Are men happier than women in marriage at midlife?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's amazing to me to contrast the comments in this thread--where everyone seems certain that women are screwed over by marriage--with the threads where women are pissed that they can't get a man to settle down and marry. Why is it that worldly, well educated women want something that is so bad for them?

It *amazes* you that two different groups of women could say different things? Your mind will be completely blown, then, when you hear that there are even more groups of women: women who love being married, women who are completely indifferent to it, women who think marriage is evil, women who want to be married but only if they find a man who is obviously devoted to them, and so on and so forth. The group who is "pissed that they can't get a man to settle down and marry" is fast dwindling, however.

So maybe then you can't really generalize about who benefits from marriage the most? Sounds like some posters in this thread -- maybe you are one -- should take that advice to heart.

Another shocker here: you can, because research has been done on it. You can look at lots of different metrics and see who benefits the most. Generally. Because we are *generalizing*.

Some people are. Others take a generalization and make it about everyone.

[Anonymous]

OP - you do not have much in terms of solid data to support your position that men are happier being married.

First, our society treats men who complain much worse than women. You only have to look at how words like “wimp” and “whiner” are strongly used to apply to men.

Men commit suicide at higher rates than women, and married men commit suicide at higher rates than married women. While divorced men commit suicide at higher rates than married men, most studies indicate that men losing access to their children is a much more devastating factor than losing access to their spouse.

Bottom line: Your female friends complain more about being unhappily married, but their husbands are much more likely to take drastic action regarding their unhappiness.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP - you do not have much in terms of solid data to support your position that men are happier being married.

First, our society treats men who complain much worse than women. You only have to look at how words like “wimp” and “whiner” are strongly used to apply to men.

Men commit suicide at higher rates than women, and married men commit suicide at higher rates than married women. While divorced men commit suicide at higher rates than married men, most studies indicate that men losing access to their children is a much more devastating factor than losing access to their spouse.

Bottom line: Your female friends complain more about being unhappily married, but their husbands are much more likely to take drastic action regarding their unhappiness.

men losing access to their children is a much more devastating factor than losing access to their spouse - I'm personally curious how many of these men see their wives and children as a means of pleasure versus the other way around as protectors and carers of them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP - you do not have much in terms of solid data to support your position that men are happier being married.

First, our society treats men who complain much worse than women. You only have to look at how words like “wimp” and “whiner” are strongly used to apply to men.

Men commit suicide at higher rates than women, and married men commit suicide at higher rates than married women. While divorced men commit suicide at higher rates than married men, most studies indicate that men losing access to their children is a much more devastating factor than losing access to their spouse.

Bottom line: Your female friends complain more about being unhappily married, but their husbands are much more likely to take drastic action regarding their unhappiness.

men losing access to their children is a much more devastating factor than losing access to their spouse - I'm personally curious how many of these men see their wives and children as a means of pleasure versus the other way around as protectors and carers of them.

I don't think the men married to women posting here are viewing them "as a means of pleasure"....

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It takes less to make men come content. Women are more complex emotionally. Lesbians and straight women initiate divorce at higher rates.

Also, men who lack the spark will often cheat but not want to end their marriage. They can separate sex and love

Men will stay in a marriage, but completely check out, start petty arguments, and/or cheat until their wives file.

+1 That's exactly how my former marriage went down.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP - you do not have much in terms of solid data to support your position that men are happier being married.

First, our society treats men who complain much worse than women. You only have to look at how words like “wimp” and “whiner” are strongly used to apply to men.

Men commit suicide at higher rates than women, and married men commit suicide at higher rates than married women. While divorced men commit suicide at higher rates than married men, most studies indicate that men losing access to their children is a much more devastating factor than losing access to their spouse.

Bottom line: Your female friends complain more about being unhappily married, but their husbands are much more likely to take drastic action regarding their unhappiness.

men losing access to their children is a much more devastating factor than losing access to their spouse - I'm personally curious how many of these men see their wives and children as a means of pleasure versus the other way around as protectors and carers of them.

I don't think the men married to women posting here are viewing them "as a means of pleasure"....

+1. That's weird and creepy.

[Anonymous]

the primary argument in this thread is that it is well known/well documented that marriage is generally a raw deal for women.

Disgruntled women who post on DCUM consult the hivemind about something they want to be true and find that other women who also want that thing to be true agree with them. Surprise, surprise!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's amazing to me to contrast the comments in this thread--where everyone seems certain that women are screwed over by marriage--with the threads where women are pissed that they can't get a man to settle down and marry. Why is it that worldly, well educated women want something that is so bad for them?

Because they want children and unfortunately society still shames never-married single mothers.

Exactly. And it's just easier with a spouse. That doesn't mean that 20 years later they're still benefitting from being married. Women initiate most divorces and remarry less.

So they are misrepresenting their long term intentions or just don't know that it turns out to be terrible (despite the supposed common knowledge)?

Are all men you meet the same? Well, all women are not the same. Some women are not capable of marriage and enter into it misrepresenting themselves. Others enter into it misrepresenting the other person. Some get it right. Some get it right and then get it wrong. There is no same pattern for everyone in life. How old are the people commenting here? It's like I'm talking to 15 year olds.

Of course "not all women" or "not all men." But the primary argument in this thread is that it is well known/well documented that marriage is generally a raw deal for women. So if that's true, then it doesn't square with the countless threads about women wanting to lock down a noncommittal man for marriage.

Marriage wasn't a raw deal for my mom, who had only a high school diploma and would have earned like $25K/year as a teacher's assistant. Instead, she married my PhD dad and now they are multi-millionaires.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's amazing to me to contrast the comments in this thread--where everyone seems certain that women are screwed over by marriage--with the threads where women are pissed that they can't get a man to settle down and marry. Why is it that worldly, well educated women want something that is so bad for them?

Because they want children and unfortunately society still shames never-married single mothers.

Exactly. And it's just easier with a spouse. That doesn't mean that 20 years later they're still benefitting from being married. Women initiate most divorces and remarry less.

So they are misrepresenting their long term intentions or just don't know that it turns out to be terrible (despite the supposed common knowledge)?

Are all men you meet the same? Well, all women are not the same. Some women are not capable of marriage and enter into it misrepresenting themselves. Others enter into it misrepresenting the other person. Some get it right. Some get it right and then get it wrong. There is no same pattern for everyone in life. How old are the people commenting here? It's like I'm talking to 15 year olds.

Of course "not all women" or "not all men." But the primary argument in this thread is that it is well known/well documented that marriage is generally a raw deal for women. So if that's true, then it doesn't square with the countless threads about women wanting to lock down a noncommittal man for marriage.

Smart women aren’t trying to lock down a “noncommittal” man. Some women think they can change a noncommittal man, but it usually doesn’t work out well for them in the long run. There are men who actually do desire marriage and a family.

Women love and chase men who are unavailable. I've seen it too often in life to believe anything else.

Revealed preferences are a thing. Women supposedly benefit the least from marriage but want it the most. And men supposedly benefit the most and want it the least.

Ever heard of Occam's razor? Generally, if women want marriage the most, you can assume it's because it benefits them the most. And the inverse goes for men.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's amazing to me to contrast the comments in this thread--where everyone seems certain that women are screwed over by marriage--with the threads where women are pissed that they can't get a man to settle down and marry. Why is it that worldly, well educated women want something that is so bad for them?

Because they want children and unfortunately society still shames never-married single mothers.

Exactly. And it's just easier with a spouse. That doesn't mean that 20 years later they're still benefitting from being married. Women initiate most divorces and remarry less.

So they are misrepresenting their long term intentions or just don't know that it turns out to be terrible (despite the supposed common knowledge)?

Are all men you meet the same? Well, all women are not the same. Some women are not capable of marriage and enter into it misrepresenting themselves. Others enter into it misrepresenting the other person. Some get it right. Some get it right and then get it wrong. There is no same pattern for everyone in life. How old are the people commenting here? It's like I'm talking to 15 year olds.

Of course "not all women" or "not all men." But the primary argument in this thread is that it is well known/well documented that marriage is generally a raw deal for women. So if that's true, then it doesn't square with the countless threads about women wanting to lock down a noncommittal man for marriage.

Smart women aren’t trying to lock down a “noncommittal” man. Some women think they can change a noncommittal man, but it usually doesn’t work out well for them in the long run. There are men who actually do desire marriage and a family.

Women love and chase men who are unavailable. I've seen it too often in life to believe anything else.

Revealed preferences are a thing. Women supposedly benefit the least from marriage but want it the most. And men supposedly benefit the most and want it the least.

Ever heard of Occam's razor? Generally, if women want marriage the most, you can assume it's because it benefits them the most. And the inverse goes for men.

Exactly. My advice to my son: don't ever get married. My advice to my daughter: get married to someone who makes more than you.

Why do I give such advice? Because I love my children.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's amazing to me to contrast the comments in this thread--where everyone seems certain that women are screwed over by marriage--with the threads where women are pissed that they can't get a man to settle down and marry. Why is it that worldly, well educated women want something that is so bad for them?

Because they want children and unfortunately society still shames never-married single mothers.

Exactly. And it's just easier with a spouse. That doesn't mean that 20 years later they're still benefitting from being married. Women initiate most divorces and remarry less.

So they are misrepresenting their long term intentions or just don't know that it turns out to be terrible (despite the supposed common knowledge)?

Are all men you meet the same? Well, all women are not the same. Some women are not capable of marriage and enter into it misrepresenting themselves. Others enter into it misrepresenting the other person. Some get it right. Some get it right and then get it wrong. There is no same pattern for everyone in life. How old are the people commenting here? It's like I'm talking to 15 year olds.

Of course "not all women" or "not all men." But the primary argument in this thread is that it is well known/well documented that marriage is generally a raw deal for women. So if that's true, then it doesn't square with the countless threads about women wanting to lock down a noncommittal man for marriage.

Smart women aren’t trying to lock down a “noncommittal” man. Some women think they can change a noncommittal man, but it usually doesn’t work out well for them in the long run. There are men who actually do desire marriage and a family.

Women love and chase men who are unavailable. I've seen it too often in life to believe anything else.

Revealed preferences are a thing. Women supposedly benefit the least from marriage but want it the most. And men supposedly benefit the most and want it the least.

Ever heard of Occam's razor? Generally, if women want marriage the most, you can assume it's because it benefits them the most. And the inverse goes for men.

Exactly. My advice to my son: don't ever get married. My advice to my daughter: get married to someone who makes more than you.

Why do I give such advice? Because I love my children.

With sons, you worry less. There is no biological clock or other reasons to force themselves into a marriage. Societal pressure isn’t there for them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's amazing to me to contrast the comments in this thread--where everyone seems certain that women are screwed over by marriage--with the threads where women are pissed that they can't get a man to settle down and marry. Why is it that worldly, well educated women want something that is so bad for them?

Because they want children and unfortunately society still shames never-married single mothers.

Exactly. And it's just easier with a spouse. That doesn't mean that 20 years later they're still benefitting from being married. Women initiate most divorces and remarry less.

So they are misrepresenting their long term intentions or just don't know that it turns out to be terrible (despite the supposed common knowledge)?

Are all men you meet the same? Well, all women are not the same. Some women are not capable of marriage and enter into it misrepresenting themselves. Others enter into it misrepresenting the other person. Some get it right. Some get it right and then get it wrong. There is no same pattern for everyone in life. How old are the people commenting here? It's like I'm talking to 15 year olds.

Of course "not all women" or "not all men." But the primary argument in this thread is that it is well known/well documented that marriage is generally a raw deal for women. So if that's true, then it doesn't square with the countless threads about women wanting to lock down a noncommittal man for marriage.

Smart women aren’t trying to lock down a “noncommittal” man. Some women think they can change a noncommittal man, but it usually doesn’t work out well for them in the long run. There are men who actually do desire marriage and a family.

Women love and chase men who are unavailable. I've seen it too often in life to believe anything else.

Revealed preferences are a thing. Women supposedly benefit the least from marriage but want it the most. And men supposedly benefit the most and want it the least.

Ever heard of Occam's razor? Generally, if women want marriage the most, you can assume it's because it benefits them the most. And the inverse goes for men.

Exactly. My advice to my son: don't ever get married. My advice to my daughter: get married to someone who makes more than you.

Why do I give such advice? Because I love my children.

With sons, you worry less. There is no biological clock or other reasons to force themselves into a marriage. Societal pressure isn’t there for them.

Oh come on. Yes, there is no biological clock.

But societal pressure is the same for everyone. You feel it or you don’t.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's amazing to me to contrast the comments in this thread--where everyone seems certain that women are screwed over by marriage--with the threads where women are pissed that they can't get a man to settle down and marry. Why is it that worldly, well educated women want something that is so bad for them?

Because they want children and unfortunately society still shames never-married single mothers.

Exactly. And it's just easier with a spouse. That doesn't mean that 20 years later they're still benefitting from being married. Women initiate most divorces and remarry less.

So they are misrepresenting their long term intentions or just don't know that it turns out to be terrible (despite the supposed common knowledge)?

Are all men you meet the same? Well, all women are not the same. Some women are not capable of marriage and enter into it misrepresenting themselves. Others enter into it misrepresenting the other person. Some get it right. Some get it right and then get it wrong. There is no same pattern for everyone in life. How old are the people commenting here? It's like I'm talking to 15 year olds.

Of course "not all women" or "not all men." But the primary argument in this thread is that it is well known/well documented that marriage is generally a raw deal for women. So if that's true, then it doesn't square with the countless threads about women wanting to lock down a noncommittal man for marriage.

Smart women aren’t trying to lock down a “noncommittal” man. Some women think they can change a noncommittal man, but it usually doesn’t work out well for them in the long run. There are men who actually do desire marriage and a family.

Women love and chase men who are unavailable. I've seen it too often in life to believe anything else.

Revealed preferences are a thing. Women supposedly benefit the least from marriage but want it the most. And men supposedly benefit the most and want it the least.

Ever heard of Occam's razor? Generally, if women want marriage the most, you can assume it's because it benefits them the most. And the inverse goes for men.

Exactly. My advice to my son: don't ever get married. My advice to my daughter: get married to someone who makes more than you.

Why do I give such advice? Because I love my children.

Good. Men who don't want to marry shouldn't. More normal women for my kids.

[Anonymous]

Marriage is an equally good deal for women as it is for men. But you have to choose well!! In my case (female), it’s been an exceptional deal for me.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's amazing to me to contrast the comments in this thread--where everyone seems certain that women are screwed over by marriage--with the threads where women are pissed that they can't get a man to settle down and marry. Why is it that worldly, well educated women want something that is so bad for them?

Because they want children and unfortunately society still shames never-married single mothers.

Exactly. And it's just easier with a spouse. That doesn't mean that 20 years later they're still benefitting from being married. Women initiate most divorces and remarry less.

So they are misrepresenting their long term intentions or just don't know that it turns out to be terrible (despite the supposed common knowledge)?

Are all men you meet the same? Well, all women are not the same. Some women are not capable of marriage and enter into it misrepresenting themselves. Others enter into it misrepresenting the other person. Some get it right. Some get it right and then get it wrong. There is no same pattern for everyone in life. How old are the people commenting here? It's like I'm talking to 15 year olds.

Of course "not all women" or "not all men." But the primary argument in this thread is that it is well known/well documented that marriage is generally a raw deal for women. So if that's true, then it doesn't square with the countless threads about women wanting to lock down a noncommittal man for marriage.

Smart women aren’t trying to lock down a “noncommittal” man. Some women think they can change a noncommittal man, but it usually doesn’t work out well for them in the long run. There are men who actually do desire marriage and a family.

Women love and chase men who are unavailable. I've seen it too often in life to believe anything else.

Revealed preferences are a thing. Women supposedly benefit the least from marriage but want it the most. And men supposedly benefit the most and want it the least.

Ever heard of Occam's razor? Generally, if women want marriage the most, you can assume it's because it benefits them the most. And the inverse goes for men.

Exactly. My advice to my son: don't ever get married. My advice to my daughter: get married to someone who makes more than you.

Why do I give such advice? Because I love my children.

With sons, you worry less. There is no biological clock or other reasons to force themselves into a marriage. Societal pressure isn’t there for them.

Oh come on. Yes, there is no biological clock.

But societal pressure is the same for everyone. You feel it or you don’t.

Not at all. My brother 100% could care less whether my mother thought he should marry and procreate. There was zero stigma for him not to.

All the stereotypes are the spinster old cat lady for women that choose not to marry and have children. That does not exit for men.