Anonymous wrote:

Muslima wrote:Right now, they are putting kids bodies in ice cream coolers because they ran our of room .Some people call Hamas Terrorists and some call them Heroes. Some call Israel a terrorist state and some call it a legitimate state. Children are children, if you kill them intentionally and try to justify the reasons behind doing that, then everybody will call you a terrorist. Period.

I agree with every you say except for the implication of what is in bold. I am 100% certain that Israel is not killing kids intentionally. That kids are dying is a tragedy. But they are not being killed intentionally.

If the militants did not use the area near the shelters as launch sites, if the militants did not use the shelters to store weapons (a war crime, by the way), then shelters would not be hit.

I am not on the ground, so I do not know what is actually happening, but consider the possibility that Hamas militants are firing from the vicinity of shelters...say 20m - 30 m away. Israel responds with artillery or mortars to the launch site. Unfortunately, there is something called Circular Error of probability (CEP). The CEP for the artillery is typically on the order of 10 m, according to http://aviationweek.com/awin/new-israeli-artillery-concepts-technology-combine-0 . With a CEP of 10, that means that there is a 50% chance that the munition will land within 10 m of the target. That is pretty good.

Now, if you launch 100 attacks, 1/2 will miss by more that 10 m, 1/4 or so by more than 20m. So of the 100 rounds, 25 will miss by more that 20 m, but in any direction. A shelter is 20 m from the target....assume the shelter is 20x20 m, and 20m is the closest point. In such a scenario, simulations I did indicate they would have about a 3.5% chance of hitting the shelter. In this scenario, they were not targeting the shelter. The problem is the children are caught in the crossfire, not that they are being intentionally targeted.

What happened in the Dahiya quarter of Beirut in 2006 will happen in every village from which Israel is fired on. […] We will apply disproportionate force on it and cause great damage and destruction there. From our standpoint, these are not civilian villages, they are military bases.

Anonymous wrote:"i didn't know the 2014 rankings were out.". Exactly the problem. You cited their latest rankings without bothering to check, something I did with a simple Google search. In addition your statement about Chile and Korea was just plain inaccurate no matter which year you looked at.

Anonymous wrote:Muslima, Reporters without Borders has Israel ranked 96th and "Palestine" ranked 138th. However, given that the USA is ranked 46th I question how these rankings are created.

Countries that pride themselves on being democracies and respecting the rule of law have not set an example, far from it. Freedom of information is too often sacrificed to an overly broad and abusive interpretation of national security needs, marking a disturbing retreat from democratic practices. Investigative journalism often suffers as a result.
This has been the case in the United States (46th), which fell 13 places, one of the most significant declines, amid increased efforts to track down whistleblowers and the sources of leaks. The trial and conviction of Private Bradley Manning and the pursuit of NSA analyst Edward Snowden were warnings to all those thinking of assisting in the disclosure of sensitive information that would clearly be in the public interest.
US journalists were stunned by the Department of Justice’s seizure of Associated Press phone records without warning in order to identify the source of a CIA leak. It served as a reminder of the urgent need for a “shield law” to protect the confidentiality of journalists’ sources at the federal level. The revival of the legislative process is little consolation for James Risen of The New York Times, who is subject to a court order to testify against a former CIA employee accused of leaking classified information. And less still for Barrett Brown, a young freelance journalist facing 105 years in prison in connection with the posting of information that hackers obtained from Statfor, a private intelligence company with close ties to the federal government.

The 2014 World Press Freedom Index spotlights the negative impact of conflicts on freedom of information and its protagonists. The ranking of some countries has also been affected by a tendency to interpret national security needs in an overly broad and abusive manner to the detriment of the right to inform and be informed. This trend constitutes a growing threat worldwide and is even endangering freedom of information in countries regarded as democracies. Finland tops the index for the fourth year running, closely followed by Netherlands and Norway, like last year. At the other end of the index, the last three positions are again held by Turkmenistan, North Korea and Eritrea, three countries where freedom of information is non-existent. Despite occasional turbulence in the past year, these countries continue to be news and information black holes and living hells for the journalists who inhabit them. This year’s index covers 180 countries, one more than last year. The new entry, Belize, has been assigned an enviable position (29th). Cases of violence against journalists are rare in Belize but there were some problems: defamation suits involving demands for large amounts in damages, national security restrictions on implementation of the Freedom of Information Act and sometimes unfair management of broadcast frequencies.

In Freedom House’s latest report, Israel’s state of press freedom demonstrates just that. In the organization’s 2012 report, Israel scored 30 on a scale of 10 to 97, putting its press freedom status at the bottom of the better “free” category. In the 2013 report, released on May 1, the country lost one point, enough to downgrade it to the top of the next lower category of “partly free,” together with Chile, Namibia and South Korea.

Several recent developments have rattled the country’s press freedom status, and have helped to raise important questions regarding both institutional censorship and self-censorship.

At least in the legal sense, Israel’s relationship with the press would seem to put it at odds with other modern democracies. 65 years since its establishment, Israel has never put into law either freedom of expression or freedom of the press. Moreover, a Press Ordinance, inherited from the pre-state days, stipulates that newspapers and their chief editors require a license, and even empowers the state to shut down publications at its discretion. A number of new laws and bills – such as an anti-boycott law, and a proposed amendment to the libel law – have been called a further threat to freedom of expression and the press.
Internationally, Israel is known as a major news hotspot, but those reporting from the country, predominantly on the longstanding Israeli-Palestinian conflict, are at times restricted. Press freedom and human rights advocates often point to Israel’s conduct in the occupied Palestinian territories as inhibiting journalists – Palestinian and international alike – from operating freely. Moreover, Palestinian groups as well as the Foreign Press Association have accused the Israeli army of harassing, arresting and attacking reporters and avoiding carrying out thorough investigations into such incidents. Recent press freedom assessments harshly criticized Israel for targeting media personnel during Operation Pillar of Defense in Gaza in 2012, specifically for killing a crew from Hamas’ Al Aqsa TV.

Consequently, Reporters without Borders’ (RwB) latest Press Freedom Index ranked Israel at a record-low 112th place. The 20-position drop in the index was explained by “the Israeli military’s targeting of journalists in the Palestinian Territories,” which as the report itself indicates, previous reports classified separately.” A separate, and even lower score remains for Palestine.

An Israeli news addict will have a hard time finding out from Hebrew sources about the deaths in Gaza or the names of civilian victims there. The motto of Yisrael Hayom, Israel's most widely circulated daily newspaper, is “Remember we are Israelis.” And I guess that's why its Wednesday’s morning edition didn't contain a word on the civilian casualties.

As the sole democracy in the Middle East, as it likes to define itself, the state of Israel has an interesting way of practicing journalism. All Israeli news stories about military activities are subject to military censorship. That means authorities have pre-approved every item the public receives.

Furthermore, most correspondents have a cozy relationship with the military. In order to get access to information, they must go through a security clearance and accreditation process controlled by the very same organization they cover.

Anonymous wrote:

Muslima wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Muslima wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Muslima, even Ban Ki-Moon said Hamas broke it. You sure lose credibility when you quote Hamas. Not exactly the authorities of truth!

Jeff, the Jeffrey Goldberg piece is actually really good. You should finish reading. Regardless where Hadar was abducted, things are not going to get better. Israel will do anything to get their people back.

This is what Ban Ki Moon said :

" This would constitute a grave violation of the cease-fire, and one that is likely to have very serious consequences for the people of Gaza, Israel and beyond," said. "Such moves call into question the credibility of Hamas' assurances to the United Nations."

Noting that the UN has no independent means to verify what happened on ground, Ban said he is deeply concerned about the resumption of Israeli attacks on Gaza and the killing of over 50 Palestinians this morning. 

"Instead of giving both sides, especially Gazan civilians, a much needed reprieve to let them attend to their injured, bury their dead and repair vital infrastructure, this breach of the ceasefire is now leading to a renewed escalation," Ban's spokesman said. 

"The Secretary-General urges both sides to show maximum restraint and return to the agreed 72-hour humanitarian ceasefire that tragically lasted such a brief period of time," he said. 

Talk about selective quoting. Here is a link to the statement, right from the UN itself:

http://www.un.org/sg/statements/index.asp?nid=7901

The Secretary-General condemns in the strongest terms the reported violation by Hamas of the mutually agreed humanitarian ceasefire which commenced this morning. He is shocked and profoundly disappointed by these developments.

The Secretary-General notes that the UN has no independent means to verify exactly what happened. According to the latest reports, two IDF soldiers were killed and one taken captive after the humanitarian ceasefire came into effect. This would constitute a grave violation of the ceasefire, and one that is likely to have very serious consequences for the people of Gaza, Israel and beyond. Such moves call into question the credibility of Hamas' assurances to the United Nations. The Secretary-General demands the immediate and unconditional release of the captured soldier.

The Secretary-General is deeply concerned about the resumption of Israeli attacks on Gaza and the killing of over 70 Palestinians this morning. Instead of giving both sides, especially Gazan civilians, a much needed reprieve to let them attend to their injured, bury their dead and repair vital infrastructure, this breach of the ceasefire is now leading to a renewed escalation.

The Secretary-General urges both sides to show maximum restraint and return to the agreed 72-hour humanitarian ceasefire that tragically lasted such a brief period of time. He also urges those with influence over the parties to do everything to convince them to observe the humanitarian ceasefire.

Waiting to hear Jeff criticize Muslims for improper use of sources. That is just shameless if you want people to listen to you, you need credibility.

Muslima, not Muslims.

Whatever you're drinking, keep drinking more of it! What exactly is the difference between what I cited and whatever you copied pasted? Wow!

Seriously!? You edited the quote to fit your argument. If you can't see the difference between what was actually said and the fiction that you created than forget credibility, there is no point in even engaging you since it clear that you're not interested in arguing in good faith.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Muslima, I have noticed that this thread is full of mistakes and misinformation. Please go out and read a book or authoritative source about different religions. I get tips on baking or saving money on DCUM, not spiritual matters.

People especially seem to have a lot of confusion and misinformation about Catholicism, even Catholics!

Anonymous wrote:

Muslima wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Muslima,

I am a reform jew. I am not particularly observant -- I do not keep kosher and observe the sabbath in the way I choose...I will use power, and will drive to synagog.

If you are interested, I am sure you would be welcome at many synagogs for friday or saturday services. I am confident my synagog would be welcoming (Temple Rodef Shalom in Falls Church). If you do come to services, please be aware, you will here strongly pro-israeli speak, even if specific policies are debated.

At my synagog, people are very supportive of Israel, even though we want to see some policies change.

To be honest, though id love to , I'd be bit scared to go to a synagogue. I have been to churches before but never dared enter in a synagogue, especially now with all the Israeli-Palestinian discourse. I've already lost 2 Jewish and one Israeli friend over it and they unfriended me on Fbook as well, so I know it's an emotional topic.

Wait until things settle down. They will settle down. At my synagog, you would probably be safe. There is heightened security, though, and people might question you. If you were to come, I would encourage you to reach out to the clergy first.

In general, jews do not try to convert. And we alway pray for peace.

Anonymous wrote:I was watching CNN this morning about the missing Israeli soldier. He was variously described as having been abducted or held hostage.

The reality is that this is a war and he is a soldier who was captured.

This is quite apart from the all out focus on a single Israeli SOLDIER as if it was the ultimate tragedy when the death and injury to dozens of Palestinians CIVILIANS today was mentioned as an after thought.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Muslima wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Muslima, even Ban Ki-Moon said Hamas broke it. You sure lose credibility when you quote Hamas. Not exactly the authorities of truth!

Jeff, the Jeffrey Goldberg piece is actually really good. You should finish reading. Regardless where Hadar was abducted, things are not going to get better. Israel will do anything to get their people back.

This is what Ban Ki Moon said :

" This would constitute a grave violation of the cease-fire, and one that is likely to have very serious consequences for the people of Gaza, Israel and beyond," said. "Such moves call into question the credibility of Hamas' assurances to the United Nations."

Noting that the UN has no independent means to verify what happened on ground, Ban said he is deeply concerned about the resumption of Israeli attacks on Gaza and the killing of over 50 Palestinians this morning. 

"Instead of giving both sides, especially Gazan civilians, a much needed reprieve to let them attend to their injured, bury their dead and repair vital infrastructure, this breach of the ceasefire is now leading to a renewed escalation," Ban's spokesman said. 

"The Secretary-General urges both sides to show maximum restraint and return to the agreed 72-hour humanitarian ceasefire that tragically lasted such a brief period of time," he said. 

Talk about selective quoting. Here is a link to the statement, right from the UN itself:

http://www.un.org/sg/statements/index.asp?nid=7901

The Secretary-General condemns in the strongest terms the reported violation by Hamas of the mutually agreed humanitarian ceasefire which commenced this morning. He is shocked and profoundly disappointed by these developments.

The Secretary-General notes that the UN has no independent means to verify exactly what happened. According to the latest reports, two IDF soldiers were killed and one taken captive after the humanitarian ceasefire came into effect. This would constitute a grave violation of the ceasefire, and one that is likely to have very serious consequences for the people of Gaza, Israel and beyond. Such moves call into question the credibility of Hamas' assurances to the United Nations. The Secretary-General demands the immediate and unconditional release of the captured soldier.

The Secretary-General is deeply concerned about the resumption of Israeli attacks on Gaza and the killing of over 70 Palestinians this morning. Instead of giving both sides, especially Gazan civilians, a much needed reprieve to let them attend to their injured, bury their dead and repair vital infrastructure, this breach of the ceasefire is now leading to a renewed escalation.

The Secretary-General urges both sides to show maximum restraint and return to the agreed 72-hour humanitarian ceasefire that tragically lasted such a brief period of time. He also urges those with influence over the parties to do everything to convince them to observe the humanitarian ceasefire.

Waiting to hear Jeff criticize Muslims for improper use of sources. That is just shameless if you want people to listen to you, you need credibility.

Muslima, not Muslims.