“You love them more than me now.” PPD in men.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP again.

I was not sure on the science behind PPD and men. I’ve read a few studies stating that some men have changed in hormones to reflect their partners during pregnancy and can have PPD. It may be BS. So let’s just say DH has a long history of depression and mental illness and that the birth of our twins seems to have created a downward spiral for him. Maybe not PPD but a depressive episode triggered by adjusting to life with newborn twins.

No, the silent treatment is not normal for him. I don’t consider him selfish or a “man baby”. I consider him highly sensitive and that’s one of the reasons I love him. I know that I’m the stronger of the two of us emotionally and for our relationship I’m usually the one he can rely on but he has supported me emotionally, mentally etc plenty of times.

He’s in a bad headspace and I wish I could help but I’m truly so exhausted I can barely function and unfortunately at the moment I cannot be his support system. I was looking for advice on anyone who has had a spouse in the same place and what seemed to help. Thank you to the users who mentioned going ahead and getting a nanny now. I’m also trying to find a parental support group for new fathers. I think talking to other men in similar situations will help.

I have been in your situation and you are being abused by your husband right now you are in the #2 of the abuse cycle.

Just because he has depression means it is okay for him to abuse you. It might be his excuse or point to what needs to change but it's not okay.

You can't support somebody out of depression and allowing his abuse is enabling it.

He needs to talk to his therapist and you need to stand up for yourself when he makes unreasonable requests. It's okay if that upsets him, it's up to him to work that out with his therapist.

Does this cycle seem familiar... if not yet, watch out for it. The cycle may be weekly/monthly/yearly... every abuser is different. The longer 3 and 4 last and when 1 and 2 are short, women explain it away as a normal cycle, but it's not.

Omg go stuff it. I'm sorry if you were abused but NOTHING OP has said about her husband implies she is being abused.

UM not sure where you got, I am abused. But the cycle starts somewhere. I stopped it when my H said... "you are putting the kids first" which is stage 2 of the cycle... dude get therapy... I am not your mama.

What the H is saying and doing to her is abuse.. but go ahead baby your man.

I assumed you were abused because you said "I have been in your situation and you are being abused".

OP has not described abuse. Men do have feelings and can express them without being man babies.

No. I said my H said he was overwhelmed and felt jealous of the children in a non-blaming, concerning way that made us get him therapy. He knew it was not a normal way to feel just like a mom with PPD know not feeling love or connection to a new born is not normal.

Yes. The OP's H is abusive.

Stage 1: Tension: From OP's post ....However emotionally/mentally he is elsewhere and has been ultra emotional and needy
Stage 2: Incident (emotional abuse, blaming) From OP's post ... He got really upset .....I received the silent treatment. he said I don’t love him as much anymore, that I love the babies more, that I’m not emotionally supporting him enough anymore He mentioned he resents the babies and that they stole me from him.

This is NOT normal

Normal is... Hey I am struggling with how much work this is can we get a nanny. My depression is really bad right now and I know you are busy with the newborns I am going to see my therapist twice a week not once.

The top... abusive.
The bottom... normal man expressing his feeling

It makes me sad that so many people think "really upset" "silent treatment" "says I don't love him anymore" "resents the baby" is NORMAL way to express emotions. It's not healthy and it may be "normal" to you because that is how men in your life express their feelings.

No you didn't say that at all. What you said was:

I have been in your situation and you are being abused by your husband right now you are in the #2 of the abuse cycle.

Just because he has depression means it is okay for him to abuse you. It might be his excuse or point to what needs to change but it's not okay.

You can't support somebody out of depression and allowing his abuse is enabling it.

He needs to talk to his therapist and you need to stand up for yourself when he makes unreasonable requests. It's okay if that upsets him, it's up to him to work that out with his therapist.

Does this cycle seem familiar... if not yet, watch out for it. The cycle may be weekly/monthly/yearly... every abuser is different. The longer 3 and 4 last and when 1 and 2 are short, women explain it away as a normal cycle, but it's not.

Everything is on a scale. Of course dumping all your emotions on your partner CAN be abusive when taken to the extreme. A new dad 7 weeks in with twins expressing depression to his wife is not that.

You are being totally over the top and straight up lying about your previous posts. I think someone is trolling this thread and I'm going to ask Jeff about it.

No I did not lie, you made assumptions. Nothing you highlighted shows I said my H abused me.

OP has not even weighed in... does he cycle like this.. has this happened before... does he lash out and then go on good behavior, are there times of tension.

I doubt this cycle is new for her. Not uncommon with depression.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wow this thread is like a PSA for how dismissive people are of mental health issues in this country.

It's super scary how cavalier people are about saying OP married a "man-baby" instead of offering helpful advice to a new mom of 2 month old twins about how she can better support her struggling partner. Oy.

Seriously! OP is doing the right thing by asking for help to improve both their lives. I shudder to think what these posters relationships are like with their own husbands. Poor guys.

Really trying to follow the logic here. If your husband didn't resent his own kids and lash out at you during your post-partum recovery, you must be a harpy? I feel like you're setting a really low bar.

OP: you said your DH is already in therapy. Start there. Ask him to schedule an emergency session to talk about these issues. He's already articulated it to you; let him do it to a professional who can actually help, not the only person in the world more sleep-deprived than he is.

The logic is that her DH is being honest about his feelings. That is not lashing out (not her words or story) and not being abusive in any way shape or form. Just being human. Guess what? Lots of parents resent their newborns, men and women. OP is doing the right thing by trying to address is and get help. You know what is NOT helpful? Telling her her husband is being a man baby and should suck it up, or telling her he is abusive. That's insane and dramatic for the sole reason of getting these responders off. They love the drama.

[Anonymous]

Wow she should clearly leave her husband. Is that what you all want? If you can't contribute anything more constructive than "tell you whiny man baby pansy husband to suck it up" just butt out.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP again.

I was not sure on the science behind PPD and men. I’ve read a few studies stating that some men have changed in hormones to reflect their partners during pregnancy and can have PPD. It may be BS. So let’s just say DH has a long history of depression and mental illness and that the birth of our twins seems to have created a downward spiral for him. Maybe not PPD but a depressive episode triggered by adjusting to life with newborn twins.

No, the silent treatment is not normal for him. I don’t consider him selfish or a “man baby”. I consider him highly sensitive and that’s one of the reasons I love him. I know that I’m the stronger of the two of us emotionally and for our relationship I’m usually the one he can rely on but he has supported me emotionally, mentally etc plenty of times.

He’s in a bad headspace and I wish I could help but I’m truly so exhausted I can barely function and unfortunately at the moment I cannot be his support system. I was looking for advice on anyone who has had a spouse in the same place and what seemed to help. Thank you to the users who mentioned going ahead and getting a nanny now. I’m also trying to find a parental support group for new fathers. I think talking to other men in similar situations will help.

I have been in your situation and you are being abused by your husband right now you are in the #2 of the abuse cycle.

Just because he has depression means it is okay for him to abuse you. It might be his excuse or point to what needs to change but it's not okay.

You can't support somebody out of depression and allowing his abuse is enabling it.

He needs to talk to his therapist and you need to stand up for yourself when he makes unreasonable requests. It's okay if that upsets him, it's up to him to work that out with his therapist.

Does this cycle seem familiar... if not yet, watch out for it. The cycle may be weekly/monthly/yearly... every abuser is different. The longer 3 and 4 last and when 1 and 2 are short, women explain it away as a normal cycle, but it's not.

Omg go stuff it. I'm sorry if you were abused but NOTHING OP has said about her husband implies she is being abused.

UM not sure where you got, I am abused. But the cycle starts somewhere. I stopped it when my H said... "you are putting the kids first" which is stage 2 of the cycle... dude get therapy... I am not your mama.

What the H is saying and doing to her is abuse.. but go ahead baby your man.

I assumed you were abused because you said "I have been in your situation and you are being abused".

OP has not described abuse. Men do have feelings and can express them without being man babies.

No. I said my H said he was overwhelmed and felt jealous of the children in a non-blaming, concerning way that made us get him therapy. He knew it was not a normal way to feel just like a mom with PPD know not feeling love or connection to a new born is not normal.

Yes. The OP's H is abusive.

Stage 1: Tension: From OP's post ....However emotionally/mentally he is elsewhere and has been ultra emotional and needy
Stage 2: Incident (emotional abuse, blaming) From OP's post ... He got really upset .....I received the silent treatment. he said I don’t love him as much anymore, that I love the babies more, that I’m not emotionally supporting him enough anymore He mentioned he resents the babies and that they stole me from him.

This is NOT normal

Normal is... Hey I am struggling with how much work this is can we get a nanny. My depression is really bad right now and I know you are busy with the newborns I am going to see my therapist twice a week not once.

The top... abusive.
The bottom... normal man expressing his feeling

It makes me sad that so many people think "really upset" "silent treatment" "says I don't love him anymore" "resents the baby" is NORMAL way to express emotions. It's not healthy and it may be "normal" to you because that is how men in your life express their feelings.

No you didn't say that at all. What you said was:

I have been in your situation and you are being abused by your husband right now you are in the #2 of the abuse cycle.

Just because he has depression means it is okay for him to abuse you. It might be his excuse or point to what needs to change but it's not okay.

You can't support somebody out of depression and allowing his abuse is enabling it.

He needs to talk to his therapist and you need to stand up for yourself when he makes unreasonable requests. It's okay if that upsets him, it's up to him to work that out with his therapist.

Does this cycle seem familiar... if not yet, watch out for it. The cycle may be weekly/monthly/yearly... every abuser is different. The longer 3 and 4 last and when 1 and 2 are short, women explain it away as a normal cycle, but it's not.

Everything is on a scale. Of course dumping all your emotions on your partner CAN be abusive when taken to the extreme. A new dad 7 weeks in with twins expressing depression to his wife is not that.

You are being totally over the top and straight up lying about your previous posts. I think someone is trolling this thread and I'm going to ask Jeff about it.

No I did not lie, you made assumptions. Nothing you highlighted shows I said my H abused me.

OP has not even weighed in... does he cycle like this.. has this happened before... does he lash out and then go on good behavior, are there times of tension.

I doubt this cycle is new for her. Not uncommon with depression.

Do you speak english? I think you need to take a class in logical structure.

OP: Has anyone experienced X? What did you think about or do about X?

Poster: I have experienced X. You are being Y-ed.

DP: PP I'm sorry if you were Y-ed and think that experiencing X means you are being Y-ed but I disagree that X necessarily means Y.

Poster: Where on earth did I say I was being Y-ed you are leaping to ridiculous conclusions.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Can we stop with the “DH is suffering from PPD as well” concerns. It’s insulting to someone who actually did suffer from PPD which is directly triggered from the hormonal flux of childbirth, which is an experience unique only to women. So tired of these whiny man-babies having to claim all of our hardships as well.

https://www.pnas.org/content/108/39/16194
-study of impact fatherhood (including impact shortly after baby is born) has on testosterone.
Low testosterone has been linked to depression.
Obviously less dramatic than what happens to women.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wow this thread is like a PSA for how dismissive people are of mental health issues in this country.

It's super scary how cavalier people are about saying OP married a "man-baby" instead of offering helpful advice to a new mom of 2 month old twins about how she can better support her struggling partner. Oy.

Yea. a mom of newborn twins also now has to help her "struggling" husband. If he has serious mental health issues, tell him to go see a shrink. But, the title of the thread makes me think he is a man-baby. "“You love them more than me now" is something a toddler would say about his newborn siblings. Sorry.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wow this thread is like a PSA for how dismissive people are of mental health issues in this country.

It's super scary how cavalier people are about saying OP married a "man-baby" instead of offering helpful advice to a new mom of 2 month old twins about how she can better support her struggling partner. Oy.

Yea. a mom of newborn twins also now has to help her "struggling" husband. If he has serious mental health issues, tell him to go see a shrink. But, the title of the thread makes me think he is a man-baby. "“You love them more than me now" is something a toddler would say about his newborn siblings. Sorry.

You're not sorry.

+1. This is a well known issue in marriages after kids. Husbands feel replaced. Working through it constructively is in everyone's best interest.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I gave birth to my twins 7 weeks ago and it’s been a whirlwind. We were very blessed with an amazing delivery and only 3 days spent in the hospital. No NICU!

Both babies are fussy eaters and generally high needs and it’s been totally exhausting and we never sleep and obviously my entire life is now dedicated to keeping these two screaming mandrakes alive and relatively happy.

DH is sensitive and has been a great help. He physically is here with me. Helping with feeds, getting up a few times a night, changing diapers etc, I’m lucky.
However emotionally/mentally he is elsewhere and has been ultra emotional and needy and I feel awful but I’m just too tired trying to heal and survive to be there like I could before our babies. He got really upset this weekend because we had a date night planned. One of our twins got sick (vomiting) and I freaked and canceled and then received the silent treatment. Baby was fine but I finally got him to open up and he said I don’t love him as much anymore, that I love the babies more, that I’m not emotionally supporting him enough anymore (which is true) because he’s struggling with the babies and needs help. He mentioned he resents the babies and that they stole me from him. As I said, he’s very sensitive but I found these comments out of character and wonder if he’s suffering from PPD? I know it happens.

How can I support him while barely being able to support myself? Any resources? He goes to therapy but I’m not sure if he’s mentioned this to his therapist. Has anyone had a spouse suffer PPD?

I'm sorry, but he sounds way too needy to be having children. Please don't have anymore with him. I don't think he can handle it.

You're barely able to support you, let alone him. Yes, he needs to work it out with his therapist.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP again.

I was not sure on the science behind PPD and men. I’ve read a few studies stating that some men have changed in hormones to reflect their partners during pregnancy and can have PPD. It may be BS. So let’s just say DH has a long history of depression and mental illness and that the birth of our twins seems to have created a downward spiral for him. Maybe not PPD but a depressive episode triggered by adjusting to life with newborn twins.

No, the silent treatment is not normal for him. I don’t consider him selfish or a “man baby”. I consider him highly sensitive and that’s one of the reasons I love him. I know that I’m the stronger of the two of us emotionally and for our relationship I’m usually the one he can rely on but he has supported me emotionally, mentally etc plenty of times.

He’s in a bad headspace and I wish I could help but I’m truly so exhausted I can barely function and unfortunately at the moment I cannot be his support system. I was looking for advice on anyone who has had a spouse in the same place and what seemed to help. Thank you to the users who mentioned going ahead and getting a nanny now. I’m also trying to find a parental support group for new fathers. I think talking to other men in similar situations will help.

-Get the nanny now
-Insist that he discuss this issue with his therapist
-Raise the issue of meds/TMS/something else, at least temporarily

Here's the thing: you won't able to be his support system anymore. Not the way you used to. Your children will need to be your emotional priority from here on out, and so you need a plan for him getting the emotional support he needs from someone other than you. With parenting comes a massive shift in roles, and this one is a biggie. Even if the newborn haze is getting to him, you both will need to readjust your dynamic to make sure the kids get the attention they need.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP again.

I was not sure on the science behind PPD and men. I’ve read a few studies stating that some men have changed in hormones to reflect their partners during pregnancy and can have PPD. It may be BS. So let’s just say DH has a long history of depression and mental illness and that the birth of our twins seems to have created a downward spiral for him. Maybe not PPD but a depressive episode triggered by adjusting to life with newborn twins.

No, the silent treatment is not normal for him. I don’t consider him selfish or a “man baby”. I consider him highly sensitive and that’s one of the reasons I love him. I know that I’m the stronger of the two of us emotionally and for our relationship I’m usually the one he can rely on but he has supported me emotionally, mentally etc plenty of times.

He’s in a bad headspace and I wish I could help but I’m truly so exhausted I can barely function and unfortunately at the moment I cannot be his support system. I was looking for advice on anyone who has had a spouse in the same place and what seemed to help. Thank you to the users who mentioned going ahead and getting a nanny now. I’m also trying to find a parental support group for new fathers. I think talking to other men in similar situations will help.

-Get the nanny now
-Insist that he discuss this issue with his therapist
-Raise the issue of meds/TMS/something else, at least temporarily

Here's the thing: you won't able to be his support system anymore. Not the way you used to. Your children will need to be your emotional priority from here on out, and so you need a plan for him getting the emotional support he needs from someone other than you. With parenting comes a massive shift in roles, and this one is a biggie. Even if the newborn haze is getting to him, you both will need to readjust your dynamic to make sure the kids get the attention they need.

I basically agree with you but I don't think the bolded has to be true. My DH and I are still each other's best friends and emotional support (had two under two and now number three is imminent two years later).

Sure we have a little less bandwidth, but we make time for each other. OP's DH definitely needs to seek professional help, but I don't think you just have to do everything on your own after you have kids. Part of being married is being there for each other, even after kids.

[Anonymous]

Lol at the idea of a date night winner you have seven week old twins.


Is he old?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wow this thread is like a PSA for how dismissive people are of mental health issues in this country.

It's super scary how cavalier people are about saying OP married a "man-baby" instead of offering helpful advice to a new mom of 2 month old twins about how she can better support her struggling partner. Oy.

Seriously! OP is doing the right thing by asking for help to improve both their lives. I shudder to think what these posters relationships are like with their own husbands. Poor guys.

Really trying to follow the logic here. If your husband didn't resent his own kids and lash out at you during your post-partum recovery, you must be a harpy? I feel like you're setting a really low bar.

OP: you said your DH is already in therapy. Start there. Ask him to schedule an emergency session to talk about these issues. He's already articulated it to you; let him do it to a professional who can actually help, not the only person in the world more sleep-deprived than he is.

7 weeks into life with newborn twins her husband had a bad few days.

I resent my newborns at 7 weeks every time. 7 weeks sucks. They aren't sleeping, they aren't smiling, they are take take take and you're freaking exhausted. I can only imagine that being magnified exponentially with twins.

I think its telling that all of you are seeing this as lashing out instead of just like...having a hard time. OP never used to the words lashed out. OP is worried about him and OP is the only person this thread that actually knows him.

She did not use the words "lash out" but she did list seven separate complaints that he made to her, all after she had to coax him to talk to her after being cold-shouldered for prioritizing a sick newborn over a date night. Yes OP is worried about him, but some of us are worried about OP. As she admitted in a follow-up, she's barely able to keep her own head above water, let alone be made responsible for the emotional well-being of a man who already has a therapist.

I stand by my recommendation. He has a therapist. He needs to go talk to this therapist. He needs to seek help that is readily available to him, much more so than it would be to a person who had to find someone new/taking patients/uses your insurance.

OP is used to being her husband's rock and apparently he just expects she will always prioritize him above everything, including the health of her children and her own health. I recognize that OP is trying to uphold what she sees as her end of this relationship - coax him into opening up, find a solution for him even if it means braving the waters of DCUM, try to make him feel better. I think that's unhealthy for her and she needs him to step up. That's not the same as calling him a man-baby but I can see where those people are standing from here. It's one thing to expect support from your spouse but it's another to take take take and never recognize when the well is dry.

This is very wise. OP and her husband reminds neighbor the giving tree story. She’s recovering from giving birth to twins and instead of getting support from her spouse she’s depleting herself trying to support him.

This is not sustainable. There are certain situations where it’s not okay to keep taking. There are two vulnerable newborns who need OP. If she keeps running on fumes, who’s going to take care of them???

This is a very bad situation. Her DH needs to lean on his therapist not on OP.

[Anonymous]

Yes to getting the nanny now. When I went to get therapy for PPD, that was the first recommendation the therapist made. I didn't follow it, but I should have. I did get some babysitting starting at 3 weeks so I could take a walk and go to the gym a few times a week, which was crucial.

Yes to insisting on therapy for your DH, and then couples therapy for both of you. My STBX DH adjusted horribly to parenthood (in a different way than yours) and by failing to address it, our relationship was ruined.

Finally, do you have any family or friends that you really trust who could fly in for a few days - weeks to keep you company?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP again.

I was not sure on the science behind PPD and men. I’ve read a few studies stating that some men have changed in hormones to reflect their partners during pregnancy and can have PPD. It may be BS. So let’s just say DH has a long history of depression and mental illness and that the birth of our twins seems to have created a downward spiral for him. Maybe not PPD but a depressive episode triggered by adjusting to life with newborn twins.

No, the silent treatment is not normal for him. I don’t consider him selfish or a “man baby”. I consider him highly sensitive and that’s one of the reasons I love him. I know that I’m the stronger of the two of us emotionally and for our relationship I’m usually the one he can rely on but he has supported me emotionally, mentally etc plenty of times.

He’s in a bad headspace and I wish I could help but I’m truly so exhausted I can barely function and unfortunately at the moment I cannot be his support system. I was looking for advice on anyone who has had a spouse in the same place and what seemed to help. Thank you to the users who mentioned going ahead and getting a nanny now. I’m also trying to find a parental support group for new fathers. I think talking to other men in similar situations will help.

-Get the nanny now
-Insist that he discuss this issue with his therapist
-Raise the issue of meds/TMS/something else, at least temporarily

Here's the thing: you won't able to be his support system anymore. Not the way you used to. Your children will need to be your emotional priority from here on out, and so you need a plan for him getting the emotional support he needs from someone other than you. With parenting comes a massive shift in roles, and this one is a biggie. Even if the newborn haze is getting to him, you both will need to readjust your dynamic to make sure the kids get the attention they need.

And this is why marriages fail and children today have become spoiled entitled brats. Your spouse, especially your provider, should always be number one.

[Anonymous]

I have twins and agree with all the people saying you need some help if your husband is in this place. If you can get a nanny early, go for it. You're both in the trenches now and just need to focus on getting through the next few months. You can work out what marriage plus kids looks like for you guys after the babies get a little bigger and you've both gotten some sleep. This is not the time to make any big decisions or start battles that don't need to be fought now.

OP, are you in the DC area? There are a bunch of groups for parents of multiples and they are very supportive. Even just knowing that other people got through this time can help!