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[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:And, no, hourly employees do not generally get to bill time for travel. Mileage and per diem yes, but travelling out of state to work a convention? Absolutely cannot claim air or drive time as working hours. You would bankrupt universities and non-profits if this were true.

What? Are you kidding? I travel on the regular with my. Family and always bill for travel time. Sitting with a baby on flight to Tokyo while my mb sleep is work and I’m paid for that.

You’re a nanny. And you are taking care of the child. Not sitting there watching your own movie and doing whatever else you want.

Plenty of APs do that too though. I am an AP and have definitely had the lion's share of the care of the kids during flight time. I can actively remember a trip to Hawaii (5 hours) where the baby didn't want to settle and I spent the entirety of the flight walking up and down the aisle, the parents only holding the baby at landing and take off. Most hf don't seem to count flight times as work hours though, so despite doing 5 hours with no break on the flight I still had to do a full day whilst there because of course so much need to be done on the first day, I am one of the AP who appreciate the gesture of being invited on a trip but often dislike the reality of it. More often than not trips are a massive grey area where no proper schedule is set so AP is always semi on call, where you can't go late at night at the risk of waking people in the hotel room up, where you are stuck somewhere with gorgeous landscapes that you often can't really explore (no access to a car, stuck in an all inclusive hotel by the beach but far away from any local cultural experience etc...), I also find host parents to be way more lax (not in the best way) about the schedule because somehow they feel like they are doing a good deed for taking you along and know they can push the line a bit because saying anything would make the AP ungrateful.



I was very appreciative of my hf taking me with them to hawaii but I was also stuck in a very tiny town in the middle of nowhere with only 1 restaurants and 3 shops and nothing to do without a car (and I didn't have car) and I was bored out of my mind, (I had my real hawaii holiday when I took a week off to explore and had full freedom to do so) I was appreciative of the experience but if my hf had wanted to make this a bi-monthly thing I would have really resented it. It wouldn't have mattered that I had Saturday day off or Sunday day off and to do as I please when there was NOTHING for me to do in the area.

It sounds like you probably were not mature enough to entertain yourself at that age - if you could not entertain yourself or manage to find joy and enjoyment in Hawaii of all places. Yikes. Vacations are a gray areas for APs, too, ours do not wake up early on a schedule unless there is a planned activity, have no trouble planning and organizing activities, and communicating as adult women (e.g., our AP asked if she could book a surfing lesson at a specific time, we dropped her off and picked her up, booked herself a massage on the beach (we dropped her off and picked her up), and looked up free yoga and hikes she wanted to try. We had a detailed discussion regarding hours before the vacation. We indicated she would not be left alone with DD throughout vacation, but would be expected when with us to assist when asked. We asked her to make a list of activities she wanted to do, and we would try to combine with our trip objectives. We do screen for older, mature APs, however. Plus, our agency recommends that APs pick one and HFs pick one in terms of vacation. We could have asked for her to use vacation time. I would have beg borrowed or stolen to have a working vacation in Hawaii (still would). The idea that an au pair expects a “real Hawaii holiday” on what is essentially a work vacation is pretty narcissistic. I would never tell my boss that a European work trip is my personal holiday.

Did you even read the post? The point is it is not a vacation for the AP and its work. It absolutely is work. Where was this poster to go in a small town with no car in the middle of no where.

In Hawaii, even rural Hawaii, there are buses. She could ask her HPs for a ride. She could lyft. She could exercise her mind by reading. She could exercise her body by walking, hiking, swimming, yoga, whatever. Presumably the parents also went places in Hawaii that AP tagged along to. But again, a work trip is not a personal vacation. I travel to real boring places all of the time: adulting is hard.

I am the poster who went to Hawaii did you READ my post? There was zero buses, the nearest beach was 30 minutes drive, walking wasn’t safe because there was NO sidewalks nor street lights (though I did walk), there was no books nor TV in the Airbnb and asking my hf for rides was NOT an option. My hf was into remote holidays were they could disconnect from the world by staying in the middle of nowhere catching up on sleep and reading (they had their own kindles), stop PRESUMING and start reading, please.

My hf had a blast but I didn’t (I loved Hawai’i when I got to explore it during my actual holidays and do the things you mentioned ) and yes I would have been resentful if my hf expected me to do this type of remote weekend twice a month for free.

I READ it, but I did not BELIEVE it. I have stayed in rural Hawaii many times, there are buses, they might not come frequently, but they have them. I doubt there was no tv in an airbnb, they may not have had cable, but you could almost certainly have hooked the tv up to your laptop or phone. Your HF also had a car - I do not believe that they refused to take you to places or things you wanted to see, or give you driving privileges. Surely, their kids were getting out and being taken to see things. It sounds like you were not interested in doing the family stuff and only wanted to do what you wanted to do on a working vacation. Wouldn't we all!
Also, the traffic in Hawaii is really bad - so it might take 30 minutes in a car to get to a beach in walking distance. "Beaches" in Hawaii are often just crossing the road and getting into the water - the actual sitting area can be narrow and rocky. Hawaii like MANY states/cities have NO sidewalks or street lights ("light pollution" is taken seriously in Hawaii) - most adult women are capable of packing their own reading material and laptop with movies, and having a stocked Netflix list, and asking for a ride....

[Anonymous]

I also find it hard to believe that a family with a young baby would travel all the way to Hawaii to stay in a remote house with no nearby beach or any other activities. Why would they take a long flight and deal with a time change just to sit in a house in one of the most naturally beautiful places in the world? It makes little sense, and if the ap had any sense herself she would’ve packed her own entertainment materials. Who doesn’t bring their own book on a trip?

[Anonymous]

I am laughing at the fact that you seem to have more insight into my life than me. I assume you have been absolutely EVERYWHERE in Hawaii? Not.

I will reiterate that it wasn’t a question of buses coming by every 4 hours, they simply did NOT exist in the area, and there was also ZERO traffic where I was (so obviously we don’t holiday in the same parts or Hawaii) so it wasn’t a question of traffic being too heavy and walking being easier, the nearest beach was 30 minutes drive because I was staying INLAND and not near the beach. And no there was no TV indoors it might be coming as a shock to your system but not ALL Airbnbs come with a TV, believe it or not.
As for my host family not giving me rides or letting me use the rental car, I wasn’t allowed to use it because I wasn’t on the contract and therefore not insured to drive it. As for them traveling all this way with a baby just to stay in the Airbnb, it’s what THEY like to do, and when else in a kids life can you afford to stay home with a child without them fully losing it other than when they are a baby? Not that it’s any of your business but both my host parents had health issues that meant their ideal holidays wasn’t your (or my) ideal holiday with lots of outdoors fun. That’s also why them giving me a ride wasn’t necessarily convenient. STOP assuming and creating completely fictive scenarios just to suit your narrative. not that I have to justify myself but I was dumb enough to think that I wouldn’t need my laptop to entertain myself in Hawaii (hence why I didn’t bring it), I thought I would be able to explore and see things and walk places, obviously that wasn’t the case.

That’s my point though, the ideal holiday of someone may be someone’s nightmare holiday/work environment, it’s irrelevant if you or anybody would kill for a free trip to Hawaii or anywhere else, if ultimately the persons concerned (here OP‘s AP) hates it .

And before any of you say I am a nightmare AP, I never begrudged my hf for this holiday and spending it like they intended, I appreciated them bringing me along and thanked them plenty of time for it. I was just mentioning that if my host family had wanted me to go there twice a month during my free time just so they could use me for 3 hours it would have been a different story and I would have hated it. I am not an entitled AP in fact, I was baby sitting for them no later than last Saturday (for free) and will be spending a full weekend (again for free) with the toddler so they can get away, my current hf (different one) has also asked me if I would be willing to change my visa status to student (they would sponsor me) so I could keep being a part of their kids life and one of my former host families (again I have been an AP a few times) will come visit me here in the summer. So I like to think that I am a pretty damn good AP very much loved by her host families despite me not always sharing their idea of the perfect holiday.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I am laughing at the fact that you seem to have more insight into my life than me. I assume you have been absolutely EVERYWHERE in Hawaii? Not.

I will reiterate that it wasn’t a question of buses coming by every 4 hours, they simply did NOT exist in the area, and there was also ZERO traffic where I was (so obviously we don’t holiday in the same parts or Hawaii) so it wasn’t a question of traffic being too heavy and walking being easier, the nearest beach was 30 minutes drive because I was staying INLAND and not near the beach. And no there was no TV indoors it might be coming as a shock to your system but not ALL Airbnbs come with a TV, believe it or not.
As for my host family not giving me rides or letting me use the rental car, I wasn’t allowed to use it because I wasn’t on the contract and therefore not insured to drive it. As for them traveling all this way with a baby just to stay in the Airbnb, it’s what THEY like to do, and when else in a kids life can you afford to stay home with a child without them fully losing it other than when they are a baby? Not that it’s any of your business but both my host parents had health issues that meant their ideal holidays wasn’t your (or my) ideal holiday with lots of outdoors fun. That’s also why them giving me a ride wasn’t necessarily convenient. STOP assuming and creating completely fictive scenarios just to suit your narrative. not that I have to justify myself but I was dumb enough to think that I wouldn’t need my laptop to entertain myself in Hawaii (hence why I didn’t bring it), I thought I would be able to explore and see things and walk places, obviously that wasn’t the case.

That’s my point though, the ideal holiday of someone may be someone’s nightmare holiday/work environment, it’s irrelevant if you or anybody would kill for a free trip to Hawaii or anywhere else, if ultimately the persons concerned (here OP‘s AP) hates it .

And before any of you say I am a nightmare AP, I never begrudged my hf for this holiday and spending it like they intended, I appreciated them bringing me along and thanked them plenty of time for it. I was just mentioning that if my host family had wanted me to go there twice a month during my free time just so they could use me for 3 hours it would have been a different story and I would have hated it. I am not an entitled AP in fact, I was baby sitting for them no later than last Saturday (for free) and will be spending a full weekend (again for free) with the toddler so they can get away, my current hf (different one) has also asked me if I would be willing to change my visa status to student (they would sponsor me) so I could keep being a part of their kids life and one of my former host families (again I have been an AP a few times) will come visit me here in the summer. So I like to think that I am a pretty damn good AP very much loved by her host families despite me not always sharing their idea of the perfect holiday.

You are not credible, hon.

[Anonymous]

Good thing I don’t have to prove myself to you then, hon.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Good thing I don’t have to prove myself to you then, hon.

Right, but no one here believes. Your story makes no sense nor does the lie that you are watching someone's kids for free (you are working illegally and getting paid) or the BS that you will get changed to student (will never happy). Good luck on your fictive journey!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Good thing I don’t have to prove myself to you then, hon.

Right, but no one here believes. Your story makes no sense nor does the lie that you are watching someone's kids for free (you are working illegally and getting paid) or the BS that you will get changed to student (will never happy). Good luck on your fictive journey!

I am not watching ''someone's kid'' for free, I am watching my former host kid, who I have looked after since he was 3 months old, for FREE because I rarely see him due to living in another city now. Do former APs who come visit you (if any!) charge you for spending time with your kids? or they do it for free because they actually want to spend time with them? I am not gonna charge my former host family to spend time with a kid that I love and only get to see about once a month now. Lovely of you to pay any former AP everytime they spend time with your children though. It must be awfully hard living your life with the amount of paranoia and distrust you seem to experience.

Here is an insight into my ''fantasy world/fictive journey'' that somehow seem to match the reality I describe:

https://ibb.co/28F0nkd

https://ibb.co/zh1NMXF

I have removed anything too identifying out of respect, not that they would care (I am close to all of my host families and I don't say anything they don't already know) but you might want to give your head a wobble and realize that because some things are things you haven't experienced or wouldn't do, doesn't necessarily mean they are untrue.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Good thing I don’t have to prove myself to you then, hon.

Right, but no one here believes. Your story makes no sense nor does the lie that you are watching someone's kids for free (you are working illegally and getting paid) or the BS that you will get changed to student (will never happy). Good luck on your fictive journey!

I am not watching ''someone's kid'' for free, I am watching my former host kid, who I have looked after since he was 3 months old, for FREE because I rarely see him due to living in another city now. Do former APs who come visit you (if any!) charge you for spending time with your kids? or they do it for free because they actually want to spend time with them? I am not gonna charge my former host family to spend time with a kid that I love and only get to see about once a month now. Lovely of you to pay any former AP everytime they spend time with your children though. It must be awfully hard living your life with the amount of paranoia and distrust you seem to experience.

Here is an insight into my ''fantasy world/fictive journey'' that somehow seem to match the reality I describe:

https://ibb.co/28F0nkd

https://ibb.co/zh1NMXF

I have removed anything too identifying out of respect, not that they would care (I am close to all of my host families and I don't say anything they don't already know) but you might want to give your head a wobble and realize that because some things are things you haven't experienced or wouldn't do, doesn't necessarily mean they are untrue.

None of which supports your original narrative, does not compute.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Good thing I don’t have to prove myself to you then, hon.

Right, but no one here believes. Your story makes no sense nor does the lie that you are watching someone's kids for free (you are working illegally and getting paid) or the BS that you will get changed to student (will never happy). Good luck on your fictive journey!

I am not watching ''someone's kid'' for free, I am watching my former host kid, who I have looked after since he was 3 months old, for FREE because I rarely see him due to living in another city now. Do former APs who come visit you (if any!) charge you for spending time with your kids? or they do it for free because they actually want to spend time with them? I am not gonna charge my former host family to spend time with a kid that I love and only get to see about once a month now. Lovely of you to pay any former AP everytime they spend time with your children though. It must be awfully hard living your life with the amount of paranoia and distrust you seem to experience.

Here is an insight into my ''fantasy world/fictive journey'' that somehow seem to match the reality I describe:

https://ibb.co/28F0nkd

https://ibb.co/zh1NMXF

I have removed anything too identifying out of respect, not that they would care (I am close to all of my host families and I don't say anything they don't already know) but you might want to give your head a wobble and realize that because some things are things you haven't experienced or wouldn't do, doesn't necessarily mean they are untrue.

I am a HM and I believe your AP story. I recognize some of your posts and you sound like you are a great AP. When I was a first time HM, for our first trip, my AP didn't have a real schedule because we didn't have a schedule either lol, but now I know they appreciate having some kind of schedule during the vacation and I do my best to give them one but we are very flexible and will accommodate AP's needs. I also understand not wanting to go to the same boring place every weekend. I also believe there are AirBnb with no TV (at least a few years ago I stayed in one). Anyway just my 2 cents

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I travel frequently for work and have thus far always brought infant now toddler. I screen for au pairs who like to travel and put it in our handbook. I have taken au pairs to Europe, Asia, and random boring to gritty US cities. If AP doesn’t want to for all or part of the trip, she has to use her vacation time (it’s never happened). Our AP gets every evening and weekend off, but works until 4:00 on Friday. I don’t feel bad if she’s “stuck in Rehoboth or Rome or Tokyo or Kansas City. A an AP that is really in it for the cultural exchange should be able to entertain herself for the odd weekend away.

That is really crummy.

Yeah, who wants to go to Rome or Tokyo? The horror! You actually were up front about your needs with the AP upfront, she agreed to them, and then you have the audacity to take her to Europe??? True Cruella Daville stuff, this is.

Is the airport free to explore Tokyo and Rome on her own? No. I went to Australia for 2 weeks with a family and literally never left the hotel once. On a plane with a screaming baby while my MB sat in business and took ambien. Working 24/7. Sharing a room with the kids. Being on call 24/7. Yeah. There’s lots of reasons aupairs and nannies don’t wanT to travel with families!!

I am sorry for your clearly traumatic experience - but it is certainly not universal. I pay for a separate hotel room or bedroom for my AP because she is working on these trips. She generally works her same schedule 8-4 with evenings and weekends off (or something akin, mornings and evenings with afternoons off) with a 45 hour cap. Any more than that, we pay for a hotel babysitter. On the plane we sit together in coach, usually the baby is worn by me, with occasional relief here and there. Our AP has gone to anime conventions, concerts, lessons, sporting events, lots of shopping, etc., on her off time. She can hang with us - or go out on her own when she's off - we will drop her off or help her take public transportation. We pay for her food and any excursion she takes DD to. So, our APs are generally happy with this arrangement, because we tell them in advance and discuss frequently. We give one week of vacation that she picks and one week that we pick - and if she prefers to break it up with long weekends here and there, we don't care.

Travel time should be considered work time.

Well, my travel time (as with many professionals) is not considered work time, so I am unaware on the regulation you are relying on for that statement. That said, on the days that we do travel, she is never alone with DD, and is only called into action if needed. Again, sorry for your trauma: your damage has clearly made you bitter and jaded about the AP program. We all wish you had never been an AP.

I'm a working professional and my travel time is considered work time. It it weren't, I wouldn't get reimbursed for meals.

If my job requires me to fly or drive somewhere other than my daily home office, I'm on their clock. Not mine.

I call BS on this one. Commuting time is NOT on a professional clock. For example, lawyers can only ethically for spending time doing legal work. They cannot bill you for the time they spend in traffic or on a plane. They can ask you to reimburse expenses - but they do not get paid for travel time.

Commuting= time to and from the typical workspace, not compensated as most employees commute
Travel time= time spent traveling to a different, farther work space, usually temporary, almost always compensated at either a mileage rate or with employer paying transportation, employer frequently compensated for time

Well, the employer isn't compensated for anything. But, no, the employee is not frequently compensated for time unless they are working. For a example, a truck driver is compensated for time, because the driving is work. A lawyer who travels on behalf of a client is not compensated for the act of taking a plane or a train - because is not their work. They are compensated for working on a brief on the train, for example.

And attorney is absolutely compensated for travel for a client. They are on billable hours its a job. If its for training or a conference, no but that's a choice.

NOPE! Actual attorney: we have ethical rules that do not allow for billing for travel time.

Actual attorney: we bill travel time to every client that agrees to pay it and the vast majority do. You are flatly wrong that an attorney and client can’t agree to compensate travel time, or any other non legal task.

[Anonymous]

If you are billing full fees for travel, you are in violation of many ethics opinions. If you are saying you negotiate specifically with clients about out of area travel fees billed at a non-attorney rate, maybe, but I doubt most clients pay for it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Good thing I don’t have to prove myself to you then, hon.

Right, but no one here believes. Your story makes no sense nor does the lie that you are watching someone's kids for free (you are working illegally and getting paid) or the BS that you will get changed to student (will never happy). Good luck on your fictive journey!

I am not watching ''someone's kid'' for free, I am watching my former host kid, who I have looked after since he was 3 months old, for FREE because I rarely see him due to living in another city now. Do former APs who come visit you (if any!) charge you for spending time with your kids? or they do it for free because they actually want to spend time with them? I am not gonna charge my former host family to spend time with a kid that I love and only get to see about once a month now. Lovely of you to pay any former AP everytime they spend time with your children though. It must be awfully hard living your life with the amount of paranoia and distrust you seem to experience.

Here is an insight into my ''fantasy world/fictive journey'' that somehow seem to match the reality I describe:

https://ibb.co/28F0nkd

https://ibb.co/zh1NMXF

I have removed anything too identifying out of respect, not that they would care (I am close to all of my host families and I don't say anything they don't already know) but you might want to give your head a wobble and realize that because some things are things you haven't experienced or wouldn't do, doesn't necessarily mean they are untrue.

I am a HM and I believe your AP story. I recognize some of your posts and you sound like you are a great AP. When I was a first time HM, for our first trip, my AP didn't have a real schedule because we didn't have a schedule either lol, but now I know they appreciate having some kind of schedule during the vacation and I do my best to give them one but we are very flexible and will accommodate AP's needs. I also understand not wanting to go to the same boring place every weekend. I also believe there are AirBnb with no TV (at least a few years ago I stayed in one). Anyway just my 2 cents

THANK YOU. Not that I have anything to prove to anybody but I am a recurrent poster and whilst I am an AP I am not an AP apologist, I don’t believe AP should get superior treatment (I wasn’t even if favor of the AP law-suit though I do agree there should be a change in rates depending on states and number of children/hours) but I do think they deserve consideration (same as anybody else).

I have been the first AP for all of my host families, which has really good sides but also some bad sides because it means the families are often figuring stuff out and the lines between the concept of what’s appropriate to ask a family member to do vs an Au pair can easily get blurry and sometimes crossed. I am glad you realized what works best for your AP (I agree having a rough schedule even if it needs adjustment down the line is often best.) You sound like a very considerate family, that’s awesome and I hope you are enjoying the AP experience!

As for some people not believing Airbnb with no TV exist when they live in a country where children can be left living in the streets and people still die from treatable illnesses due to lack of healthcare, I don’t think I have enough eye rolls to spare. Must be nice living in a world where lack of transportation and a house without TV are a shock to one’s system and something unfathomable, it must be nice to be so privileged as to never having had to experience such things and therefore feeling so entitled to negate this may even occurs. What a life it must be

Thanks for the kind words pp, appreciated!

[Anonymous]

Wow... you realize this. isn’t. about. you. Right?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Wow... you realize this. isn’t. about. you. Right?

Not pp but who is to say who or what this thread is about anymore, it seems the thread has been derailed pages ago and is now an in-war between local lawyers about what they charge and whatever else? I doubt OP is even still around...

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Good thing I don’t have to prove myself to you then, hon.

Right, but no one here believes. Your story makes no sense nor does the lie that you are watching someone's kids for free (you are working illegally and getting paid) or the BS that you will get changed to student (will never happy). Good luck on your fictive journey!

I am not watching ''someone's kid'' for free, I am watching my former host kid, who I have looked after since he was 3 months old, for FREE because I rarely see him due to living in another city now. Do former APs who come visit you (if any!) charge you for spending time with your kids? or they do it for free because they actually want to spend time with them? I am not gonna charge my former host family to spend time with a kid that I love and only get to see about once a month now. Lovely of you to pay any former AP everytime they spend time with your children though. It must be awfully hard living your life with the amount of paranoia and distrust you seem to experience.

Here is an insight into my ''fantasy world/fictive journey'' that somehow seem to match the reality I describe:

https://ibb.co/28F0nkd

https://ibb.co/zh1NMXF

I have removed anything too identifying out of respect, not that they would care (I am close to all of my host families and I don't say anything they don't already know) but you might want to give your head a wobble and realize that because some things are things you haven't experienced or wouldn't do, doesn't necessarily mean they are untrue.

I am a HM and I believe your AP story. I recognize some of your posts and you sound like you are a great AP. When I was a first time HM, for our first trip, my AP didn't have a real schedule because we didn't have a schedule either lol, but now I know they appreciate having some kind of schedule during the vacation and I do my best to give them one but we are very flexible and will accommodate AP's needs. I also understand not wanting to go to the same boring place every weekend. I also believe there are AirBnb with no TV (at least a few years ago I stayed in one). Anyway just my 2 cents

THANK YOU. Not that I have anything to prove to anybody but I am a recurrent poster and whilst I am an AP I am not an AP apologist, I don’t believe AP should get superior treatment (I wasn’t even if favor of the AP law-suit though I do agree there should be a change in rates depending on states and number of children/hours) but I do think they deserve consideration (same as anybody else).

I have been the first AP for all of my host families, which has really good sides but also some bad sides because it means the families are often figuring stuff out and the lines between the concept of what’s appropriate to ask a family member to do vs an Au pair can easily get blurry and sometimes crossed. I am glad you realized what works best for your AP (I agree having a rough schedule even if it needs adjustment down the line is often best.) You sound like a very considerate family, that’s awesome and I hope you are enjoying the AP experience!

As for some people not believing Airbnb with no TV exist when they live in a country where children can be left living in the streets and people still die from treatable illnesses due to lack of healthcare, I don’t think I have enough eye rolls to spare. Must be nice living in a world where lack of transportation and a house without TV are a shock to one’s system and something unfathomable, it must be nice to be so privileged as to never having had to experience such things and therefore feeling so entitled to negate this may even occurs. What a life it must be

Thanks for the kind words pp, appreciated!

Right on, privileged German au pair! For whom whom Hawaii is too boring - and is aghast at it's lack of sidewalks...