Spanking

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Non-spanking parent here, and also a preschool teacher. I hope those of you who spank realize that your kids are learning that when mommy and daddy get upset, they hit others; I've seen it time and time again. I also hope you know that preschool kids talk about all sorts of things that go on in their home, so if you are spanking them and think it's a secret -- it's not. They've told me, and yes, I have judged you for it.

I think an awful lot of parents are well aware of this. Judge away.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Non-spanking parent here, and also a preschool teacher. I hope those of you who spank realize that your kids are learning that when mommy and daddy get upset, they hit others; I've seen it time and time again. I also hope you know that preschool kids talk about all sorts of things that go on in their home, so if you are spanking them and think it's a secret -- it's not. They've told me, and yes, I have judged you for it.

Judge away. I'm sure you make parenting choices that I disagree with.

[Anonymous]

I did once, DS spanked me back!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How do you do it?

I mean - do literally?

Do you put your child over your knee and hit them? Do you hit them where they are standing?

What are the logistics of spanking?

I was spanked as a child (once) and I never forgot it. I'm wondering if it works the same for all parents.

For us, we don't do it out of anger or in the moment, which I think could be confusing. So one of us will sit down with the child and briefly go over the behavior that has earned the spanking. Then put him or her over our knee and give three or four spanks on the bare tush.

There's crying, of course, but it's not an out of control angry event.

Honestly, I think that is even more messed-up. The thought of making a child pull down their pants so you can strike their bare bottom while they are over your knee is about as nuts as you can get.

Yup. This is just creepy.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:the story with the dad, substitute yelling at her, and it's not a whole lot different. It can even be damaging in a context in which a spanking would not be; it all depends.

Imagine it this way. Would you be more willing to forgive your husband for hitting you or yelling at you?

Honestly, I think people who hit children believe they're a little bit less human than adults. What else would excuse the total lack of respect for another person?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Let's have an honest discussion. I think spanking is wrong. I think it can damage kids and cause distrust. More broadly, i believe (and i think some studies have shown) that demonstrating the resolution of problems, or enforcement of boundaries / one's wishes greatly contributes to a world where our impulses are to shove, punch, bully, murder, execute, and nuke one another into submission. At the same time, I can't even with these people who say EVERY child will respond well to positive reinforcement only and that anyone whose child doesn't respond isn't doing it right. i know spanking is wrong, and yet i don't have a foolproof substitute!

Why would it damage kids and cause distrust any more than any other punishment? I'm up for a civil discussion. My assessment is that it all depends on how it's explained and implemented.

+1
My kid thinks I'm mean when I punish him by taking away his electronic time. I think he'd rather I just spank him than take away his electronic time. He's 11. I don't think he remembers being spanked when he was 5, but he does probably remember when I spanked him when he was 8.

What did he do in those cases to get a spanking, and are you in the same camp as the previous poster in terms of how you do it?

He was very disrespectful to me when I asked him to do something. He was given warnings about this previously. I turned him around where he stood and gave him a quick whack on the backside fully clothed. Now, when he starts to speak disrespectfully to me, I just give him a look, and he knows better because he knows he'll get electronic time taken away. That's the atomic bomb for him. When he was 5, he didn't have much electronic time, and he certainly didn't cherish it like he does now.

So he's scared you will hit him. He's frightened of you.

Yea, that's why he gives me a hug every night at bed time ...because he's afraid of me. He's told me about his latest crush. I don't think he'd do that if he was afraid of me. Nice try though. Do you honestly think every person who was ever spanked is afraid of their parents? No. You have some issues.

But I agree with a PP... a kid should be somewhat afraid of getting into trouble from their parents. That doesn't mean they will grow up to be mortally afraid of their parents or do crazy things when they leave their parents house. There are thousands, millions of people over hundreds/thousands of years who were spanked by their parents but don't fear them, and go on to live very normal, law abiding lives. You are strange to think otherwise.

Children do what they have to do. They need love and support. They'll do what they have to in order to get it. He still doesn't trust you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Let's have an honest discussion. I think spanking is wrong. I think it can damage kids and cause distrust. More broadly, i believe (and i think some studies have shown) that demonstrating the resolution of problems, or enforcement of boundaries / one's wishes greatly contributes to a world where our impulses are to shove, punch, bully, murder, execute, and nuke one another into submission. At the same time, I can't even with these people who say EVERY child will respond well to positive reinforcement only and that anyone whose child doesn't respond isn't doing it right. i know spanking is wrong, and yet i don't have a foolproof substitute!

Why would it damage kids and cause distrust any more than any other punishment? I'm up for a civil discussion. My assessment is that it all depends on how it's explained and implemented.

+1
My kid thinks I'm mean when I punish him by taking away his electronic time. I think he'd rather I just spank him than take away his electronic time. He's 11. I don't think he remembers being spanked when he was 5, but he does probably remember when I spanked him when he was 8.

What did he do in those cases to get a spanking, and are you in the same camp as the previous poster in terms of how you do it?

He was very disrespectful to me when I asked him to do something. He was given warnings about this previously. I turned him around where he stood and gave him a quick whack on the backside fully clothed. Now, when he starts to speak disrespectfully to me, I just give him a look, and he knows better because he knows he'll get electronic time taken away. That's the atomic bomb for him. When he was 5, he didn't have much electronic time, and he certainly didn't cherish it like he does now.

So he's scared you will hit him. He's frightened of you.

Yea, that's why he gives me a hug every night at bed time ...because he's afraid of me. He's told me about his latest crush. I don't think he'd do that if he was afraid of me. Nice try though. Do you honestly think every person who was ever spanked is afraid of their parents? No. You have some issues.

But I agree with a PP... a kid should be somewhat afraid of getting into trouble from their parents. That doesn't mean they will grow up to be mortally afraid of their parents or do crazy things when they leave their parents house. There are thousands, millions of people over hundreds/thousands of years who were spanked by their parents but don't fear them, and go on to live very normal, law abiding lives. You are strange to think otherwise.

Children do what they have to do. They need love and support. They'll do what they have to in order to get it. He still doesn't trust you.

Interesting line of thought. Do you think that all children who are spanked (which is the vast majority of kids, even today. Obviously the number was even higher in years past...) distrust their parents?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How do you do it?

I mean - do literally?

Do you put your child over your knee and hit them? Do you hit them where they are standing?

What are the logistics of spanking?

I was spanked as a child (once) and I never forgot it. I'm wondering if it works the same for all parents.

For us, we don't do it out of anger or in the moment, which I think could be confusing. So one of us will sit down with the child and briefly go over the behavior that has earned the spanking. Then put him or her over our knee and give three or four spanks on the bare tush.

There's crying, of course, but it's not an out of control angry event.

This description actually makes me feel sick to my stomach.

to you too buddy. It's disgusting.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Let's have an honest discussion. I think spanking is wrong. I think it can damage kids and cause distrust. More broadly, i believe (and i think some studies have shown) that demonstrating the resolution of problems, or enforcement of boundaries / one's wishes greatly contributes to a world where our impulses are to shove, punch, bully, murder, execute, and nuke one another into submission. At the same time, I can't even with these people who say EVERY child will respond well to positive reinforcement only and that anyone whose child doesn't respond isn't doing it right. i know spanking is wrong, and yet i don't have a foolproof substitute!

Why would it damage kids and cause distrust any more than any other punishment? I'm up for a civil discussion. My assessment is that it all depends on how it's explained and implemented.

Yay for civility!

I don't think that every spanking causes lasting, irreversable, major damage to children but i'd be willing to bet that the way most people are doing it does some damage, the way most people are doing it and the way they THINK they are doing it is probably a good deal different, and also that even the most benign instance is still carrying the capability to cause some damage. Why? Well, there are probably numerous studies that lay out why it does damage, but to me the duty of a parent to protect child from harm, and the need for the child to 100 percent feel physically safe with the parent is sacrosanct. Every time you spank, you're eroding that trust just a little bit, even temporarily. While there are certainly lots of ways to undo trust that do not involve parents striking and intentionally inflicting physical pain on the child, I don't think these are okay, either. I think there is probably a continuum where on one end you get the parent fluttering around trying to lovingly redirect where there is minimal harm done in the immediate sense (but depending on the circumstance if the kid isn't really getting any discipline and boundaries some lifelong consequences there too) to severe emotional abuse or physical abuse being on the other side of the continuum. I'm talking about child abuse there. Spanking, to me, has more in common with the abuse because at the end of the day, no matter how well intentioned, it is the trusted parent figure that is intentionally causing physical pain, there is a great risk of a breach opening up.

But why is moderate and controlled physical pain somehow more detrimental than the emotional pain that you cause by any other punishment, such as putting a child in timeout (which can be physical in itself) and denying the opportunity for interaction with others?

Because denying a child attention or the opportunity to interact is a natural consequence of antisocial or unpleasant behavior. It happens among adults as well - if my friends mistreat me, I make myself unavailable to them.

Spanking, on the other hand, is not something done among healthy adults who are having a disagreement. It epitomizes disrespect and abuses the spanker's power.

Different poster. I disagree about disrespect, of course. But I don't understand why the parent-child relationship should be identical to a relationship among adults. I would think that the parent-child relationship is different, although some relationships can be similar -- teacher-student for one.

It is a different relationship. Children are utterly and completely dependent on their parents for their housing, food, clothing and care when injured or I'll. If your friend or coworker smacked you around, you'd be able to walk away from them. Children can't get away. That's why you are morally obligated to treat them with care and kindness.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I think that poster is joking.

We do bare bottom because we don't spank very hard at all, and when DS was still wearing pull ups, he just laughed if it was over the pull up. So after he crossed the line one day, I pulled it down and it made all the difference. After that, it just seemed to make more sense than spanking over jeans.

I can see your point. You gotta hurt them - right?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Let's have an honest discussion. I think spanking is wrong. I think it can damage kids and cause distrust. More broadly, i believe (and i think some studies have shown) that demonstrating the resolution of problems, or enforcement of boundaries / one's wishes greatly contributes to a world where our impulses are to shove, punch, bully, murder, execute, and nuke one another into submission. At the same time, I can't even with these people who say EVERY child will respond well to positive reinforcement only and that anyone whose child doesn't respond isn't doing it right. i know spanking is wrong, and yet i don't have a foolproof substitute!

Why would it damage kids and cause distrust any more than any other punishment? I'm up for a civil discussion. My assessment is that it all depends on how it's explained and implemented.

+1
My kid thinks I'm mean when I punish him by taking away his electronic time. I think he'd rather I just spank him than take away his electronic time. He's 11. I don't think he remembers being spanked when he was 5, but he does probably remember when I spanked him when he was 8.

What did he do in those cases to get a spanking, and are you in the same camp as the previous poster in terms of how you do it?

He was very disrespectful to me when I asked him to do something. He was given warnings about this previously. I turned him around where he stood and gave him a quick whack on the backside fully clothed. Now, when he starts to speak disrespectfully to me, I just give him a look, and he knows better because he knows he'll get electronic time taken away. That's the atomic bomb for him. When he was 5, he didn't have much electronic time, and he certainly didn't cherish it like he does now.

So he's scared you will hit him. He's frightened of you.

Yea, that's why he gives me a hug every night at bed time ...because he's afraid of me. He's told me about his latest crush. I don't think he'd do that if he was afraid of me. Nice try though. Do you honestly think every person who was ever spanked is afraid of their parents? No. You have some issues.

But I agree with a PP... a kid should be somewhat afraid of getting into trouble from their parents. That doesn't mean they will grow up to be mortally afraid of their parents or do crazy things when they leave their parents house. There are thousands, millions of people over hundreds/thousands of years who were spanked by their parents but don't fear them, and go on to live very normal, law abiding lives. You are strange to think otherwise.

Children do what they have to do. They need love and support. They'll do what they have to in order to get it. He still doesn't trust you.

Interesting line of thought. Do you think that all children who are spanked (which is the vast majority of kids, even today. Obviously the number was even higher in years past...) distrust their parents?

Yes - given that this is my experience, I do. I rarely see or talk to my parents. I don't care to. When I do visit, in the back of my mind I am always remembering how helpless I felt when they spanked my younger siblings.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Let's have an honest discussion. I think spanking is wrong. I think it can damage kids and cause distrust. More broadly, i believe (and i think some studies have shown) that demonstrating the resolution of problems, or enforcement of boundaries / one's wishes greatly contributes to a world where our impulses are to shove, punch, bully, murder, execute, and nuke one another into submission. At the same time, I can't even with these people who say EVERY child will respond well to positive reinforcement only and that anyone whose child doesn't respond isn't doing it right. i know spanking is wrong, and yet i don't have a foolproof substitute!

Why would it damage kids and cause distrust any more than any other punishment? I'm up for a civil discussion. My assessment is that it all depends on how it's explained and implemented.

+1
My kid thinks I'm mean when I punish him by taking away his electronic time. I think he'd rather I just spank him than take away his electronic time. He's 11. I don't think he remembers being spanked when he was 5, but he does probably remember when I spanked him when he was 8.

What did he do in those cases to get a spanking, and are you in the same camp as the previous poster in terms of how you do it?

He was very disrespectful to me when I asked him to do something. He was given warnings about this previously. I turned him around where he stood and gave him a quick whack on the backside fully clothed. Now, when he starts to speak disrespectfully to me, I just give him a look, and he knows better because he knows he'll get electronic time taken away. That's the atomic bomb for him. When he was 5, he didn't have much electronic time, and he certainly didn't cherish it like he does now.

So he's scared you will hit him. He's frightened of you.

Yea, that's why he gives me a hug every night at bed time ...because he's afraid of me. He's told me about his latest crush. I don't think he'd do that if he was afraid of me. Nice try though. Do you honestly think every person who was ever spanked is afraid of their parents? No. You have some issues.

But I agree with a PP... a kid should be somewhat afraid of getting into trouble from their parents. That doesn't mean they will grow up to be mortally afraid of their parents or do crazy things when they leave their parents house. There are thousands, millions of people over hundreds/thousands of years who were spanked by their parents but don't fear them, and go on to live very normal, law abiding lives. You are strange to think otherwise.

Children do what they have to do. They need love and support. They'll do what they have to in order to get it. He still doesn't trust you.

Interesting line of thought. Do you think that all children who are spanked (which is the vast majority of kids, even today. Obviously the number was even higher in years past...) distrust their parents?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think that poster is joking.

We do bare bottom because we don't spank very hard at all, and when DS was still wearing pull ups, he just laughed if it was over the pull up. So after he crossed the line one day, I pulled it down and it made all the difference. After that, it just seemed to make more sense than spanking over jeans.

I can see your point. You gotta hurt them - right?

Yes, it has to hurt a little bit. That's the point, isn't it?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Let's have an honest discussion. I think spanking is wrong. I think it can damage kids and cause distrust. More broadly, i believe (and i think some studies have shown) that demonstrating the resolution of problems, or enforcement of boundaries / one's wishes greatly contributes to a world where our impulses are to shove, punch, bully, murder, execute, and nuke one another into submission. At the same time, I can't even with these people who say EVERY child will respond well to positive reinforcement only and that anyone whose child doesn't respond isn't doing it right. i know spanking is wrong, and yet i don't have a foolproof substitute!

Why would it damage kids and cause distrust any more than any other punishment? I'm up for a civil discussion. My assessment is that it all depends on how it's explained and implemented.

+1
My kid thinks I'm mean when I punish him by taking away his electronic time. I think he'd rather I just spank him than take away his electronic time. He's 11. I don't think he remembers being spanked when he was 5, but he does probably remember when I spanked him when he was 8.

What did he do in those cases to get a spanking, and are you in the same camp as the previous poster in terms of how you do it?

He was very disrespectful to me when I asked him to do something. He was given warnings about this previously. I turned him around where he stood and gave him a quick whack on the backside fully clothed. Now, when he starts to speak disrespectfully to me, I just give him a look, and he knows better because he knows he'll get electronic time taken away. That's the atomic bomb for him. When he was 5, he didn't have much electronic time, and he certainly didn't cherish it like he does now.

So he's scared you will hit him. He's frightened of you.

Yea, that's why he gives me a hug every night at bed time ...because he's afraid of me. He's told me about his latest crush. I don't think he'd do that if he was afraid of me. Nice try though. Do you honestly think every person who was ever spanked is afraid of their parents? No. You have some issues.

But I agree with a PP... a kid should be somewhat afraid of getting into trouble from their parents. That doesn't mean they will grow up to be mortally afraid of their parents or do crazy things when they leave their parents house. There are thousands, millions of people over hundreds/thousands of years who were spanked by their parents but don't fear them, and go on to live very normal, law abiding lives. You are strange to think otherwise.

Children do what they have to do. They need love and support. They'll do what they have to in order to get it. He still doesn't trust you.

He told me about his crush because he doesn't trust me? Yea, that makes total sense. Do you think every person who was spanked doesn't trust their parent, are afraid of them? There are lots of people on dcum alone who will tell you otherwise. But you go ahead and think all of these people are damaged, and that your kids won't grow up with any issues because you didn't spank them.

And please people, stop comparing adult relationships with child/parent relationships. They are not the same. One adult is not responsible for the behavior of another adult. People who keep comparing these relationships and are convinced that kids who were spanked a few times in their lives are afraid of their parents and/or grow up to hate their parents have a very twisted view on parent/child relationships. Kids are not little adults. We have different expectations of adults vs kids.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Non-spanking parent here, and also a preschool teacher. I hope those of you who spank realize that your kids are learning that when mommy and daddy get upset, they hit others; I've seen it time and time again. I also hope you know that preschool kids talk about all sorts of things that go on in their home, so if you are spanking them and think it's a secret -- it's not. They've told me, and yes, I have judged you for it.

Crock of shit. Generations of kids were spanked at home and didn't think that meant their parents were running around slapping everyone they disagreed with. Kids are more than capable of making the distinction that being spanked by a parent is restricted to just that, parent/child, and doesn't apply in other relationships.