professors are leaving florida - and turning down job offers in florida - because of desantis

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:UF has really been rising in the rankings and just behind Uva. for public universities, so I think this is all B.S. And who cares anyway if the woke profs get driven out? That's a good thing. Maybe we can get back to actual education.

It’s not just driving out woke profs. It’s making people even in pre med and social science fields worried about accepting jobs there. It’s hard to completely avoid potentially controversial topics in most fields, and it’s not fun to worry about saying the “wrong” thing or giving the “wrong” type of assignment. Academic freedom has always been a really important part of the job. Why risk it if you’re a strong candidate with other options elsewhere?

This. I know of one applied math prof who is looking for other opportunities because he is scared about whether his assignments could be “woke” (ML techniques but some might think the finding of racial patterning is “woke”). You are crazy if you think it doesn’t affect all professors. Academic freedom is what makes the system work.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It's fine if people who are politically progressive leave Florida. People shouldn't have to be uncomfortable with the policies of their state when there are other states that may be a match. Florida is the top destination for transplants, so presumably these people will be replaced with new folks who are happier with Florida's policies. I think this political segregation is a good thing, and is not a problem. Live and let live.

Florida’s electorate is not far right. It hasn’t behaved like it in recent years, but it is very much a swing state. I think ten republicans are going to be in for a reckoning in a few years.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It's fine if people who are politically progressive leave Florida. People shouldn't have to be uncomfortable with the policies of their state when there are other states that may be a match. Florida is the top destination for transplants, so presumably these people will be replaced with new folks who are happier with Florida's policies. I think this political segregation is a good thing, and is not a problem. Live and let live.

Oh dear lord have we not learned why segregation is bad, after all these years? Can you not comprehend how that turns out? Did you fail history in school??

Any form of segregation - whether it is cultural, religious, political, ethnic - results in pockets of minorities whose civil liberties get violated. The whole point of the Bill of Rights is to guarantee civil liberties regardless of what state you are in and how many of you live in that state. It is a protection against tyranny of the majority, and what you propose is tyrannies at each state level.

Add to that the disastrous economic effect of companies picking and choosing what states they will hire in, based on politics, and you have baked in inefficiencies. And the knock-on effect of this is the re-establishment of the north and south economies except in this case it will be based on education. Educated people move for jobs every time they get a new degree and then one or two times later in their careers. Corporations will not establish major hiring centers in states that are unattractive to a significant fraction of them, and they skew liberal. I think it's pretty well known now that North Carolina lost Amazon HQ2 for this reason. On the other hand, low wage/ blue collar jobs are filled with people who generally don't move (except for immigrants) and so that's what will stay. The south loses again, along with chunks of the midwest.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:UF has really been rising in the rankings and just behind Uva. for public universities, so I think this is all B.S. And who cares anyway if the woke profs get driven out? That's a good thing. Maybe we can get back to actual education.

It’s not just driving out woke profs. It’s making people even in pre med and social science fields worried about accepting jobs there. It’s hard to completely avoid potentially controversial topics in most fields, and it’s not fun to worry about saying the “wrong” thing or giving the “wrong” type of assignment. Academic freedom has always been a really important part of the job. Why risk it if you’re a strong candidate with other options elsewhere?

This. I know of one applied math prof who is looking for other opportunities because he is scared about whether his assignments could be “woke” (ML techniques but some might think the finding of racial patterning is “woke”). You are crazy if you think it doesn’t affect all professors. Academic freedom is what makes the system work.

Funny how conservative professors aren’t allowed academic freedom at woke universities, hypocrite.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:UF has really been rising in the rankings and just behind Uva. for public universities, so I think this is all B.S. And who cares anyway if the woke profs get driven out? That's a good thing. Maybe we can get back to actual education.

It’s not just driving out woke profs. It’s making people even in pre med and social science fields worried about accepting jobs there. It’s hard to completely avoid potentially controversial topics in most fields, and it’s not fun to worry about saying the “wrong” thing or giving the “wrong” type of assignment. Academic freedom has always been a really important part of the job. Why risk it if you’re a strong candidate with other options elsewhere?

Those people would be happier in places like New Jersey. It's okay. There's a lid for every pot.

The question is whether there is enough talent willing to work in states where the governor is actively banning academic fields, and where school districts are banning books. What academic wants that? Certainly some people will, but it puts Florida at a disadvantage. You aren't just getting rid of a few radicals. You're getting rid of people who value academic freedom.

Four years ago the right was up in arms about campus speakers being canceled. Those are guest speakers. And today the same conservatives are banning curriculum.

[Anonymous]

Woke professors teach WHAT to think.
Intelligent professors teach HOW to think.

Florida does not need schools or colleges to indoctrinate its students with radical garbage. We have enough of that across America right now. What exactly is their end game?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It is not cheap to live here or to find affordable housing. Maybe a double wide trailer in davie or a hoarder house listed for $550,000

I moved here (s. Fla) from dc and I’m shocked at the prices

People who think the red state metros are still cheap do not have current information. Last year, Florida averaged-- the entire state-- 30% yoy growth in real estate prices. Meanwhile, DC grew just under 7%. The mass migration to the south might have started with people seeking better cost of living but that's less the case now. Taxes are still better.

Ok, but how is DC supposed to grow? Where?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I know many younger professionals who live in Southern Florida and hate it.

young people move to FL and TX because it's cheap, not because of politics. I think some conservatives who tout how so many are moving to TX/FL don't understand the reason why people are moving there.. it's not because of their politics, but in spite of their politics.

These young people are just starting out, and if they are making $100K, they are being taxed a lot, so they escape to tax havens like TX and FL. Yes, I know TX has high property taxes, but young people aren't buying expensive homes.

Tax haven is because of the politics. Lower cost of living is because of the politics. These younger professionals, if they come in and vote for Democrats, will then turn those places into very expensive places to live with high taxes.

I think you do not understand how this works. It's purely the law of supply and demand.

The lower cost of living is that way because there is no demand. Historically, even with low taxes, the educated did not flock to TX or FL. They went to places like CA, IL, NY, which then became a victim of their own success with high cost of living. People who cannot afford the hcol move out to a lcol area, and if they move out in droves, then the housing cost and general col goes up there, too. That happened in cities in ID, OR and NV.

Austin is seeing this, too. Their property values and property taxes are sky high. It has driven out long time residents out of the area.

Other cities in TX will experience the same thing that CA, IL, NY experienced.

However, FL with its anti-education policies may end up driving the educated away.

You leave out the supply part of the equation. It is easier to get more housing in Atlanta, Dallas, Orlando, while enivronmentalists insist on no development, and all you get is housing for rich people that developers are able to bribe the right people.

those areas were largely under developed, but now they have huge sprawl. Most of the liveable parts of CA have been developed already. The Bay Area does not have a lot of room for more development. SoCal is completely over developed. I lived in both Socal and Bay Area for 40 years. There is no more room to develop.

I now live in a suburb of the DC area, and there is still room for development outside the beltway. I have been seeing so many new builds in the past 10 years around here. Can't do that in Ca.

It is very much a matter of supply and demand. That is why Austin home prices skyrocketed. Huge demand there now. Be careful what you wish for.

Austin has always been expensive. Now it also has the distinction of being ruined by huge, ugly sprawl. It is a damn shame how the Hill Country is being ruined.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I'm a liberal and I say "good". When the old folks in Fla can't find a nurse who can read their chart or properly administer meds because they are ignoramuses, maybe they will say to them selves "hmm, perhaps we should not have driven the educated out of the state".

Actions, consequences.

Also, let them make enemies of Disney and hopefully decimate their economy. Reap, sow.

Disney's is booming in Florida. Unless they are wiling to move the property, they are going to have to keep investing in it. Do you really think Iger is going to decide that DeSantis is mean and write off Disney World and move to a more welcoming state?

I think nowadays anything can happen, and usually does.

Company is committing suicide. Stock murdered over the last 2 years.

Sure because they may have to shut down operations in Florida? Lol Disney Florida operations are 5% of the companies revenue and the parks have seen large increase year over year from 2020. Disney yearly revenues are almost 140% larger vs the state of Florida’s yearly budget and 34% of the state budget is federal money. If you back that out Disney revenues are 2x the size of Florida state budget.

How DeSantis doing in the polls after Iger went after him? DeSantis and his minions will be out of jobs next cycle because Disney will flex its muscle.

You support corporations' controlling government.

Unlike you I do not support government forcing corporations punishing gays, blacks, Jews, etc employees and customers. I also do not support tax increases to support private businesses.

If you are referring to Reedy Creek you are misinformed on the subject, by various journalists who are biased and reporting against DeSantis.
The only taxes that would be raised would be on Disney to pay for things.
Apparently Democrats if they get back in power would hand over control to Disney to be the local government. They have been quietly running this fake district for decades, and got caught out.
The district was for a city that Walt Disney was planning to open, and after he died, the company opened Magic Kingdom and EPCOT instead. That should have been the end of the district.

Disney created that whole area, including its local government and infrastructure, out of nothing. They built it all. It's amazing to see people now coming in out of the blue and acting indignant as if Disney is somehow usurping something that Disney created in the first place.

That was an argument they maybe could have made if they bothered to hire local lawyers who knew the subject, instead of out of state lawyers.
Big problem is Iger saying Disney is Reedy Creek, when they are supposed to be independent, and this was certified in many forms, including when they put out those bonds worth billions.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's not just college professors that are leaving--public school teachers are leaving as well.

"Florida has 5,294 teacher vacancies, the state education association says, compared with 2,217 vacancies in January 2019 when Gov. Ron DeSantis took office. Teachers say they are leaving because of low pay and DeSantis' education policies, dubbed the 'war on woke.'"

https://www.newsweek.com/florida-combats-colossal-teacher-shortage-1793928#:~:text=Florida%20has%205%2C294%20teacher%20vacancies,the%20%22war%20on%20woke.%22

Voucher time.

An explosion of private options would be fantastic for education.

Well, it would make rich people richer I suppose. And just think how white the schools will be. But how is a teacher shortage going to be solved by vouchers?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm a liberal and I say "good". When the old folks in Fla can't find a nurse who can read their chart or properly administer meds because they are ignoramuses, maybe they will say to them selves "hmm, perhaps we should not have driven the educated out of the state".

Actions, consequences.

Also, let them make enemies of Disney and hopefully decimate their economy. Reap, sow.

Disney's is booming in Florida. Unless they are wiling to move the property, they are going to have to keep investing in it. Do you really think Iger is going to decide that DeSantis is mean and write off Disney World and move to a more welcoming state?

I think nowadays anything can happen, and usually does.

Company is committing suicide. Stock murdered over the last 2 years.

Sure because they may have to shut down operations in Florida? Lol Disney Florida operations are 5% of the companies revenue and the parks have seen large increase year over year from 2020. Disney yearly revenues are almost 140% larger vs the state of Florida’s yearly budget and 34% of the state budget is federal money. If you back that out Disney revenues are 2x the size of Florida state budget.

How DeSantis doing in the polls after Iger went after him? DeSantis and his minions will be out of jobs next cycle because Disney will flex its muscle.

You support corporations' controlling government.

Unlike you I do not support government forcing corporations punishing gays, blacks, Jews, etc employees and customers. I also do not support tax increases to support private businesses.

If you are referring to Reedy Creek you are misinformed on the subject, by various journalists who are biased and reporting against DeSantis.
The only taxes that would be raised would be on Disney to pay for things.
Apparently Democrats if they get back in power would hand over control to Disney to be the local government. They have been quietly running this fake district for decades, and got caught out.
The district was for a city that Walt Disney was planning to open, and after he died, the company opened Magic Kingdom and EPCOT instead. That should have been the end of the district.

Disney created that whole area, including its local government and infrastructure, out of nothing. They built it all. It's amazing to see people now coming in out of the blue and acting indignant as if Disney is somehow usurping something that Disney created in the first place.

That was an argument they maybe could have made if they bothered to hire local lawyers who knew the subject, instead of out of state lawyers.
Big problem is Iger saying Disney is Reedy Creek, when they are supposed to be independent, and this was certified in many forms, including when they put out those bonds worth billions.

Disney was doing just fine with the system as is. But if Florida wants to insist on stepping in then they are immediately responsible for the billions as well.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm a liberal and I say "good". When the old folks in Fla can't find a nurse who can read their chart or properly administer meds because they are ignoramuses, maybe they will say to them selves "hmm, perhaps we should not have driven the educated out of the state".

Actions, consequences.

Also, let them make enemies of Disney and hopefully decimate their economy. Reap, sow.

Disney's is booming in Florida. Unless they are wiling to move the property, they are going to have to keep investing in it. Do you really think Iger is going to decide that DeSantis is mean and write off Disney World and move to a more welcoming state?

I think nowadays anything can happen, and usually does.

Company is committing suicide. Stock murdered over the last 2 years.

Sure because they may have to shut down operations in Florida? Lol Disney Florida operations are 5% of the companies revenue and the parks have seen large increase year over year from 2020. Disney yearly revenues are almost 140% larger vs the state of Florida’s yearly budget and 34% of the state budget is federal money. If you back that out Disney revenues are 2x the size of Florida state budget.

How DeSantis doing in the polls after Iger went after him? DeSantis and his minions will be out of jobs next cycle because Disney will flex its muscle.

You support corporations' controlling government.

Unlike you I do not support government forcing corporations punishing gays, blacks, Jews, etc employees and customers. I also do not support tax increases to support private businesses.

If you are referring to Reedy Creek you are misinformed on the subject, by various journalists who are biased and reporting against DeSantis.
The only taxes that would be raised would be on Disney to pay for things.
Apparently Democrats if they get back in power would hand over control to Disney to be the local government. They have been quietly running this fake district for decades, and got caught out.
The district was for a city that Walt Disney was planning to open, and after he died, the company opened Magic Kingdom and EPCOT instead. That should have been the end of the district.

Disney created that whole area, including its local government and infrastructure, out of nothing. They built it all. It's amazing to see people now coming in out of the blue and acting indignant as if Disney is somehow usurping something that Disney created in the first place.

That was an argument they maybe could have made if they bothered to hire local lawyers who knew the subject, instead of out of state lawyers.
Big problem is Iger saying Disney is Reedy Creek, when they are supposed to be independent, and this was certified in many forms, including when they put out those bonds worth billions.

"They are supposed to be independent" was never part of the deal when it was all created by Disney. That's being falsely imposed from outside.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Florida’s colleges are generally mediocre at best, in any event. But tenure track jobs are quite rare indeed—old farts teaching into their 80s and the repulsive treatment of adjuncts.

UF is excellent as state schools go.

No shortage of professors will take those spots of others turn them down. Higher education has a massive surplus of phds looking for teaching jobs.

If UF is “excellent as state schools go,” what the hell happened to other state schools?

UF has always been a top ranked school.

That's going downhill fast. They're losing their top professors and their top students.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's fine if people who are politically progressive leave Florida. People shouldn't have to be uncomfortable with the policies of their state when there are other states that may be a match. Florida is the top destination for transplants, so presumably these people will be replaced with new folks who are happier with Florida's policies. I think this political segregation is a good thing, and is not a problem. Live and let live.

Exactly. Wokism doesn’t need to rule us all.

Yes, so much better to be ruled by authoritarian, smooth-brained troglodytism.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's not just college professors that are leaving--public school teachers are leaving as well.

"Florida has 5,294 teacher vacancies, the state education association says, compared with 2,217 vacancies in January 2019 when Gov. Ron DeSantis took office. Teachers say they are leaving because of low pay and DeSantis' education policies, dubbed the 'war on woke.'"

https://www.newsweek.com/florida-combats-colossal-teacher-shortage-1793928#:~:text=Florida%20has%205%2C294%20teacher%20vacancies,the%20%22war%20on%20woke.%22

Voucher time.

An explosion of private options would be fantastic for education.

The state has a shortage of teachers. Vouchers won't make new teachers appear out of nowhere. You have to raise pay to get more teachers.

Oh don't worry - I'm sure Florida will find yahoos who barely finished high school, themselves, to serve as teachers.