what's the difference btw William & Mary and Wake?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wake has lots of rich kids. W&M prob less so.

Wake has better ROI and can compete outside of regional placement for jobs. It will get closer to top 25 in a few years.

Wak is nowhere near being a top 25

Dp, but why this again. When us news decides to eliminate the dei factors it’s used for the last year or two, Wake will likely be back on the T30, just as it was for over 25 straight years.

But we all know they won't, and since Wake isn't really looking to grow research they'll continue to be punished

Not sure why you would say Wake is no looking to grow research, they just built a large medical research facility and also added a second campus for their Medical School.

They aren't interested in being r1 as far as i can tell - no public strategy of that

R1 just means a certain level of funding has been received. William and Mary does have more research funding at the undergraduate level, but that is in arts and sciences, education, and Marine sciences.

Wake medical school alone has almost four times as much research funding as William and Mary as a whole. That research is accessible to undergraduates. In fact, my own kid easily found a position for this summer.

And it doesn't count for the rankings so like I said that's the issue Wake has

All that counts for research in the U.S. News rankings is the number of citations in journals. Schools like Wake and Willam and Mary are never going to match the number of research faculty numbers of the research powerhouses and therefore won’t benefit from this criteria.

William and Mary has $81 million in research funding, Wake has over $350 million, including the medical school. Vanderbilt, which I assume is what you mean by a mid tier private, has over $ 1 billion, with a little less than half representing the undergraduate portion.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wake has lots of rich kids. W&M prob less so.

Wake has better ROI and can compete outside of regional placement for jobs. It will get closer to top 25 in a few years.

Wak is nowhere near being a top 25

Dp, but why this again. When us news decides to eliminate the dei factors it’s used for the last year or two, Wake will likely be back on the T30, just as it was for over 25 straight years.

But we all know they won't, and since Wake isn't really looking to grow research they'll continue to be punished

So will William and Mary, the schools excel based on class size and having full professors teachers. The research factors are less than 5 percent of score and focus only on overall number of citations. Schools the size of Wake or William and Mary simply can’t compete with the the large flagships on this criteria, they don’t have the same raw numbers of faculty.

W&M is certainly trying to grow research now that it's R1. Will obviously never be able to compete with flagships but it can probably catch up to bigger research privates

Doubtful, it doesn’t even have a medical school.

There are plenty of bigger research schools without a med school. You can still do health related research without one - I imagine the new bioengineering program they're adding will ramp up with that pretty quickly.

My student is premed. She could go to Wake, where she can take classes with medical schools faculty, works in labs with her professors at a school that has well over $300 million in biomedical funding, and shadow her professors at Wake Med.

Or she could go to William and Mary, which has no medical school and a total of $81 million in research funding, nearly all of which is not biomedical.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wake has lots of rich kids. W&M prob less so.

Wake has better ROI and can compete outside of regional placement for jobs. It will get closer to top 25 in a few years.

Wak is nowhere near being a top 25

Dp, but why this again. When us news decides to eliminate the dei factors it’s used for the last year or two, Wake will likely be back on the T30, just as it was for over 25 straight years.

But we all know they won't, and since Wake isn't really looking to grow research they'll continue to be punished

So will William and Mary, the schools excel based on class size and having full professors teachers. The research factors are less than 5 percent of score and focus only on overall number of citations. Schools the size of Wake or William and Mary simply can’t compete with the the large flagships on this criteria, they don’t have the same raw numbers of faculty.

W&M is certainly trying to grow research now that it's R1. Will obviously never be able to compete with flagships but it can probably catch up to bigger research privates

Doubtful, it doesn’t even have a medical school.

There are plenty of bigger research schools without a med school. You can still do health related research without one - I imagine the new bioengineering program they're adding will ramp up with that pretty quickly.

My student is premed. She could go to Wake, where she can take classes with medical schools faculty, works in labs with her professors at a school that has well over $300 million in biomedical funding, and shadow her professors at Wake Med.

Or she could go to William and Mary, which has no medical school and a total of $81 million in research funding, nearly all of which is not biomedical.

Thank you for this wonderful straw man argument that had absolutely nothing to do with the previous comment

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wake has lots of rich kids. W&M prob less so.

Wake has better ROI and can compete outside of regional placement for jobs. It will get closer to top 25 in a few years.

Wak is nowhere near being a top 25

Dp, but why this again. When us news decides to eliminate the dei factors it’s used for the last year or two, Wake will likely be back on the T30, just as it was for over 25 straight years.

But we all know they won't, and since Wake isn't really looking to grow research they'll continue to be punished

Not sure why you would say Wake is no looking to grow research, they just built a large medical research facility and also added a second campus for their Medical School.

They aren't interested in being r1 as far as i can tell - no public strategy of that

R1 just means a certain level of funding has been received. William and Mary does have more research funding at the undergraduate level, but that is in arts and sciences, education, and Marine sciences.

Wake medical school alone has almost four times as much research funding as William and Mary as a whole. That research is accessible to undergraduates. In fact, my own kid easily found a position for this summer.

And it doesn't count for the rankings so like I said that's the issue Wake has

All that counts for research in the U.S. News rankings is the number of citations in journals. Schools like Wake and Willam and Mary are never going to match the number of research faculty numbers of the research powerhouses and therefore won’t benefit from this criteria.

William and Mary has $81 million in research funding, Wake has over $350 million, including the medical school. Vanderbilt, which I assume is what you mean by a mid tier private, has over $ 1 billion, with a little less than half representing the undergraduate portion.

Vanderbilt is 24 in the nation in research spending. What a terrible assumption.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wake has lots of rich kids. W&M prob less so.

Wake has better ROI and can compete outside of regional placement for jobs. It will get closer to top 25 in a few years.

Wak is nowhere near being a top 25

Dp, but why this again. When us news decides to eliminate the dei factors it’s used for the last year or two, Wake will likely be back on the T30, just as it was for over 25 straight years.

But we all know they won't, and since Wake isn't really looking to grow research they'll continue to be punished

Not sure why you would say Wake is no looking to grow research, they just built a large medical research facility and also added a second campus for their Medical School.

They aren't interested in being r1 as far as i can tell - no public strategy of that

R1 just means a certain level of funding has been received. William and Mary does have more research funding at the undergraduate level, but that is in arts and sciences, education, and Marine sciences.

Wake medical school alone has almost four times as much research funding as William and Mary as a whole. That research is accessible to undergraduates. In fact, my own kid easily found a position for this summer.

And it doesn't count for the rankings so like I said that's the issue Wake has

All that counts for research in the U.S. News rankings is the number of citations in journals. Schools like Wake and Willam and Mary are never going to match the number of research faculty numbers of the research powerhouses and therefore won’t benefit from this criteria.

William and Mary has $81 million in research funding, Wake has over $350 million, including the medical school. Vanderbilt, which I assume is what you mean by a mid tier private, has over $ 1 billion, with a little less than half representing the undergraduate portion.

Vanderbilt is 24 in the nation in research spending. What a terrible assumption.

Your arguments make no sense. If your argument is that William and Mary is going to move up the rankings based on research (even though less than 5 percent of the ranking criteria), Vandy is exactly the type of school you would need to pass to move up rapidly. Of course, your entire argument is fatally flawed because federal funding for research has been dramatically cut by Trump and even the powerhouses are facing declines in researching funding support.

Moving on . . .

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wake has lots of rich kids. W&M prob less so.

Wake has better ROI and can compete outside of regional placement for jobs. It will get closer to top 25 in a few years.

Wak is nowhere near being a top 25

Dp, but why this again. When us news decides to eliminate the dei factors it’s used for the last year or two, Wake will likely be back on the T30, just as it was for over 25 straight years.

But we all know they won't, and since Wake isn't really looking to grow research they'll continue to be punished

So will William and Mary, the schools excel based on class size and having full professors teachers. The research factors are less than 5 percent of score and focus only on overall number of citations. Schools the size of Wake or William and Mary simply can’t compete with the the large flagships on this criteria, they don’t have the same raw numbers of faculty.

W&M is certainly trying to grow research now that it's R1. Will obviously never be able to compete with flagships but it can probably catch up to bigger research privates

Doubtful, it doesn’t even have a medical school.

There are plenty of bigger research schools without a med school. You can still do health related research without one - I imagine the new bioengineering program they're adding will ramp up with that pretty quickly.

My student is premed. She could go to Wake, where she can take classes with medical schools faculty, works in labs with her professors at a school that has well over $300 million in biomedical funding, and shadow her professors at Wake Med.

Or she could go to William and Mary, which has no medical school and a total of $81 million in research funding, nearly all of which is not biomedical.

Thank you for this wonderful straw man argument that had absolutely nothing to do with the previous comment

Not remotely a straw man. It just shows how superficial your understanding of research is. William and Mary being R1 had very little value to my family when their total amount of research is still small and there is little in the area of interest to my student. If my kid was interested in marine science or education, William and Mary would be a better choice for them given its research strength in those area. For a premed kid, Wake offers significantly better research opportunities in their area of interest. Unlike total number of citations in scientific journals, these are inquiries families should be considering because they will have a direct impact on their kid’s academic experience.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wake has lots of rich kids. W&M prob less so.

Wake has better ROI and can compete outside of regional placement for jobs. It will get closer to top 25 in a few years.

Wak is nowhere near being a top 25

Dp, but why this again. When us news decides to eliminate the dei factors it’s used for the last year or two, Wake will likely be back on the T30, just as it was for over 25 straight years.

But we all know they won't, and since Wake isn't really looking to grow research they'll continue to be punished

Not sure why you would say Wake is no looking to grow research, they just built a large medical research facility and also added a second campus for their Medical School.

They aren't interested in being r1 as far as i can tell - no public strategy of that

R1 just means a certain level of funding has been received. William and Mary does have more research funding at the undergraduate level, but that is in arts and sciences, education, and Marine sciences.

Wake medical school alone has almost four times as much research funding as William and Mary as a whole. That research is accessible to undergraduates. In fact, my own kid easily found a position for this summer.

And it doesn't count for the rankings so like I said that's the issue Wake has

All that counts for research in the U.S. News rankings is the number of citations in journals. Schools like Wake and Willam and Mary are never going to match the number of research faculty numbers of the research powerhouses and therefore won’t benefit from this criteria.

William and Mary has $81 million in research funding, Wake has over $350 million, including the medical school. Vanderbilt, which I assume is what you mean by a mid tier private, has over $ 1 billion, with a little less than half representing the undergraduate portion.

Vanderbilt is 24 in the nation in research spending. What a terrible assumption.

Your arguments make no sense. If your argument is that William and Mary is going to move up the rankings based on research (even though less than 5 percent of the ranking criteria), Vandy is exactly the type of school you would need to pass to move up rapidly. Of course, your entire argument is fatally flawed because federal funding for research has been dramatically cut by Trump and even the powerhouses are facing declines in researching funding support.

Moving on . . .

My arguments "make no sense" because you've already decided I've wrong and have made no effort to actually engage with any of what I said.

"even though less than 5 percent of the ranking criteria"
Already mentioned that this also indirectly impacts the peer reputation score which you ignored because that's 20% of the criteria.

For whatever reason W&M wasn't screwed over by the funding cuts 🤷‍♂️ they hit 110 mil in expenditures last year per some end of year email they sent out to everyone. But if everyone is getting screwed over it's still about positioning yourself higher on that list and getting people at other universities to have a higher reputation of you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wake has lots of rich kids. W&M prob less so.

Wake has better ROI and can compete outside of regional placement for jobs. It will get closer to top 25 in a few years.

Wak is nowhere near being a top 25

Dp, but why this again. When us news decides to eliminate the dei factors it’s used for the last year or two, Wake will likely be back on the T30, just as it was for over 25 straight years.

But we all know they won't, and since Wake isn't really looking to grow research they'll continue to be punished

So will William and Mary, the schools excel based on class size and having full professors teachers. The research factors are less than 5 percent of score and focus only on overall number of citations. Schools the size of Wake or William and Mary simply can’t compete with the the large flagships on this criteria, they don’t have the same raw numbers of faculty.

W&M is certainly trying to grow research now that it's R1. Will obviously never be able to compete with flagships but it can probably catch up to bigger research privates

Doubtful, it doesn’t even have a medical school.

There are plenty of bigger research schools without a med school. You can still do health related research without one - I imagine the new bioengineering program they're adding will ramp up with that pretty quickly.

My student is premed. She could go to Wake, where she can take classes with medical schools faculty, works in labs with her professors at a school that has well over $300 million in biomedical funding, and shadow her professors at Wake Med.

Or she could go to William and Mary, which has no medical school and a total of $81 million in research funding, nearly all of which is not biomedical.

Thank you for this wonderful straw man argument that had absolutely nothing to do with the previous comment

Not remotely a straw man. It just shows how superficial your understanding of research is. William and Mary being R1 had very little value to my family when their total amount of research is still small and there is little in the area of interest to my student. If my kid was interested in marine science or education, William and Mary would be a better choice for them given its research strength in those area. For a premed kid, Wake offers significantly better research opportunities in their area of interest. Unlike total number of citations in scientific journals, these are inquiries families should be considering because they will have a direct impact on their kid’s academic experience.

It's a strawman because I was talking about the US news rankings and you're going on a whole side argument about personal value. Great! But who asked? I'm not a fan of the new ranking weights but Wake has made it pretty clear they aren't going to try to improve on them. https://about.wfu.edu/wake-forest-and-rankings/

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wake has lots of rich kids. W&M prob less so.

Wake has better ROI and can compete outside of regional placement for jobs. It will get closer to top 25 in a few years.

Wak is nowhere near being a top 25

Dp, but why this again. When us news decides to eliminate the dei factors it’s used for the last year or two, Wake will likely be back on the T30, just as it was for over 25 straight years.

But we all know they won't, and since Wake isn't really looking to grow research they'll continue to be punished

So will William and Mary, the schools excel based on class size and having full professors teachers. The research factors are less than 5 percent of score and focus only on overall number of citations. Schools the size of Wake or William and Mary simply can’t compete with the the large flagships on this criteria, they don’t have the same raw numbers of faculty.

W&M is certainly trying to grow research now that it's R1. Will obviously never be able to compete with flagships but it can probably catch up to bigger research privates

Doubtful, it doesn’t even have a medical school.

There are plenty of bigger research schools without a med school. You can still do health related research without one - I imagine the new bioengineering program they're adding will ramp up with that pretty quickly.

My student is premed. She could go to Wake, where she can take classes with medical schools faculty, works in labs with her professors at a school that has well over $300 million in biomedical funding, and shadow her professors at Wake Med.

Or she could go to William and Mary, which has no medical school and a total of $81 million in research funding, nearly all of which is not biomedical.

Thank you for this wonderful straw man argument that had absolutely nothing to do with the previous comment

Not remotely a straw man. It just shows how superficial your understanding of research is. William and Mary being R1 had very little value to my family when their total amount of research is still small and there is little in the area of interest to my student. If my kid was interested in marine science or education, William and Mary would be a better choice for them given its research strength in those area. For a premed kid, Wake offers significantly better research opportunities in their area of interest. Unlike total number of citations in scientific journals, these are inquiries families should be considering because they will have a direct impact on their kid’s academic experience.

It's a strawman because I was talking about the US news rankings and you're going on a whole side argument about personal value. Great! But who asked? I'm not a fan of the new ranking weights but Wake has made it pretty clear they aren't going to try to improve on them. https://about.wfu.edu/wake-forest-and-rankings/

That web page doesn’t support your statement at all. It is a great summary of wake’s strengths though.

Nature magazine, the preeminent peer reviewed scientific journal, ranks Wake 143rd for its research efforts and William and Mary 287th.

And like every other university, Wake continues to work on growing its research efforts. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Innovation_Quarter

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wake has lots of rich kids. W&M prob less so.

Wake has better ROI and can compete outside of regional placement for jobs. It will get closer to top 25 in a few years.

Wak is nowhere near being a top 25

Dp, but why this again. When us news decides to eliminate the dei factors it’s used for the last year or two, Wake will likely be back on the T30, just as it was for over 25 straight years.

But we all know they won't, and since Wake isn't really looking to grow research they'll continue to be punished

So will William and Mary, the schools excel based on class size and having full professors teachers. The research factors are less than 5 percent of score and focus only on overall number of citations. Schools the size of Wake or William and Mary simply can’t compete with the the large flagships on this criteria, they don’t have the same raw numbers of faculty.

W&M is certainly trying to grow research now that it's R1. Will obviously never be able to compete with flagships but it can probably catch up to bigger research privates

Doubtful, it doesn’t even have a medical school.

There are plenty of bigger research schools without a med school. You can still do health related research without one - I imagine the new bioengineering program they're adding will ramp up with that pretty quickly.

My student is premed. She could go to Wake, where she can take classes with medical schools faculty, works in labs with her professors at a school that has well over $300 million in biomedical funding, and shadow her professors at Wake Med.

Or she could go to William and Mary, which has no medical school and a total of $81 million in research funding, nearly all of which is not biomedical.

Thank you for this wonderful straw man argument that had absolutely nothing to do with the previous comment

Not remotely a straw man. It just shows how superficial your understanding of research is. William and Mary being R1 had very little value to my family when their total amount of research is still small and there is little in the area of interest to my student. If my kid was interested in marine science or education, William and Mary would be a better choice for them given its research strength in those area. For a premed kid, Wake offers significantly better research opportunities in their area of interest. Unlike total number of citations in scientific journals, these are inquiries families should be considering because they will have a direct impact on their kid’s academic experience.

It's a strawman because I was talking about the US news rankings and you're going on a whole side argument about personal value. Great! But who asked? I'm not a fan of the new ranking weights but Wake has made it pretty clear they aren't going to try to improve on them. https://about.wfu.edu/wake-forest-and-rankings/

That web page doesn’t support your statement at all. It is a great summary of wake’s strengths though.

Nature magazine, the preeminent peer reviewed scientific journal, ranks Wake 143rd for its research efforts and William and Mary 287th.

And like every other university, Wake continues to work on growing its research efforts. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Innovation_Quarter

Wake Forest has never made decisions or determined University strategy based on chasing rankings such as those from U.S. News. We do not intend to start now.

seems pretty point and blank to me.

If you're going to keep deliberately ignoring/misinterpreting what I've said I'm really just wasting my time. I'm not talking about now, I'm talking about the future. And a different future requires many years of planning and thought and strategy. Pulling out current rankings like that somehow undermines that is just you being disingenuous.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wake has lots of rich kids. W&M prob less so.

Wake has better ROI and can compete outside of regional placement for jobs. It will get closer to top 25 in a few years.

Wak is nowhere near being a top 25

Dp, but why this again. When us news decides to eliminate the dei factors it’s used for the last year or two, Wake will likely be back on the T30, just as it was for over 25 straight years.

But we all know they won't, and since Wake isn't really looking to grow research they'll continue to be punished

So will William and Mary, the schools excel based on class size and having full professors teachers. The research factors are less than 5 percent of score and focus only on overall number of citations. Schools the size of Wake or William and Mary simply can’t compete with the the large flagships on this criteria, they don’t have the same raw numbers of faculty.

W&M is certainly trying to grow research now that it's R1. Will obviously never be able to compete with flagships but it can probably catch up to bigger research privates

Doubtful, it doesn’t even have a medical school.

There are plenty of bigger research schools without a med school. You can still do health related research without one - I imagine the new bioengineering program they're adding will ramp up with that pretty quickly.

My student is premed. She could go to Wake, where she can take classes with medical schools faculty, works in labs with her professors at a school that has well over $300 million in biomedical funding, and shadow her professors at Wake Med.

Or she could go to William and Mary, which has no medical school and a total of $81 million in research funding, nearly all of which is not biomedical.

Thank you for this wonderful straw man argument that had absolutely nothing to do with the previous comment

Not remotely a straw man. It just shows how superficial your understanding of research is. William and Mary being R1 had very little value to my family when their total amount of research is still small and there is little in the area of interest to my student. If my kid was interested in marine science or education, William and Mary would be a better choice for them given its research strength in those area. For a premed kid, Wake offers significantly better research opportunities in their area of interest. Unlike total number of citations in scientific journals, these are inquiries families should be considering because they will have a direct impact on their kid’s academic experience.

It's a strawman because I was talking about the US news rankings and you're going on a whole side argument about personal value. Great! But who asked? I'm not a fan of the new ranking weights but Wake has made it pretty clear they aren't going to try to improve on them. https://about.wfu.edu/wake-forest-and-rankings/

That web page doesn’t support your statement at all. It is a great summary of wake’s strengths though.

Nature magazine, the preeminent peer reviewed scientific journal, ranks Wake 143rd for its research efforts and William and Mary 287th.

And like every other university, Wake continues to work on growing its research efforts. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Innovation_Quarter

Wake Forest has never made decisions or determined University strategy based on chasing rankings such as those from U.S. News. We do not intend to start now.

seems pretty point and blank to me.

If you're going to keep deliberately ignoring/misinterpreting what I've said I'm really just wasting my time. I'm not talking about now, I'm talking about the future. And a different future requires many years of planning and thought and strategy. Pulling out current rankings like that somehow undermines that is just you being disingenuous.

You suggested that only William and Mary is interested in growing its research efforts. Wake, like nearly every other university in the country, has been doing that for decades and continues to do so, and is not focused on research for purposes of U.S. News ranking improvement. I suspect that William and Mary’s increased focus on research also has zilch to do with the U.S. News rankings and instead has more substantive underpinnings. Your arguments are literally nonsense.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wake has lots of rich kids. W&M prob less so.

Wake has better ROI and can compete outside of regional placement for jobs. It will get closer to top 25 in a few years.

Wak is nowhere near being a top 25

Dp, but why this again. When us news decides to eliminate the dei factors it’s used for the last year or two, Wake will likely be back on the T30, just as it was for over 25 straight years.

But we all know they won't, and since Wake isn't really looking to grow research they'll continue to be punished

So will William and Mary, the schools excel based on class size and having full professors teachers. The research factors are less than 5 percent of score and focus only on overall number of citations. Schools the size of Wake or William and Mary simply can’t compete with the the large flagships on this criteria, they don’t have the same raw numbers of faculty.

W&M is certainly trying to grow research now that it's R1. Will obviously never be able to compete with flagships but it can probably catch up to bigger research privates

Doubtful, it doesn’t even have a medical school.

There are plenty of bigger research schools without a med school. You can still do health related research without one - I imagine the new bioengineering program they're adding will ramp up with that pretty quickly.

My student is premed. She could go to Wake, where she can take classes with medical schools faculty, works in labs with her professors at a school that has well over $300 million in biomedical funding, and shadow her professors at Wake Med.

Or she could go to William and Mary, which has no medical school and a total of $81 million in research funding, nearly all of which is not biomedical.

Thank you for this wonderful straw man argument that had absolutely nothing to do with the previous comment

Not remotely a straw man. It just shows how superficial your understanding of research is. William and Mary being R1 had very little value to my family when their total amount of research is still small and there is little in the area of interest to my student. If my kid was interested in marine science or education, William and Mary would be a better choice for them given its research strength in those area. For a premed kid, Wake offers significantly better research opportunities in their area of interest. Unlike total number of citations in scientific journals, these are inquiries families should be considering because they will have a direct impact on their kid’s academic experience.

It's a strawman because I was talking about the US news rankings and you're going on a whole side argument about personal value. Great! But who asked? I'm not a fan of the new ranking weights but Wake has made it pretty clear they aren't going to try to improve on them. https://about.wfu.edu/wake-forest-and-rankings/

That web page doesn’t support your statement at all. It is a great summary of wake’s strengths though.

Nature magazine, the preeminent peer reviewed scientific journal, ranks Wake 143rd for its research efforts and William and Mary 287th.

And like every other university, Wake continues to work on growing its research efforts. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Innovation_Quarter

Wake Forest has never made decisions or determined University strategy based on chasing rankings such as those from U.S. News. We do not intend to start now.

seems pretty point and blank to me.

If you're going to keep deliberately ignoring/misinterpreting what I've said I'm really just wasting my time. I'm not talking about now, I'm talking about the future. And a different future requires many years of planning and thought and strategy. Pulling out current rankings like that somehow undermines that is just you being disingenuous.

You suggested that only William and Mary is interested in growing its research efforts. Wake, like nearly every other university in the country, has been doing that for decades and continues to do so, and is not focused on research for purposes of U.S. News ranking improvement. I suspect that William and Mary’s increased focus on research also has zilch to do with the U.S. News rankings and instead has more substantive underpinnings. Your arguments are literally nonsense.

Again another misread! Yikes lady. Can't find anything online about Wake looking to significantly boost research or try to go R1 or expand heavily outside of just the med scholl. If you have some stuff that counters that please send it our way, but this gaslighting is just ridiculous.

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Anonymous wrote:Wake has lots of rich kids. W&M prob less so.

Wake has better ROI and can compete outside of regional placement for jobs. It will get closer to top 25 in a few years.

Wak is nowhere near being a top 25

Dp, but why this again. When us news decides to eliminate the dei factors it’s used for the last year or two, Wake will likely be back on the T30, just as it was for over 25 straight years.

But we all know they won't, and since Wake isn't really looking to grow research they'll continue to be punished

So will William and Mary, the schools excel based on class size and having full professors teachers. The research factors are less than 5 percent of score and focus only on overall number of citations. Schools the size of Wake or William and Mary simply can’t compete with the the large flagships on this criteria, they don’t have the same raw numbers of faculty.

W&M is certainly trying to grow research now that it's R1. Will obviously never be able to compete with flagships but it can probably catch up to bigger research privates

Doubtful, it doesn’t even have a medical school.

There are plenty of bigger research schools without a med school. You can still do health related research without one - I imagine the new bioengineering program they're adding will ramp up with that pretty quickly.

My student is premed. She could go to Wake, where she can take classes with medical schools faculty, works in labs with her professors at a school that has well over $300 million in biomedical funding, and shadow her professors at Wake Med.

Or she could go to William and Mary, which has no medical school and a total of $81 million in research funding, nearly all of which is not biomedical.

Thank you for this wonderful straw man argument that had absolutely nothing to do with the previous comment

Not remotely a straw man. It just shows how superficial your understanding of research is. William and Mary being R1 had very little value to my family when their total amount of research is still small and there is little in the area of interest to my student. If my kid was interested in marine science or education, William and Mary would be a better choice for them given its research strength in those area. For a premed kid, Wake offers significantly better research opportunities in their area of interest. Unlike total number of citations in scientific journals, these are inquiries families should be considering because they will have a direct impact on their kid’s academic experience.

It's a strawman because I was talking about the US news rankings and you're going on a whole side argument about personal value. Great! But who asked? I'm not a fan of the new ranking weights but Wake has made it pretty clear they aren't going to try to improve on them. https://about.wfu.edu/wake-forest-and-rankings/

That web page doesn’t support your statement at all. It is a great summary of wake’s strengths though.

Nature magazine, the preeminent peer reviewed scientific journal, ranks Wake 143rd for its research efforts and William and Mary 287th.

And like every other university, Wake continues to work on growing its research efforts. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Innovation_Quarter

Wake Forest has never made decisions or determined University strategy based on chasing rankings such as those from U.S. News. We do not intend to start now.

seems pretty point and blank to me.

If you're going to keep deliberately ignoring/misinterpreting what I've said I'm really just wasting my time. I'm not talking about now, I'm talking about the future. And a different future requires many years of planning and thought and strategy. Pulling out current rankings like that somehow undermines that is just you being disingenuous.

You suggested that only William and Mary is interested in growing its research efforts. Wake, like nearly every other university in the country, has been doing that for decades and continues to do so, and is not focused on research for purposes of U.S. News ranking improvement. I suspect that William and Mary’s increased focus on research also has zilch to do with the U.S. News rankings and instead has more substantive underpinnings. Your arguments are literally nonsense.

Again another misread! Yikes lady. Can't find anything online about Wake looking to significantly boost research or try to go R1 or expand heavily outside of just the med scholl. If you have some stuff that counters that please send it our way, but this gaslighting is just ridiculous.

Wake, as an institution, has more than three times the research funding of William anns Mary and a research ranking more than 140 places ahead, according to the preeminent science journal. I gave you an entire wiki article about Winston Salem’s innovation corridor and Wake’s role in it. I previously mentioned that Wake has a brand new research faculty dedicated to undergraduate and medical school research and that there is fantastic opportunities for science undergrads to take classes with and work in labs run by medical school professors.

And if you ran a simple google search, here’s what else you would learn:

Key Research Growth & Investments
School of Medicine Expansion: The School of Medicine and Advocate Health are driving major research initiatives, highlighted by a new $ 100 million campaign to support studies in Alzheimer's, regenerative medicine, and diabetes.
Translational Focus: A new translational eye and vision research center has been launched, connecting researchers across the Advocate Health system.
Infrastructure Investment: The university is investing over $1 million in upgrading laboratory and learning spaces, with further campus master planning underway to support increased research activities.
Research Areas: Key focus areas include Alzheimer’s disease, cancer, cardiovascular disease, neurosciences, and regenerative medicine.
Academic Upgrades: The university is planning a capital campaign set to culminate in 2034 to fund academic innovation and research, following a period of modest strategic undergraduate enrollment growth

I’m not the one gaslighting.

[Anonymous]

Wake, as an institution, has more than three times the research funding of William anns Mary and a research ranking more than 140 places ahead, according to the preeminent science journal.

You just can't help yourself can you! Queen of strawmen

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Wake, as an institution, has more than three times the research funding of William anns Mary and a research ranking more than 140 places ahead, according to the preeminent science journal.

You just can't help yourself can you! Queen of strawmen

I don’t think you understand the meaning of the term. It’s objective data.