This dynamic is so frustrating!

[Anonymous]

Several years ago this loved one did something really hurtful to me (made fun of me about a subject I was quite sensitive about at the time, in front of others, in a way that was really unnecessary and cruel). I explained that it was hurtful and why. They did not apologize but said we should move forward. I said I needed an apology to move forward because I felt trust had been broken. They said they had “just been making a joke” and refused to apologize. So I didn’t forgive them.

It has now been years and we are estranged. It is awkward for others and has led to other schisms. But now their lives is that I’m “too sensitive” and demand apologies for “everything”. But I’ve never asked for an apology for anything other than this one thing, and I feel like I have a right! I just honestly needed an apology to feel like this was a person I’d feel comfortable being around again. I don’t normally demand apologies from people, in fact I can’t think of any other situation where I have gone do — this just felt like a bridge too far because it was public and embarrassing for me.

But now of course the attitude is that we are both at fault and are both being stubborn, and we should both “let it go”. But I’m really the only one who would be letting anything go— the only thing I “did” to this person is ask for sn apology and refuse to forget about what they did. That doesn’t really feel like an act of malice to me.

At this point I’m probably more angry with them for refusing to apologize than the original offense, just because it’s gone on so long and feels like some game they are playing to win the conflict, whereas the original thing was more them being dumb and hurtful in the moment.

I know to keep peace I should probably just say “ok, let’s forget about it.” But I know if I do that, I won’t forget. Everyone else will be happy to move on, but I’ll always remember we that this person did this gross thing, refused to apologize or make amends in any way, and then somehow I became the bad guy for being hurt by this. I feel like this has poisoned my reputation in this group of people and other than magically not caring when publicly insulted and laughed at, I’m not sure what I could have done to prevent it.

Just needed to vent.

[Anonymous]

^ sorry for typos, on phone

[Anonymous]

If you’re dragging other people into this, it’s a bridge too far.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If you’re dragging other people into this, it’s a bridge too far.

OP here. What does this mean? Can you explain?

[Anonymous]

You do not have to be around toxic people. You were the one that was insulted, not them, so you should be the one to decide when to forgive. I think it's petty and immature not to apologize when a person has told you that your behavior has hurt them. They want to move on because they weren't the ones who were hurt and wronged. F that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:You do not have to be around toxic people. You were the one that was insulted, not them, so you should be the one to decide when to forgive. I think it's petty and immature not to apologize when a person has told you that your behavior has hurt them. They want to move on because they weren't the ones who were hurt and wronged. F that.

OP here and THANK YOU. This is how I feel but I am getting so much pressure to let it go. I am starting g to feel crazy for caring about this in the first place.

[Anonymous]

Either way if it’s been several years then for your own mental health you should find a way to get over it. Harboring negative feelings for an extended time is unhealthy. Forgive, don’t forget.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Either way if it’s been several years then for your own mental health you should find a way to get over it. Harboring negative feelings for an extended time is unhealthy. Forgive, don’t forget.

I mean this sounds great until you actually try it. It is a specific kind of torture to try and forgive someone who is vocally telling people you’re too sensitive and annoying even AS you try to forgive them. And then try going to Thanksgiving or another gathering with this person present and feel forgiving. If there are people who have actually done this successfully I’m gonna need you to break it down for me because HOW.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:You do not have to be around toxic people. You were the one that was insulted, not them, so you should be the one to decide when to forgive. I think it's petty and immature not to apologize when a person has told you that your behavior has hurt them. They want to move on because they weren't the ones who were hurt and wronged. F that.

I agree with this.

[Anonymous]

You just pretend to move on as a way of dropping all of the drama you are creating for a whole group. You don’t have to actually feel like this person is your new BFF in your heart. Just go along to get along. This grudge is likely exhausting to everyone having to hear about it years later.

What was the subject matter of the insult, btw? I’m not saying it’s ok, but carrying it around and making it an issue for multiple people might be excessive. Would be helpful to know what this is all about.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:You just pretend to move on as a way of dropping all of the drama you are creating for a whole group. You don’t have to actually feel like this person is your new BFF in your heart. Just go along to get along. This grudge is likely exhausting to everyone having to hear about it years later.

What was the subject matter of the insult, btw? I’m not saying it’s ok, but carrying it around and making it an issue for multiple people might be excessive. Would be helpful to know what this is all about.

I think it’s interesting that you think someone is creating drama for a group by not forgiving. Isn’t it the person who made the public insult in the first place the one who created this drama? And then perpetuated it by refusing to apologize, and doubling down with “I was kidding” (which everyone knows is code for “can’t you take a joke?”).

This is some gaslighting right here. No one should have to pretend to be okay for the good of the group. Why even have a group at all if you have to fake feeling okay with it?

[Anonymous]

NP here. My own mother would do this crap. Say awful and humiliating things about me at family gatherings (including my wedding), then brush it off as just good fun and I’m being too sensitive. When she tried to gaslight about actual physical abuse she’d perpetrated on me as a child, it was the last straw. I haven’t spoken with her in a few years. My siblings don’t understand it and think I’m being stubborn or selfish, when really I don’t want to be around a manipulative abuser who delights in making me look foolish in front of my family (including now my own children). No thank you.

OP, you have to evaluate what YOU need, reasonably, out of this situation. It doesn’t sound like you are trying to “win” so much as you are trying to establish boundaries with toxic people who for some reason are a part of your life. Ask yourself: does this person, and the extended group need to be a part of my life? If no, then don’t spend time with them. If yes, establish appropriate boundaries. For example, if you have an obligation to attend the family holiday party and this person will be there, practice gray rock greetings, responses and your poker face. The key is to tread very shallowly with such people and never give them the pleasure of an emotional reaction. Godspeed to you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:NP here. My own mother would do this crap. Say awful and humiliating things about me at family gatherings (including my wedding), then brush it off as just good fun and I’m being too sensitive. When she tried to gaslight about actual physical abuse she’d perpetrated on me as a child, it was the last straw. I haven’t spoken with her in a few years. My siblings don’t understand it and think I’m being stubborn or selfish, when really I don’t want to be around a manipulative abuser who delights in making me look foolish in front of my family (including now my own children). No thank you.

OP, you have to evaluate what YOU need, reasonably, out of this situation. It doesn’t sound like you are trying to “win” so much as you are trying to establish boundaries with toxic people who for some reason are a part of your life. Ask yourself: does this person, and the extended group need to be a part of my life? If no, then don’t spend time with them. If yes, establish appropriate boundaries. For example, if you have an obligation to attend the family holiday party and this person will be there, practice gray rock greetings, responses and your poker face. The key is to tread very shallowly with such people and never give them the pleasure of an emotional reaction. Godspeed to you.

This is good advice though admittedly I am very bad at gray rock greetings. Like my emotion just reads on my face, everyone knows, even when I think I have a poker face. But yes, you have to stay passive and calm anyway. Don't give them anything they can use against you because look at all these folks saying you're "causing drama" by just standing up for yourself. People are something else.

Thing is, at this point there's probably no way out. If they haven't apologized after years, they either aren't going to or that apology is never going to cover the scope of what they did. Because you're right that the real offense at this point isn't the original thing, though I'm sure that was unpleasant. The real offense is just flat out telling a loved one "you do not matter enough to me for me to just say I'm sorry I hurt you." Like that takes a large amount of disrespect. I have family members who drive me up the wall crazy, friends who I know are deeply flawed, and if one of them came to me and said "You hurt me," I'd apologize. If someone I love is like "something is not right between us" then I'm going to do what is in my power to try and make it right. And apologizing isn't hard because I really don't mean to hurt anyone ever. So if I did, even unintentionally, it's no skin off my back to say "I'm sorry I hurt you." Because I am! That's not how I want to go through the world. I might feel differently if someone really was asking all the time, if they were taking offense at every little thing, but like you said, this was one specific thing. That's really not much to ask at all.

So someone who can look at your hurt and say "Nope, not my problem," and then expect everyone to move on with their day? That's some serious disrespect. Way worse than insulting me or embarrassing me in public because that goes to the heart of our relationship and it means they just don't think I have the right to ask something like that. That's a big power imbalance to me. And to go on like that for years? Nope.

This person is never coming back, and anyone who is defending them or taking their side isn't your friend either. I say drop them. It sucks because letting go of relationships you've put work into is hard. But it's never going to feel good to exist in a space where people don't feel like you deserve this basic courtesy. You're always going to feel in the back of your mind like "Oh, I have less value than this other person." That's no way to live. You've got to go where you are loved and appreciated and unfortunately it is not with this particular group of people.

[Anonymous]

^^ OP, the best way is not to overthink it. Here’s the breakdown:

1. The person is a jerk (or however you choose to define it);
2. The person is not going to change;
3. The person makes you feel like crap;
4. You avoid said person unless you seriously need something from them (try not to) or need to be in a location proximate to them;
5. If you have to be around the person, force yourself to NOT CARE. They don’t care, and you can not care too.
6. Don’t waste your time ruminating about what anyone else thinks. Make your reasonable decisions here stick by those decisions.
7. Move on with your life on your terms.

[Anonymous]

Good Lord it's been years. Get help