I hate the mentality that college admissions is creating

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I totally agree, but it’s an unfortunate reality. The truth is that a couple of Bs will not only cost your child admission at T20 schools, but often at state flagships as well.

Only the highly selective state flagships. There are plenty of options out there.

Not as many if you’re middle class. You need T20 stats to make the other schools affordable.

Oh hells no. My DD got significant merit at Michigan State and Iowa. And she is nowhere near top 20 stats. Her aid brought both schools down to the 40k range all in.

Like I said, there are tons of options.

Curious what you consider middle class if 40k a year is no problem.

You can’t get much lower than that at OOS flagships with top merit. You may need to look at more economical regional state schools.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I totally agree, but it’s an unfortunate reality. The truth is that a couple of Bs will not only cost your child admission at T20 schools, but often at state flagships as well.

Only the highly selective state flagships. There are plenty of options out there.

Not as many if you’re middle class. You need T20 stats to make the other schools affordable.

Oh hells no. My DD got significant merit at Michigan State and Iowa. And she is nowhere near top 20 stats. Her aid brought both schools down to the 40k range all in.

Like I said, there are tons of options.

Curious what you consider middle class if 40k a year is no problem.

You can’t get much lower than that at OOS flagships with top merit. You may need to look at more economical regional state schools.

+1 and even in-state W&M is that much and UVA gets close in some programs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I totally agree, but it’s an unfortunate reality. The truth is that a couple of Bs will not only cost your child admission at T20 schools, but often at state flagships as well.

Only the highly selective state flagships. There are plenty of options out there.

Not as many if you’re middle class. You need T20 stats to make the other schools affordable.

Oh hells no. My DD got significant merit at Michigan State and Iowa. And she is nowhere near top 20 stats. Her aid brought both schools down to the 40k range all in.

Like I said, there are tons of options.

Thank you for this dose of reality!

[Anonymous]

This is also an issue with how people view their own kids - most kids are average (hence the definition of average) - a truly exceptional student will get all As at the high school level without breaking a sweat, if your DC can't do that you are creating unrealistic expectations for them by not emphasizing how many great schools there are at every level and making the goal the best learning environment for each person - not best bragging rights for the parents

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I totally agree, but it’s an unfortunate reality. The truth is that a couple of Bs will not only cost your child admission at T20 schools, but often at state flagships as well.

Only the highly selective state flagships. There are plenty of options out there.

Not as many if you’re middle class. You need T20 stats to make the other schools affordable.

If you’re middle class then T20 were off the table for you right from the beginning. As were competitive state flagships (many of which don’t give merit, or very little at all). Many many state schools give excellent merit. But you won’t get much below 35k/yr. If you’re truly middle class this discussion probably isn’t for you. You’re looking at much cheaper schools right out of the gate.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have a hs freshman who started at a challenging high school. She got all A’s except for one class and I thought this was fabulous. That class was out of her area of comfort but she was super interested in the topic and worked hard, but the grading was very difficult. Yet she learned a ton from this class, probably more than in the classes she got perfect grades in. The school culture is very college oriented and from listening to other kids talk she believes any imperfect grade may end her chances at competitive college admissions. Now in selecting classes for next year she and her friends are very concerned about difficulty, which classes play to their strengths, and who is a hard teacher etc. My kid has always been naturally curious and wants to learn everything and try new things, but I feel like the looming threat of college admissions is already turning her into someone else who is afraid to take intellectual or academic risks. This makes me sad. Anyone else feel this way? Can anything be done about it? I don’t feel like we pressure her about getting into a top college, but even so the difficulty of getting into colleges is so talked up (maybe the talk is true, I don’t know) that it’s hurting our kids attitudes towards learning. I’m not sure if anyone can offer advice, but it’s just frustrating.

I mean...you actually are responsible for starting the rat race that you so despise...did you honestly not understand the culture of the HS?

I mean, does anyone sending their kid to a Big3 or Whitman, Blair Magnet, Churchill, TJ, Langley...not realize what kind of HS for which they are enrolling their kid and the culture?

You actively have to reinforce the opposite if your kid is at one of these schools. That it is OK to take chances and move forward in life, and that it may mean a top college is off-the-table...or take that curiosity and run with it outside of the classroom/school to create some really unique EC.

This, it is because of you. A majority of US high schools have the opposite problem. Kids don't care about grades, don't turn in assignments and don't listen in class. This is a very small bubble that you created.

[Anonymous]

This is on your kid's school. My kid doesn't go to a school like that so doesn't worry like that. He gets good grades and I know that he will go to a "good enough" school. And what the school lacks in prestige can be made up with our connections, internships, and money. Likely, this is the case with you too. So don't worry about it too much. And encourage your kid not to worry either.

Your kid only gets one childhood. It's up to you as a parent to make sure it is as happy and stress free as possible and something they remember fondly.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I totally agree, but it’s an unfortunate reality. The truth is that a couple of Bs will not only cost your child admission at T20 schools, but often at state flagships as well.

Only the highly selective state flagships. There are plenty of options out there.

Not as many if you’re middle class. You need T20 stats to make the other schools affordable.

Oh hells no. My DD got significant merit at Michigan State and Iowa. And she is nowhere near top 20 stats. Her aid brought both schools down to the 40k range all in.

Like I said, there are tons of options.

Thank you for this dose of reality!

Welcome! We are thrilled and so is she. She also got merit at Penn State but not as much (6K I think). Waiting to hear from Delaware about their merit aid package (if any) but she already knows it’s either MSU or Iowa.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I feel like you want us to say you're right and the peer group is wrong. But the kids who are gunning for the top colleges are gunning from day one. Plenty of GPAs are blown freshman year.

Is it crazy? sure. But it's crazy to me that people have 5 million dollar homes. Or drive cars you can't park in the street. That's not even aspirational to me. IT's okay if those kids want that and it's okay to opt out. 99% of kids in America opt out or never had the chance to opt in.

Not exactly. I am not saying that the peer groups is "wrong." They are just responding to a culture that the college admissions process created, which I don't think is a good culture. Ironically, it seems all the colleges say they want intellectually curious kids who are willing to take risks, but I think the reality is that they are encouraging the opposite. Some posters have pointed out that it's my fault if I sent my kid to a challenging high school. Call me naive, but I did want solid academics and for her to be challenged and engaged even though I didn't expect perfect grades. In retrospect, I admit I was naive, but we are where we are and not moving her away from friends and teachers she likes. I guess I have to help her navigate this culture without without getting too stressed/obsessed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I feel like you want us to say you're right and the peer group is wrong. But the kids who are gunning for the top colleges are gunning from day one. Plenty of GPAs are blown freshman year.

Is it crazy? sure. But it's crazy to me that people have 5 million dollar homes. Or drive cars you can't park in the street. That's not even aspirational to me. IT's okay if those kids want that and it's okay to opt out. 99% of kids in America opt out or never had the chance to opt in.

Not exactly. I am not saying that the peer groups is "wrong." They are just responding to a culture that the college admissions process created, which I don't think is a good culture. Ironically, it seems all the colleges say they want intellectually curious kids who are willing to take risks, but I think the reality is that they are encouraging the opposite. Some posters have pointed out that it's my fault if I sent my kid to a challenging high school. Call me naive, but I did want solid academics and for her to be challenged and engaged even though I didn't expect perfect grades. In retrospect, I admit I was naive, but we are where we are and not moving her away from friends and teachers she likes. I guess I have to help her navigate this culture without without getting too stressed/obsessed.

It's always what they aren't saying...they do want your kid to take risks, but they also want them to get an A in the class.

No surprise, the kids getting into the Top 10 both took risks and received the highest marks.

[Anonymous]

The whole system is ridiculous. Candidates being ashamed of GPAs under 4.0 or scores below the 99th percentile. I've seen colleges where you need a 3.9 to make dean's list. Everything is so inflated now. Let's stop with the grade inflation and require tests for everyone so that a 3.5 GPA with 1400 SAT is actually something to be proud of. It's really sad that kids feel the need to game the system.

[Anonymous]

Famously documented in the film "Race To Nowhere" in 2015

https://youtu.be/BE7TLXbXROg?si=nbGoldoS4iIKrJy8

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Famously documented in the film "Race To Nowhere" in 2015

https://youtu.be/BE7TLXbXROg?si=nbGoldoS4iIKrJy8

Also, new PBS documentary: https://www.pbs.org/video/dream-school-a-journey-to-higher-ed-uw8zuz/

[Anonymous]

For all the parents stressing about grades, I can assure you that there was a lot LESS stress with my freshman CS major, NMSF, 11 APs, 1560 SAT and 4.5 GPA then my 2.3 GPA 11th grader taking the easiest course load. So what if you get a couple of Bs and Cs. You will have options!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:For all the parents stressing about grades, I can assure you that there was a lot LESS stress with my freshman CS major, NMSF, 11 APs, 1560 SAT and 4.5 GPA then my 2.3 GPA 11th grader taking the easiest course load. So what if you get a couple of Bs and Cs. You will have options!

Did you mean a lot MORE stress with your high-achieving kid?