yes, it's good to be diligent and to always complete your homework beginning at a young age. But not everyone has that ability when the system demands it. All children need to be build up, not beaten down. That's how healthy adults of all genders and races are formed. Support, belief, and encouragement should be built into the system and it's not.

you have no idea to whom you are responding to.

I grew up low income. My brother went into the military and then to a public ivy from there.

Privileged? OK, I mean I had parents but they didn't speak any English, couldn't help us navigate anything, and were uneducated.

If any child, boy or girl, has some SN that requires supports, sure, that should be provided.

Are you saying that the ALL of these boys who can't complete a college application with the required information are all SN? Or are many just floundering because they don't realize that you need a good paying job to get by?

The previous system wasn't working for different groups, yet those groups figured it out.

I don't see many colleges preferring females over males. Quite the opposite. If you are a male, you seem to get a boost.

The article isn't about what colleges do. It's more about general . . . purposelessness of a generation.

And no, groups didn't figure it out. That's why we have all of the supports in place for marginalized groups. Or are you a pull yourself by your bootstraps Republican who blames minorities for not getting further ahead?

I am a minority and female. There were no supports when I went to college back in the 80s. I had to figure it out on my own. Not even my parents could help me since they didn't speak any English nor were they educated.

Stop coddling young men. You are not helping them. I have seen what coddling young men can do. It's not pretty.

So you are a Repblican?

What does politics have to do with this? You don't think there are liberals who think these young men have no grit? I voted for Biden. So did my spouse, and my spouse feels the same way I do.

Are you a liberal? Do liberals not have any fortitude or grit?

Yep, I was right. A Republican.

I'm one of those old-school liberals who doesn't think that teaching "grit" should be an excuse for a system that doesn't meet the needs of those it serves. It's always worth examining whether there is more at play than simply lazy, video-game obsessed young males. But obviously most people in this form would prefer to live by their winners and losers worldview without examining if there are ways we could do better for our youth.

[Anonymous]

OP— why should the rules be different for white males than everyone else on college admissions? I have yet to see any concrete explanation except video game addiction, which is the least compelling excuse ever for academic underperformance.

If you want to argue something like males having poor executive functioning skills, then the answer is clearly to make executive functioning skills classes and tutoring more widely available. But, I haven’t even seen that argued. And mommy doing it for them is not the solution.

Besides arguing video game addiction, some parents on here want to argue that their boys are not allowed to participate in class discussions or don’t feel welcome doing so. Given that girls, especially bright girls, are significantly likely to have anxiety issues than boys this is BS.

I’ve also seen the “but school is an all female environment” argument. And I agree many kids will get through ES with only women classroom teachers. But, my FCPS senior has 4 of 7 teachers who are male this year (AP Econ, AP CompGov, AP Calc and Orchestra), and 5 of 8 if you count advisory. Last year it was 3 of 7 male and 4 of 8 if you count advisory. In fact, across 2 kids and 8 years of FCPS high school, the number has been at least 3 of 7 male, except freshman year for one kid when it was 2 of 8. My son had one year where 5 of 7 teachers were men. Also, their principal has been male, and one kid’s assigned AP was male. So clearly not female dominated at the HS level when kids are applying for college.

Teach you kids that when the going gets rough, they need to dig deep and step up. Teach your sons that life doesn’t owe them a free pass. How long are you going to make excuses and blame everyone else because your kid has never faced adversity and you jump in every time they are challenged.

Being a white male with no real trauma or adversity in your life and giving up is pathetic.