1. Man should fully cover his awrah.
2. Men's clothes should be loose enough so as not
to describe what he is covering (his awrah).
3. They should be thick enough so as not to describe the color of the skin or the parts
required to be covered.
4. They should not be designed in a way to attract
attention. The basic rule of modesty and avoiding "show off" applies to all believers’ men and women. Source: http://www.icmtn.org/forms/women_dress.pdf
Anonymous wrote:Muslima wrote:Anonymous wrote:QUESTION
Islam has certain rules of physcial modesty for women, for covering up, once they are a certain age. Some muslim women cover more than others.
Does Islams have any modesty rule like for males at all? Or would (hypotheticlly, of course) females be free to see males nude and the men would not technically be in violation of any muslim law?
Thanks in advance for your answer.
Modesty is required in Islam for both men and women. It is not solely about the way they dress but modesty in action and character as well. Both are also asked to lower their gaze. The Prophet, peace be upon him said: ‘Every religion has a character, and the character of Islam is modesty.’
why do women have to dress a certain way but men have no similar restriction?
Anonymous wrote:QUESTION
Islam has certain rules of physcial modesty for women, for covering up, once they are a certain age. Some muslim women cover more than others.
Does Islams have any modesty rule like for males at all? Or would (hypotheticlly, of course) females be free to see males nude and the men would not technically be in violation of any muslim law?
Thanks in advance for your answer.
Anonymous wrote:Muslima wrote:Anonymous wrote:Muslima wrote:Anonymous wrote:Muslima wrote:
The Op asked what Islam said about divorce and that's what I responded to. The fact that some imams don't follow this has nothing to do with Islam. Just like in the US, you will find Christian, Jewish, atheists, ect women who have to fight for years to get a divorce. Every case is different and the complexities of divorce or each case can't be summed up here. There is nothing in the text of the Quran or hadiths that make getting a divorce difficult, not for the woman or the man, really it shouldn't be that difficult. Citing examples about women who couldn't get a divorce for x, y reason doesn't change this either and saying it's hard to find an imam to grant a divorce to a woman is really false. I know a multitude of women who got divorced here in the US and in Muslim countries and I have yet had to meet one who had any issues of getting a divorce or an imam who refused to grant her a divorce, not a single one. In fact I am one of those women. I got divorced at my request and it took 5 minutes if that much , really lol.
Our niece in KSA had to pay her drug addicted husband 50K before he would agree to a divorce. He'd show up to court stoned out of his mind wearing dark glasses, and the judge would still say, you need sabr, my daughter, go home and reconcile with your husband.
Muslima wrote:
As far as children custody, saying some women are denied custody after a certain age is not correct. There are clear custody rules as well and all the 4 schools of though of Islam have different custody rulings. But for all of them, when the kids are young, they stay with the mother. If she remarries, the father gets custody. In practice though , this is rarely followed, all women that I know still had custody of their kids even after remarriage, men usually never go back to court just for custody, not saying some don't, but most do not.
I think you need to make up your mind whether the scripture or the practice matters most. In your first paragraph you say that what is in the Quran matters most, and it doesn't matter what some imams do. In this paragraph you say that fathers are entitled to custody if the mother remarries but it rarely happens in practice. If you are all about the scripture, then what happens in practice shouldn't matter. If you are all about the practice, then what is written in the scripture shouldn't matter. You cannot remain intellectually honest and say that it doesn't matter what some imams do but it matters what some fathers do.
That's unfortunate for your niece, but really KSA? You do know that they are not the beacon of Islamic enlightenment and this is not the norm in the Muslim world.
Now as far as your simplistic argument about practice/texts, it just shows how little you know about Islam. Of course the Quran supersede practice. Newsflash for you, there is nothing in the Quran about child custody, so the texts im referring to when talking about custody are hadiths and shariah I-e Islamic jurisprudence which is man-made so not set in stone. Shariah changes according to context, time and place. Now When I cited texts earlier and said the text said so , I was referring to the Quran since divorce is discussed in the Quran, the is an entire chapter about it, so in the case of divorce shariah can't supersede the Quran.
I see. So your argument is, is it not, that practice matters when referring to hadith and shariah, but does not matter when referring to the Quran? Is that the gist of it?
Then please, o the enlightened one, cite for us what the Quran says on women-initiated divorces.
Please also tell us when the last change to shariah was made, with dates, if possible.
Google it! Self-imposed ignorance isn't bliss and I don't have the patience, the will or time to educate you.
That's 'cause you can't.
Anonymous wrote:Muslima wrote:Anonymous wrote:Muslima wrote:
The Op asked what Islam said about divorce and that's what I responded to. The fact that some imams don't follow this has nothing to do with Islam. Just like in the US, you will find Christian, Jewish, atheists, ect women who have to fight for years to get a divorce. Every case is different and the complexities of divorce or each case can't be summed up here. There is nothing in the text of the Quran or hadiths that make getting a divorce difficult, not for the woman or the man, really it shouldn't be that difficult. Citing examples about women who couldn't get a divorce for x, y reason doesn't change this either and saying it's hard to find an imam to grant a divorce to a woman is really false. I know a multitude of women who got divorced here in the US and in Muslim countries and I have yet had to meet one who had any issues of getting a divorce or an imam who refused to grant her a divorce, not a single one. In fact I am one of those women. I got divorced at my request and it took 5 minutes if that much , really lol.
Our niece in KSA had to pay her drug addicted husband 50K before he would agree to a divorce. He'd show up to court stoned out of his mind wearing dark glasses, and the judge would still say, you need sabr, my daughter, go home and reconcile with your husband.
Muslima wrote:
As far as children custody, saying some women are denied custody after a certain age is not correct. There are clear custody rules as well and all the 4 schools of though of Islam have different custody rulings. But for all of them, when the kids are young, they stay with the mother. If she remarries, the father gets custody. In practice though , this is rarely followed, all women that I know still had custody of their kids even after remarriage, men usually never go back to court just for custody, not saying some don't, but most do not.
I think you need to make up your mind whether the scripture or the practice matters most. In your first paragraph you say that what is in the Quran matters most, and it doesn't matter what some imams do. In this paragraph you say that fathers are entitled to custody if the mother remarries but it rarely happens in practice. If you are all about the scripture, then what happens in practice shouldn't matter. If you are all about the practice, then what is written in the scripture shouldn't matter. You cannot remain intellectually honest and say that it doesn't matter what some imams do but it matters what some fathers do.
That's unfortunate for your niece, but really KSA? You do know that they are not the beacon of Islamic enlightenment and this is not the norm in the Muslim world.
Now as far as your simplistic argument about practice/texts, it just shows how little you know about Islam. Of course the Quran supersede practice. Newsflash for you, there is nothing in the Quran about child custody, so the texts im referring to when talking about custody are hadiths and shariah I-e Islamic jurisprudence which is man-made so not set in stone. Shariah changes according to context, time and place. Now When I cited texts earlier and said the text said so , I was referring to the Quran since divorce is discussed in the Quran, the is an entire chapter about it, so in the case of divorce shariah can't supersede the Quran.
I see. So your argument is, is it not, that practice matters when referring to hadith and shariah, but does not matter when referring to the Quran? Is that the gist of it?
Then please, o the enlightened one, cite for us what the Quran says on women-initiated divorces.
Please also tell us when the last change to shariah was made, with dates, if possible.
Anonymous wrote:Muslima wrote:Anonymous wrote:Muslima wrote:Anonymous wrote:Muslima wrote:Anonymous wrote:.
Op, yes divorce is allowed in Islam. Both muslim men and women have been getting divorces since the 7th century. The only time a divorce cant be granted is when the woman is menstruating or if she is pregnant. Also , there is a 3 months waiting period called the Iddah , I guess this would be similar to separation period, before the divorce becomes final. During the iddah, the couple can reconcile which will nullify the divorce but after the iddah, they have to remarry If they want to get back together.
No, not "the couple can reconcile". The man decides whether he takes the wife back or not during these three months. The wife's opinion is not a factor.
That's completely false. Wives are not animals. The wife has an opinion and a say in this, there is no Forced Marriage in Islam
It's in the article that you yourself posted.
"In case divorce happens through the husband, he can take his wife back within three months."
If the wife does not wish to reconcile during a three-month separation period after the husband-initiated divorce, she will need to start her own divorce proceedings. In a husband-initiated divorce, it's the husband decision alone that decides whether the wife is divorced or kept.
He can take his wife back doesn't mean against her will. Where did it say that? And it cites the husband as taking the wife, because the opposite is not possible. A woman can't marry herself in Islam. You can't take your wife back against her will, forced marriages are invalid
Right here. You can bring your own ruling if you wish.
http://islamqa.info/en/75027
The wife’s consent is not a condition of taking her back after divorce
The husband has the right to take his wife back and it is not essential that she agree to that, so long as he is taking her back within the ‘iddah of a first or second talaaq, because Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):
“And divorced women shall wait (as regards their marriage) for three menstrual periods, and it is not lawful for them to conceal what Allaah has created in their wombs, if they believe in Allaah and the Last Day. And their husbands have the better right to take them back in that period, if they wish for reconciliation. And they (women) have rights (over their husbands as regards living expenses) similar (to those of their husbands) over them (as regards obedience and respect) to what is reasonable, but men have a degree (of responsibility) over them. And Allaah is All-Mighty, All-Wise”
[al-Baqarah 2:228]
This verse points to the conditions of taking back the wife, which are:
1- That it applies to talaaq (divorce). If it is the matter of annulment of the marriage, the husband cannot take her back, because Allaah says “And divorced women”.
2- That it should be a revocable divorce, which can only be a first or second talaaq. The phrase “The divorce is twice” [al-Baqarah 2:229] refers to the divorce where it is possible to take back the wife. If the third talaaq takes place, then he cannot take her back unless she marries another husband in a genuine marriage, then he separates from her in a proper manner after consummating the marriage.
3- It should be within the ‘iddah period, because Allaah says “And their husbands have the better right to take them back in that period” i.e., during the ‘iddah. If the ‘iddah comes to an end and he wants to take her back, that is only possible with a new marriage contract and mahr.
4- By taking her back, he should not intend to harm her, rather he should intend to reconcile and set things straight, because Allaah says “if they wish for reconciliation”. If he intended to harm her, she has to prove that to the shar’i judge so that he may rule as he sees fit.
The verse clearly indicates that the wife has no choice in the matter if the husband wants to take her back, and she has no right to refuse to go back to him, because Allaah says “And their husbands have the better right to take them back”. Even if she does not go back to his house, if he says he takes her back and brings witnesses to that, then he has in fact taken her back.
The waiting period (idda) for the woman will be similar to that of a woman who was given an irrevocable divorce (ba’in) which is three menstrual cycles. The husband can not take her back within or after the waiting period without her consent (by contracting a new agreement of marriage).
Finally, it should also be remembered that a Khul’ agreement can only be carried out with the consent of the husband. The wife does not have the jurisdiction to enforce Khul’ without the consent of her husband. This is an agreed upon ruling in all of the four Sunni schools of Islamic law.
The great Hanafi jurist, Imam al-Sarakhsi says:
“An agreement of Khul’ is permissible with or without the presence of a judge, as it is a contract that is based on mutual agreement.” (al-Mabsut, 6/173)
The same has also been mentioned in Radd al-Muhtar, al-Fatawa al-Hindiyya and other major works.
Anonymous wrote:Muslima wrote:
The Op asked what Islam said about divorce and that's what I responded to. The fact that some imams don't follow this has nothing to do with Islam. Just like in the US, you will find Christian, Jewish, atheists, ect women who have to fight for years to get a divorce. Every case is different and the complexities of divorce or each case can't be summed up here. There is nothing in the text of the Quran or hadiths that make getting a divorce difficult, not for the woman or the man, really it shouldn't be that difficult. Citing examples about women who couldn't get a divorce for x, y reason doesn't change this either and saying it's hard to find an imam to grant a divorce to a woman is really false. I know a multitude of women who got divorced here in the US and in Muslim countries and I have yet had to meet one who had any issues of getting a divorce or an imam who refused to grant her a divorce, not a single one. In fact I am one of those women. I got divorced at my request and it took 5 minutes if that much , really lol.
Our niece in KSA had to pay her drug addicted husband 50K before he would agree to a divorce. He'd show up to court stoned out of his mind wearing dark glasses, and the judge would still say, you need sabr, my daughter, go home and reconcile with your husband.
Muslima wrote:
As far as children custody, saying some women are denied custody after a certain age is not correct. There are clear custody rules as well and all the 4 schools of though of Islam have different custody rulings. But for all of them, when the kids are young, they stay with the mother. If she remarries, the father gets custody. In practice though , this is rarely followed, all women that I know still had custody of their kids even after remarriage, men usually never go back to court just for custody, not saying some don't, but most do not.
I think you need to make up your mind whether the scripture or the practice matters most. In your first paragraph you say that what is in the Quran matters most, and it doesn't matter what some imams do. In this paragraph you say that fathers are entitled to custody if the mother remarries but it rarely happens in practice. If you are all about the scripture, then what happens in practice shouldn't matter. If you are all about the practice, then what is written in the scripture shouldn't matter. You cannot remain intellectually honest and say that it doesn't matter what some imams do but it matters what some fathers do.
Anonymous wrote:Muslima wrote:Anonymous wrote:Muslima wrote:Anonymous wrote:.
Op, yes divorce is allowed in Islam. Both muslim men and women have been getting divorces since the 7th century. The only time a divorce cant be granted is when the woman is menstruating or if she is pregnant. Also , there is a 3 months waiting period called the Iddah , I guess this would be similar to separation period, before the divorce becomes final. During the iddah, the couple can reconcile which will nullify the divorce but after the iddah, they have to remarry If they want to get back together.
No, not "the couple can reconcile". The man decides whether he takes the wife back or not during these three months. The wife's opinion is not a factor.
That's completely false. Wives are not animals. The wife has an opinion and a say in this, there is no Forced Marriage in Islam
It's in the article that you yourself posted.
"In case divorce happens through the husband, he can take his wife back within three months."
If the wife does not wish to reconcile during a three-month separation period after the husband-initiated divorce, she will need to start her own divorce proceedings. In a husband-initiated divorce, it's the husband decision alone that decides whether the wife is divorced or kept.
Anonymous wrote:Muslima wrote:Anonymous wrote:.
Op, yes divorce is allowed in Islam. Both muslim men and women have been getting divorces since the 7th century. The only time a divorce cant be granted is when the woman is menstruating or if she is pregnant. Also , there is a 3 months waiting period called the Iddah , I guess this would be similar to separation period, before the divorce becomes final. During the iddah, the couple can reconcile which will nullify the divorce but after the iddah, they have to remarry If they want to get back together.
No, not "the couple can reconcile". The man decides whether he takes the wife back or not during these three months. The wife's opinion is not a factor.
Anonymous wrote:Muslima wrote:Anonymous wrote:Above is for men. Women do not have the right of divorce automatically, although they can write it into the marriage contract. Obviously, however, writing it in raises eyebrows so socially may be difficult to pull off.
Other than that, a woman can petition the Islamic court for a divorce for cause. Depending on the country, this could be extremely hard to obtain, even with more dire reasons like the husband is imprisoned or is a drug addict. Taking a second wife would not be cause for divorce as Muslim men are permitted more than one wife.
False again! Both men and women have the right to get a divorce for any reason and yes you can get a divorce if your husband gets a 2nd wife, you can get a divorce if you hate his guts , you can get a divorce just because you don't like him, really you can get a divorce for almost anything. The only difference between a husband and wife is
1., A husband has the right to divorce his wife at any time by just saying I divorce you and having the intention to divorce her.
2. A wife needs to ask for her husband to divorce her, ie she can't just say I divorce you and sever the marriage. She had to ask him and he has to agree to divorce her. If he doesn't agree, she can go to any imam and ask for a divorce, at which point the imam will grant a divorce whether the husband wants it or not.
True--forgot the step where she can ask her husband to divorce her because in practice this is often not readily agreed to. There are plenty of cases where the religious authorities will not grant the woman her request to divorce where her husband disagrees but rather encourage her to try reconciliation instead.
As I said, this depends on the country--imams in Lebanon would more likely grant the request than those in Afghanistan. But it is not a walk in the park in the U.S. even. As this article shows, women often go "imam shopping" for years to find one that will grant her a divorce, even in relatively straightforward cases of physical abuse.
http://www.arabamericannews.com/news/news/id_7475
Also, in cases of divorce women are almost always denied custody of their children if they are over a certain age.
Anonymous wrote:.
Anonymous wrote:Above is for men. Women do not have the right of divorce automatically, although they can write it into the marriage contract. Obviously, however, writing it in raises eyebrows so socially may be difficult to pull off.
Other than that, a woman can petition the Islamic court for a divorce for cause. Depending on the country, this could be extremely hard to obtain, even with more dire reasons like the husband is imprisoned or is a drug addict. Taking a second wife would not be cause for divorce as Muslim men are permitted more than one wife.
Anonymous wrote:You have to say Talaq, Talaq, Talaq - 3 times to your wife in front of witnesses.
If you divorce her once and want to remarry her, she will need to marry another person first, consummate that marriage and hope that he divorces her before you can marry her again.
A clever way to ensure that people do not divorce for trivial reasons.
Anonymous wrote:Muslima wrote:Anonymous wrote:aeropress deal at amazon for $20. Will make a great present for dh to use at work.
Also kids wifi headphones.
where did you get the wifi headphones from? and what brand?
Amazon, LilGadgets untangled pro children's wireless Bluetooth headphones. 33% off. the discount is still on.
They go with the big present this year, which also were deals especially if you have amazon prime, kindle fires for the kids.
But also scored a lands end coat for 40% off and free shipping, and didn't have to fight any crowds. Nice!