Estrangement Doesn't Just Happen to "Bad" Moms—It Happened to Me Too

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I believe the person who doesn’t go out of their way to air their side of a personal relationship publicly. There’s something wrong with a person who does that.

They do that out of the same heartache as a death.
Millennials need to understand how relationships work and how to communicate. Estrangement is epic in this generation and it is usually a daughter or son in law that draws a line in the sand. I've heard a ton of stories as to why someone thinks their MIL is toxic. They don't know what toxic means. Any comment is misconstrued, ever thought, and taken personally...and then the family is cut off.

I’d argue that people are finally starting to demand to be treated better. Being a MIL doesn’t give you a license to say horrible comments. In previous generations women were expected to just take it. Sorry but no one is treating me badly. People make mistakes, but continue to insult me and cause trouble and yes, you will be cut off.

Or maybe someone is the type of person who needs so much validation that they read slights into everything. That is what I see. I know someone who went to a craft store with her DIL. Mil carried the baby, and saw a friend. The friend said to the MIL, who knew there was a new grandchild, " Is that the new baby?" Mil said " Yes! It's our new addition!"
DIL made her apologize later that night , with the husband/son in tow to watch, for the word "our." " It's not YOUR baby!" She was angry, and crying, that Mom used the word "our." SIL, husband's sister suggested that DIL might be overtired. The entire family has been cut off . It's been years. No contact. There are more stories like this. Don't ever assume there is always the "right" one and inlaws or parents are always monsters.

I'd bet a million dollars that the MIL had been acting like its equally/partially her baby up to that point, and it was that behavior and not the particular words that day that caused the estrangement. Like the MIL complaining that she doesn't get to see "our new baby" enough, for example. The fact is that it's not her baby at ALL unless the parents of the baby want that to be the case.

Seriously? You’re going to defend an entire family being cut off because A GRANDMOTHER WAS OVERJOYED ABOUT A NEW BABY? Seriously? Do you really not see the sick need for control and dominance that reflects? As well as, yes, narcissism? Cutting the husband off from his family for wanting to see their grandchild — that’s some cult shit right there.

You fail at reading comprehension.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Who asks their son two weeks before the wedding if he is sure?!! Or purchases Disneyland Park tickets for her son and his gf after he tells her he is planning to propose? Yuck.

Parents who know it might not be right.

My father asked me two months before the wedding. He also asked me again right before walking me down the aisle--the wedding photographer caught me giving him a WTF look. He was right, we were divorced 3 yrs later when he left me with a 3 month old who he later gave up for adoption, because he's a complete douchebag. My father was right, and he *knew*.

Same here. My dad asked me the morning of the wedding. My spouse left me with an infant. Dad was right. I would never, ever consider cutting off my parents. Estrangement is not a acceptable except in cases of criminal and major physical abuse.

Yes, I judge you if you are estranged from your parents over accusations that they are narcissistic or toxic. It's more likely that you are the problem.

You need to consider the possibility that people are saying things like “narcissistic” and “toxic” because it is less awkward than saying things like “my mother slept with me in her bed until I was 14” or “I don’t exactly know why, but my sister ends up sleeping with every one of my dad’s AA sponsees and he seems to be OK with it.”

Some things are none of your business and when you judge on the limited information you are given you look like an ass.

[Anonymous]

The bizarre and crazy backstory narratives the pro-estrangement posters are weaving out of thin air are remarkable. Screaming "narcissist" while embellishing a wholly imaginary backstory does not make you sound rational or credible.

I think there are times estrangement is necessary. Not getting the exact present you wanted in college is not one of them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I believe the person who doesn’t go out of their way to air their side of a personal relationship publicly. There’s something wrong with a person who does that.

They do that out of the same heartache as a death.
Millennials need to understand how relationships work and how to communicate. Estrangement is epic in this generation and it is usually a daughter or son in law that draws a line in the sand. I've heard a ton of stories as to why someone thinks their MIL is toxic. They don't know what toxic means. Any comment is misconstrued, ever thought, and taken personally...and then the family is cut off.

I’d argue that people are finally starting to demand to be treated better. Being a MIL doesn’t give you a license to say horrible comments. In previous generations women were expected to just take it. Sorry but no one is treating me badly. People make mistakes, but continue to insult me and cause trouble and yes, you will be cut off.

Or maybe someone is the type of person who needs so much validation that they read slights into everything. That is what I see. I know someone who went to a craft store with her DIL. Mil carried the baby, and saw a friend. The friend said to the MIL, who knew there was a new grandchild, " Is that the new baby?" Mil said " Yes! It's our new addition!"
DIL made her apologize later that night , with the husband/son in tow to watch, for the word "our." " It's not YOUR baby!" She was angry, and crying, that Mom used the word "our." SIL, husband's sister suggested that DIL might be overtired. The entire family has been cut off . It's been years. No contact. There are more stories like this. Don't ever assume there is always the "right" one and inlaws or parents are always monsters.

I'd bet a million dollars that the MIL had been acting like its equally/partially her baby up to that point, and it was that behavior and not the particular words that day that caused the estrangement. Like the MIL complaining that she doesn't get to see "our new baby" enough, for example. The fact is that it's not her baby at ALL unless the parents of the baby want that to be the case.

Seriously? You’re going to defend an entire family being cut off because A GRANDMOTHER WAS OVERJOYED ABOUT A NEW BABY? Seriously? Do you really not see the sick need for control and dominance that reflects? As well as, yes, narcissism? Cutting the husband off from his family for wanting to see their grandchild — that’s some cult shit right there.

“OVERJOYED” is not a blanket exuse for obnoxious behavior. Boundaries between adults dont’t get cancelled by having a baby. It’s mother’s and father’s baby, not “ours”. You don’t get to be present in the hospital unless invited, you visit when invited, you hold the baby when parents are ok with it, and you dont get to throw a hissy fit about any of this. Its not about you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Pp who loathes ... SAME!! I hear you and I understand. My mom is the same.

Same here, too.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I believe the person who doesn’t go out of their way to air their side of a personal relationship publicly. There’s something wrong with a person who does that.

They do that out of the same heartache as a death.
Millennials need to understand how relationships work and how to communicate. Estrangement is epic in this generation and it is usually a daughter or son in law that draws a line in the sand. I've heard a ton of stories as to why someone thinks their MIL is toxic. They don't know what toxic means. Any comment is misconstrued, ever thought, and taken personally...and then the family is cut off.

I’d argue that people are finally starting to demand to be treated better. Being a MIL doesn’t give you a license to say horrible comments. In previous generations women were expected to just take it. Sorry but no one is treating me badly. People make mistakes, but continue to insult me and cause trouble and yes, you will be cut off.

Or maybe someone is the type of person who needs so much validation that they read slights into everything. That is what I see. I know someone who went to a craft store with her DIL. Mil carried the baby, and saw a friend. The friend said to the MIL, who knew there was a new grandchild, " Is that the new baby?" Mil said " Yes! It's our new addition!"
DIL made her apologize later that night , with the husband/son in tow to watch, for the word "our." " It's not YOUR baby!" She was angry, and crying, that Mom used the word "our." SIL, husband's sister suggested that DIL might be overtired. The entire family has been cut off . It's been years. No contact. There are more stories like this. Don't ever assume there is always the "right" one and inlaws or parents are always monsters.

I'd bet a million dollars that the MIL had been acting like its equally/partially her baby up to that point, and it was that behavior and not the particular words that day that caused the estrangement. Like the MIL complaining that she doesn't get to see "our new baby" enough, for example. The fact is that it's not her baby at ALL unless the parents of the baby want that to be the case.

Seriously? You’re going to defend an entire family being cut off because A GRANDMOTHER WAS OVERJOYED ABOUT A NEW BABY? Seriously? Do you really not see the sick need for control and dominance that reflects? As well as, yes, narcissism? Cutting the husband off from his family for wanting to see their grandchild — that’s some cult shit right there.

“OVERJOYED” is not a blanket exuse for obnoxious behavior. Boundaries between adults dont’t get cancelled by having a baby. It’s mother’s and father’s baby, not “ours”. You don’t get to be present in the hospital unless invited, you visit when invited, you hold the baby when parents are ok with it, and you dont get to throw a hissy fit about any of this. Its not about you.

My mom, who I’m estranged from for other reasons, pulled crap like that. Due to complications, I wasn’t able to hold my first baby right away. She talked the nurse into letting her hold the baby and it actually delayed them bringing the baby back to me so I could hold him the first time. While he was an infant, my mom would say “our baby” too. It was really annoying. I asked her to stop, and she responded that I came out of her body, so any child coming from my body belongs to her too. I didn’t see the situation for what it was at the time, but long story short, she never met a boundary she wouldn’t gleefully cross.

[Anonymous]

All of you "same here " buddies, or sock puppets, are actually giving points to your opposing viewpoint- better than anyone with an example can. Grow up.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:All of you "same here " buddies, or sock puppets, are actually giving points to your opposing viewpoint- better than anyone with an example can. Grow up.

I'm the pp that people are saying same here to. It is nice to have people understand. I imagine it's difficult to be confronted with the mental anguish you inflict on others pp.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The bizarre and crazy backstory narratives the pro-estrangement posters are weaving out of thin air are remarkable. Screaming "narcissist" while embellishing a wholly imaginary backstory does not make you sound rational or credible.

I think there are times estrangement is necessary. Not getting the exact present you wanted in college is not one of them.

Serious question, have you ever been affected by or spent time with a genuinely personality disordered individual? There are very distinct characteristics that are pretty obvious to those that have been there. There’s obviously more to the story about the college pet gift than Mom is relaying.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The bizarre and crazy backstory narratives the pro-estrangement posters are weaving out of thin air are remarkable. Screaming "narcissist" while embellishing a wholly imaginary backstory does not make you sound rational or credible.

I think there are times estrangement is necessary. Not getting the exact present you wanted in college is not one of them.

Serious question, have you ever been affected by or spent time with a genuinely personality disordered individual? There are very distinct characteristics that are pretty obvious to those that have been there. There’s obviously more to the story about the college pet gift than Mom is relaying.

Yes. Making up wildly exaggerated stories and background was part of the dysfunction.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The bizarre and crazy backstory narratives the pro-estrangement posters are weaving out of thin air are remarkable. Screaming "narcissist" while embellishing a wholly imaginary backstory does not make you sound rational or credible.

I think there are times estrangement is necessary. Not getting the exact present you wanted in college is not one of them.

Serious question, have you ever been affected by or spent time with a genuinely personality disordered individual? There are very distinct characteristics that are pretty obvious to those that have been there. There’s obviously more to the story about the college pet gift than Mom is relaying.

Yes. Making up wildly exaggerated stories and background was part of the dysfunction.

Ah, gaslighting by accusing the other person of gaslighting! My least fave :-/

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The bizarre and crazy backstory narratives the pro-estrangement posters are weaving out of thin air are remarkable. Screaming "narcissist" while embellishing a wholly imaginary backstory does not make you sound rational or credible.

I think there are times estrangement is necessary. Not getting the exact present you wanted in college is not one of them.

Serious question, have you ever been affected by or spent time with a genuinely personality disordered individual? There are very distinct characteristics that are pretty obvious to those that have been there. There’s obviously more to the story about the college pet gift than Mom is relaying.

Yes. Making up wildly exaggerated stories and background was part of the dysfunction.

Ah, gaslighting by accusing the other person of gaslighting! My least fave :-/

You know, you are really building the case that the people screaming narcissist are unbalanced.

I believe there are cases where estrangement is warranted. I believe there are cases of years of abuse. I have friends, in fact, in that situation. But I also believe there are people like a lot of posters on this thread who live in entirely fantastical worlds, where they are imaginary victims. Making up whole cloth backstories is typical of this type. Look, I am not the one who made up an imaginary backstory here. I didn't come up with some fantasy world. That was you and the other pro-estrangement posters. And when you do that, you really weaken your credibility. The fact you don't even see this should be a red flag to you, but I bet it won't be.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The bizarre and crazy backstory narratives the pro-estrangement posters are weaving out of thin air are remarkable. Screaming "narcissist" while embellishing a wholly imaginary backstory does not make you sound rational or credible.

I think there are times estrangement is necessary. Not getting the exact present you wanted in college is not one of them.

Serious question, have you ever been affected by or spent time with a genuinely personality disordered individual? There are very distinct characteristics that are pretty obvious to those that have been there. There’s obviously more to the story about the college pet gift than Mom is relaying.

Yes. Making up wildly exaggerated stories and background was part of the dysfunction.

Ah, gaslighting by accusing the other person of gaslighting! My least fave :-/

You know, you are really building the case that the people screaming narcissist are unbalanced.

I believe there are cases where estrangement is warranted. I believe there are cases of years of abuse. I have friends, in fact, in that situation. But I also believe there are people like a lot of posters on this thread who live in entirely fantastical worlds, where they are imaginary victims. Making up whole cloth backstories is typical of this type. Look, I am not the one who made up an imaginary backstory here. I didn't come up with some fantasy world. That was you and the other pro-estrangement posters. And when you do that, you really weaken your credibility. The fact you don't even see this should be a red flag to you, but I bet it won't be.

Five bucks says this PP is the mom that wrote the post about giving her DIL the pet gift.

PP, you don't know any better than anyone else if there's a backstory or not as it relates to the situations posted on this thread. The fact you are so ridiculously insistent that there isn't says a lot about your motives and background. I choose to give people the benefit of the doubt, especially those who don't have the opportunity to defend themselves.

And personally, I don't give a crap if you take people's claims of narcissism seriously. Who are you, really? Nobody.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The bizarre and crazy backstory narratives the pro-estrangement posters are weaving out of thin air are remarkable. Screaming "narcissist" while embellishing a wholly imaginary backstory does not make you sound rational or credible.

I think there are times estrangement is necessary. Not getting the exact present you wanted in college is not one of them.

Serious question, have you ever been affected by or spent time with a genuinely personality disordered individual? There are very distinct characteristics that are pretty obvious to those that have been there. There’s obviously more to the story about the college pet gift than Mom is relaying.

Yes. Making up wildly exaggerated stories and background was part of the dysfunction.

Ah, gaslighting by accusing the other person of gaslighting! My least fave :-/

You know, you are really building the case that the people screaming narcissist are unbalanced.

I believe there are cases where estrangement is warranted. I believe there are cases of years of abuse. I have friends, in fact, in that situation. But I also believe there are people like a lot of posters on this thread who live in entirely fantastical worlds, where they are imaginary victims. Making up whole cloth backstories is typical of this type. Look, I am not the one who made up an imaginary backstory here. I didn't come up with some fantasy world. That was you and the other pro-estrangement posters. And when you do that, you really weaken your credibility. The fact you don't even see this should be a red flag to you, but I bet it won't be.

Five bucks says this PP is the mom that wrote the post about giving her DIL the pet gift.

PP, you don't know any better than anyone else if there's a backstory or not as it relates to the situations posted on this thread. The fact you are so ridiculously insistent that there isn't says a lot about your motives and background. I choose to give people the benefit of the doubt, especially those who don't have the opportunity to defend themselves.

And personally, I don't give a crap if you take people's claims of narcissism seriously. Who are you, really? Nobody.

You can ask Jeff to confirm I am a different poster, if you'd like.

I am not taking a side here other than to point out that making up stories whole cloth doesn't make one sound credible. If that is a shock to you, you might want to ask why.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The bizarre and crazy backstory narratives the pro-estrangement posters are weaving out of thin air are remarkable. Screaming "narcissist" while embellishing a wholly imaginary backstory does not make you sound rational or credible.

I think there are times estrangement is necessary. Not getting the exact present you wanted in college is not one of them.

Serious question, have you ever been affected by or spent time with a genuinely personality disordered individual? There are very distinct characteristics that are pretty obvious to those that have been there. There’s obviously more to the story about the college pet gift than Mom is relaying.

Yes. Making up wildly exaggerated stories and background was part of the dysfunction.

Ah, gaslighting by accusing the other person of gaslighting! My least fave :-/

You know, you are really building the case that the people screaming narcissist are unbalanced.

I believe there are cases where estrangement is warranted. I believe there are cases of years of abuse. I have friends, in fact, in that situation. But I also believe there are people like a lot of posters on this thread who live in entirely fantastical worlds, where they are imaginary victims. Making up whole cloth backstories is typical of this type. Look, I am not the one who made up an imaginary backstory here. I didn't come up with some fantasy world. That was you and the other pro-estrangement posters. And when you do that, you really weaken your credibility. The fact you don't even see this should be a red flag to you, but I bet it won't be.

Five bucks says this PP is the mom that wrote the post about giving her DIL the pet gift.

PP, you don't know any better than anyone else if there's a backstory or not as it relates to the situations posted on this thread. The fact you are so ridiculously insistent that there isn't says a lot about your motives and background. I choose to give people the benefit of the doubt, especially those who don't have the opportunity to defend themselves.

And personally, I don't give a crap if you take people's claims of narcissism seriously. Who are you, really? Nobody.

You can ask Jeff to confirm I am a different poster, if you'd like.

I am not taking a side here other than to point out that making up stories whole cloth doesn't make one sound credible. If that is a shock to you, you might want to ask why.

What hasn't sounded credible to you?