S/O- Affirmative Action- where does it end?

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:OP - affirmative action is horrible and discriminatory. It should not be a thing.

But this is the system we are dealing with, so your son should check both boxes or check 'two or more races'. (Which is it?)

OP, PP's opinions are horrible and ignorant. Affirmative action should absolutely be a thing.

I have no opinion about what box your child should check, but commend your throughtfullness in asking the question. Have you spoken to your child's guiance counselor or any admissions offices?

Affirmative action should be based on income not race, hence that would be no need to check "boxes". if you are white and poor, brown and poor, yellow and poor, and black and poor, you should benefit from affirmative action. The common denominator should be income not race.

+1
It's a racist policy. The worst part is the never ending lies, which have caused the sickos to rebrand the policy every few years. They give someone an opportunity because of the color of their skin, and that same opportunity is denied to someone because of their skin color. The policy has nothing to do with opportunity, it's all about genetics. And to make matters worse, when it comes to college admissions, they are discriminating against a group of people that has historically been discriminated against.

+2

I understand the historical inequities, I understand how systemic racism has affected generations of Black people.

I don't understand why Black people think it's okay for Affirmative Action to discriminate against another much smaller than them minority group based on race who were not their oppressors to right the wrongs they have faced by the hands and laws of White people.

This notion of collateral damage to get mine is racist, discriminatory, unjustified, and belligerent. All the things they seem to stand against, yet have no problem partaking in. Rising up by stepping on others is no different than what White people have done to Black people and other races all over the world.

How would you suggest that we confront the inequalities of past policies that have currently day implications? If other minority groups are facing the same systemic racism in law enforcement, loans, housing, health care issues etc, what’s the hold up from being being allies? If you pretend not to see it because it either reinforces your belief or you benefit from it, how is that right?

It’s a hypocritical thought process. Allies are a two way street.

If you’re okay with racist policies towards certain groups and not others, that is not being an ally. That is asking for support against racism of you while you support and fight for racist policies towards others because it benefits you.

Right - Denounce racist discriminatory policies of affirmative action against Asian Americans period. In addition, call out (totally ignored by media) systematic racism and dismissal towards Asian Americans in sports, politics (don't give me Kamala non-sense), television, movies, music, journalism, judiciary, C-Suites, law firms, consulting, negative portrayal in media - basically in all areas in business, government and entertainment fields.

In addition, comedians openly mock Asians when they cannot for any other groups (including g fat people, disabled people, gay people etc.). Asians lack protection that gays, fat people and other groups in the society enjoy. On top of that, Asian men are constantly portrayed as feminine in TV programs, movies, music and in popular culture leading to negative consequences. You may try to minimize the hardships of Asian Americans and that is precisely the point. Asians would be treated just like blacks by law enforcement if Asians become belligerent and confrontational with law enforcement officers. Asians KNOW they lack the requisite politicians and receptive media people who will jump at these incidents for blacks. Asians who suffer death, injuries and worse as a result of hate crimes DO NOT even get reported or hardly ever get reported in the media : https://news.uchicago.edu/story/uchicago-mourns-loss-phd-student-yiran-fan

People spout oh there is no hardship for Asian Americans - only because Asians are deemed not worthy of even being a part of a discussion or even having a "seat" at the table in every possible ways. Most Asians would love to trade places with Blacks in US.

Eliminate racist affirmative action.

[Anonymous]

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I agree with everything said except you don’t take away privileges from AA to even the score, you extend the privilege to Asian Americans.

Why is this point made in a college forum?

It was in response to the PP. did you read their post?

Yes, I did. It asked about which box to check on a college application, making it relevant in a college forum. How is the comment above relevant to college admissions?

If being willfully ignorant suits your needs because you don't like what you're hearing, that's on you.

Just answer the question.

It was answered. You are feigning ignorance and already stated that you are purposely retorting one liners to be dismissive, not here actually engage in any meaningful conversation.

You don't want to hear the other side. You are perfectly content being racist and being a victim at the same time. Move along 'ally'.

You may be confusing me with other posters. I am saying nothing which could be even remotely construed as racist. I am asking why that comment is relevant in a college forum. You have not answered, because you know it is not relevant.

That’s all.

NP but which comment are you talking about- this one?

I agree with everything said except you don’t take away privileges from AA to even the score, you extend the privilege to Asian Americans.

But racial preference in college admissions is not affirmative action, and is in fact already extended to Asians and all other races, as any college where they are under-represented would result in a benefit for them statistically.

[Anonymous]

^^^Please name one US Top 50 college where being Asian or Asian-American provides an affirmative action benefit.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:^^^Please name one US Top 50 college where being Asian or Asian-American provides an affirmative action benefit.

Yeah.... that's.... not a thing.

You have to do much better on standardized tests, and they tend to ping you for having an unappealing "personality". These are facts.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:^^^Please name one US Top 50 college where being Asian or Asian-American provides an affirmative action benefit.

Many LACs. Wash Lee for one.

The point is not where the underrepresentation is, the point is it is applied across all races equally.

Also, your requirement that it be "top 50 college" is an embarrassing tell. Why should any ranking determine what racial balance a college thinks it needs?

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:^^^Please name one US Top 50 college where being Asian or Asian-American provides an affirmative action benefit.

Yeah.... that's.... not a thing.

Yeah, it's TOTALLY a thing, I assure you. At any school who employs the practice where the asian percentage is lower than the general population. It's just like schools who have more female applicants than male (like Vassar). A lower statistical cohort of males is NOT sexist against the female applicants if the class the college wants to build has closer to 50/50 balance.

Exact same principle.

You have to do much better on standardized tests, and they tend to ping you for having an unappealing "personality". These are facts.

Those are the "post hoc ergo propter hoc" results for any race which is not under-represented.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^^^Please name one US Top 50 college where being Asian or Asian-American provides an affirmative action benefit.

Yeah.... that's.... not a thing.

You have to do much better on standardized tests, and they tend to ping you for having an unappealing "personality". These are facts.

It actually is a thing if you dumbasses actually understood the diversity within the Asian-American community. Stop lumping all Asian people together.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^^^Please name one US Top 50 college where being Asian or Asian-American provides an affirmative action benefit.

Yeah.... that's.... not a thing.

Yeah, it's TOTALLY a thing, I assure you. At any school who employs the practice where the asian percentage is lower than the general population. It's just like schools who have more female applicants than male (like Vassar). A lower statistical cohort of males is NOT sexist against the female applicants if the class the college wants to build has closer to 50/50 balance.

Exact same principle.

You have to do much better on standardized tests, and they tend to ping you for having an unappealing "personality". These are facts.

Those are the "post hoc ergo propter hoc" results for any race which is not under-represented.

PP stop with “logic” and “facts”. You’ll upset the narrative.

[Anonymous]

Asian americans are discriminated against in college admissions. Just read the Harvard law suit. It's clearly documented.

The problem with race-based affirmative action is that at the end it does not benefit the intended target. If you have two doctors, one black and one white, which one will you pick? You pick the white one because you are not sure that the black one became a doctor on its own merit.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^^^Please name one US Top 50 college where being Asian or Asian-American provides an affirmative action benefit.

Many LACs. Wash Lee for one.

The point is not where the underrepresentation is, the point is it is applied across all races equally.

Also, your requirement that it be "top 50 college" is an embarrassing tell. Why should any ranking determine what racial balance a college thinks it needs?

Bob and Bill are both low income, first generation college applicants applying out of state to Berkeley with identical, impressive stats. ECs are roughly equivalent. Bob is Black and checks the African American box on the app, while Bill is Hmong and checks the Asian box on the app. Granted the app allows further drill down on those categories, but colleges generally report demographics in the broad categories of Black, Asian, etc. On that basis, who has the greater chance of getting into Berkeley, Bob or Bill?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^^^Please name one US Top 50 college where being Asian or Asian-American provides an affirmative action benefit.

Many LACs. Wash Lee for one.

The point is not where the underrepresentation is, the point is it is applied across all races equally.

Also, your requirement that it be "top 50 college" is an embarrassing tell. Why should any ranking determine what racial balance a college thinks it needs?

Bob and Bill are both low income, first generation college applicants applying out of state to Berkeley with identical, impressive stats. ECs are roughly equivalent. Bob is Black and checks the African American box on the app, while Bill is Hmong and checks the Asian box on the app. Granted the app allows further drill down on those categories, but colleges generally report demographics in the broad categories of Black, Asian, etc. On that basis, who has the greater chance of getting into Berkeley, Bob or Bill?

Berkley? Bob.

Howard? Bill.

Get it now?

[Anonymous]

Maybe you could try to envision how it would make him feel to check the box. Would he feel sensitive about it in later years, or would he feel OK about it?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^^^Please name one US Top 50 college where being Asian or Asian-American provides an affirmative action benefit.

Many LACs. Wash Lee for one.

The point is not where the underrepresentation is, the point is it is applied across all races equally.

Also, your requirement that it be "top 50 college" is an embarrassing tell. Why should any ranking determine what racial balance a college thinks it needs?

Bob and Bill are both low income, first generation college applicants applying out of state to Berkeley with identical, impressive stats. ECs are roughly equivalent. Bob is Black and checks the African American box on the app, while Bill is Hmong and checks the Asian box on the app. Granted the app allows further drill down on those categories, but colleges generally report demographics in the broad categories of Black, Asian, etc. On that basis, who has the greater chance of getting into Berkeley, Bob or Bill?

Berkley? Bob.

Howard? Bill.

Get it now?

Bill didn’t apply to Howard. He has the stats and credentials, and wants to attend Berkeley. Perhaps it is tops in the major he wishes to pursue.

Also, do we really think that Bob would be disadvantaged as compared to Bill if both were applying to Howard?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^^^Please name one US Top 50 college where being Asian or Asian-American provides an affirmative action benefit.

Many LACs. Wash Lee for one.

The point is not where the underrepresentation is, the point is it is applied across all races equally.

Also, your requirement that it be "top 50 college" is an embarrassing tell. Why should any ranking determine what racial balance a college thinks it needs?

Bob and Bill are both low income, first generation college applicants applying out of state to Berkeley with identical, impressive stats. ECs are roughly equivalent. Bob is Black and checks the African American box on the app, while Bill is Hmong and checks the Asian box on the app. Granted the app allows further drill down on those categories, but colleges generally report demographics in the broad categories of Black, Asian, etc. On that basis, who has the greater chance of getting into Berkeley, Bob or Bill?

Berkley? Bob.

Howard? Bill.

Get it now?

Bill didn’t apply to Howard. He has the stats and credentials, and wants to attend Berkeley. Perhaps it is tops in the major he wishes to pursue.

Also, do we really think that Bob would be disadvantaged as compared to Bill if both were applying to Howard?

What Bill wants is meaningless, and irrelevant to whether it is fair.

Yes, Bob would be disadvantaged compared to Bill when applying to Howard.

As is evidenced by the gender-specific example of Vassar provided above.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^^^Please name one US Top 50 college where being Asian or Asian-American provides an affirmative action benefit.

Many LACs. Wash Lee for one.

The point is not where the underrepresentation is, the point is it is applied across all races equally.

Also, your requirement that it be "top 50 college" is an embarrassing tell. Why should any ranking determine what racial balance a college thinks it needs?

Bob and Bill are both low income, first generation college applicants applying out of state to Berkeley with identical, impressive stats. ECs are roughly equivalent. Bob is Black and checks the African American box on the app, while Bill is Hmong and checks the Asian box on the app. Granted the app allows further drill down on those categories, but colleges generally report demographics in the broad categories of Black, Asian, etc. On that basis, who has the greater chance of getting into Berkeley, Bob or Bill?

Berkley? Bob.

Howard? Bill.

Get it now?

Bill didn’t apply to Howard. He has the stats and credentials, and wants to attend Berkeley. Perhaps it is tops in the major he wishes to pursue.

Also, do we really think that Bob would be disadvantaged as compared to Bill if both were applying to Howard?

What Bill wants is meaningless, and irrelevant to whether it is fair.

Yes, Bob would be disadvantaged compared to Bill when applying to Howard.

As is evidenced by the gender-specific example of Vassar provided above.

At the end of the day, Bob does better in applications to Berkeley, Howard (it’s a HBCU after all) and Vassar - as well as pretty much any other school in roughly the Top 50 (i.e., a school where there is competition for seats) as compared to Bill. Bill stands slightly less than a snowball’s chance at Berkeley and much lower chances than Bob at other competitive schools. The point is that Bill is the Asian version of Bob, but Bill is disadvantaged generally across the board when it comes to institutions that are competitive in filling their seats. (For institutions that need applicants as a general matter, presumably the two would have an equal chance.)