Octuplet mom: Can you justify that level of anger in public?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
Why don't we make an argument that these families just should have gotten a better education when they were younger? Perhaps then they wouldn't be out of work, then wouldn't need state assistance.

Is this just a hypothetical? Are you the pp who mentioned that if one is unemployed now, it's bc they went to a community college and studied fashion? If so, it just seems like such a sad simplification of people who are jobless and homeless now. I heard on the news a few nights ago that there are PhD's and former bank VP's who are living in homeless shelters.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I think you are overreacting. No one on this board has suggested that they wish Nadya dead. And , in fact, many people have posted that they wish the babies could have parents who are responsible, loving and mature--ie--adoptive parents. Those babies are darling and they each deserve a chance at a wonderful life. Many doubt that Nadya has the emotional maturity to provide this.And , I believe, time will show this to be true.(As has already been shown to be true with her previous 6)

What is the proof that she is an irresponsible mother with the 6 she has? That she chose to do another invitro? She was trying for a 7th child, not 14. It is so common for Arab (and Jewish and Mormon and Catholic ) families to have lots of children.

So is your proof that she could not afford the 6 she had? Well her family was affording them. In her Arab culture, many extended families stay together and work things out together financially. Not every Arab family, but for some.

Again, lots of parents do stupid things at 33 or even older. There is a thread that was started talking about a mom who leaves her DC in the car while running errands. Now, that's stupid!

The best thing for children is to remain with their biological mother, providing she is stable enough to care for them. Courts will look to see if the mom does not have the resources if she has help. In this case, she has her parents who have been helping her. Having invitro while single doesn't make you incapable of being a decent mother. Having invitro and expecting your parents to support them, if that is what's sometimes done in your culture, doesn't make you incapable of being a decent mother either.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:[
Have you already forgotten about the race riots in London last summer?!!!!

Or in Paris 2 years ago?

The Paris riots were due to African immigrants who were discriminated. We have riots, sometimes on a smaller scale, here all the time - when white cops shoot blacks for sometimes little provocation, for black men being tied and dragged by a car, abandoning predominantly blacks in New Orleans after Katrina, and we've got a horrible legacy of slavery which can never be erased from the minds of black people. So lets not go to the subject of determining if our country has historically treated blacks well because you won't succeed in proving they treated blacks generally well.

Instead of picking one or two incidents or one or two countries to prove how intolerant Europeans are of others, lets look at ourselves to see how good a job we do of supporting our own needy folk.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Why don't we make an argument that these families just should have gotten a better education when they were younger? Perhaps then they wouldn't be out of work, then wouldn't need state assistance.

Is this just a hypothetical? Are you the pp who mentioned that if one is unemployed now, it's bc they went to a community college and studied fashion? If so, it just seems like such a sad simplification of people who are jobless and homeless now. I heard on the news a few nights ago that there are PhD's and former bank VP's who are living in homeless shelters.

Would love to get the statistics on that. I want to see the % of PhD's living in homeless shelters.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think you are overreacting. No one on this board has suggested that they wish Nadya dead. And , in fact, many people have posted that they wish the babies could have parents who are responsible, loving and mature--ie--adoptive parents. Those babies are darling and they each deserve a chance at a wonderful life. Many doubt that Nadya has the emotional maturity to provide this.And , I believe, time will show this to be true.(As has already been shown to be true with her previous 6)

What is the proof that she is an irresponsible mother with the 6 she has? That she chose to do another invitro? She was trying for a 7th child, not 14. It is so common for Arab (and Jewish and Mormon and Catholic ) families to have lots of children.

So is your proof that she could not afford the 6 she had? Well her family was affording them. In her Arab culture, many extended families stay together and work things out together financially. Not every Arab family, but for some.

Again, lots of parents do stupid things at 33 or even older. There is a thread that was started talking about a mom who leaves her DC in the car while running errands. Now, that's stupid!

The best thing for children is to remain with their biological mother, providing she is stable enough to care for them. Courts will look to see if the mom does not have the resources if she has help. In this case, she has her parents who have been helping her. Having invitro while single doesn't make you incapable of being a decent mother. Having invitro and expecting your parents to support them, if that is what's sometimes done in your culture, doesn't make you incapable of being a decent mother either.

I really cannot believe people are defending this woman. I think that she is a lousy mother because she continued having kids even after having two with special needs. An autistic child requires time, money and early intervention to make a difference in the long run. I think she is a lousy mother because she doesn't have money to support her kids but she somehow found enough money to have a boatload of plastic surgery so she could look like Angelina Jolie. I think that she is a lousy mother because she was recently spotted shopping for make-up at MAC while her eight infants remained in the NICU. The list goes on and on. She has the right to do whatever the hell she wants but just don't ask the rest of us to pay for her self-indulgent behavior.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think you are overreacting. No one on this board has suggested that they wish Nadya dead. And , in fact, many people have posted that they wish the babies could have parents who are responsible, loving and mature--ie--adoptive parents. Those babies are darling and they each deserve a chance at a wonderful life. Many doubt that Nadya has the emotional maturity to provide this.And , I believe, time will show this to be true.(As has already been shown to be true with her previous 6)

What is the proof that she is an irresponsible mother with the 6 she has? That she chose to do another invitro? She was trying for a 7th child, not 14. It is so common for Arab (and Jewish and Mormon and Catholic ) families to have lots of children.

So is your proof that she could not afford the 6 she had? Well her family was affording them. In her Arab culture, many extended families stay together and work things out together financially. Not every Arab family, but for some.

Again, lots of parents do stupid things at 33 or even older. There is a thread that was started talking about a mom who leaves her DC in the car while running errands. Now, that's stupid!

The best thing for children is to remain with their biological mother, providing she is stable enough to care for them. Courts will look to see if the mom does not have the resources if she has help. In this case, she has her parents who have been helping her. Having invitro while single doesn't make you incapable of being a decent mother. Having invitro and expecting your parents to support them, if that is what's sometimes done in your culture, doesn't make you incapable of being a decent mother either.

How is her Arab family affording them? Last I heard, they were probably going to lose their house to foreclosure. Ask the bank how well the family is affording their house payments. Meanwhile, ol' Mom is receiving food stamps and disability payments. Is this your definition of "affording them"?

[Anonymous]

I do have to take exception with the comment that she could afford the 6 children she already had. She and the children are living with her mother in a house that is undergoing foreclosure. She was already receiving public assistance in the form of food stamps and well as payments for three of her children that have some form of disability. Plus she admits to having at least $50,000 in student loans. Her income over the last 10 years has consisted of disability benefits. Obviously her parents have been supporting her and her children, but the load has sent them into financial trouble (i.e., foreclosure, etc). I do think it was wrong of her to even consider having a 7th child at this time. Why did she need to implant the embryos now? Why not keep them frozen and use them down the road when she might have been better able to care for the children financially as well as emotionally?

I think the real crime here though is the emotional train wreck for her children. It is impossible for a single mother to "be there" for all 14 of these children -- all of whom are under the age of 8, 10 of which are 2 and younger, and 3 of which have autism and or developmental delays. BTW -- one of the children DOES have autism while a 2nd one is showing some autism signs, and a 3rd has speech delays. Who knows if any of the octuplets will have any problems. Being the mother of 4 young children including twins, I can tell you that it is tough to give each child the amount of one-on-one time and attention that each deserves. I try to tuck each one in individually at night. I find this especially important with the older ones as it give us that one-on-one time to discuss their day and how they are feeling about things in general. Sure there will be volunteers to help out at the beginning (this is just plain necessary), but in the long term each child deserves a constant person in their lives who is there when the child needs them - whether to discuss problems, celebrate achievements, or just feel loved. I think this is possible even in extremely large families, but only in cases where the children are more spread out in age and where there is a mother and father present (at least for the initial years). All the monetary donations in the world are not going to solve this problem.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:[
Have you already forgotten about the race riots in London last summer?!!!!

Or in Paris 2 years ago?

The Paris riots were due to African immigrants who were discriminated. We have riots, sometimes on a smaller scale, here all the time - when white cops shoot blacks for sometimes little provocation, for black men being tied and dragged by a car, abandoning predominantly blacks in New Orleans after Katrina, and we've got a horrible legacy of slavery which can never be erased from the minds of black people. So lets not go to the subject of determining if our country has historically treated blacks well because you won't succeed in proving they treated blacks generally well.

Instead of picking one or two incidents or one or two countries to prove how intolerant Europeans are of others, lets look at ourselves to see how good a job we do of supporting our own needy folk.

Well, from what I read, the riot was a consequence of the African immigrants' economic plight. They live in the ghetto suburbs where public transport is infrequent so they cannot get to a job with ease which leaves them in this cycle of not getting anywhere financially.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think you are overreacting. No one on this board has suggested that they wish Nadya dead. And , in fact, many people have posted that they wish the babies could have parents who are responsible, loving and mature--ie--adoptive parents. Those babies are darling and they each deserve a chance at a wonderful life. Many doubt that Nadya has the emotional maturity to provide this.And , I believe, time will show this to be true.(As has already been shown to be true with her previous 6)

What is the proof that she is an irresponsible mother with the 6 she has? That she chose to do another invitro? She was trying for a 7th child, not 14. It is so common for Arab (and Jewish and Mormon and Catholic ) families to have lots of children.

So is your proof that she could not afford the 6 she had? Well her family was affording them. In her Arab culture, many extended families stay together and work things out together financially. Not every Arab family, but for some.
Again, lots of parents do stupid things at 33 or even older. There is a thread that was started talking about a mom who leaves her DC in the car while running errands. Now, that's stupid!

The best thing for children is to remain with their biological mother, providing she is stable enough to care for them. Courts will look to see if the mom does not have the resources if she has help. In this case, she has her parents who have been helping her. Having invitro while single doesn't make you incapable of being a decent mother. Having invitro and expecting your parents to support them, if that is what's sometimes done in your culture, doesn't make you incapable of being a decent mother either.

I respectfully disagree. That's not very common in Arab culture. It is, however, absolutely uncommon among Arab families to have children out of wedlock....

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think you are overreacting. No one on this board has suggested that they wish Nadya dead. And , in fact, many people have posted that they wish the babies could have parents who are responsible, loving and mature--ie--adoptive parents. Those babies are darling and they each deserve a chance at a wonderful life. Many doubt that Nadya has the emotional maturity to provide this.And , I believe, time will show this to be true.(As has already been shown to be true with her previous 6)

What is the proof that she is an irresponsible mother with the 6 she has? That she chose to do another invitro? She was trying for a 7th child, not 14. It is so common for Arab (and Jewish and Mormon and Catholic ) families to have lots of children.

So is your proof that she could not afford the 6 she had? Well her family was affording them. In her Arab culture, many extended families stay together and work things out together financially. Not every Arab family, but for some.
Again, lots of parents do stupid things at 33 or even older. There is a thread that was started talking about a mom who leaves her DC in the car while running errands. Now, that's stupid!

The best thing for children is to remain with their biological mother, providing she is stable enough to care for them. Courts will look to see if the mom does not have the resources if she has help. In this case, she has her parents who have been helping her. Having invitro while single doesn't make you incapable of being a decent mother. Having invitro and expecting your parents to support them, if that is what's sometimes done in your culture, doesn't make you incapable of being a decent mother either.

I respectfully disagree. That's not very common in Arab culture. It is, however, absolutely uncommon among Arab families to have children out of wedlock....

She's a Christian Arab, not a Muslim Arab. This would be unheard of among Muslim Arabs if they follow their religion because it's forbidden in Islam to have a child through a sperm donor.

[Anonymous]

"In her Arab culture, many extended families stay together and work things out together financially. Not every Arab family, but for some. "

The grandmother is from eastern Europe......

[Anonymous]

Some of the points brought up on this page were discussed pages ago already.

Foreclosure began Feb. 9th. She got pregnant 9 months before this before the family was in dire financial straits - as I understand. May be wrong but this is from what I read.

Many families have their kids in daycare or preschool for 40 hours a week. They don't always give them their undivided attention all during the day because they're working.

She's immature and need psych help, you'll get no argument from me on those points. But her actions do not rise to the level of terminating parental rights. If you just read up on what would truly give rise to terminating parental rights you would understand that as nutty as Nadya may be, she shouldn't be considered for such an egregious measure.

No matter what you think of Nadya, I wish people would separate feelings against nadya from help for those babies. Your attitude only makes it harder on those newborns.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think you are overreacting. No one on this board has suggested that they wish Nadya dead. And , in fact, many people have posted that they wish the babies could have parents who are responsible, loving and mature--ie--adoptive parents. Those babies are darling and they each deserve a chance at a wonderful life. Many doubt that Nadya has the emotional maturity to provide this.And , I believe, time will show this to be true.(As has already been shown to be true with her previous 6)

What is the proof that she is an irresponsible mother with the 6 she has? That she chose to do another invitro? She was trying for a 7th child, not 14. It is so common for Arab (and Jewish and Mormon and Catholic ) families to have lots of children.

So is your proof that she could not afford the 6 she had? Well her family was affording them. In her Arab culture, many extended families stay together and work things out together financially. Not every Arab family, but for some.
Again, lots of parents do stupid things at 33 or even older. There is a thread that was started talking about a mom who leaves her DC in the car while running errands. Now, that's stupid!

The best thing for children is to remain with their biological mother, providing she is stable enough to care for them. Courts will look to see if the mom does not have the resources if she has help. In this case, she has her parents who have been helping her. Having invitro while single doesn't make you incapable of being a decent mother. Having invitro and expecting your parents to support them, if that is what's sometimes done in your culture, doesn't make you incapable of being a decent mother either.

I respectfully disagree. That's not very common in Arab culture. It is, however, absolutely uncommon among Arab families to have children out of wedlock....

She's a Christian Arab, not a Muslim Arab. This would be unheard of among Muslim Arabs if they follow their religion because it's forbidden in Islam to have a child through a sperm donor.

That's absolutely untrue.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Some of the points brought up on this page were discussed pages ago already.

Foreclosure began Feb. 9th. She got pregnant 9 months before this before the family was in dire financial straits - as I understand. May be wrong but this is from what I read.

Many families have their kids in daycare or preschool for 40 hours a week. They don't always give them their undivided attention all during the day because they're working.

She's immature and need psych help, you'll get no argument from me on those points. But her actions do not rise to the level of terminating parental rights. If you just read up on what would truly give rise to terminating parental rights you would understand that as nutty as Nadya may be, she shouldn't be considered for such an egregious measure.

No matter what you think of Nadya, I wish people would separate feelings against nadya from help for those babies. Your attitude only makes it harder on those newborns.

Not sure why you are so insistent on defending her. If Nadya is not up to the job, her babies can go to foster care, but it really would be best for them if they could have a stable, safe home right from the beginning.

[Anonymous]

"She's a Christian Arab, not a Muslim Arab. "

Was she raised Christian? Is her mother a Christian? Is her mother Arab? Is her father Muslim? Not sure people can speculate about her and her family without the facts.