I’m breadwinner, dh asked me to help with side hustle

[Anonymous]

OP, I feel for you. I was the breadwinner as well in my marriage with a DH who was underemployed by his own choice.

If his side hustle is practicing law, who is covering his malpractice insurance, and is he qualified to practice in the jurisdiction and subject area? This just seems like a bad idea as a "side hustle". There is just too many pitfalls and you absolutely cannot put your career at risk by being involved this.

You need to take a step back and think about what will work best for your family. Does it really matter that he makes less money than you? Combined, do you make enough money to support your family? Is he working at his job and spending time with your family? Aside from this issue, is he happy? If so, then let go of the money thing. It won't bring you happiness.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You both sound miserable, to be honest. I predict you two will divorce in 2025.

How is the OP miserable when this man actually told her “what else do you have to do that you can’t help with this” and she’s working FT and managing all the load of being a parent and managing a household while he doesn’t help? She’s a problem for being resentful? Absolutely not. You’re trying to gaslight this poor OP too.

Sounds like he is working. She is now earning twice as much as he does, and in the past he outearned by twice as much. But, somehow she seemed ok when she was earning less, but is not ok with him earning less.

I’m less sympathetic now I know you are both lawyers, OP.

You’re making 200k or more and he’s making 100k. Let me get my tissues to wipe my eyes.

If you don’t have enough time, hire help.

Ha. Op here. I make 150k and he makes 75.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I can’t tell if I’m crazy, being Gaslit, if he’s an a hole or if I’m the a hole.

I’m long time breadwinner. Dh used to make double my salary. He got laid off 8 years ago and never recovered. Since then, I’ve out earned him. I almost make double him now. It’s been frustrating to see him underemployed AND stressed about money AND complaining that he doesn’t like his job. On top of that, I handle the mental load at home. Kid stuff, school signups, it’s me.

I had a moment last week and got very overwhelmed last week with a kid starting a new school/ the sign ups, ordering uniforms, the paperwork, the invoices for payment etc. I had an outburst/vent and flipped out at dh. I said to him- im tired of being the responsible one. For feeling like the only adult. I need to be with someone who has their sht together. I pay for the family vacations, I pay for the schooling, I do the forms, I need a partner. I’m resentful.

Fast fwd to this week. Dh said “I have an opportunity for a side hustle that’s lucrative. But I’m not organized enough to keep track of everything. If only I had an organized smart wife who could help me with it.”

I lost my sht. I said I hear you saying that it’s my responsibility to help get you organized? It’s my responsibility to help you with another job? I have a full time job.”

Him: “I have a full time job too. What else do you have to do that you can’t help with this? You can’t say I’m lazy and not bringing in enough money and then also reject the opportunity to help bring in More income for our family.”

I can’t tell if I’m being gaslit or what. Just giving my honest feelings here. I am extremely resentful that he is underemployed, under paid, and not picking up the slack at home, AND also asking me to help him with a side hustle. It feels unfair that I told him I’m stressed about money, mental load, and that he isn’t contributing adequately….and the result is asking me to do even more??

He’s now turned this into- he feels unsupported and that I’m not willing to do more than the minimum. “If you came to me with an opportunity make more money for our family, I’d jump and say how can I help you. And you won’t do the same.”

Keeping it really real: HE IS NOT PULLING HIS WEIGHT. THAT ISNT A GROUP PROJECT. I’ve been doing my share and his for far too long. It’s time for him to step it up. Not ADD TO MY PLATE.

Am I an ahole? Am I being gaslit?

Did he lose his mind like you do when he was making twice as much as you?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You both sound miserable, to be honest. I predict you two will divorce in 2025.

How is the OP miserable when this man actually told her “what else do you have to do that you can’t help with this” and she’s working FT and managing all the load of being a parent and managing a household while he doesn’t help? She’s a problem for being resentful? Absolutely not. You’re trying to gaslight this poor OP too.

Sounds like he is working. She is now earning twice as much as he does, and in the past he outearned by twice as much. But, somehow she seemed ok when she was earning less, but is not ok with him earning less.

I’m less sympathetic now I know you are both lawyers, OP.

You’re making 200k or more and he’s making 100k. Let me get my tissues to wipe my eyes.

If you don’t have enough time, hire help.

Ha. Op here. I make 150k and he makes 75.

That’s plenty. Maybe stop spending so much?

[Anonymous]

OP, a couple things...

(1) As all the other lawyers have mentioned, your husband's side hustle makes no sense, and having another attorney (employed elsewhere!) become your secretary is a logistical and ethical morass, even putting aside the marital issues. It is a BS plan and I would stop wasting any time thinking about it.

(2) You should step back at work, even if it means less pay. Even if you and DH both are or become feds or the equivalent, you won't perish and should have sufficient income for a couple years (you mention no pressing expenses). This may cut resentment and also free up bandwidth to tackle your other issues.

(3) Very explicitly set up childcare/household plan where your DH takes on defined tasks. Perhaps he won't but then...

(4) If the above does not work, at that point, consider divorce. Raging on DCUM and debating how much time it does/should take to select camp is just a distraction from your problems.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I can’t tell if I’m crazy, being Gaslit, if he’s an a hole or if I’m the a hole.

I’m long time breadwinner. Dh used to make double my salary. He got laid off 8 years ago and never recovered. Since then, I’ve out earned him. I almost make double him now. It’s been frustrating to see him underemployed AND stressed about money AND complaining that he doesn’t like his job. On top of that, I handle the mental load at home. Kid stuff, school signups, it’s me.

I had a moment last week and got very overwhelmed last week with a kid starting a new school/ the sign ups, ordering uniforms, the paperwork, the invoices for payment etc. I had an outburst/vent and flipped out at dh. I said to him- im tired of being the responsible one. For feeling like the only adult. I need to be with someone who has their sht together. I pay for the family vacations, I pay for the schooling, I do the forms, I need a partner. I’m resentful.

Fast fwd to this week. Dh said “I have an opportunity for a side hustle that’s lucrative. But I’m not organized enough to keep track of everything. If only I had an organized smart wife who could help me with it.”

I lost my sht. I said I hear you saying that it’s my responsibility to help get you organized? It’s my responsibility to help you with another job? I have a full time job.”

Him: “I have a full time job too. What else do you have to do that you can’t help with this? You can’t say I’m lazy and not bringing in enough money and then also reject the opportunity to help bring in More income for our family.”

I can’t tell if I’m being gaslit or what. Just giving my honest feelings here. I am extremely resentful that he is underemployed, under paid, and not picking up the slack at home, AND also asking me to help him with a side hustle. It feels unfair that I told him I’m stressed about money, mental load, and that he isn’t contributing adequately….and the result is asking me to do even more??

He’s now turned this into- he feels unsupported and that I’m not willing to do more than the minimum. “If you came to me with an opportunity make more money for our family, I’d jump and say how can I help you. And you won’t do the same.”

Keeping it really real: HE IS NOT PULLING HIS WEIGHT. THAT ISNT A GROUP PROJECT. I’ve been doing my share and his for far too long. It’s time for him to step it up. Not ADD TO MY PLATE.

Am I an ahole? Am I being gaslit?

Did he lose his mind like you do when he was making twice as much as you?

Nope. Because I handled just about everything related to home, i paid my proportion of the bills, and kept the trains running. And I certainly never asked him for money for any of my personal expenses.

Now I still do all of this…plus make more money…plus kids.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I will full admit that if he were the breadwinner or even matched my salary, I wouid have zero issue being the default parent.

I am not ok with

Researching + piecing together summer camps
Doing forms and paperwork for camps
Paying for the camps out of my money
Noticing that the kids need new shoes and
Paying for the shoes out of my money

Sorry, if these are the tasks that are just *overwhelming* you I don’t think you ARE capable of being a high school level admin for him anyway. Seriously, researching camps takes like 10 minutes. Filling out the forms? 10 minutes x number of kids. “Noticing” the kids need shoes? 30 seconds? Then ordering a size up online is another 5 minutes x number of kids x number of half sizes their feet grow per year.

So generously we’re talking maybe three hours of effort per year, and you’re whining about it. It’s obviously just about the money. Sorry you’re not actually RHDC the princess you thought you were going to be 8 years ago…

Anyone who actually thinks researching camps is a 10 minute task is high, a crap parent, or has never actually looked into summer camps.

Medical forms take longer than that.

Shoes also take longer than that once a kid is over 5 and cares what kind of shoes they are wearing.

But I am guessing you know that and are just trolling.

No, I have three kids ages 8-14 who have always done summer camps and gone through countless pairs of shoes.

I believe that some of you can spend infinite time on these extremely simple tasks, but that does not make the tasks inherently time-consuming.

Maybe it’s because I’m a professional research scientist, but whenever someone describes “researching” summer camps as though it’s some arduous thing it is a red flag that they are some combination of inefficient and incompetent. I mean really, what exactly are you researching? My research consisted of 1) what camps are available near our house, 2) what are their hours, 3) which of those have space available for the weeks we need (summer break minus our vacation week), and 4) of those still standing which ones would the kids like best?

I cannot fathom how it would take longer than 10 minutes to fill out a medical form. I guess maybe if your kid has lots of allergies or is on a bunch of medications?

Shoes also aren’t difficult. Stride rite for the little kids and jordans for the older ones. My kids have big feet so we just order online. And this will probably blow your mind, but once kids are capable of looking stuff up on the internet (elementary school) you can just have them send you a link to the shoes they want. So there are maybe two or three years where a kid is old enough to care what shoes they’re wearing but unable to pick them out on their own. So for those cases I’ll concede that it’s maybe a 10-15 minute task. Happy?

But some of us care about our kids and what they like to do and the fact that they are much happier with certain conditions (e.g. access to indoor facilities for hot days) and enjoy going to camp with friends. None of that is strictly necessary but I consider it a good use of my time to find a camp that provides specific instruction they are looking for and to coordinate which weeks they will do various camps with their friends parents. I don’t find it particularly burdensome but it’s a task on my list like a number of things that I chose to do well.

If you don’t care I can understand how you could do camp sign up extremely quickly. Like giving your kid a happy meal for dinner every night. Easy peasy, right?

Your post made me laugh out loud. You want credit that it’s hard and takes time to research camps. You care about your children, with the implicit suggestion that the PP must not. But You acknowledge that none of that is necessary. But don’t worry you don’t find it burdensome. Here’s your gold star, lady.

I am the PP you are writing back to and you are completely missing the point. The point is yes you can do anything in. 10 minutes if you are going for the easiest route. I do that for tons of things including the shoe example. But some things are worth a little more effort. For my kids being in a camp they are interested in and being with friends makes a big difference to their happiness so it’s worth a couple hours of calling around and figuring out how to get them to camps that they both like without driving across town for different drop offs.

If your kids have no preferences or you don’t think their preferences are worth more than 10 minutes or maybe you don’t even know your kids well enough to understand that they really wish they saw their friends over the summer and everyone else is in camp x but don’t complain because Mon and Dad won’t care, well you do you. But if that’s your approach to every parenting task - just do whatever makes MY life easier, I feel bad for your kids.

Do you think your kids will seriously give a F about their carefully curated summer camps when the result is their parents getting divorced and them having to shuffle between two homes? Because this contemptuous, petty bean counting over things that YOU CHOOSE to do is going to lead you there. If you really care about your kids put some of this gold star effort into your marriage.

Also, by your own admission dealing with the camps takes you 2 hours, which is of course significantly longer than 10 minutes over the course of a day, but obviously it’s *nothing* over the course of a year (and summer camps are a ONCE A YEAR task).

Wow calm down! I’m not getting divorced. I am not OP. I’m also not cool with people on her gaslighting her that all her household tasks are super easy because they choose to make everything easy for themselves. I think women want a co-parent who is a partner, who not only shares in the load but recognizes that caring for children well takes time and effort. The advice for her to do more and/or act like a dad who doesn’t care doesn’t achieve any of that.

The camp thing gets to me because it used to be one of those things my husband thought was just make work. But then we had a really bad experience at a camp we picked because it was very convenient and one of our kids was miserable. We were faced with the choice of leaving them there or scrambling to find other childcare that might be better or might be worse. I’m glad my kid told me about the things that made camp shitty for them and trusted I would care. Now DH is totally on board and grateful that I do this, and have relationships with the families of our kids friends that enable me to make things go better for them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I can’t tell if I’m crazy, being Gaslit, if he’s an a hole or if I’m the a hole.

I’m long time breadwinner. Dh used to make double my salary. He got laid off 8 years ago and never recovered. Since then, I’ve out earned him. I almost make double him now. It’s been frustrating to see him underemployed AND stressed about money AND complaining that he doesn’t like his job. On top of that, I handle the mental load at home. Kid stuff, school signups, it’s me.

I had a moment last week and got very overwhelmed last week with a kid starting a new school/ the sign ups, ordering uniforms, the paperwork, the invoices for payment etc. I had an outburst/vent and flipped out at dh. I said to him- im tired of being the responsible one. For feeling like the only adult. I need to be with someone who has their sht together. I pay for the family vacations, I pay for the schooling, I do the forms, I need a partner. I’m resentful.

Fast fwd to this week. Dh said “I have an opportunity for a side hustle that’s lucrative. But I’m not organized enough to keep track of everything. If only I had an organized smart wife who could help me with it.”

I lost my sht. I said I hear you saying that it’s my responsibility to help get you organized? It’s my responsibility to help you with another job? I have a full time job.”

Him: “I have a full time job too. What else do you have to do that you can’t help with this? You can’t say I’m lazy and not bringing in enough money and then also reject the opportunity to help bring in More income for our family.”

I can’t tell if I’m being gaslit or what. Just giving my honest feelings here. I am extremely resentful that he is underemployed, under paid, and not picking up the slack at home, AND also asking me to help him with a side hustle. It feels unfair that I told him I’m stressed about money, mental load, and that he isn’t contributing adequately….and the result is asking me to do even more??

He’s now turned this into- he feels unsupported and that I’m not willing to do more than the minimum. “If you came to me with an opportunity make more money for our family, I’d jump and say how can I help you. And you won’t do the same.”

Keeping it really real: HE IS NOT PULLING HIS WEIGHT. THAT ISNT A GROUP PROJECT. I’ve been doing my share and his for far too long. It’s time for him to step it up. Not ADD TO MY PLATE.

Am I an ahole? Am I being gaslit?

Did he lose his mind like you do when he was making twice as much as you?

Nope. Because I handled just about everything related to home, i paid my proportion of the bills, and kept the trains running. And I certainly never asked him for money for any of my personal expenses.

Now I still do all of this…plus make more money…plus kids.

If you’re saying that your money is separate, it doesn’t matter at all who makes how much. So why even bring it up?

If your proportion of the bills is the number of bills you pay, who care? Bills are paid so easily in autopay

Maybe you’re trying to turn him into a woman. For example, if you want him to call the other parents for camp selection, those parents will be moms 9/10 times. You basically want him go hang out with the women.

I’m sure he didn’t lose it like you because he’s generous, not because you’re a martyr. Stop it with the power trip.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You are nasty, and that has nothing to do with anything he wants. It is not YOU who pays for this; it is WE, even if you are the spouse who earns more money! Was it all his money when he earned more? Did you consider that HIS money or your mutual money?
I can't even start to think about his admin request, but I would be divorcing you for having YOUR money and now OUR money.
The only gripe you should have is that he needs to equally pitch with the kidsand the household. Instead, you are trying to make him feel like he has no money.

He has asked me for money twice in the last 2 months. Bc he hasn’t been able to pay his bills. There are bills that are ours, there are bills that are mine, and bills that are his. We’ve never done one pot of shared money or bills.

There are no bills that are his and yours in a marriage. You keep proving what a narcissistic abuser you are. You need to get off your high horse and start being a partner in a marriage.

apparently that's how they do finances, so yeah, there are his and hers bills.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I will full admit that if he were the breadwinner or even matched my salary, I wouid have zero issue being the default parent.

I am not ok with

Researching + piecing together summer camps
Doing forms and paperwork for camps
Paying for the camps out of my money
Noticing that the kids need new shoes and
Paying for the shoes out of my money

Sorry, if these are the tasks that are just *overwhelming* you I don’t think you ARE capable of being a high school level admin for him anyway. Seriously, researching camps takes like 10 minutes. Filling out the forms? 10 minutes x number of kids. “Noticing” the kids need shoes? 30 seconds? Then ordering a size up online is another 5 minutes x number of kids x number of half sizes their feet grow per year.

So generously we’re talking maybe three hours of effort per year, and you’re whining about it. It’s obviously just about the money. Sorry you’re not actually RHDC the princess you thought you were going to be 8 years ago…

Anyone who actually thinks researching camps is a 10 minute task is high, a crap parent, or has never actually looked into summer camps.

Medical forms take longer than that.

Shoes also take longer than that once a kid is over 5 and cares what kind of shoes they are wearing.

But I am guessing you know that and are just trolling.

No, I have three kids ages 8-14 who have always done summer camps and gone through countless pairs of shoes.

I believe that some of you can spend infinite time on these extremely simple tasks, but that does not make the tasks inherently time-consuming.

Maybe it’s because I’m a professional research scientist, but whenever someone describes “researching” summer camps as though it’s some arduous thing it is a red flag that they are some combination of inefficient and incompetent. I mean really, what exactly are you researching? My research consisted of 1) what camps are available near our house, 2) what are their hours, 3) which of those have space available for the weeks we need (summer break minus our vacation week), and 4) of those still standing which ones would the kids like best?

I cannot fathom how it would take longer than 10 minutes to fill out a medical form. I guess maybe if your kid has lots of allergies or is on a bunch of medications?

Shoes also aren’t difficult. Stride rite for the little kids and jordans for the older ones. My kids have big feet so we just order online. And this will probably blow your mind, but once kids are capable of looking stuff up on the internet (elementary school) you can just have them send you a link to the shoes they want. So there are maybe two or three years where a kid is old enough to care what shoes they’re wearing but unable to pick them out on their own. So for those cases I’ll concede that it’s maybe a 10-15 minute task. Happy?

But some of us care about our kids and what they like to do and the fact that they are much happier with certain conditions (e.g. access to indoor facilities for hot days) and enjoy going to camp with friends. None of that is strictly necessary but I consider it a good use of my time to find a camp that provides specific instruction they are looking for and to coordinate which weeks they will do various camps with their friends parents. I don’t find it particularly burdensome but it’s a task on my list like a number of things that I chose to do well.

If you don’t care I can understand how you could do camp sign up extremely quickly. Like giving your kid a happy meal for dinner every night. Easy peasy, right?

Your post made me laugh out loud. You want credit that it’s hard and takes time to research camps. You care about your children, with the implicit suggestion that the PP must not. But You acknowledge that none of that is necessary. But don’t worry you don’t find it burdensome. Here’s your gold star, lady.

I am the PP you are writing back to and you are completely missing the point. The point is yes you can do anything in. 10 minutes if you are going for the easiest route. I do that for tons of things including the shoe example. But some things are worth a little more effort. For my kids being in a camp they are interested in and being with friends makes a big difference to their happiness so it’s worth a couple hours of calling around and figuring out how to get them to camps that they both like without driving across town for different drop offs.

If your kids have no preferences or you don’t think their preferences are worth more than 10 minutes or maybe you don’t even know your kids well enough to understand that they really wish they saw their friends over the summer and everyone else is in camp x but don’t complain because Mon and Dad won’t care, well you do you. But if that’s your approach to every parenting task - just do whatever makes MY life easier, I feel bad for your kids.

Do you think your kids will seriously give a F about their carefully curated summer camps when the result is their parents getting divorced and them having to shuffle between two homes? Because this contemptuous, petty bean counting over things that YOU CHOOSE to do is going to lead you there. If you really care about your kids put some of this gold star effort into your marriage.

Also, by your own admission dealing with the camps takes you 2 hours, which is of course significantly longer than 10 minutes over the course of a day, but obviously it’s *nothing* over the course of a year (and summer camps are a ONCE A YEAR task).

Wow calm down! I’m not getting divorced. I am not OP. I’m also not cool with people on her gaslighting her that all her household tasks are super easy because they choose to make everything easy for themselves. I think women want a co-parent who is a partner, who not only shares in the load but recognizes that caring for children well takes time and effort. The advice for her to do more and/or act like a dad who doesn’t care doesn’t achieve any of that.

The camp thing gets to me because it used to be one of those things my husband thought was just make work. But then we had a really bad experience at a camp we picked because it was very convenient and one of our kids was miserable. We were faced with the choice of leaving them there or scrambling to find other childcare that might be better or might be worse. I’m glad my kid told me about the things that made camp shitty for them and trusted I would care. Now DH is totally on board and grateful that I do this, and have relationships with the families of our kids friends that enable me to make things go better for them.

Other people aren't cool with her gaslighting her husband or other women that tasks are super difficult because you/she makes them harder for themselves.

[Anonymous]

Funny troll thread. So much back and forth that fake op lawyer has for DCUM!

Maybe the side hustle is racking up clicks for Jeff Steeles ad click revenue!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I will full admit that if he were the breadwinner or even matched my salary, I wouid have zero issue being the default parent.

I am not ok with

Researching + piecing together summer camps
Doing forms and paperwork for camps
Paying for the camps out of my money
Noticing that the kids need new shoes and
Paying for the shoes out of my money

Sorry, if these are the tasks that are just *overwhelming* you I don’t think you ARE capable of being a high school level admin for him anyway. Seriously, researching camps takes like 10 minutes. Filling out the forms? 10 minutes x number of kids. “Noticing” the kids need shoes? 30 seconds? Then ordering a size up online is another 5 minutes x number of kids x number of half sizes their feet grow per year.

So generously we’re talking maybe three hours of effort per year, and you’re whining about it. It’s obviously just about the money. Sorry you’re not actually RHDC the princess you thought you were going to be 8 years ago…

Anyone who actually thinks researching camps is a 10 minute task is high, a crap parent, or has never actually looked into summer camps.

Medical forms take longer than that.

Shoes also take longer than that once a kid is over 5 and cares what kind of shoes they are wearing.

But I am guessing you know that and are just trolling.

No, I have three kids ages 8-14 who have always done summer camps and gone through countless pairs of shoes.

I believe that some of you can spend infinite time on these extremely simple tasks, but that does not make the tasks inherently time-consuming.

Maybe it’s because I’m a professional research scientist, but whenever someone describes “researching” summer camps as though it’s some arduous thing it is a red flag that they are some combination of inefficient and incompetent. I mean really, what exactly are you researching? My research consisted of 1) what camps are available near our house, 2) what are their hours, 3) which of those have space available for the weeks we need (summer break minus our vacation week), and 4) of those still standing which ones would the kids like best?

I cannot fathom how it would take longer than 10 minutes to fill out a medical form. I guess maybe if your kid has lots of allergies or is on a bunch of medications?

Shoes also aren’t difficult. Stride rite for the little kids and jordans for the older ones. My kids have big feet so we just order online. And this will probably blow your mind, but once kids are capable of looking stuff up on the internet (elementary school) you can just have them send you a link to the shoes they want. So there are maybe two or three years where a kid is old enough to care what shoes they’re wearing but unable to pick them out on their own. So for those cases I’ll concede that it’s maybe a 10-15 minute task. Happy?

But some of us care about our kids and what they like to do and the fact that they are much happier with certain conditions (e.g. access to indoor facilities for hot days) and enjoy going to camp with friends. None of that is strictly necessary but I consider it a good use of my time to find a camp that provides specific instruction they are looking for and to coordinate which weeks they will do various camps with their friends parents. I don’t find it particularly burdensome but it’s a task on my list like a number of things that I chose to do well.

If you don’t care I can understand how you could do camp sign up extremely quickly. Like giving your kid a happy meal for dinner every night. Easy peasy, right?

Your post made me laugh out loud. You want credit that it’s hard and takes time to research camps. You care about your children, with the implicit suggestion that the PP must not. But You acknowledge that none of that is necessary. But don’t worry you don’t find it burdensome. Here’s your gold star, lady.

I am the PP you are writing back to and you are completely missing the point. The point is yes you can do anything in. 10 minutes if you are going for the easiest route. I do that for tons of things including the shoe example. But some things are worth a little more effort. For my kids being in a camp they are interested in and being with friends makes a big difference to their happiness so it’s worth a couple hours of calling around and figuring out how to get them to camps that they both like without driving across town for different drop offs.

If your kids have no preferences or you don’t think their preferences are worth more than 10 minutes or maybe you don’t even know your kids well enough to understand that they really wish they saw their friends over the summer and everyone else is in camp x but don’t complain because Mon and Dad won’t care, well you do you. But if that’s your approach to every parenting task - just do whatever makes MY life easier, I feel bad for your kids.

Do you think your kids will seriously give a F about their carefully curated summer camps when the result is their parents getting divorced and them having to shuffle between two homes? Because this contemptuous, petty bean counting over things that YOU CHOOSE to do is going to lead you there. If you really care about your kids put some of this gold star effort into your marriage.

Also, by your own admission dealing with the camps takes you 2 hours, which is of course significantly longer than 10 minutes over the course of a day, but obviously it’s *nothing* over the course of a year (and summer camps are a ONCE A YEAR task).

Amazing you’re still making this argument. It’s not JUST the camps. It’s the camps plus everything else. And then the accusation that the work isn’t actually work.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I will full admit that if he were the breadwinner or even matched my salary, I wouid have zero issue being the default parent.

I am not ok with

Researching + piecing together summer camps
Doing forms and paperwork for camps
Paying for the camps out of my money
Noticing that the kids need new shoes and
Paying for the shoes out of my money

Sorry, if these are the tasks that are just *overwhelming* you I don’t think you ARE capable of being a high school level admin for him anyway. Seriously, researching camps takes like 10 minutes. Filling out the forms? 10 minutes x number of kids. “Noticing” the kids need shoes? 30 seconds? Then ordering a size up online is another 5 minutes x number of kids x number of half sizes their feet grow per year.

So generously we’re talking maybe three hours of effort per year, and you’re whining about it. It’s obviously just about the money. Sorry you’re not actually RHDC the princess you thought you were going to be 8 years ago…

Anyone who actually thinks researching camps is a 10 minute task is high, a crap parent, or has never actually looked into summer camps.

Medical forms take longer than that.

Shoes also take longer than that once a kid is over 5 and cares what kind of shoes they are wearing.

But I am guessing you know that and are just trolling.

No, I have three kids ages 8-14 who have always done summer camps and gone through countless pairs of shoes.

I believe that some of you can spend infinite time on these extremely simple tasks, but that does not make the tasks inherently time-consuming.

Maybe it’s because I’m a professional research scientist, but whenever someone describes “researching” summer camps as though it’s some arduous thing it is a red flag that they are some combination of inefficient and incompetent. I mean really, what exactly are you researching? My research consisted of 1) what camps are available near our house, 2) what are their hours, 3) which of those have space available for the weeks we need (summer break minus our vacation week), and 4) of those still standing which ones would the kids like best?

I cannot fathom how it would take longer than 10 minutes to fill out a medical form. I guess maybe if your kid has lots of allergies or is on a bunch of medications?

Shoes also aren’t difficult. Stride rite for the little kids and jordans for the older ones. My kids have big feet so we just order online. And this will probably blow your mind, but once kids are capable of looking stuff up on the internet (elementary school) you can just have them send you a link to the shoes they want. So there are maybe two or three years where a kid is old enough to care what shoes they’re wearing but unable to pick them out on their own. So for those cases I’ll concede that it’s maybe a 10-15 minute task. Happy?

But some of us care about our kids and what they like to do and the fact that they are much happier with certain conditions (e.g. access to indoor facilities for hot days) and enjoy going to camp with friends. None of that is strictly necessary but I consider it a good use of my time to find a camp that provides specific instruction they are looking for and to coordinate which weeks they will do various camps with their friends parents. I don’t find it particularly burdensome but it’s a task on my list like a number of things that I chose to do well.

If you don’t care I can understand how you could do camp sign up extremely quickly. Like giving your kid a happy meal for dinner every night. Easy peasy, right?

Your post made me laugh out loud. You want credit that it’s hard and takes time to research camps. You care about your children, with the implicit suggestion that the PP must not. But You acknowledge that none of that is necessary. But don’t worry you don’t find it burdensome. Here’s your gold star, lady.

I am the PP you are writing back to and you are completely missing the point. The point is yes you can do anything in. 10 minutes if you are going for the easiest route. I do that for tons of things including the shoe example. But some things are worth a little more effort. For my kids being in a camp they are interested in and being with friends makes a big difference to their happiness so it’s worth a couple hours of calling around and figuring out how to get them to camps that they both like without driving across town for different drop offs.

If your kids have no preferences or you don’t think their preferences are worth more than 10 minutes or maybe you don’t even know your kids well enough to understand that they really wish they saw their friends over the summer and everyone else is in camp x but don’t complain because Mon and Dad won’t care, well you do you. But if that’s your approach to every parenting task - just do whatever makes MY life easier, I feel bad for your kids.

Do you think your kids will seriously give a F about their carefully curated summer camps when the result is their parents getting divorced and them having to shuffle between two homes? Because this contemptuous, petty bean counting over things that YOU CHOOSE to do is going to lead you there. If you really care about your kids put some of this gold star effort into your marriage.

Also, by your own admission dealing with the camps takes you 2 hours, which is of course significantly longer than 10 minutes over the course of a day, but obviously it’s *nothing* over the course of a year (and summer camps are a ONCE A YEAR task).

Amazing you’re still making this argument. It’s not JUST the camps. It’s the camps plus everything else. And then the accusation that the work isn’t actually work.

Everyone and anyone can make busy work if they choose to. Doesn't mean it's actually meaningful or worth a damn.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
There are no bills that are his and yours in a marriage. You keep proving what a narcissistic abuser you are. You need to get off your high horse and start being a partner in a marriage.

You sound like my borderline personality, conflict avoidant, play the victim Ex H.

I am sorry your ex was a narc and they are all victims of their own making. You know that. However, I am in a very healthy marriage, have been married for 30 years, and I know what a healthy marriage looks like. It doesn't look like OPs, nor do mentally healthy people in a healthy marriage have separate bills. If you have no learned that, I hope that in the future, you will find a partner who will show you what kindness is and what a healthy relationship looks like. If this is OP, you just keep proving you are a narcissist gaslighting people

It’s pretty common to have separate bills and accounts in a marriage. Married for 20 years, never merged a single account. Shrug.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I will full admit that if he were the breadwinner or even matched my salary, I wouid have zero issue being the default parent.

I am not ok with

Researching + piecing together summer camps
Doing forms and paperwork for camps
Paying for the camps out of my money
Noticing that the kids need new shoes and
Paying for the shoes out of my money

Sorry, if these are the tasks that are just *overwhelming* you I don’t think you ARE capable of being a high school level admin for him anyway. Seriously, researching camps takes like 10 minutes. Filling out the forms? 10 minutes x number of kids. “Noticing” the kids need shoes? 30 seconds? Then ordering a size up online is another 5 minutes x number of kids x number of half sizes their feet grow per year.

So generously we’re talking maybe three hours of effort per year, and you’re whining about it. It’s obviously just about the money. Sorry you’re not actually RHDC the princess you thought you were going to be 8 years ago…

Anyone who actually thinks researching camps is a 10 minute task is high, a crap parent, or has never actually looked into summer camps.

Medical forms take longer than that.

Shoes also take longer than that once a kid is over 5 and cares what kind of shoes they are wearing.

But I am guessing you know that and are just trolling.

No, I have three kids ages 8-14 who have always done summer camps and gone through countless pairs of shoes.

I believe that some of you can spend infinite time on these extremely simple tasks, but that does not make the tasks inherently time-consuming.

Maybe it’s because I’m a professional research scientist, but whenever someone describes “researching” summer camps as though it’s some arduous thing it is a red flag that they are some combination of inefficient and incompetent. I mean really, what exactly are you researching? My research consisted of 1) what camps are available near our house, 2) what are their hours, 3) which of those have space available for the weeks we need (summer break minus our vacation week), and 4) of those still standing which ones would the kids like best?

I cannot fathom how it would take longer than 10 minutes to fill out a medical form. I guess maybe if your kid has lots of allergies or is on a bunch of medications?

Shoes also aren’t difficult. Stride rite for the little kids and jordans for the older ones. My kids have big feet so we just order online. And this will probably blow your mind, but once kids are capable of looking stuff up on the internet (elementary school) you can just have them send you a link to the shoes they want. So there are maybe two or three years where a kid is old enough to care what shoes they’re wearing but unable to pick them out on their own. So for those cases I’ll concede that it’s maybe a 10-15 minute task. Happy?

But some of us care about our kids and what they like to do and the fact that they are much happier with certain conditions (e.g. access to indoor facilities for hot days) and enjoy going to camp with friends. None of that is strictly necessary but I consider it a good use of my time to find a camp that provides specific instruction they are looking for and to coordinate which weeks they will do various camps with their friends parents. I don’t find it particularly burdensome but it’s a task on my list like a number of things that I chose to do well.

If you don’t care I can understand how you could do camp sign up extremely quickly. Like giving your kid a happy meal for dinner every night. Easy peasy, right?

Your post made me laugh out loud. You want credit that it’s hard and takes time to research camps. You care about your children, with the implicit suggestion that the PP must not. But You acknowledge that none of that is necessary. But don’t worry you don’t find it burdensome. Here’s your gold star, lady.

I am the PP you are writing back to and you are completely missing the point. The point is yes you can do anything in. 10 minutes if you are going for the easiest route. I do that for tons of things including the shoe example. But some things are worth a little more effort. For my kids being in a camp they are interested in and being with friends makes a big difference to their happiness so it’s worth a couple hours of calling around and figuring out how to get them to camps that they both like without driving across town for different drop offs.

If your kids have no preferences or you don’t think their preferences are worth more than 10 minutes or maybe you don’t even know your kids well enough to understand that they really wish they saw their friends over the summer and everyone else is in camp x but don’t complain because Mon and Dad won’t care, well you do you. But if that’s your approach to every parenting task - just do whatever makes MY life easier, I feel bad for your kids.

Do you think your kids will seriously give a F about their carefully curated summer camps when the result is their parents getting divorced and them having to shuffle between two homes? Because this contemptuous, petty bean counting over things that YOU CHOOSE to do is going to lead you there. If you really care about your kids put some of this gold star effort into your marriage.

Also, by your own admission dealing with the camps takes you 2 hours, which is of course significantly longer than 10 minutes over the course of a day, but obviously it’s *nothing* over the course of a year (and summer camps are a ONCE A YEAR task).

Amazing you’re still making this argument. It’s not JUST the camps. It’s the camps plus everything else. And then the accusation that the work isn’t actually work.

Everyone and anyone can make busy work if they choose to. Doesn't mean it's actually meaningful or worth a damn.

What’s not busywork, in your opinion? Here’s a list of everything my ExDH did not do. Kindly let me know which was busywork

- cooking
- cleaning
- grocery shopping
- around 80% of childcare
- medical appointments
- childcare arrangements
- clothes and shoes
- any skills teaching necessary (eg how to tie shoes)
- IEP meetings and follow up
- paying bills
- home maintenance
- yard work
- all holiday and birthday planning & execution