What happened to average kids? Where are they?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A FCPS math teacher (not a teacher at our school) told us quietly that the top math kids all are being tutored, either at home by a STEM parent, or at AoPS, Kumon, Mathnasium, or RSM. We were very grateful she told us. She also said that math textbooks were replaced by less effective electronic materials, and encouraged us to at least buy appropriate math workbooks or download math worksheets for our DC to practice with at home.

I don’t know the others, but I would not consider AOPS as tutoring. It is more extension work. When I think of tutoring it is learning the material before it is officially taught in school so the kid looks super smart for picking it up so “quickly”

I agree. AOPS math is not tutoring. It is just more in depth and challenging work. It’s for kids like our DS where math is way too easy. It is definitely not the program for kids who are struggling in math or kids who need tutoring.

If the schools could provide appropriate rigor, depth, and challenge for these kids, they would not need AOPS.

Yes, it's tutoring. Maybe in another eight or ten years, you'll realize that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:There are plenty of average and below average kids, you just don’t see them in your social circles.
My kid is below average, but I don’t advertise that. They’re one of the weakest players on their rec team, but the other parents assume they’re excelling academically just like their kids. I just nod along when the other parents talk about advanced classes and future colleges and careers.

How does your kid deal with that?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A FCPS math teacher (not a teacher at our school) told us quietly that the top math kids all are being tutored, either at home by a STEM parent, or at AoPS, Kumon, Mathnasium, or RSM. We were very grateful she told us. She also said that math textbooks were replaced by less effective electronic materials, and encouraged us to at least buy appropriate math workbooks or download math worksheets for our DC to practice with at home.

I don’t know the others, but I would not consider AOPS as tutoring. It is more extension work. When I think of tutoring it is learning the material before it is officially taught in school so the kid looks super smart for picking it up so “quickly”

I agree. AOPS math is not tutoring. It is just more in depth and challenging work. It’s for kids like our DS where math is way too easy. It is definitely not the program for kids who are struggling in math or kids who need tutoring.

If the schools could provide appropriate rigor, depth, and challenge for these kids, they would not need AOPS.

Yes, it's tutoring. Maybe in another eight or ten years, you'll realize that.

The parents that push tutoring on their kids (bot of course, would never admit it) are doing their kids a disservice because their first (any job!) job will not have a tutor.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A FCPS math teacher (not a teacher at our school) told us quietly that the top math kids all are being tutored, either at home by a STEM parent, or at AoPS, Kumon, Mathnasium, or RSM. We were very grateful she told us. She also said that math textbooks were replaced by less effective electronic materials, and encouraged us to at least buy appropriate math workbooks or download math worksheets for our DC to practice with at home.

I don’t know the others, but I would not consider AOPS as tutoring. It is more extension work. When I think of tutoring it is learning the material before it is officially taught in school so the kid looks super smart for picking it up so “quickly”

I agree. AOPS math is not tutoring. It is just more in depth and challenging work. It’s for kids like our DS where math is way too easy. It is definitely not the program for kids who are struggling in math or kids who need tutoring.

If the schools could provide appropriate rigor, depth, and challenge for these kids, they would not need AOPS.

Yes, it's tutoring. Maybe in another eight or ten years, you'll realize that.

No it’s not. Math is too damn easy. Get back to me when your kid always scores in the top 10% or higher on standardized testing.

[Anonymous]

Its a race and it starts early. Have to do everything, sports, academics, chess, music, volunteering, highest track in high school, best college, best jobs, etc etc.. never ending

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I've been thinking about this lately as it concerns my kids. One of them seems to be very bright and above average but it having some behavior issues. I wonder if it is I push him too much to try himself at different things. In the last couple of days I'm starting to question my actions. I get reminded of a realization I had a decade or so ago about my siblings and I. One of my siblings used to be into dancing every since she was in school and despite a degree in economics, she is now doing, yes, dancing. She has her own kids' studio, she loves it, and she is wildly popular with kids and their parents. My other sibling used to do something that kind of entertained us--she would find a bookshelf/cabinetry corner and set it up with mini furniture and mini dolls, like really miniature ones. Lo and behold, she is a successful interior designer now, despite her degree in economics

With myself, I am more conflicted. I was also bright and good at ...studying...and so what? I am smart, have a humanities phd, but don't have a job because I prefer to stay with little kids for now. Maybe soon I'll get into the workforce. But my family's examples somehow have long shocked me into a realization that kids' abilities and passions can be visible very early on, and perhaps they should be nurtured indeed, so that kids get to enjoy childhood and young adulthood, instead of trying to do everything at once and getting stressed because of it. Perhaps one or max two talents should be priority for all kids. And I can definitely already see in my kids what they are good at, passionate about. It kind of already helped me feel less stressed about how they will be doing in school. I'm not going to expect excellence in every subject.

+1 I don't think this happens all the time, but for a lot of kids, if you look, yes, there are things that really light them up and those should be encouraged. I do think pushing kids to do all the expected things regardless of passion can make it harder for kids to find those authentic interests. Kids need time to be bored and figure out what they want to do with their time. Not enough kids are allowed that.

I think my kids are bright but not super above average, in part because both have ADHD. But they each had a clear interest from early childhood. My son loves numbers and data. His favorite books were always big almanacs and anything with a lot of data visualizations, his walls are covered in maps. His best classes were always math. I tried to push a bit to do things like AoPS but that he resisted, I think mainly because the ADHD once he was done coping with school he just didn't have the bandwidth to do more after school. He's now majoring in a data science type of major with a 3.9 GPA. Says he still hasn't had a hard math class. He didn't have the overall profile to be competitive for a T30 college but that's fine since we couldn't have afforded that anyway! But, he's at a good college and having a great experience there.

DD is all about the outdoors. She's been fascinated by bugs and reptiles and wanted nothing but to be exploring outside pretty much since she could express an interest in anything. The only classes she liked as a small child were at the nature center. We really leaned into that with her with lots of time hiking, going to nature centers, finding camps that focused on it. All her MS-HS science projects (which she LOVED doing) were on water and soil issues. She is majoring in environmental science and has spent the last couple summers working at a nature education camp. Going to a small college where ES is a big focus.

FWIW, on the sports thing, DS played rec soccer and occasional baseball through ES-MS just because it was fun to play with friends. He plays golf occasionally with friends because his grandfather taught him. He runs for fitness. DD refused all sports until late ES when she decided she'd like to try something and decided on fencing because it was an individual sport and not something other kids would have been doing a long time. She really liked it and benefited a lot from learning to cope with the challenge of competition. But other things took over in HS (band and more time on homework). She also runs for fitness.

Our job as parents is to help support our kids to grow into who they are meant to be. Not to manufacture what we think Harvard wants to see.

Separate point... someone mentioned nursing as an awful job. Nursing was my sister's early childhood spark. I don't know where she tuned into that but as early as 7-8 years old she wanted to be a nurse. It was always part of our games. She was a candy striper as soon as it was allowed and she spent as much time as she could at the hospital. People tried to push her to be a doctor but she'd had enough exposure to the field to understand the differences and know nursing was what she wanted. Nursing degree, ICU specialty, then a masters as a clinical nurse specialist. Now works for a large hospital system in a role where she develops and oversees training and does research on best practices for patient care. Prior to that she was a teacher in a nursing education program and is working on a doctorate. Nursing is a wide and varied field. I had no idea how many paths there are. How sad it would have been if my parents had told her nursing was unacceptable and she must do something else.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A FCPS math teacher (not a teacher at our school) told us quietly that the top math kids all are being tutored, either at home by a STEM parent, or at AoPS, Kumon, Mathnasium, or RSM. We were very grateful she told us. She also said that math textbooks were replaced by less effective electronic materials, and encouraged us to at least buy appropriate math workbooks or download math worksheets for our DC to practice with at home.

I don’t know the others, but I would not consider AOPS as tutoring. It is more extension work. When I think of tutoring it is learning the material before it is officially taught in school so the kid looks super smart for picking it up so “quickly”

I agree. AOPS math is not tutoring. It is just more in depth and challenging work. It’s for kids like our DS where math is way too easy. It is definitely not the program for kids who are struggling in math or kids who need tutoring.

If the schools could provide appropriate rigor, depth, and challenge for these kids, they would not need AOPS.

Yes, it's tutoring. Maybe in another eight or ten years, you'll realize that.

The parents that push tutoring on their kids (bot of course, would never admit it) are doing their kids a disservice because their first (any job!) job will not have a tutor.

The highest paying jobs have tutors. They are called mentors, trainers, or coaches.

Lebron James has tutors.

Larry Page had tutors.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A FCPS math teacher (not a teacher at our school) told us quietly that the top math kids all are being tutored, either at home by a STEM parent, or at AoPS, Kumon, Mathnasium, or RSM. We were very grateful she told us. She also said that math textbooks were replaced by less effective electronic materials, and encouraged us to at least buy appropriate math workbooks or download math worksheets for our DC to practice with at home.

I don’t know the others, but I would not consider AOPS as tutoring. It is more extension work. When I think of tutoring it is learning the material before it is officially taught in school so the kid looks super smart for picking it up so “quickly”

I agree. AOPS math is not tutoring. It is just more in depth and challenging work. It’s for kids like our DS where math is way too easy. It is definitely not the program for kids who are struggling in math or kids who need tutoring.

If the schools could provide appropriate rigor, depth, and challenge for these kids, they would not need AOPS.

Yes, it's tutoring. Maybe in another eight or ten years, you'll realize that.

The parents that push tutoring on their kids (bot of course, would never admit it) are doing their kids a disservice because their first (any job!) job will not have a tutor.

The highest paying jobs have tutors. They are called mentors, trainers, or coaches.

Lebron James has tutors.

Larry Page had tutors.

Wut?

[Anonymous]

Plenty of average kids in my neighborhood in Arlington. Maybe it’s your neighborhood?

[Anonymous]

Everybody appears to be above average in elementary school. Just give it time .

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A FCPS math teacher (not a teacher at our school) told us quietly that the top math kids all are being tutored, either at home by a STEM parent, or at AoPS, Kumon, Mathnasium, or RSM. We were very grateful she told us. She also said that math textbooks were replaced by less effective electronic materials, and encouraged us to at least buy appropriate math workbooks or download math worksheets for our DC to practice with at home.

I don’t know the others, but I would not consider AOPS as tutoring. It is more extension work. When I think of tutoring it is learning the material before it is officially taught in school so the kid looks super smart for picking it up so “quickly”

I agree. AOPS math is not tutoring. It is just more in depth and challenging work. It’s for kids like our DS where math is way too easy. It is definitely not the program for kids who are struggling in math or kids who need tutoring.

If the schools could provide appropriate rigor, depth, and challenge for these kids, they would not need AOPS.

Yes, it's tutoring. Maybe in another eight or ten years, you'll realize that.

-1
Maybe in that length of time you will come to realize that no one at your kids' schools cares if they leave with anything more than a basic memorization of algorithms let alone if they learn to like math.

[Anonymous]

There are average kids all around you, everywhere. And not everyone plays sports. This isn’t a problem. Stop getting riled up by braggy moms.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A FCPS math teacher (not a teacher at our school) told us quietly that the top math kids all are being tutored, either at home by a STEM parent, or at AoPS, Kumon, Mathnasium, or RSM. We were very grateful she told us. She also said that math textbooks were replaced by less effective electronic materials, and encouraged us to at least buy appropriate math workbooks or download math worksheets for our DC to practice with at home.

I don’t know the others, but I would not consider AOPS as tutoring. It is more extension work. When I think of tutoring it is learning the material before it is officially taught in school so the kid looks super smart for picking it up so “quickly”

I agree. AOPS math is not tutoring. It is just more in depth and challenging work. It’s for kids like our DS where math is way too easy. It is definitely not the program for kids who are struggling in math or kids who need tutoring.

If the schools could provide appropriate rigor, depth, and challenge for these kids, they would not need AOPS.

Yes, it's tutoring. Maybe in another eight or ten years, you'll realize that.

The parents that push tutoring on their kids (bot of course, would never admit it) are doing their kids a disservice because their first (any job!) job will not have a tutor.

The highest paying jobs have tutors. They are called mentors, trainers, or coaches.

Lebron James has tutors.

Larry Page had tutors.

Wut?

"Executive coaching" - its a thing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There are plenty of average and below average kids, you just don’t see them in your social circles.
My kid is below average, but I don’t advertise that. They’re one of the weakest players on their rec team, but the other parents assume they’re excelling academically just like their kids. I just nod along when the other parents talk about advanced classes and future colleges and careers.

How does your kid deal with that?

They don’t hear those conversations amongst the sports team parents. Their school friends are mostly Hispanic immigrants and on the same level academically.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There are plenty of average and below average kids, you just don’t see them in your social circles.
My kid is below average, but I don’t advertise that. They’re one of the weakest players on their rec team, but the other parents assume they’re excelling academically just like their kids. I just nod along when the other parents talk about advanced classes and future colleges and careers.

How does your kid deal with that?

They don’t hear those conversations amongst the sports team parents. Their school friends are mostly Hispanic immigrants and on the same level academically.

I can’t believe you answered her politely. This site is worst of the worst as far as humanity.