I hate the mentality that college admissions is creating

[Anonymous]

1500 is also not very high for T10.

[Anonymous]

I live inside the beltway, but not in the same bubble as you. My senior and friends are headed off to great places, but not “top 20” nor were those the goal. I think my kid’s public university is in the 60s or 70s in US news but really don’t care.

[Anonymous]

The school talk here is insane. Is it like that everywhere or is it just DC/Nova parents driving that train?

Also my DS got into UVA with As and Bs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is a "you're both right" situation.

Getting imperfect grades year after year may very well knock out the T10 or maybe T20 schools. If those are what you mean when you say "competitive colleges". Unless your kid is hooked.

I remember one AO saying, "listen kids, don't fret - one B is fine". He meant 1 B over 4 years. Or three years - 9th grade doesn't really count.

It's like saying a 95% on the SAT is great - it is. But it's also a 1410 and it's not getting you into Yale.

Best you can do is talk up some schools that make sense for all smart kids with Aish averages. When you hear a kid got into Princeton, say, "That's awesome. They're going to have so much fun". When you hear a kid got into Syracuse, say, "That's awesome. They're going to have so much fun."

Because that's true! Set the tone, it will be fine, And picking the easy teacher sometimes is fine too. high school is hard these days

This. Also, there's always grad school. Always wanted to attend an Ivy for undergrad, didn't get in. Then I worked after undergrad did really interesting things and guess what? Got into a top Ivy for graduate school, but it was the right program for me. There are many great universities and programs not in the T10 or T20.

I would also look into moving your child to another HS. Is this kind of mindset good for them? Is this part of the mental health issues that are impacting young people today?

My BIL went to random state schools because that is where he got aid. Went to law school too, again, at schools most people wouldn't know. He is incredibly successful. He worked hard, and knew what his end goal was and got there without some degree from a T50 school even. He is first generation, but now he is pressuring his kids like crazy. He says his oldest must get into MIT and keeps pushing that kid (in elementary). It makes me sad that this pressure is coming from everywhere. My nephew was asking me about my time at graduate school and I told my nephew there are plenty of other schools and programs and he should decide where to go and his dad came over and goes, "no, he is getting into MIT."

While I do believe that focus and hard work is what matters in the end, your BIL also had a pretty significant hook. Not even for undergrad admissions. It helps to be first generation applying on to law school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The school talk here is insane. Is it like that everywhere or is it just DC/Nova parents driving that train?

Also my DS got into UVA with As and Bs.

This sounds so promising , thank you

What years and how many and what classes did he get a b in (I’m assuming final transcript ) ?
Also what school in uva did he get in ?
Test scores if any ??

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:That is just such a sad commentary. One B in high school means you are shut out of T20? No matter what else they do or don't do? No matter what scores they put up? What they've done in their lives? I'm really sorry for the kids going through this. My kids, not that long ago at all, took challenging courses and got more than a few Bs, but they learned, scored well on tests, did lots outside of the classroom and all ended up at high end T20s. No wonder schools can't choose among applicants if so many have A+ averages. And, pity the kids who feel that getting one B is ruinous to their chances. We really have to do better than this as a society.

Unfortunately, when the T20 schools are rejecting 95%+ of their applicants, and 95% of those rejected have an amazing resume (with almost all A's and maybe one or two A- and 10-12+ AP courses), it does mean a B or 2 most likely ruins your chances for admission. There are simply too many kids with an UW 4.0 or only 1 or 2 A- on their transcript.

My 1500/3.95 (at graduation) kid had 9APs (all STEM and AP Psych, no APHistory or English or FL). They were deferred ED1 at a T10.

They had 1 A- first semester of HS for honors history (taught by the AP team leader who essentially taught it as rigorous as APUSH). The only other blemish on their transcript was a B- first semester senior year for Calc BC (great teacher, really pushes the kids, and this ultimately turned into an A- when my kid got a 5---100% of the kids get 4 or 5s, with 95%+ being 5s). This is at a school known for only deferring a small percentage and then often taking a significant percentage of them in RD. My kid was rejected in RD. Don't know for sure, but as an engineering major, that B- in Calc BC certainly did not help them get accepted. Now it could just be the lack of AP ENG/AP history, but given that they don't defer many and then accept a decent amount, it's just as likely the "bad grade" cost my kid admissions.

I'm actually happy it happened, because my kid is at a non-pressure cooker school (T40s) that is actually a better fit for them. I love their ED1 school, I went there and loved it. But nowadays the top schools are largely pressure cookers. And that can't be healthy for many students.

Your kid’s B- in a major-related class in the most recent grading period would be weighted more than a B in sophomore year, for example. Also overall coursework was not the most difficult and 9 APs may not have been that many compared to others at his school who did take AP English and history. The basic guideline for the most competitive schools is 5 core classes for all 4 years, at the highest rigor available.

It was likely not only due to the B-, but overall rigor and other factors.

I agree. Even if my kid had done all the rigor (APUSH/AP ENG/AP FL) they might still have not gotten in, but it would give a better chance. My kid consciously made the decision not to do those, JR year was done from home and they thought of their mental health (no issues but it was covid and they need more than 2 hours of sleep). As I stated, it all worked out, they got into all their targets and safeties and had many excellent choices to choose from.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The school talk here is insane. Is it like that everywhere or is it just DC/Nova parents driving that train?

Also my DS got into UVA with As and Bs.

A lot of people here are truly horrible.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:That is just such a sad commentary. One B in high school means you are shut out of T20? No matter what else they do or don't do? No matter what scores they put up? What they've done in their lives? I'm really sorry for the kids going through this. My kids, not that long ago at all, took challenging courses and got more than a few Bs, but they learned, scored well on tests, did lots outside of the classroom and all ended up at high end T20s. No wonder schools can't choose among applicants if so many have A+ averages. And, pity the kids who feel that getting one B is ruinous to their chances. We really have to do better than this as a society.

Unfortunately, when the T20 schools are rejecting 95%+ of their applicants, and 95% of those rejected have an amazing resume (with almost all A's and maybe one or two A- and 10-12+ AP courses), it does mean a B or 2 most likely ruins your chances for admission. There are simply too many kids with an UW 4.0 or only 1 or 2 A- on their transcript.

My 1500/3.95 (at graduation) kid had 9APs (all STEM and AP Psych, no APHistory or English or FL). They were deferred ED1 at a T10.

They had 1 A- first semester of HS for honors history (taught by the AP team leader who essentially taught it as rigorous as APUSH). The only other blemish on their transcript was a B- first semester senior year for Calc BC (great teacher, really pushes the kids, and this ultimately turned into an A- when my kid got a 5---100% of the kids get 4 or 5s, with 95%+ being 5s). This is at a school known for only deferring a small percentage and then often taking a significant percentage of them in RD. My kid was rejected in RD. Don't know for sure, but as an engineering major, that B- in Calc BC certainly did not help them get accepted. Now it could just be the lack of AP ENG/AP history, but given that they don't defer many and then accept a decent amount, it's just as likely the "bad grade" cost my kid admissions.

I'm actually happy it happened, because my kid is at a non-pressure cooker school (T40s) that is actually a better fit for them. I love their ED1 school, I went there and loved it. But nowadays the top schools are largely pressure cookers. And that can't be healthy for many students.

Your kid’s B- in a major-related class in the most recent grading period would be weighted more than a B in sophomore year, for example. Also overall coursework was not the most difficult and 9 APs may not have been that many compared to others at his school who did take AP English and history. The basic guideline for the most competitive schools is 5 core classes for all 4 years, at the highest rigor available.

It was likely not only due to the B-, but overall rigor and other factors.

I agree. Even if my kid had done all the rigor (APUSH/AP ENG/AP FL) they might still have not gotten in, but it would give a better chance. My kid consciously made the decision not to do those, JR year was done from home and they thought of their mental health (no issues but it was covid and they need more than 2 hours of sleep). As I stated, it all worked out, they got into all their targets and safeties and had many excellent choices to choose from.

However, the other side is it could easily have been the B- in Calculus. If it was the "rigor" and lack of APUSH/APENG/AP FL, then why wouldn't they just reject outright. Fact they wanted to see a LOCI and first semester grades indicates my kid had made them "competitive". It's a school that only Defers 100-120 kids typically and accepted ~1000-1100 for ED1. So it's not like some of the Ivies that defer 75%+ of ED/EA/whatever they call it

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is a "you're both right" situation.

Getting imperfect grades year after year may very well knock out the T10 or maybe T20 schools. If those are what you mean when you say "competitive colleges". Unless your kid is hooked.

I remember one AO saying, "listen kids, don't fret - one B is fine". He meant 1 B over 4 years. Or three years - 9th grade doesn't really count.

It's like saying a 95% on the SAT is great - it is. But it's also a 1410 and it's not getting you into Yale.

Best you can do is talk up some schools that make sense for all smart kids with Aish averages. When you hear a kid got into Princeton, say, "That's awesome. They're going to have so much fun". When you hear a kid got into Syracuse, say, "That's awesome. They're going to have so much fun."

Because that's true! Set the tone, it will be fine, And picking the easy teacher sometimes is fine too. high school is hard these days

This. Also, there's always grad school. Always wanted to attend an Ivy for undergrad, didn't get in. Then I worked after undergrad did really interesting things and guess what? Got into a top Ivy for graduate school, but it was the right program for me. There are many great universities and programs not in the T10 or T20.

I would also look into moving your child to another HS. Is this kind of mindset good for them? Is this part of the mental health issues that are impacting young people today?

My BIL went to random state schools because that is where he got aid. Went to law school too, again, at schools most people wouldn't know. He is incredibly successful. He worked hard, and knew what his end goal was and got there without some degree from a T50 school even. He is first generation, but now he is pressuring his kids like crazy. He says his oldest must get into MIT and keeps pushing that kid (in elementary). It makes me sad that this pressure is coming from everywhere. My nephew was asking me about my time at graduate school and I told my nephew there are plenty of other schools and programs and he should decide where to go and his dad came over and goes, "no, he is getting into MIT."

While I do believe that focus and hard work is what matters in the end, your BIL also had a pretty significant hook. Not even for undergrad admissions. It helps to be first generation applying on to law school.

Probably because two people can come to completely opposite conclusions when given the same facts.

Your conclusion for BIL is that he didn't need any name schools because he worked hard and is successful. Perhaps his conclusion is that he had to work 2x as hard as everyone else at non-name schools just to get to the same place that kids that worked 50% less then him, but went to the "right" schools.

I know a guy that dropped out of Indiana and started a successful Tech company...his verdict is that no way his kid is going to Indiana or anything that smells like Indiana, because he thought it was worthless. I don't know what schools he thinks are acceptable, but I would imagine they are all top names.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No, one B does not preclude getting admitted to T20.

+2 Kids can have some Bs on their transcripts! I suspect it is public school parents saying you can’t have any Bs and they are at schools where the teachers don’t give Bs at all so a B would be shocking. Lots of Bs given out at my DC’s private school.

I sat in on some zoom "info sessions" at top 20 schools (and high ranking liberal arts colleges). They tried not to say it but, in the end, you need to take the most rigorous classes and get As. Without some special circumstances, this is the reality at most of the brand name schools.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No, one B does not preclude getting admitted to T20.

+2 Kids can have some Bs on their transcripts! I suspect it is public school parents saying you can’t have any Bs and they are at schools where the teachers don’t give Bs at all so a B would be shocking. Lots of Bs given out at my DC’s private school.

I sat in on some zoom "info sessions" at top 20 schools (and high ranking liberal arts colleges). They tried not to say it but, in the end, you need to take the most rigorous classes and get As. Without some special circumstances, this is the reality at most of the brand name schools.

Yes, kids are dropping down in rigor to maintain GPA at our high school. Colleges prefer 4.0 with some non AP classes rather than all AP’s and a bunch of B’s.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No, one B does not preclude getting admitted to T20.

+2 Kids can have some Bs on their transcripts! I suspect it is public school parents saying you can’t have any Bs and they are at schools where the teachers don’t give Bs at all so a B would be shocking. Lots of Bs given out at my DC’s private school.

I sat in on some zoom "info sessions" at top 20 schools (and high ranking liberal arts colleges). They tried not to say it but, in the end, you need to take the most rigorous classes and get As. Without some special circumstances, this is the reality at most of the brand name schools.

But also the reality is that even with all As in the most rigorous classes, the very likely outcome is they still don't get into the T20 schools so why should that drive the HS choices. Lighten up on the rigor so you can enjoy your life, maybe you'll still get some Bs. And you'll likely end up at college with a lot of the kids who made themselves crazy in HS trying to meet that standard.

[Anonymous]

It's a messed up game they have to play, or they pay the price for it. My kids have switched if the teacher is not good, or a hard grader, even if they'd prefer the class theoretically. Having a C on transcript would have too much of an impact and create huge amounts of stress.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is a "you're both right" situation.

Getting imperfect grades year after year may very well knock out the T10 or maybe T20 schools. If those are what you mean when you say "competitive colleges". Unless your kid is hooked.

I remember one AO saying, "listen kids, don't fret - one B is fine". He meant 1 B over 4 years. Or three years - 9th grade doesn't really count.

It's like saying a 95% on the SAT is great - it is. But it's also a 1410 and it's not getting you into Yale.

Best you can do is talk up some schools that make sense for all smart kids with Aish averages. When you hear a kid got into Princeton, say, "That's awesome. They're going to have so much fun". When you hear a kid got into Syracuse, say, "That's awesome. They're going to have so much fun."

Because that's true! Set the tone, it will be fine, And picking the easy teacher sometimes is fine too. high school is hard these days

This. Also, there's always grad school. Always wanted to attend an Ivy for undergrad, didn't get in. Then I worked after undergrad did really interesting things and guess what? Got into a top Ivy for graduate school, but it was the right program for me. There are many great universities and programs not in the T10 or T20.

I would also look into moving your child to another HS. Is this kind of mindset good for them? Is this part of the mental health issues that are impacting young people today?

My BIL went to random state schools because that is where he got aid. Went to law school too, again, at schools most people wouldn't know. He is incredibly successful. He worked hard, and knew what his end goal was and got there without some degree from a T50 school even. He is first generation, but now he is pressuring his kids like crazy. He says his oldest must get into MIT and keeps pushing that kid (in elementary). It makes me sad that this pressure is coming from everywhere. My nephew was asking me about my time at graduate school and I told my nephew there are plenty of other schools and programs and he should decide where to go and his dad came over and goes, "no, he is getting into MIT."

While I do believe that focus and hard work is what matters in the end, your BIL also had a pretty significant hook. Not even for undergrad admissions. It helps to be first generation applying on to law school.

Probably because two people can come to completely opposite conclusions when given the same facts.

Your conclusion for BIL is that he didn't need any name schools because he worked hard and is successful. Perhaps his conclusion is that he had to work 2x as hard as everyone else at non-name schools just to get to the same place that kids that worked 50% less then him, but went to the "right" schools.

I know a guy that dropped out of Indiana and started a successful Tech company...his verdict is that no way his kid is going to Indiana or anything that smells like Indiana, because he thought it was worthless. I don't know what schools he thinks are acceptable, but I would imagine they are all top names.

It's his own bias based on his situation and great luck at being successful. The reality is most who graduate from Indiana will do better than drop outs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It's a messed up game they have to play, or they pay the price for it. My kids have switched if the teacher is not good, or a hard grader, even if they'd prefer the class theoretically. Having a C on transcript would have too much of an impact and create huge amounts of stress.

A C screws you for T30.