What is with DCUM women and "mental loads?"

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The mental load placed on women is perpetuated by gender-based expectations of a variety of parties, from parents, to health care providers to school staff, which always call the mother any time there is a problem at school.

If you aren’t smart enough to give them only your spose’s name and number, you deserve it

Oh good grief.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The mental load placed on women is perpetuated by gender-based expectations of a variety of parties, from parents, to health care providers to school staff, which always call the mother any time there is a problem at school.

If you aren’t smart enough to give them only your spose’s name and number, you deserve it

I do give them DH number. They always call the wife first. One of our friends is a stay at home dad-even he noticed this. He had to fight hard to become the default. Another example: how many men’s rooms have a baby changing station in them? Why is that? Again women are viewed as default parent and carry a lot more of caregiving and mental load

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:90 percent of women on my block are SAHMs. My neighbor for instance has one kid at home, an executive husband and she does clean her own house and manage house and makes dinner for three every night. Except weekends.

Her husband works in an office and eats breakfast and lunch there.

So an extra chicken cutlet at dinner time and sex on his birthday is what he gets for sharing his 600k a year salary with her.

She can deal with mental load

I am a lawyer in biglaw and I am constantly told on this board I should quit my job to support my husband’s even more lucrative job instead of expecting him to do half the work. Seeing you frame it as if being a SAHM is a favor men do for their wives is really hilarious. First husbands burn out their working wives by not doing the work, and then when women lean out so it gets done, they’re painted as leeches. Lovely.

This. There are so many men who think women use motherhood as an excuse to get out of working. It’s so weird! I literally don’t know a single woman for who having kids was a chance to do LESS work. It’s an amazing joke. If you have a job, having kids is this intense second shift that is I credibly hard to balance with all but the cushiest working gigs. And if you stay home, you do the work of mom, nanny, and housekeeper. Either way, there is no way it amounts to less work than you were doing before. Even with outsourcing.

The only people who think they will be able to get away with doing the exact same amount of labor after kids as before are men. Snd that expectation is a big part of what drives this.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's not new, and it's not exclusive to DCUM. Who in your household keeps track of birthdays, doctors appointments, clothing sizes, early dismissals, permission slips, camp signups, holiday cards, and meal planning? Does that person also have a paid job?

I do all of this and have a paid job. It's not hard. Why do women seem to struggle with it?

-- Single Dad.

It's much easier if you are single. It's why life is easier if your H travels ALOT!

The problem is that if you have 2 parents, then 2 parents are suppose to parent.

Also, often the other parent has 1/2 the load, they just don't do it. So you are always picking up the slack.

I just do it all and don't expect anything and I'm much happier than women who expect their H's to actually talk to their kids.

Saddest thing on this thread.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:90 percent of women on my block are SAHMs. My neighbor for instance has one kid at home, an executive husband and she does clean her own house and manage house and makes dinner for three every night. Except weekends.

Her husband works in an office and eats breakfast and lunch there.

So an extra chicken cutlet at dinner time and sex on his birthday is what he gets for sharing his 600k a year salary with her.

She can deal with mental load

Exhibit A for why women are underappreciated. This woman cleans, manages a house, parents, cooks and she should be grateful for it!

Sounds like all this man has to do is go to work. I'd rather be the man in this situation. And yes, I also make a good salary.

+1000. I was a SAHM until my youngest went to kindergarten. It was horrible. I love my kids but I also like time alone. Now that I make almost as much as my DH the mental load is equalizing. He really started doing more when I had a high demand/visibility position and just couldn’t anymore.

I think if it is just assumed to be mom’s responsibility, it’s infuriating.

This is why I pretty much refuse to go back to work full-time. My kids are in school, and when my husband makes noises about me going back, I ask him what additional tasks he will do if I do. He replies that he will order our groceries online.

He has no idea on any given week if he will have to leave for work early or stay at work late (attorney) or go meet a client or have some other fire to put out. He’s helpful enough when he’s here but doesn’t give it a second though when he calls to say he will be late. The only way I don’t lose my mind at the inequity is the fact that I don’t also work full time. (I am a sub.) If I did work full time I think I would just be angry at him all the time.

I went back because I like working and feel a level of obligation because I’m a woman in a male dominated industry. Husbands play dumb because it gets them out of stuff. My DH owns a company and he has become aware of the issues women face with kids because I expected him to step up as an equal. In turn, his company policy is much more accommodating to parents.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:90 percent of women on my block are SAHMs. My neighbor for instance has one kid at home, an executive husband and she does clean her own house and manage house and makes dinner for three every night. Except weekends.

Her husband works in an office and eats breakfast and lunch there.

So an extra chicken cutlet at dinner time and sex on his birthday is what he gets for sharing his 600k a year salary with her.

She can deal with mental load

Exhibit A for why women are underappreciated. This woman cleans, manages a house, parents, cooks and she should be grateful for it!

Sounds like all this man has to do is go to work. I'd rather be the man in this situation. And yes, I also make a good salary.

+100

The husband gets acknowledged with his salary and performance reviews as contributing to society and the family, but the wife gets written off as “just” needing to make an extra serving of dinner and putting out once a year. It’s absurd how little respect some men have for the work that goes into housekeeping and caregiving. No wonder some women go live their best lives as divorcees once the kids are grown.

I am a working mom with 3 kids and that means my DH has to take on a lot of household/child duties. In fact, I start work early while DH does all the breakfast, dishwasher unloading, pet feeding, getting kids to their bus stops duty in the morning. This is all before he has even logged onto begin his workday. I then handle the afternoon bus stop pickup, generally doing an activity (like playing outside with neighbors or going to the library), followed by dinner prep/overseeing any homework/packing lunches for the next day, etc. The thought of *only* having a job to worry about and coming home to a hot meal and clean house sounds SO easy. I laugh that this man actually thinks he has the harder job simply being a financial provider. No wonder he only gets laid on his birthday, he totally takes his wife for granted! Whereas others of us outsource things like cleaning and grocery delivery because we realize how valuable those services are!

[Anonymous]

does anyone feel like we are doing carrying the mental load for OP? You all have done all the work for them in spelling out what mental load means!

BTW, in my house, I am playing chicken with the mental load. Oh, you didn't think about what we need to eat for dinner? Oh well, cereal it is. Oh, you didn't think about what to get for your staff for xmas? Yes, gas cards sound just fine. If I don't care, it's not happening. For example, we will probably never go to disney again, because I really don't want to do the planning to go somewhere that I really don't like very much.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Petula Dvorak wrote a tribute to a woman who died recently, and one of the things she/the widower celebrate is how she took care of everything.

This guy was 40 when he got married, so he had handled all his stuff on his own for decades. But as soon as he gets married, he dumps it on his wife.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/dc-md-va/2021/12/13/blind-government-lawyer-disabilities-rights/?%20va._2

Bad case for your argument. She was blind. He did all the cooking, all the driving, etc. They were a team. We could all learn from that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The mental load from being married and raising young kids is the reason I am now blissfully divorced with grown out of the house children, and no one but me understands my current state of bliss.

I cringe at the thought of remarriage. Why would I enter into an arrangement again that is of very limited benefit to me?

Hell, yes! I still have 2 in college , but couldn't agree more and am so happy to not be married.

[Anonymous]

I think some people take on too much of the mental load that isn’t even necessary. I’m sure a lot of this is due to societal pressures but some people are just really uptight and make more work for themselves and their spouse shouldn’t have to carry an equal load. However, naming and having “mental load” as part of a conversation is incredibly crucial in building more equitable and healthy relationships. I’d like to raise my children understanding this concept and I’ve chosen a spouse that has a lot of empathy and wants to build an equitable partnership and family. He has certain responsibilities that match his skills and he has full ownership. Its important to recognize that people have different standards so after agreeing on a general vision, let your partner own their job without criticism.

It’s also important to recognize that we have different values and I have to change my expectations around certain things. For example, he doesn’t agree with the commercialization of holidays like Christmas and he doesn’t care for decorating during the holidays. I care more about Christmas so I will buy and put up the lights and select the decorations I want. I keep it minimal and try to buy sustainable decor because we both agree on that point. He would be perfectly fine without lights and decor or even a tree. This responsibility I’ve freely taken on and enjoy, even though it adds to my mental load. If I expected him to participate 50%, I’m setting myself up for failure. Although he does offer to put up the lights himself, I just choose to do it since I have a particular vision and it frees him up to do things he’s better at, like constant repairs to our house.

[Anonymous]

The mental load is that I planned out the meals for the week (taking into consideration nutrition, balance, price, and everyone's tastes), made the grocery list, ordered them all online, dealt with the "substitutions" etc from instant cart store pick up. It took me a long time and a lot of thought.

THEN I ask my husband to actually go pick up the groceries (ie wait in the car line for like 2 minutes while someone puts the in the trunk) and make one of the 30 minute meals I planned out, and somehow it looks like he is hero who handles all our food and meals. Especially if he calls his mom during all of this and tell her he's picking up groceries and making dinner......

[Anonymous]

I fully respect the concept of the mental load - it is real.

What bothers me about most mental load conversations is it often sounds like working moms reinventing the wheel. We actually had a time where women stayed home and it was understood that what they were doing was important and time consuming. Then in the 70s-90s it was decided that women at home were doing nothing/"baking cookies and having teas." NOW working moms have "discovered" everyting involved with taking care of kids and household and have to tell everyone about it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I think some people take on too much of the mental load that isn’t even necessary. I’m sure a lot of this is due to societal pressures but some people are just really uptight and make more work for themselves and their spouse shouldn’t have to carry an equal load. However, naming and having “mental load” as part of a conversation is incredibly crucial in building more equitable and healthy relationships. I’d like to raise my children understanding this concept and I’ve chosen a spouse that has a lot of empathy and wants to build an equitable partnership and family. He has certain responsibilities that match his skills and he has full ownership. Its important to recognize that people have different standards so after agreeing on a general vision, let your partner own their job without criticism.

It’s also important to recognize that we have different values and I have to change my expectations around certain things. For example, he doesn’t agree with the commercialization of holidays like Christmas and he doesn’t care for decorating during the holidays. I care more about Christmas so I will buy and put up the lights and select the decorations I want. I keep it minimal and try to buy sustainable decor because we both agree on that point. He would be perfectly fine without lights and decor or even a tree. This responsibility I’ve freely taken on and enjoy, even though it adds to my mental load. If I expected him to participate 50%, I’m setting myself up for failure. Although he does offer to put up the lights himself, I just choose to do it since I have a particular vision and it frees him up to do things he’s better at, like constant repairs to our house.

There is much truth in what you wrote. Well done. We have a similar take on Christmas on our marriage, with me taking on the load because it matters more to me. At the same time, telling women that they value things that shouldn't be valued is a cop-out. If I want to put up the Christmas lights, that's on me. But if I do it while I'm also doing 90% of the housework, this might be a time when DH needs to step up in other areas. Too often in marriages, men discount women's load by designating the things they value as unimportant. If there is an even division of responsibilities, then maybe one spouse can take on additional things that the other doesn't value. However, when there's not, the fact that one spouse bears the majority of responsibilities should not be a ticket to refusing to pitch in when the spouse's additional priorities make their shaie unworkable.

[Anonymous]

Mental load used to be called emotional labor, no? Emotional labor doesn't really exist for men. More physical labor for women is a thing too, where men will passive aggressively screw up something just to get out of doing it. Why else do men buy the wrong thing when sent to the grocery store?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The mental load is that I planned out the meals for the week (taking into consideration nutrition, balance, price, and everyone's tastes), made the grocery list, ordered them all online, dealt with the "substitutions" etc from instant cart store pick up. It took me a long time and a lot of thought.

THEN I ask my husband to actually go pick up the groceries (ie wait in the car line for like 2 minutes while someone puts the in the trunk) and make one of the 30 minute meals I planned out, and somehow it looks like he is hero who handles all our food and meals. Especially if he calls his mom during all of this and tell her he's picking up groceries and making dinner......

Ha tell him next time to pay for blue apron and call his mom about that.

But this actually might be a cool way to split things up, I’ll keep it in mind.