Poor American kids in Florida to take immigrant jobs

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This law would apply to HOMESCHOOLED CHILDREN ONLY. Look it up.

In that case, I see nothing wrong with it, though I would not allow my own kids to work overnights.

I worked 15-20 hours a week starting at 16 (and usually more in the summers). I balanced school, a school sport, marching band, and my PT job as a grocery store cashier just fine. It was good for me (taught me great time management skills) and I needed the money to help pay for upcoming college expenses.

Are you dense? No one is talking about the merits of teenagers having jobs. They are talking about rolling back worker protections and allowing 14 year olds to work oversight, leaving them open to the predation and danger that happens when you work at jobs at 1 am.

Honestly, people in this thread and others today are so dumb. Just the way MAGA likes their voters.

+1

I can’t believe all stupid people in this thread defending this $&it. These jobs will be taken mostly by low income POC. Specifically girls. But of course this would never affect the DCUM crowd because they would never allow their kids to do this, or be in a position forced to do this. And the fact that so many don’t see the trickle down effect is astounding. I thought this country cared about its children? This sad. Set aside the work part, are you also okay with kids not getting a break to eat during an 8 hour shift? Most of you would quit jobs if they don’t allow coffee runs while on the clock.


Example of the trickle down. In Memphis Tn, FedEx during the mid 80s, started hiring college students during the Christmas season to sort millions of packages on the overnight 10pm to 6am shift, the pay was significantly above minimum wage. Back then they also offered about $500 a year for tuition reimbursement, so it was a great recruiting tool. As FedEx grew, they started hiring students to work year around. The University of Memphis (Memphis State) had over 22% students of color (meaning African American) drop out after only working for FedEx for 8 months, 17% decrease in college applications from Memphis area AA high school students. Understandably, most are now 18, and can decide for themselves, but most came from low income families that needed them to contribute to their household. Instead of attempting to get an education/complete their education, they started working for FEDEX because it paid good money. It took Memphis nearly 20 (around 2003) years to recover from this deficit and get the percentages back up to where they were in the 1980’s regarding college applications from families making less than $30,000 annually (including non-POC families). Even with high paying jobs from FEDEX and UPS, Memphis consistently ranks in the top 5 for violent crime. Now of course FEDEX wasn’t the main factor in these drops, and I’m not blaming FEDEX at all. (My mother worked there for over 30 years, actually worked for Fred Smith in the early years.)And of course I’m probably leaving out nuances from the study conducted by U of M, but it clearly laid out when lower income young adults, especially AA males, joined the work force from high school or while in college, they don’t go/go back to college. Thankfully, FedEx has made significant inroads in keeping the enrollment up for college student workers by better managing the shifts of that demographic and incentives to stay in school.

Saying this to say, many times when kids on the fringe start working, they often push education to the back burner because they’ve become dependent on the money.

Thank you for bringing data and evidence to this discussion. Very powerful.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This law would apply to HOMESCHOOLED CHILDREN ONLY. Look it up.

In that case, I see nothing wrong with it, though I would not allow my own kids to work overnights.

I worked 15-20 hours a week starting at 16 (and usually more in the summers). I balanced school, a school sport, marching band, and my PT job as a grocery store cashier just fine. It was good for me (taught me great time management skills) and I needed the money to help pay for upcoming college expenses.

Are you dense? No one is talking about the merits of teenagers having jobs. They are talking about rolling back worker protections and allowing 14 year olds to work oversight, leaving them open to the predation and danger that happens when you work at jobs at 1 am.

Boy those goal posts that you're moving must be heavy.

Again... Federal labor laws prohibit 14 year olds from working more than a certain number of hours per day and week. It also prohibits them from working in certain dangerous jobs.

Except, everyone who enforces federal labors laws has been fired. Remember?

Okay, sure everyone who enforces it has been fired. So why are you so worked up? No one is going to enforce federal labor laws anyway no matter what Florida does!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This law would apply to HOMESCHOOLED CHILDREN ONLY. Look it up.

In that case, I see nothing wrong with it, though I would not allow my own kids to work overnights.

I worked 15-20 hours a week starting at 16 (and usually more in the summers). I balanced school, a school sport, marching band, and my PT job as a grocery store cashier just fine. It was good for me (taught me great time management skills) and I needed the money to help pay for upcoming college expenses.

Are you dense? No one is talking about the merits of teenagers having jobs. They are talking about rolling back worker protections and allowing 14 year olds to work oversight, leaving them open to the predation and danger that happens when you work at jobs at 1 am.

Honestly, people in this thread and others today are so dumb. Just the way MAGA likes their voters.

+1

I can’t believe all stupid people in this thread defending this $&it. These jobs will be taken mostly by low income POC. Specifically girls. But of course this would never affect the DCUM crowd because they would never allow their kids to do this, or be in a position forced to do this. And the fact that so many don’t see the trickle down effect is astounding. I thought this country cared about its children? This sad. Set aside the work part, are you also okay with kids not getting a break to eat during an 8 hour shift? Most of you would quit jobs if they don’t allow coffee runs while on the clock.


Example of the trickle down. In Memphis Tn, FedEx during the mid 80s, started hiring college students during the Christmas season to sort millions of packages on the overnight 10pm to 6am shift, the pay was significantly above minimum wage. Back then they also offered about $500 a year for tuition reimbursement, so it was a great recruiting tool. As FedEx grew, they started hiring students to work year around. The University of Memphis (Memphis State) had over 22% students of color (meaning African American) drop out after only working for FedEx for 8 months, 17% decrease in college applications from Memphis area AA high school students. Understandably, most are now 18, and can decide for themselves, but most came from low income families that needed them to contribute to their household. Instead of attempting to get an education/complete their education, they started working for FEDEX because it paid good money. It took Memphis nearly 20 (around 2003) years to recover from this deficit and get the percentages back up to where they were in the 1980’s regarding college applications from families making less than $30,000 annually (including non-POC families). Even with high paying jobs from FEDEX and UPS, Memphis consistently ranks in the top 5 for violent crime. Now of course FEDEX wasn’t the main factor in these drops, and I’m not blaming FEDEX at all. (My mother worked there for over 30 years, actually worked for Fred Smith in the early years.)And of course I’m probably leaving out nuances from the study conducted by U of M, but it clearly laid out when lower income young adults, especially AA males, joined the work force from high school or while in college, they don’t go/go back to college. Thankfully, FedEx has made significant inroads in keeping the enrollment up for college student workers by better managing the shifts of that demographic and incentives to stay in school.

Saying this to say, many times when kids on the fringe start working, they often push education to the back burner because they’ve become dependent on the money.

Thank you for bringing data and evidence to this discussion. Very powerful.

Some of you will lap up anything you agree with.
College tuition and expenses are no longer 1980s prices. Its okay for people to work hourly jobs. Truly.
Some times this DCUM bubble is hilarious and sometimes it's frightening how out of touch some of you are with life outside the beltway.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This law would apply to HOMESCHOOLED CHILDREN ONLY. Look it up.

In that case, I see nothing wrong with it, though I would not allow my own kids to work overnights.

I worked 15-20 hours a week starting at 16 (and usually more in the summers). I balanced school, a school sport, marching band, and my PT job as a grocery store cashier just fine. It was good for me (taught me great time management skills) and I needed the money to help pay for upcoming college expenses.

Are you dense? No one is talking about the merits of teenagers having jobs. They are talking about rolling back worker protections and allowing 14 year olds to work oversight, leaving them open to the predation and danger that happens when you work at jobs at 1 am.

Honestly, people in this thread and others today are so dumb. Just the way MAGA likes their voters.

+1

All fine with kids going out unsupervised at night and getting into trouble, immature brains and all, but the horror if they have a job.

You're being deliberately obtuse, because there is no defending it. This law is about allowing 8th graders to work full time graveyard shifts on school nights, the kind of jobs immigrants used to do, because they can't find adults willing to do it. It's about exploiting poor and vulnerable kids. It's not about baby sitting or part time jobs at the mall, which the kids are already allowed to do.

This entire post is hyperbolic and stupid. 14 years olds will not legally be able to work overnight shifts. Federal law prohibits this.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This law would apply to HOMESCHOOLED CHILDREN ONLY. Look it up.

In that case, I see nothing wrong with it, though I would not allow my own kids to work overnights.

I worked 15-20 hours a week starting at 16 (and usually more in the summers). I balanced school, a school sport, marching band, and my PT job as a grocery store cashier just fine. It was good for me (taught me great time management skills) and I needed the money to help pay for upcoming college expenses.

Are you dense? No one is talking about the merits of teenagers having jobs. They are talking about rolling back worker protections and allowing 14 year olds to work oversight, leaving them open to the predation and danger that happens when you work at jobs at 1 am.

Honestly, people in this thread and others today are so dumb. Just the way MAGA likes their voters.

+1

All fine with kids going out unsupervised at night and getting into trouble, immature brains and all, but the horror if they have a job.

You're being deliberately obtuse, because there is no defending it. This law is about allowing 8th graders to work full time graveyard shifts on school nights, the kind of jobs immigrants used to do, because they can't find adults willing to do it. It's about exploiting poor and vulnerable kids. It's not about baby sitting or part time jobs at the mall, which the kids are already allowed to do.

This entire post is hyperbolic and stupid. 14 years olds will not legally be able to work overnight shifts. Federal law prohibits this.

Can't you read? This is literally what the Florida legislature is proposing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This law would apply to HOMESCHOOLED CHILDREN ONLY. Look it up.

In that case, I see nothing wrong with it, though I would not allow my own kids to work overnights.

I worked 15-20 hours a week starting at 16 (and usually more in the summers). I balanced school, a school sport, marching band, and my PT job as a grocery store cashier just fine. It was good for me (taught me great time management skills) and I needed the money to help pay for upcoming college expenses.

Are you dense? No one is talking about the merits of teenagers having jobs. They are talking about rolling back worker protections and allowing 14 year olds to work oversight, leaving them open to the predation and danger that happens when you work at jobs at 1 am.

Honestly, people in this thread and others today are so dumb. Just the way MAGA likes their voters.

+1

All fine with kids going out unsupervised at night and getting into trouble, immature brains and all, but the horror if they have a job.

You're being deliberately obtuse, because there is no defending it. This law is about allowing 8th graders to work full time graveyard shifts on school nights, the kind of jobs immigrants used to do, because they can't find adults willing to do it. It's about exploiting poor and vulnerable kids. It's not about baby sitting or part time jobs at the mall, which the kids are already allowed to do.

This entire post is hyperbolic and stupid. 14 years olds will not legally be able to work overnight shifts. Federal law prohibits this.

Can't you read? This is literally what the Florida legislature is proposing.

FEDERAL LAW... you know what nevermind... Go sit at the kids table and read about the supremecy clause and child labor laws under FLSA.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This law would apply to HOMESCHOOLED CHILDREN ONLY. Look it up.

In that case, I see nothing wrong with it, though I would not allow my own kids to work overnights.

I worked 15-20 hours a week starting at 16 (and usually more in the summers). I balanced school, a school sport, marching band, and my PT job as a grocery store cashier just fine. It was good for me (taught me great time management skills) and I needed the money to help pay for upcoming college expenses.

Are you dense? No one is talking about the merits of teenagers having jobs. They are talking about rolling back worker protections and allowing 14 year olds to work oversight, leaving them open to the predation and danger that happens when you work at jobs at 1 am.

Honestly, people in this thread and others today are so dumb. Just the way MAGA likes their voters.

+1

All fine with kids going out unsupervised at night and getting into trouble, immature brains and all, but the horror if they have a job.

You're being deliberately obtuse, because there is no defending it. This law is about allowing 8th graders to work full time graveyard shifts on school nights, the kind of jobs immigrants used to do, because they can't find adults willing to do it. It's about exploiting poor and vulnerable kids. It's not about baby sitting or part time jobs at the mall, which the kids are already allowed to do.

This entire post is hyperbolic and stupid. 14 years olds will not legally be able to work overnight shifts. Federal law prohibits this.

Can't you read? This is literally what the Florida legislature is proposing.

FEDERAL LAW... you know what nevermind... Go sit at the kids table and read about the supremecy clause and child labor laws under FLSA.

https://www.cbsnews.com/amp/miami/news/florida-senate-panel-advances-bill-to-further-roll-back-child-labor-restrictions/

Do you mean “supremacy”? The MAGA are insisting that having teens work overnight aligns with federal standards. So like so many things in Trumpland, you end up hoping that the courts will strike it down?

Supporters say the bill aligns with federal standards

Bill sponsor state Rep. Jay Collins, R-Tampa, told the Senate Commerce and Tourism Committee that the bill would bring Florida into line with federal labor laws. Most of the jobs held by teens are in safe environments such as grocery stores, according to Collins.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This law would apply to HOMESCHOOLED CHILDREN ONLY. Look it up.

In that case, I see nothing wrong with it, though I would not allow my own kids to work overnights.

I worked 15-20 hours a week starting at 16 (and usually more in the summers). I balanced school, a school sport, marching band, and my PT job as a grocery store cashier just fine. It was good for me (taught me great time management skills) and I needed the money to help pay for upcoming college expenses.

Are you dense? No one is talking about the merits of teenagers having jobs. They are talking about rolling back worker protections and allowing 14 year olds to work oversight, leaving them open to the predation and danger that happens when you work at jobs at 1 am.

Honestly, people in this thread and others today are so dumb. Just the way MAGA likes their voters.

+1

I can’t believe all stupid people in this thread defending this $&it. These jobs will be taken mostly by low income POC. Specifically girls. But of course this would never affect the DCUM crowd because they would never allow their kids to do this, or be in a position forced to do this. And the fact that so many don’t see the trickle down effect is astounding. I thought this country cared about its children? This sad. Set aside the work part, are you also okay with kids not getting a break to eat during an 8 hour shift? Most of you would quit jobs if they don’t allow coffee runs while on the clock.


Example of the trickle down. In Memphis Tn, FedEx during the mid 80s, started hiring college students during the Christmas season to sort millions of packages on the overnight 10pm to 6am shift, the pay was significantly above minimum wage. Back then they also offered about $500 a year for tuition reimbursement, so it was a great recruiting tool. As FedEx grew, they started hiring students to work year around. The University of Memphis (Memphis State) had over 22% students of color (meaning African American) drop out after only working for FedEx for 8 months, 17% decrease in college applications from Memphis area AA high school students. Understandably, most are now 18, and can decide for themselves, but most came from low income families that needed them to contribute to their household. Instead of attempting to get an education/complete their education, they started working for FEDEX because it paid good money. It took Memphis nearly 20 (around 2003) years to recover from this deficit and get the percentages back up to where they were in the 1980’s regarding college applications from families making less than $30,000 annually (including non-POC families). Even with high paying jobs from FEDEX and UPS, Memphis consistently ranks in the top 5 for violent crime. Now of course FEDEX wasn’t the main factor in these drops, and I’m not blaming FEDEX at all. (My mother worked there for over 30 years, actually worked for Fred Smith in the early years.)And of course I’m probably leaving out nuances from the study conducted by U of M, but it clearly laid out when lower income young adults, especially AA males, joined the work force from high school or while in college, they don’t go/go back to college. Thankfully, FedEx has made significant inroads in keeping the enrollment up for college student workers by better managing the shifts of that demographic and incentives to stay in school.

Saying this to say, many times when kids on the fringe start working, they often push education to the back burner because they’ve become dependent on the money.

Thank you for bringing data and evidence to this discussion. Very powerful.

Some of you will lap up anything you agree with.
College tuition and expenses are no longer 1980s prices. Its okay for people to work hourly jobs. Truly.
Some times this DCUM bubble is hilarious and sometimes it's frightening how out of touch some of you are with life outside the beltway.

I’m the Memphis poster, from Memphis, and definitely know life outside the beltway. Where Black males are more likely to end up in jail than graduate high school. What do you know about life in the inner city? That’s a real question. Tell me about your experience. Tell us all about life outside the Beltway. As they say in Memphis, “Where your people from?”

Absolutely none one said working hourly jobs wasn’t ok. Almost my entire family works above average hourly jobs. Of course we know tuition isn’t the same, tuition at Memphis State was about $1500 a year in the 80’s. At those prices it should’ve been easy to stay in school, but it was just the opposite for lower income kids. Once FedEx stepped in (I’m not saying that was bad), 18 year olds thought $9.00hr was really doing something. Some of my high school friends still work at FEDEX, in the Hub. It was a real sight to see thousands of folks file out of FEDEX Hub at 5am, in orange jumpsuits no less. They were like ants. Didn’t play the long game of using FEDEX to get ahead, instead falling into the trap.

[Anonymous]

Meatpacking used to be a stable, middle-class union job, with multiple generations of families working at the same plant. In 1960, the industry was 95% unionized, paying wages that were comparable to those in the auto and steel industries. Meatpacking was skilled labor. A meatpacker was trained like an old-fashioned butcher to take an animal from slaughter to final cuts.

In the 1960s, a company called IBP (Iowa Beef Packers) figured out that you didn't need skilled labor if you didn't care about your workers. Instead of workers doing a variety of jobs, IBP had workers do one cut all day long, maybe separate the hind quarter from the carcass, or slice a single cut of steak.

Meatpacking wages across the industry stayed high through the early 1980s, but then started to fall, as more companies adopted the IBP method. After all, anyone could be trained to do a single cut. By the mid-80s, wages had plunged and unions were disappearing. It was a race to the bottom and meatpacking was quickly becoming the worst job in America.

One reason it was now so awful, was that the IBP method resulted in a huge rise in repetitive stress injuries and debilitating knife cuts caused by inattention and fatigue. Doing one cut all day long on a speeding factory line was good for corporate profits but disastrously bad for actual humans.

Today, Places like Tyson Chicken and Smithfield Ham need an endless supply of 3rd world immigrants to keep wages low and unions busted, but also because it's a job that destroys the human body and spirit. Even if you're not injured, the work is so grueling that most immigrants can only do it for a couple of years before they move on. That's why you'll see that the ethnic composition of rural meatpacking towns goes through successive waves of foreigners-- Mexicans, Somalis, Sudanese, Guatemalans, Haitians-- as each group gets brought in and burned out, while management goes looking for another group of suckers.

Shutting down the immigration pipeline and deporting the illegals will go a long way to restoring the balance between workers and corporations. Likewise, we need to go back to a system with lots of small-scale regional meat processors staffed by skilled workers, something that will require breaking up these abusive corporations and overhauling the USDA inspection program.

Yes, prices of meat will certainly rise, but you already shouldn't be eating factory-farmed meat and you shouldn't be patronizing corporations that are actively wrecking America.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How many 14 year olds are working in Florida right now?

Where is the evidence that this will lead to kids taking immigrant jobs?
Especially when Florida is already pretty restrictive of illegal immigrants. I remember the thread on this forum of how all the construction firms were going to disappear because they couldn't hire illegal immigrants.

People please look this up. Don’t be willfully obtuse. It was proposed to fill a void for the loss of migrant workers. Have some curiosity. Be a free thinker. Check sources. Think about consequences, unintended and otherwise. Stop relating this to yourself and think about what it means for the larger community and state.

That's why it was proposed. But where is the evidence that this will happen?

What is the current state of 14 and 15 year olds working in the currently easier jobs that are not overnight shifts?

I love that you’re doubling down on your stupidity.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Meatpacking used to be a stable, middle-class union job, with multiple generations of families working at the same plant. In 1960, the industry was 95% unionized, paying wages that were comparable to those in the auto and steel industries. Meatpacking was skilled labor. A meatpacker was trained like an old-fashioned butcher to take an animal from slaughter to final cuts.

In the 1960s, a company called IBP (Iowa Beef Packers) figured out that you didn't need skilled labor if you didn't care about your workers. Instead of workers doing a variety of jobs, IBP had workers do one cut all day long, maybe separate the hind quarter from the carcass, or slice a single cut of steak.

Meatpacking wages across the industry stayed high through the early 1980s, but then started to fall, as more companies adopted the IBP method. After all, anyone could be trained to do a single cut. By the mid-80s, wages had plunged and unions were disappearing. It was a race to the bottom and meatpacking was quickly becoming the worst job in America.

One reason it was now so awful, was that the IBP method resulted in a huge rise in repetitive stress injuries and debilitating knife cuts caused by inattention and fatigue. Doing one cut all day long on a speeding factory line was good for corporate profits but disastrously bad for actual humans.

Today, Places like Tyson Chicken and Smithfield Ham need an endless supply of 3rd world immigrants to keep wages low and unions busted, but also because it's a job that destroys the human body and spirit. Even if you're not injured, the work is so grueling that most immigrants can only do it for a couple of years before they move on. That's why you'll see that the ethnic composition of rural meatpacking towns goes through successive waves of foreigners-- Mexicans, Somalis, Sudanese, Guatemalans, Haitians-- as each group gets brought in and burned out, while management goes looking for another group of suckers.

Shutting down the immigration pipeline and deporting the illegals will go a long way to restoring the balance between workers and corporations. Likewise, we need to go back to a system with lots of small-scale regional meat processors staffed by skilled workers, something that will require breaking up these abusive corporations and overhauling the USDA inspection program.

Yes, prices of meat will certainly rise, but you already shouldn't be eating factory-farmed meat and you shouldn't be patronizing corporations that are actively wrecking America.

There’s no plan for any of that except deportations. The meat industry isn’t going to police itself, and Republicans will protect them. That’s why we need bipartisan effort and compromise.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Why doesn’t DeSantis lead by example and send his own kids?

Yeah. Where will the DeSantis kids work? Which hotel? Will they wash my sheets?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My teen wanted to work over the summer, but foreign Eastern European temp workers took all the jobs.

That's the fault of the employers--not the temp workers. Your child should look for a job the temps can't fill.


"6. Are there any restrictions on the types of jobs that can be filled by temporary workers in Delaware?

Yes, there are certain restrictions on the types of jobs that can be filled by temporary workers in Delaware. Temporary workers should not be used to replace permanent or regular employees. They are typically brought in to fill short-term needs or to provide additional support during peak periods. Additionally, temporary workers should not be used for hazardous or dangerous work, as they may not have received proper training for these types of jobs."

https://www.stateregstoday.com/business/labor/temporary-worker-protections-in-delaware

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I started working as a teen washing dishes. I was 13, and it was invaluable life and work experience, and i got paid.

Whats wrong with this?

Did you work the overnight shift at 13? That's what he's saying.

FWIW my teens both work but not overnight shifts.

They also want to remove mandatory meal breaks. I also worked from a young age, but I worked limited hours and not overnight. I was also allowed to eat meals.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:No time for joyriding and crime when you're tired from physical labor.

For some, it's easier to carjack people and rob them at gunpoint. Why would they give that up to mop floors for $10/hour?