Why Asian American kids excel. It’s not ‘Tiger Moms.’

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Different cultures - Asian cultures are "we" cultures; American culture is "I" based culture. Not saying one is better than the other, they are just different.

Then why don't Asians do anything for charity, to help others, etc.

PP you are responding too. I do not know. I do believe Americans are much more generous than Asians. Wealth in Asian people/countries is relatively new thing. Maybe being poor is deeply rooted in their psych that giving doesn't come easy (yet).

Europeans also don't volunteer much. My DH is from the UK. Volunteerism is not a big thing over there.

Maybe the "I" cultures volunteer more because that culture does tend to focus on oneself more, so they volunteer to feel better about the fact that most of their lives are centered on the "I" rather than the "we". IDK.

The "we" culture tends to not volunteer as much because the "we" is already embeded in the culture.

However, I think what PP wrote about how most of the Asian countries have only recently come into wealth plays apart in why they are becoming so much more self-centered. It's a problem. Everyone's just looking out for themselves, or just their immediate families. I will say, though, in places like China and Korea, more and more people are abandoning their duties to their elderly parents because of greed. So sad.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I honestly find threads like this worthless. You have Asians who act like they are the only ones who value academic achievement. You have whites who resent academic accomplishments by Asians. And you have both Asians and whites pointing to Asian academic achievement when their actual intent is simply to insult blacks and Hispanics. It is time to step up and recognize that all students deserve our attention and support, and that fetishizing Asians is having unlikely to advance that goal.

99.99% of DCUM threads are useless.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I honestly find threads like this worthless. You have Asians who act like they are the only ones who value academic achievement. You have whites who resent academic accomplishments by Asians. And you have both Asians and whites pointing to Asian academic achievement when their actual intent is simply to insult blacks and Hispanics. It is time to step up and recognize that all students deserve our attention and support, and that fetishizing Asians is having unlikely to advance that goal.

Whites should not resent academic accomplishments by Asians. Academic accomplishments should be celebrated more so than sports etc. The primary goal of schools are to educate and to learn and other goals are secondary.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Different cultures - Asian cultures are "we" cultures; American culture is "I" based culture. Not saying one is better than the other, they are just different.

Then why don't Asians do anything for charity, to help others, etc.

PP you are responding too. I do not know. I do believe Americans are much more generous than Asians. Wealth in Asian people/countries is relatively new thing. Maybe being poor is deeply rooted in their psych that giving doesn't come easy (yet).

Asians are relatively not as well-off as whites in general. Also, many Asians give to churches and these churches engage in extensive charitable/missionary work. Although, capitalism is based on "greed" so whites tend to be the most greedy/exploitative people in general.

It's not just Asian cultures. Very few other cultures value volunteering as much as the US culture does. And it is not just donations from well-off families. I know many middle class families who freely give hours and hours of time to help others. Most of them were born in this country. I have been a volunteer organizer, and I have been told very directly by people born in other countries (and we are not talking about just Asian countries here) that they do not do that where they come from and they would not consider helping unless they got paid.

I just think that it is interesting that such an individualist culture values volunteering so highly.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I honestly find threads like this worthless. You have Asians who act like they are the only ones who value academic achievement. You have whites who resent academic accomplishments by Asians. And you have both Asians and whites pointing to Asian academic achievement when their actual intent is simply to insult blacks and Hispanics. It is time to step up and recognize that all students deserve our attention and support, and that fetishizing Asians is having unlikely to advance that goal.

Whites should not resent academic accomplishments by Asians. Academic accomplishments should be celebrated more so than sports etc. The primary goal of schools are to educate and to learn and other goals are secondary.

Unfortunately, the top universities don't want kids who only focus on academics. Not saying it's right. Just saying this is how it is. Maybe it's racist, or maybe they just want more "well rounded" students. IDK.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We've got mixed Asian/White kids, live in a community with lots of Asians, and I've had a good long look behind the facade.

They are expected to get jobs that pay well and have higher status, and are strongly discouraged from pursuing studies in other fields, even if it's their dream.

If they don't do well, they're not just letting themselves down, they're letting the whole family down, including generations of ancestors. And they will shame their parents, because they'll make them look bad to the community. They'll shame their community to outsiders. Is that enough pressure?

Parents do say commonly things like, "Only an A minus? What happened? Why not an A?" and the kids say those things to each other and to themselves. I've heard it plenty.

Shame. Shame is a big one. If you haven't been raised in a shaming culture, you won't get how powerful it is. You're invalidated and shamed for everything you do and feel, and who you feel you are, if it does not agree with the elders' ideas of who you should be, what you should do, and how you're supposed to feel. And the shame has no boundaries. Your shame as a child is heaped on your parents and family.

Yes, there are a lot of success stories. What you will not be allowed to see, because outward appearances mean everything, are the casualties. I've heard lots of stories and witnessed lots of misery and dysfunction. You want to study BPD, get deep into some Asian communities. It's rampant.

And you say that because you are Asian? Or you have done research like the one OP linked to? No?

I see a lot of White moms and kids in my neighborhood. The kids are perpetually neglected. They come to my house and eat like they have been starving - why are the parents not feeding them? They are never doing homework and they are disruptive in classrooms - why do their parents not care? They speak in an insolent tone with their parents - because they recognize that the parents are worthless. I know that they are the most messed up group of kids. White kids live with the uncertainty of unstable families and self-obsessed parents. They see their moms trying to be cougar moms and not paying attention to the kids needs. Their homes do not function in a way a home should. They pack crap food for their kids for lunch. Their kids are obsessed with sex at a young age and the parents encourage that behavior. How many Asian-American kids get pregnant at high school? How many White girls get pregnant? There you have it.

Asian kids have at least a moral compass that they can feel shame for bad behavior. White kids are narcissistic and emotionally damaged. We do not have to hear stories of the dysfunction of the white families. We see it on TV.

Want to see a White kid pimp slapping his mom - here you go.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h9BEsJPGTYI

And this is not a rarity. This is the essence of the relationship between the White kids and their parents.

I know because I am an expert on these things. I have heard stories and watched behind the facade of White families.

You should check out DCPS if you hate the whites

I don't think PP was hating on whites. The post just made observations in light of the similar post(s) making general observations of Asians which is often and common in this forum to make a point.

Thank you.

You are exactly right. Every week or so, we have the same circular arguments that goes something like this ---- Asian children do well so they must be terribly unhappy. Their parents must be abusing them and forcing them to study. The children are socially awkward because 1) they are not allowed TV time 2) They are not allowed to play on video games 3) they must work hard and do well in school 4) they are not allowed to mix with other kids....

People are making generalizations and stereotyping Asians, but react when others generalize and stereotype them in return.

I have seen White people become Tiger parents in sports, in cheerleading, in dance, in beauty competitions. Yes, every culture value something different. Asians value academic achievement. If that is not something that you do not value, why should you even care?

Concur

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I honestly find threads like this worthless. You have Asians who act like they are the only ones who value academic achievement. You have whites who resent academic accomplishments by Asians. And you have both Asians and whites pointing to Asian academic achievement when their actual intent is simply to insult blacks and Hispanics. It is time to step up and recognize that all students deserve our attention and support, and that fetishizing Asians is having unlikely to advance that goal.

Whites should not resent academic accomplishments by Asians. Academic accomplishments should be celebrated more so than sports etc. The primary goal of schools are to educate and to learn and other goals are secondary.

Unfortunately, the top universities don't want kids who only focus on academics. Not saying it's right. Just saying this is how it is. Maybe it's racist, or maybe they just want more "well rounded" students. IDK.

Many lessons can be learned outside the classroom. Extracurricular activities provide situations where kids can learn much about perseverance, hard work, gracious winning and losing, how to be a contributing member of a group. A child who does nothing outside of academics will have missed out on a lot of the lessons kids need to learn to be good adults. Colleges are looking for students who bring much more to the table than just academics.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I honestly find threads like this worthless. You have Asians who act like they are the only ones who value academic achievement. You have whites who resent academic accomplishments by Asians. And you have both Asians and whites pointing to Asian academic achievement when their actual intent is simply to insult blacks and Hispanics. It is time to step up and recognize that all students deserve our attention and support, and that fetishizing Asians is having unlikely to advance that goal.

Whites should not resent academic accomplishments by Asians. Academic accomplishments should be celebrated more so than sports etc. The primary goal of schools are to educate and to learn and other goals are secondary.

Unfortunately, the top universities don't want kids who only focus on academics. Not saying it's right. Just saying this is how it is. Maybe it's racist, or maybe they just want more "well rounded" students. IDK.

There are plenty of "well-rounded" Asian kids. Top colleges reject well-rounded Asian kids too.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I honestly find threads like this worthless. You have Asians who act like they are the only ones who value academic achievement. You have whites who resent academic accomplishments by Asians. And you have both Asians and whites pointing to Asian academic achievement when their actual intent is simply to insult blacks and Hispanics. It is time to step up and recognize that all students deserve our attention and support, and that fetishizing Asians is having unlikely to advance that goal.

Whites should not resent academic accomplishments by Asians. Academic accomplishments should be celebrated more so than sports etc. The primary goal of schools are to educate and to learn and other goals are secondary.

Unfortunately, the top universities don't want kids who only focus on academics. Not saying it's right. Just saying this is how it is. Maybe it's racist, or maybe they just want more "well rounded" students. IDK.

Many lessons can be learned outside the classroom. Extracurricular activities provide situations where kids can learn much about perseverance, hard work, gracious winning and losing, how to be a contributing member of a group. A child who does nothing outside of academics will have missed out on a lot of the lessons kids need to learn to be good adults. Colleges are looking for students who bring much more to the table than just academics.

It's system devised to keep top performing, well-rounded Asian American kids out of top colleges.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We've got mixed Asian/White kids, live in a community with lots of Asians, and I've had a good long look behind the facade.

They are expected to get jobs that pay well and have higher status, and are strongly discouraged from pursuing studies in other fields, even if it's their dream.

If they don't do well, they're not just letting themselves down, they're letting the whole family down, including generations of ancestors. And they will shame their parents, because they'll make them look bad to the community. They'll shame their community to outsiders. Is that enough pressure?

Parents do say commonly things like, "Only an A minus? What happened? Why not an A?" and the kids say those things to each other and to themselves. I've heard it plenty.

Shame. Shame is a big one. If you haven't been raised in a shaming culture, you won't get how powerful it is. You're invalidated and shamed for everything you do and feel, and who you feel you are, if it does not agree with the elders' ideas of who you should be, what you should do, and how you're supposed to feel. And the shame has no boundaries. Your shame as a child is heaped on your parents and family.

Yes, there are a lot of success stories. What you will not be allowed to see, because outward appearances mean everything, are the casualties. I've heard lots of stories and witnessed lots of misery and dysfunction. You want to study BPD, get deep into some Asian communities. It's rampant.

And you say that because you are Asian? Or you have done research like the one OP linked to? No? [Snipped blather]

Actually, yes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I honestly find threads like this worthless. You have Asians who act like they are the only ones who value academic achievement. You have whites who resent academic accomplishments by Asians. And you have both Asians and whites pointing to Asian academic achievement when their actual intent is simply to insult blacks and Hispanics. It is time to step up and recognize that all students deserve our attention and support, and that fetishizing Asians is having unlikely to advance that goal.

Whites should not resent academic accomplishments by Asians. Academic accomplishments should be celebrated more so than sports etc. The primary goal of schools are to educate and to learn and other goals are secondary.

Unfortunately, the top universities don't want kids who only focus on academics. Not saying it's right. Just saying this is how it is. Maybe it's racist, or maybe they just want more "well rounded" students. IDK.

Many lessons can be learned outside the classroom. Extracurricular activities provide situations where kids can learn much about perseverance, hard work, gracious winning and losing, how to be a contributing member of a group. A child who does nothing outside of academics will have missed out on a lot of the lessons kids need to learn to be good adults. Colleges are looking for students who bring much more to the table than just academics.

It's system devised to keep top performing, well-rounded Asian American kids out of top colleges.

Oh, right, of course. What else could it possibly be? Those top schools couldn't possibly have a genuine interest in kids who have developed a variety of talents and character traits over their high school years.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Different cultures - Asian cultures are "we" cultures; American culture is "I" based culture. Not saying one is better than the other, they are just different.

Then why don't Asians do anything for charity, to help others, etc.

PP you are responding too. I do not know. I do believe Americans are much more generous than Asians. Wealth in Asian people/countries is relatively new thing. Maybe being poor is deeply rooted in their psych that giving doesn't come easy (yet).

Asians are relatively not as well-off as whites in general. Also, many Asians give to churches and these churches engage in extensive charitable/missionary work. Although, capitalism is based on "greed" so whites tend to be the most greedy/exploitative people in general.

Well, China seems to be plenty greedy. And pretty gosh darn not nice to the environment. Lots of greedy folks fled Hong Kong too.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I honestly find threads like this worthless. You have Asians who act like they are the only ones who value academic achievement. You have whites who resent academic accomplishments by Asians. And you have both Asians and whites pointing to Asian academic achievement when their actual intent is simply to insult blacks and Hispanics. It is time to step up and recognize that all students deserve our attention and support, and that fetishizing Asians is having unlikely to advance that goal.

Whites should not resent academic accomplishments by Asians. Academic accomplishments should be celebrated more so than sports etc. The primary goal of schools are to educate and to learn and other goals are secondary.

Unfortunately, the top universities don't want kids who only focus on academics. Not saying it's right. Just saying this is how it is. Maybe it's racist, or maybe they just want more "well rounded" students. IDK.

Many lessons can be learned outside the classroom. Extracurricular activities provide situations where kids can learn much about perseverance, hard work, gracious winning and losing, how to be a contributing member of a group. A child who does nothing outside of academics will have missed out on a lot of the lessons kids need to learn to be good adults. Colleges are looking for students who bring much more to the table than just academics.

It's system devised to keep top performing, well-rounded Asian American kids out of top colleges.

Oh, right, of course. What else could it possibly be? Those top schools couldn't possibly have a genuine interest in kids who have developed a variety of talents and character traits over their high school years.

NP - this is a serious question. I have read people making similar statements too many times to count. Why do you assume Asian kids don't have that? Do you really believe because their academic success means lack of "talents and character traits"?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Unfortunately, the top universities don't want kids who only focus on academics. Not saying it's right. Just saying this is how it is. Maybe it's racist, or maybe they just want more "well rounded" students. IDK.

Many lessons can be learned outside the classroom. Extracurricular activities provide situations where kids can learn much about perseverance, hard work, gracious winning and losing, how to be a contributing member of a group. A child who does nothing outside of academics will have missed out on a lot of the lessons kids need to learn to be good adults. Colleges are looking for students who bring much more to the table than just academics.

It's system devised to keep top performing, well-rounded Asian American kids out of top colleges.

Oh, right, of course. What else could it possibly be? Those top schools couldn't possibly have a genuine interest in kids who have developed a variety of talents and character traits over their high school years.

NP - this is a serious question. I have read people making similar statements too many times to count. Why do you assume Asian kids don't have that? Do you really believe because their academic success means lack of "talents and character traits"?

I can't speak for others, but I personally do not assume that Asian kids don't have that. I think that top colleges want kids with strong academics and a variety of other traits and talents that they have spent time developing. I think those colleges can fill their classes many times over and that they have an interest in putting together classes full of kids from many different places and backgrounds with a wide diversity of skills and talents. There are many, many kids who qualify and they just cannot accept every kids who applies. That's why they call them lottery schools.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I honestly find threads like this worthless. You have Asians who act like they are the only ones who value academic achievement. You have whites who resent academic accomplishments by Asians. And you have both Asians and whites pointing to Asian academic achievement when their actual intent is simply to insult blacks and Hispanics. It is time to step up and recognize that all students deserve our attention and support, and that fetishizing Asians is having unlikely to advance that goal.

Whites should not resent academic accomplishments by Asians. Academic accomplishments should be celebrated more so than sports etc. The primary goal of schools are to educate and to learn and other goals are secondary.

Unfortunately, the top universities don't want kids who only focus on academics. Not saying it's right. Just saying this is how it is. Maybe it's racist, or maybe they just want more "well rounded" students. IDK.

Many lessons can be learned outside the classroom. Extracurricular activities provide situations where kids can learn much about perseverance, hard work, gracious winning and losing, how to be a contributing member of a group. A child who does nothing outside of academics will have missed out on a lot of the lessons kids need to learn to be good adults. Colleges are looking for students who bring much more to the table than just academics.

It's system devised to keep top performing, well-rounded Asian American kids out of top colleges.

Oh, right, of course. What else could it possibly be? Those top schools couldn't possibly have a genuine interest in kids who have developed a variety of talents and character traits over their high school years.

What "character traits" are supposedly missing from Asian American students that all the other students (whites, blacks, Hispanics) possess?