It seems SAHM & working mom live in different world

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:A SAHM neighbor does not understand that why my kids are at school beforecare/aftercare & summer camp. Well, DH works from home, and I work hybrid. Maybe we could save a bit money by dropping school beforecare but I am not able to work and manage kids at the same time even on my work from home days. I always wait until last minutes to pick up kids. Kids have stayed long time outside and get tired. So we do.

I am in a rush every day. I think I can't be friends with her since we are not on same page. Her kids do not need school beforecare/aftercare or summer camps. I think I have more in common things to talk with working moms. But working moms are busy to hang out to meet on weekend, so we are.

You do live in different worlds and that is okay.

It really negatively impacted Ted my relationship with my best friend for about15 years. We’re coming out of it now.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Op here. My kids are not left outside because I forget to pick them up. I mean they are outside of home for long hours daily. One kid's beforecare is 7am to 8:40am & aftercare is 3:25pm to 6:30pm. One kid's beforecare is 7am to 9am & aftercare is 3pm to 6pm. They are at different schools, and I do separate drop off /pickup. I drop off one kid around 8am & another kid around 8:30am. I pick up one kid right before 6pm and another kid before 6:20am. We don't use the full hours for beforecare hours. I still have to work at nighttime or on weekend for a few hours.

I sometimes see that SAHM neighbor doing gardening, walking kids to bus stop or chilling in front of her front porch in the mornings. I sometimes see her hanging around at front porch by herself or with kids when we get home. We can see their house from our window, like 20 steps away, so close to each other. We have one same age kid going to same school. Maybe she thinks I am a bad mom. The high energy kid loves beforecare/aftercare and summer camps. The low energy kid probably is better off with less activities and would not mind staying longer time at home.

As a SAHM when I see a mom like this, I dont judge her. I feel slightly sorry for how tired and rushed she always looks, especially when I see her wrangling crying kids in and out of the car early morning or late at night. I feel a pang of gratitude that I can stay at home and not put my very young kid in daycare for 8 plus hours a day.

And I am very happy to chat or be friends with a working mom , on a schedule that’s convenient for her.

Fellow sahm here. I also feel slightly bad for them because I used to be them. I feel fortunate Dh earns a high enough income that I don’t have to work.

You are a financial dependent. Gross.

+1

I would never want my daughters to be dependent on a man, who will likely lose respect for them and cheat. They need to be gainfully employed and in a partnership - no matter what their HHI is.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Op here. My kids are not left outside because I forget to pick them up. I mean they are outside of home for long hours daily. One kid's beforecare is 7am to 8:40am & aftercare is 3:25pm to 6:30pm. One kid's beforecare is 7am to 9am & aftercare is 3pm to 6pm. They are at different schools, and I do separate drop off /pickup. I drop off one kid around 8am & another kid around 8:30am. I pick up one kid right before 6pm and another kid before 6:20am. We don't use the full hours for beforecare hours. I still have to work at nighttime or on weekend for a few hours.

I sometimes see that SAHM neighbor doing gardening, walking kids to bus stop or chilling in front of her front porch in the mornings. I sometimes see her hanging around at front porch by herself or with kids when we get home. We can see their house from our window, like 20 steps away, so close to each other. We have one same age kid going to same school. Maybe she thinks I am a bad mom. The high energy kid loves beforecare/aftercare and summer camps. The low energy kid probably is better off with less activities and would not mind staying longer time at home.

As a SAHM when I see a mom like this, I dont judge her. I feel slightly sorry for how tired and rushed she always looks, especially when I see her wrangling crying kids in and out of the car early morning or late at night. I feel a pang of gratitude that I can stay at home and not put my very young kid in daycare for 8 plus hours a day.

And I am very happy to chat or be friends with a working mom , on a schedule that’s convenient for her.

Fellow sahm here. I also feel slightly bad for them because I used to be them. I feel fortunate Dh earns a high enough income that I don’t have to work.

Please don't feel bad for us. It sounds like a better solution for you is not to work outside the home, and great that your husband earns enough for the family as a whole. Some of us, like me, however, would chose to work regardless of how much our spouses make and it's the best choice for us.

I have 3 kids. I worked when my older two were younger. I felt like I missed a lot of their childhood. Like OP, I was stressed out with not enough hours in a day. I had a full time nanny and put my kid in daycare. I used to call it preschool but it was daycare. I put my kids in camps year round. All three of my kids are happy and healthy. I don’t think my working hurt my older kids but I just feel like I missed a lot.

I know not all moms feel like me.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Whole family has 11-12 hr workdays including children, even though neither parent commutes. You need major life changes. Its not healthy.

+1

I’m a working mom with 3 kids. DH and I both have flexible schedules with WAH. We have staggered our schedules so that we do not need any before or after care. One of us works 7-3:30 while the other manages all the breakfast/bus stop stuff and the other works 9-5:30 while the early worker handles afternoons with the kids. Sometimes we have to shift things around to accommodate meetings or to divide and conquer taking the kids to after school extracurriculars, and then we make up a bit of work at night.

I realize this isn’t feasible for everyone, but if OP and her DH are working from home a lot, I don’t understand why they need 11-12 hours of childcare? Even when DH and I were going into the office and had 30-45 min commutes we still staggered so kids were in daycare no more than ~8-9 hours and often less because we’d flex things around.

I have plenty of mom friends who are PT, SAH (or were SAH and recently went back), etc. and our employment status does not feel like some huge divide.

I think OP is relying on extended childcare hours and feeling judged by her neighbor because she is unhappy with her current family schedule. Usually when you’re sensitive about something it’s coming from something internal.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Op here. My kids are not left outside because I forget to pick them up. I mean they are outside of home for long hours daily. One kid's beforecare is 7am to 8:40am & aftercare is 3:25pm to 6:30pm. One kid's beforecare is 7am to 9am & aftercare is 3pm to 6pm. They are at different schools, and I do separate drop off /pickup. I drop off one kid around 8am & another kid around 8:30am. I pick up one kid right before 6pm and another kid before 6:20am. We don't use the full hours for beforecare hours. I still have to work at nighttime or on weekend for a few hours.

I sometimes see that SAHM neighbor doing gardening, walking kids to bus stop or chilling in front of her front porch in the mornings. I sometimes see her hanging around at front porch by herself or with kids when we get home. We can see their house from our window, like 20 steps away, so close to each other. We have one same age kid going to same school. Maybe she thinks I am a bad mom. The high energy kid loves beforecare/aftercare and summer camps. The low energy kid probably is better off with less activities and would not mind staying longer time at home.

As a SAHM when I see a mom like this, I dont judge her. I feel slightly sorry for how tired and rushed she always looks, especially when I see her wrangling crying kids in and out of the car early morning or late at night. I feel a pang of gratitude that I can stay at home and not put my very young kid in daycare for 8 plus hours a day.

And I am very happy to chat or be friends with a working mom , on a schedule that’s convenient for her.

Fellow sahm here. I also feel slightly bad for them because I used to be them. I feel fortunate Dh earns a high enough income that I don’t have to work.

You are a financial dependent. Gross.

You are judging another mom based entirely on her employment status. Gross.

-working mom

[Anonymous]

We never did am or pm care for 3 kids with 2 working parents. We did have an after school caregiver instead for grades PK- 3 grade. After that, I just scheduled my WFH time to 7-3 for regular hours ( company policy was it everyone had to be available from 8 to 3) and did school pick up. I can often get another hour into answer emails and respond timely to other requests in the evening.

[Anonymous]

I feel so sorry for all of these SAHMs. It’s like Betty Draper. They seem so miserable being stuck at home with kids they don’t even like, while their husbands go out and live their lives, which their wives don’t and can’t understand. No wonder their husbands seek solace with other women. I mean, I’m on DCUM right now to kill time while I’m on a boring webcast at work - why are SAHMs on here right now? Shouldn’t they be spending time with their children, since that’s literally their full-time job?

[Anonymous]

Pp again. There is absolutely nothing wrong with aftercare. My older one went to aftercare and he enjoyed it. They gave him a snack and he played on the playground. At that time, my one kid played soccer and I hated that one day where I had to get my kid to soccer.

I was annoyed at anything that was during the middle of the work day and probably blamed SAHMs with nothing to do. I have seen threads on this complaining about class parties, staff appreciation, etc. Now I’m a room parent for all 3 kids. I can sign up my kids for whatever they want and I host many play dates a week.

[Anonymous]

I agree with other posters, before AND after care seems excessive when one spouse WFH.

Your husband can't step away for up to 30 minutes to get the kids?

If you were on good terms with this neighbor, maybe your kids could ride back with her.

Depending on the age of the children, they could entertain themselves while your husband finishes up work.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Op here. My kids are not left outside because I forget to pick them up. I mean they are outside of home for long hours daily. One kid's beforecare is 7am to 8:40am & aftercare is 3:25pm to 6:30pm. One kid's beforecare is 7am to 9am & aftercare is 3pm to 6pm. They are at different schools, and I do separate drop off /pickup. I drop off one kid around 8am & another kid around 8:30am. I pick up one kid right before 6pm and another kid before 6:20am. We don't use the full hours for beforecare hours. I still have to work at nighttime or on weekend for a few hours.

I sometimes see that SAHM neighbor doing gardening, walking kids to bus stop or chilling in front of her front porch in the mornings. I sometimes see her hanging around at front porch by herself or with kids when we get home. We can see their house from our window, like 20 steps away, so close to each other. We have one same age kid going to same school. Maybe she thinks I am a bad mom. The high energy kid loves beforecare/aftercare and summer camps. The low energy kid probably is better off with less activities and would not mind staying longer time at home.

As a SAHM when I see a mom like this, I dont judge her. I feel slightly sorry for how tired and rushed she always looks, especially when I see her wrangling crying kids in and out of the car early morning or late at night. I feel a pang of gratitude that I can stay at home and not put my very young kid in daycare for 8 plus hours a day.

And I am very happy to chat or be friends with a working mom , on a schedule that’s convenient for her.

Fellow sahm here. I also feel slightly bad for them because I used to be them. I feel fortunate Dh earns a high enough income that I don’t have to work.

You are a financial dependent. Gross.

+1

I would never want my daughters to be dependent on a man, who will likely lose respect for them and cheat. They need to be gainfully employed and in a partnership - no matter what their HHI is.

This is such a black and white (and I think wrong) perspective. And I say that as a working mom.

In a home with a working parent and a SAHP, both partners are dependent on each other. One makes all the money and the other is doing all the childcare and household work to enable the other partner to focus exclusively on work all day. When couples like this divorce, the SAHP has to get a job, yes. But guess what the working parent has to do? Usually, hire like three people to do the work that the SAHP was doing (nanny, housekeeper, assistant). So best of luck with that.

The least equitable family arrangement I regularly encounter is one in which both parents work but one does way more childcare and household stuff. You see this all the time. Happens a lot when both parents work full time but one is much higher earning, so the one with the lower income has the "flex job" which basically means that they have to shoehorn work in around all the kid and house stuff. And over time it gets less and less equitable because trying to balance work and home for the lower earning spouse takes a toll on their career, they don't advance, and it deepens this idea that they don't have a "real" job and that their time is not valuable.

I would take being a SAHM with a spouse who actually appreciates the work I do over being a working mom who is just assumed to have time to do all the pick up/drop off, cleaning, meal planning and meal prep, organizing, social planning, etc. because her job is deemed less essential than her slightly higher earning spouse. And this is so common. It is not feminism and it's not liberty.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I feel so sorry for all of these SAHMs. It’s like Betty Draper. They seem so miserable being stuck at home with kids they don’t even like, while their husbands go out and live their lives, which their wives don’t and can’t understand. No wonder their husbands seek solace with other women. I mean, I’m on DCUM right now to kill time while I’m on a boring webcast at work - why are SAHMs on here right now? Shouldn’t they be spending time with their children, since that’s literally their full-time job?

Is this a cartoon? I'm a working mom but I don't know a single SAHM like what you describe. All the SAHMs I know seem really happy and are often more productive than plenty of people I know who work for money.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:We never did am or pm care for 3 kids with 2 working parents. We did have an after school caregiver instead for grades PK- 3 grade. After that, I just scheduled my WFH time to 7-3 for regular hours ( company policy was it everyone had to be available from 8 to 3) and did school pick up. I can often get another hour into answer emails and respond timely to other requests in the evening.

But you did have "care" in the afternoon in the form of a afternoon babysitter (nanny, whatever you want to call it).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:How long is the commute from your home to your kids' schools? How far is your office from your home and schools? And what are your typical work hours in a day?

It sounds like maybe you're losing a lot of time to commuting.

OP, I'm assuming that your kids are young (maybe preschool and young elementary) given that they're both young enough to need before and aftercare and they're at two different schools. My recommendations, in no particular order, would be:

-Find at least one school closer to your home to shorten the commute time between that drop off and getting back to your house.

-Are you not eligible for a bus? WFH DH could (arguably should) be getting your kid on a bus. Or, if you live close enough that you're not bus-eligible, take the 10 minutes to drop your kid off or go pick your kid up.

-Can your kids be home while you're working for a couple hours, either in the morning or the afternoon? I have a preschooler and a kindergartener and, especially in the mornings, I can give them a bowl of cereal and then a puzzle or coloring page and tell them I'm working and they will mostly be quiet enough for me to work until it's time to take them to school. This especially works on days my DH WFH and can take a couple minutes to help if something comes up.

-Find a job closer to your home to shorten your commute on days you need to be in the office, or move closer to your office. My job and both my kids' schools are all within a 15 minute drive of my house. We moved closer to my job in order to make that work, because there wasn't work in my field closer to where we used to live. We have aftercare for both kids, but we don't have to use morning care. This wouldn't work if my commute was longer. The one downside of this setup is that I don't get more than a couple minutes to myself in the car after dropping off my second kid before getting to my office and starting my workday. I would really like more me-time in the mornings, but my kids will only be little like this for a little while, so I know I'll get that time back eventually.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Op here. My kids are not left outside because I forget to pick them up. I mean they are outside of home for long hours daily. One kid's beforecare is 7am to 8:40am & aftercare is 3:25pm to 6:30pm. One kid's beforecare is 7am to 9am & aftercare is 3pm to 6pm. They are at different schools, and I do separate drop off /pickup. I drop off one kid around 8am & another kid around 8:30am. I pick up one kid right before 6pm and another kid before 6:20am. We don't use the full hours for beforecare hours. I still have to work at nighttime or on weekend for a few hours.

I sometimes see that SAHM neighbor doing gardening, walking kids to bus stop or chilling in front of her front porch in the mornings. I sometimes see her hanging around at front porch by herself or with kids when we get home. We can see their house from our window, like 20 steps away, so close to each other. We have one same age kid going to same school. Maybe she thinks I am a bad mom. The high energy kid loves beforecare/aftercare and summer camps. The low energy kid probably is better off with less activities and would not mind staying longer time at home.

As a SAHM when I see a mom like this, I dont judge her. I feel slightly sorry for how tired and rushed she always looks, especially when I see her wrangling crying kids in and out of the car early morning or late at night. I feel a pang of gratitude that I can stay at home and not put my very young kid in daycare for 8 plus hours a day.

And I am very happy to chat or be friends with a working mom , on a schedule that’s convenient for her.

Fellow sahm here. I also feel slightly bad for them because I used to be them. I feel fortunate Dh earns a high enough income that I don’t have to work.

You are a financial dependent. Gross.

You are low value and have to earn a living because no high value man thought you or your ugly children deserve to be well provided for. Gross.

Are you trying to be mean or do you really think this?

Consider a woman with a graduate degree, mostly working from home and earning at least 200k a year. Do you really think she’s working because her husband won’t provide for her?

Ugly children she hates?

The only ugly one here is you and your ugly soul.

[Anonymous]

Wow, as a middle class slacker, I'm...um, happy with that.

It's funny reading this thread compared to all the "return to office" threads in the Jobs forum. People will talk about how long commutes make childcare tougher and everyone's like "just use before and aftercare like everyone did before covid!" Which is it? Is aftercare great and we shouldn't complain about work impacts on family life, or do we actually have an interest as parents in minimizing the hours they spend? Or are the people posting in that forum all Boomer men who never picked up their kids and didn't miss it, vs millennial moms posting here?

I just switched to a fully remote job after getting fed up with how returning to my DC commute was affecting my life, so you can guess where I fall. The tradeoff was that I actually had to shift to later hours to work with colleagues in Pacific time zones.